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Jordan Schroeder Appreciation Thread!

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Old
02-24-2013, 10:16 PM
  #751
AmazingNuck
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Originally Posted by Wizeman View Post
Its funny, but on most teams, being put on the PK is a punishment. On the canucks its a badge of honor which shows the coach trusts your play.

Hansen and Raymond just spent 2 years 'earning' their PK spots on the bottom pairing and now are the top pairing (to rest burrows and kesler)

Coach AV is impressed enough to put Schroeder on the PP and give him tough draws in the defensive zone. But hes not impressed enough to reward him with a PK assignment
You mean for peewee, right? I can't imagine a coach that keeps his job if he actually considers PK as "punishment time."

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02-24-2013, 11:08 PM
  #752
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Originally Posted by AmazingNuck View Post
You mean for peewee, right? I can't imagine a coach that keeps his job if he actually considers PK as "punishment time."
Many dont keep their jobs. Some coaches do pull tactics like that. And you are right. It is Pee Wee mentality.

The opposite is of course power play time . Rewarding players.

Coach AV tends to reward his players who hustle with power play time. This is true for most coaches.

But he wont let newbies kill penalties. Raymond never got to kill em , and neither did Hansen. Ive been watching this with amazement for years.

Schroeder is tailor made for something like this with his defensive awareness, speed and his chemistry with Raymond. Yet AV never puts him out there .

A Raymond Schroeder PK tandem would be a shorthanded threat as well.

I think Hansen could PK with just about any partner. Hes a natural. Man what a steal for a 9th rounder

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02-25-2013, 04:49 AM
  #753
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Originally Posted by Wizeman View Post
Many dont keep their jobs. Some coaches do pull tactics like that. And you are right. It is Pee Wee mentality.

The opposite is of course power play time . Rewarding players.

Coach AV tends to reward his players who hustle with power play time. This is true for most coaches.

But he wont let newbies kill penalties. Raymond never got to kill em , and neither did Hansen. Ive been watching this with amazement for years.

Schroeder is tailor made for something like this with his defensive awareness, speed and his chemistry with Raymond. Yet AV never puts him out there .

A Raymond Schroeder PK tandem would be a shorthanded threat as well.

I think Hansen could PK with just about any partner. Hes a natural. Man what a steal for a 9th rounder
I absolutely cannot imagine an NHL coach in the last, say, 15 or 20+ years doing that other than maybe Mike Keenan on a rage blackout. That's basically intentionally giving up goals, not to mention that players would generally want to play on the PK, given that TOI and special teams time is certainly a quantifiable bargaining chip come contract time.

Anyway, Hansen averaged 1:41/game on the PK in his first season as a fulltime NHLer, 1:04 in that year's playoffs.

Raymond was under a minute his first full year (08-09), and then 1:33 the next season, which was more than he has averaged since then. Last year and this year he has been in the same general range as his first season.

I'd imagine that call-ups and rookies don't get PK time because:
a) This team has a number of vets that kill penalties
b) The coaching staff want them to get their feet wet in the NHL in general before dropping them on the ice shorthanded against an NHL PP staffed by most of the same players that coaches usually go to great lengths to get those rookies away from.
c) Rookies are usually at a strength disadvantage, and board battles on the PK are huge. You lose it and not only is the other guy walking away with the puck, but you're now out of position and worst-case it's now a 5-on-3 until you can get on the right side of the puck again.

PP gets used as a reward for hard workers when games are out of hand and whatnot because it takes a hell of a lot more of a mistake on the PP for the puck to end up in your net than on a PK, and putting those guys on the PP isn't likely to piss of your goalie like dropping guys on the PK for ***** and giggles would.


Last edited by RobertKron: 02-25-2013 at 04:56 AM.
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02-25-2013, 02:34 PM
  #754
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertKron View Post

Anyway, Hansen averaged 1:41/game on the PK in his first season
Raymond was under a minute his first full year (08-09),

I'd imagine that call-ups and rookies don't get PK time because:
a) This team has a number of vets that kill penalties
b) The coaching staff want them to get their feet wet in the NHL in general before dropping them on the ice shorthanded against an NHL PP staffed by most of the same players that coaches usually go to great lengths to get those rookies away from.
c) Rookies are usually at a strength disadvantage, and board battles on the PK are huge. You lose it and not only is the other guy walking away with the puck, but you're now out of position and worst-case it's now a 5-on-3 until you can get on the right side of the puck again.
Excellent post. Well said

Its true newbies dont get pk time under AV, which is a good philosophy but not all coaches follow it.

I was thinking that Schroeder is such a natural at the position. Hes fast, strong, and smart . His defensive positioning is well beyond his NHL experience. Yet AV sticks to the program and doesnt put him out there yet.

Not until next year, his first 'full ' season yet. Perhaps he will start to use him if there is an injury . I think hes ready now.

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02-25-2013, 03:46 PM
  #755
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Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
He's talking about playstyle. Few players Schroeder's height are able to carve out long NHL careers. The ones that do, are usually offensive types that push tempo. These types play a more aggressive style than Schroeder does. Guys like Gallagher and Conacher attack the net on rushes, try to beat guys one on one, generally playing a riskier brand of hockey to justify sticking in the NHL.

That has never been Schroeder's game. It might have had other evaluators shy away from taking a risk on him. Not only was he limited by his height, but his playstyle didn't align with what was known to bring success to shorter players.

Yeah I'm not sure what F A N is having a hard time grasping...

The Scouts knew Shroeder was 5'8, 170 when they ranked him in the 5 to 10 range early in his draft eligible season. On Draft day he was still