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Kane would have the status of Ovi, Crosby if he was in a big market

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02-28-2013, 08:49 AM
  #1
cheswick
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Kane would have the status of Ovi, Crosby if he was in a big market

According to the guys on ESPN Hockey Today Podcast (Steve Levy and Barry Melrose). Due to his status as a power forward and his personality, Kane would be an absolute super star if he played in a bigger market.

Melrose:
"If this guy is in New York or Boston, he's the face of the league"
"He's stuck in Winnipeg"
"I was a perfect player for Winnipeg. Because no one knew us and I was a no name player" (Melrose played on the Jets 1.0)

Thoughts? Agree, disagree?

I personally feel its a bit of a stretch.

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02-28-2013, 08:53 AM
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Originally Posted by cheswick View Post
I personally feel its a bit of a stretch.
Yes it is. He's a great young player and arguably a real franchise player ... but he's no Sidney Crosby or Alex Ovechkin (in his prime superstar years). Maybe he'd be a bigger star in markets like Toronto, Montreal, Boston, New York etc., but he still wouldn't be a face-of-the-league kind of person.

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02-28-2013, 08:55 AM
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wilty00
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It's not like Winnipeg is a vacuum for all existence. Pretty weird thing to say.

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02-28-2013, 08:55 AM
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Yukon Joe
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He would be a bigger star if he was in a bigger media market. I don't think that's a stretch at all to say.

Ovi or Crosby... well those might be tough comparisons. Let's see Kane win the Rocket Richard before making those kinds of comparisons.

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02-28-2013, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Yukon Joe View Post
He would be a bigger star if he was in a bigger media market. I don't think that's a stretch at all to say.

Ovi or Crosby... well those might be tough comparisons. Let's see Kane win the Rocket Richard before making those kinds of comparisons.
But that's not the point. The point is, that the quote said he'd be a "face of the league"-kinda-player. And that's def. a stretch.

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02-28-2013, 09:04 AM
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Hank Chinaski
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Talk about hyperbole.

He'd definitely be more marketable in those locales, I'll allow that. But face of the league? Same status as Crosby and Ovi? LOL.

Kane is a great player in his own right, but he's not even one of the 30 best players in the game today.

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02-28-2013, 09:04 AM
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Guerzy
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Eh, I feel that's a bit of a stretch, honestly. I view Winnipeg as a big market/spotlight in a smaller location, if you will. There is NO hiding in Winnipeg. Play a handful of bad games and you're going to know about it. If anything, if he were in New York, he may be more of a "star" in a "superstars spotlight" per say, but that's only likely because he'd be so hyped that he would likely be overrated, if you want my honest opinion.

There are very few "superstars" in the league, then there are "stars". He will reach star status in Winnipeg when he earns it, and right now he is getting there. Do I think Kane will be a "superstar", no, because if he is a "superstar" then he'll be talked about in the same breathe as Crosby, Malkin, Stamkos. I don't see that happening. He stands a very good and realistic chance at being a star player in his own right, for his own reasons and talents - E. Staal, Kopitar, Iginla (prime), Spezza, P. Kane, Nash, Getzlaf, Perry, etc. I don't personally label these players as "superstars", but they are all star players in my own opinion.. Maybe it all depends what one considers a "star" and a "superstar".

If anything, players get overhyped and overrated very quickly in the spotlight of a market like New York. The media, spotlight and overrating that takes place there can build you up very fast yet strip you down and tear you apart even quicker. And no, I do not believe Kane would be even close to the face of the league if he were in New York or Boston.

And truthfully, I don't see Kane being more or less of a star in Boston than he is/will be in Winnipeg. Anyone see Seguin being such a star? he had a great 2nd season last year. Funny how he hasn't reached "superstar" status yet, but if he were in Boston.. oh wait, he is.

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02-28-2013, 09:08 AM
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If he keeps progressing like he has so far this year, maybe. He's distributing the puck better, using his linemates, picking off passes in the neutral zone and causing turnovers with his speed, he's PKing and despite all that growth in other areas of his game he's scoring at a higher pace than last year. So many of his critics seem to ignore this growth from last year or think that because he scored 30 goals last year that was his peak and that 30 goals somehow implies a finished product. Melrose might be exaggerating but I think he's trying to draw attention to the fact Kane's great season so far has gone largely unnoticed.

Again, I think the status of Ovi/Crosby is a bit of an exaggeration (although not the Ovi of today) but the general sentiment is fine - he'd be a superstar in the right market and the right team. He's not even a clear-cut fan-favorite here due to the presence of Ladd and Byfuglien. In another market on a crappier team he could easily have a Nash thing going for him. Arguably that's what Ovi has going for him now - an elite goal-scorer on an otherwise bad team in a big market.

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02-28-2013, 09:17 AM
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It's not really fair to Kane to compare him to two future hall of famers

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02-28-2013, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Zachy Goj View Post
Eh, I feel that's a bit of a stretch, honestly. I view Winnipeg as a big market/spotlight in a smaller location, if you will. There is NO hiding in Winnipeg. Play a handful of bad games and you're going to know about it. If anything, if he were in New York, he may be more of a "star" in a "superstars spotlight" per say, but that's only likely because he'd be so hyped that he would likely be overrated, if you want my honest opinion.

There are very few "superstars" in the league, then there are "stars". He will reach star status in Winnipeg when he earns it, and right now he is getting there. Do I think Kane will be a "superstar", no, because if he is a "superstar" then he'll be talked about in the same breathe as Crosby, Malkin, Stamkos. I don't see that happening. He stands a very good and realistic chance at being a star player in his own right, for his own reasons and talents - E. Staal, Kopitar, Iginla (prime), Spezza, P. Kane, Nash, Getzlaf, Perry, etc. I don't personally label these players as "superstars", but they are all star players in my own opinion.. Maybe it all depends what one considers a "star" and a "superstar".

If anything, players get overhyped and overrated very quickly in the spotlight of a market like New York. And no, I do not believe Kane would be even close to the face of the league if he were in New York or Boston.

And truthfully, I don't see Kane being more or less of a star in Boston than he is/will be in Winnipeg. Anyone see Seguin being such a star? he had a great season last year. Funny how he hasn't reached "superstar" status yet, but if he were in Boston.. oh wait, he is.
The Seguin thing is a very good point. I love Kane, but Seguin > Kane IMO

That said, I do believe Kane would get a little more attention if he actually played in some prime time TV games. No doubt that would happen in MTL, TOR or possibly even the Western Canadian markets. Winnipeg really doesn't have a great national / international TV presence. Not sure a move to the US would do much to help.

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02-28-2013, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by truck View Post
The Seguin thing is a very good point. I love Kane, but Seguin > Kane IMO

That said, I do believe Kane would get a little more attention if he actually played in some prime time TV games. No doubt that would happen in MTL, TOR or possibly even the Western Canadian markets. Winnipeg really doesn't have a great national / international TV presence. Not sure a move to the US would do much to help.
Definitely agree with more media attention, national tv time, etc. Truck. I also believe if that were the case, he would be so overrated it wouldn't even be funny. And, as fast as those markets can build you up, they can chew you up and spit you out even quicker.

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02-28-2013, 09:29 AM
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TroubaFan1
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I don't agree with this assessment at all. We all saw what Melrose, thought of Stamkos, now look at him. Im not saying Kane isn't a solid player, he is just not at that level. A big market for Kane, would make little to no difference to his status.


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02-28-2013, 09:30 AM
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Was Phil Kessel such a superstar in Boston. Is Marian Gaborik even close to that kind of star in New York.

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02-28-2013, 09:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski View Post
Talk about hyperbole.

He'd definitely be more marketable in those locales, I'll allow that. But face of the league? Same status as Crosby and Ovi? LOL.

Kane is a great player in his own right, but he's not even one of the 30 best players in the game today.
He's been one of the top 10 most productive even strength players in the league this year.

Not sure he can sustain that, but if he can that is beastly.



Kane league ranks:

Shots: 7th, 1st at even strength
Goals: 14th, 2nd at even strength
Assists: 63rd, 22nd at even strength
Points: 22nd, 6th at even strength

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02-28-2013, 09:46 AM
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sipowicz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski View Post
Talk about hyperbole.

He'd definitely be more marketable in those locales, I'll allow that. But face of the league? Same status as Crosby and Ovi? LOL.

Kane is a great player in his own right, but he's not even one of the 30 best players in the game today.
No kidding, when Kane puts up 50 goals and/or 120 points I'll call him a superstar, fact is there are those guys and no one outside Canada or a select few US cities know who they are.

LeBron was a super star when he played in frickin Cleveland.

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02-28-2013, 10:04 AM
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Lol, stupid podcast is stupid.

If Kane puts up Ovi numbers, he'll be a superstar no matter where he plays.

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02-28-2013, 10:21 AM
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Originally Posted by sipowicz View Post
No kidding, when Kane puts up 50 goals and/or 120 points I'll call him a superstar, fact is there are those guys and no one outside Canada or a select few US cities know who they are.

LeBron was a super star when he played in frickin Cleveland.
yep, that..and maybe make the Olympic team next year AND score a couple of game winners including a highlight reel goal to win the gold in overtime....
then maybe comparison to Crosby status might be closer to legitimate....

but failing that, I love what he's doing lately, and he's definitely on track to become a 'star' in this league... but "superstar' ? - not sure he'll get to that level

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02-28-2013, 10:23 AM
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Ridiculous.

He isn't even the face of the Jets.

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02-28-2013, 10:23 AM
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Originally Posted by cheswick View Post
"I was a perfect player for Winnipeg. Because no one knew us and I was a no name player" (Melrose played on the Jets 1.0)
Ummmm, things have changed a bit since Melrose and his mullett played here.

As I recall, one of the reasons nobody know Melrose was because he was a VERY AVERAGE player.

Kind of a dumb comparison. If Kane keeps playing like he has lately, his profile will rise around the league.

To me is seems like Kane has a new high gear this year. When he has the opportunity to race for a loose puck, I don't think anyone in the league could catch him now...

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02-28-2013, 10:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Zachy Goj View Post
Eh, I feel that's a bit of a stretch, honestly. I view Winnipeg as a big market/spotlight in a smaller location, if you will. There is NO hiding in Winnipeg. Play a handful of bad games and you're going to know about it. If anything, if he were in New York, he may be more of a "star" in a "superstars spotlight" per say, but that's only likely because he'd be so hyped that he would likely be overrated, if you want my honest opinion.

There are very few "superstars" in the league, then there are "stars". He will reach star status in Winnipeg when he earns it, and right now he is getting there. Do I think Kane will be a "superstar", no, because if he is a "superstar" then he'll be talked about in the same breathe as Crosby, Malkin, Stamkos. I don't see that happening. He stands a very good and realistic chance at being a star player in his own right, for his own reasons and talents - E. Staal, Kopitar, Iginla (prime), Spezza, P. Kane, Nash, Getzlaf, Perry, etc. I don't personally label these players as "superstars", but they are all star players in my own opinion.. Maybe it all depends what one considers a "star" and a "superstar".

If anything, players get overhyped and overrated very quickly in the spotlight of a market like New York. The media, spotlight and overrating that takes place there can build you up very fast yet strip you down and tear you apart even quicker. And no, I do not believe Kane would be even close to the face of the league if he were in New York or Boston.

And truthfully, I don't see Kane being more or less of a star in Boston than he is/will be in Winnipeg. Anyone see Seguin being such a star? he had a great 2nd season last year. Funny how he hasn't reached "superstar" status yet, but if he were in Boston.. oh wait, he is.
You posted this while I was writing my first post. Your use of Seguin somewhat illustrates what I was trying to say regarding the perception of a star player on a bad team - Seguin played on too good of a team (with Bergeron and Krejci) to be considered a star and only had the 5th most TOI amongst their forwards last year. Had Seguin played on a weak team (~5 more minutes on ice per game, sole focus of media attention, etc.) and one with a more offense-first system I do think he would be considered a star. Again, Nash in Columbus was a good example of that. Kovalchuk in Atlanta was another. Regardless of anyones interpretation of the word "superstar" or "star" clearly the teams system and depth plays a huge role, probably more so than the market.

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02-28-2013, 10:46 AM
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sipowicz
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Ummmm, things have changed a bit since Melrose and his mullett played here.

As I recall, one of the reasons nobody know Melrose was because he was a VERY AVERAGE player.

Kind of a dumb comparison. If Kane keeps playing like he has lately, his profile will rise around the league.

To me is seems like Kane has a new high gear this year. When he has the opportunity to race for a loose puck, I don't think anyone in the league could catch him now...
Melrose is too dumb to understand that since he played we've had an explosion of NHL coverage through the media, www, speciality TV, etc. It really doesn't matter where you play nowadays and that pretty much applies to all sports.

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02-28-2013, 11:06 AM
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I'm not sure how you take anything you hear on ESPN seriously. Kane's on a nice run right now.....buts lets not get crazy.

This is a network talking around the clock about a possible 2nd round draft pick linebacker who is slow and possesses poor social media skills.

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02-28-2013, 11:10 AM
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Those guys are complete idiots on two counts:

1: Winnipeg IS a hockey market. He isn't playing in (insert American summer-year-round state name here).

Kane farts the wrong way in a restaurant and it's everywhere. Kane IS big news here, and he's not buried in a sunshine state where no one knows what hockey is.

2. To be a premium power forward and face of the league.... that's the role of 1 or 2 people at most. That is a VERY elite club that is usually held open for the very best of an era. Does this describe Kane? Maybe one day, but not today.

++edit++
After thinking about this why are we even debating this? Why would anyone listen to anything about hockey ESPN has to say? That's like taking advice from a hamster on how to bake a cake. If I want idiotic thoughts on Hockey I'll ask my cat what she thinks of Pav's performance this year... heck maybe she'll quote ESPN!

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02-28-2013, 11:11 AM
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To be frank, does Kane really need anymore media attention?!?

Seems like one week, he's being praised, the next week we're hearing trade rumors.

And that's just from Gary Lawless...

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02-28-2013, 11:19 AM
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Turbofan
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Originally Posted by TroubaFan1 View Post
I don't agree with this assessment at all. We all saw what Melrose, thought of Stamkos, now look at him. Im not saying Kane isn't a solid player, he is just not at that level. A big market for Kane, would make little to no difference to his status.
I think the point is more that he would be marketed more aggressively, as a 'face of the new NHL' kind of way. Not that he is on the skill level of a Crosby or Ovechkin, but he would probably be pushed to the point that he would be just as popular. Or more.

Let's face it, Ovi and Crosby have boring-as-dirt personalities. If Kane had their skill, combined with his polarizing-yet-enticing personality, and he was in a big-market city, he'd be pushed like crazy.

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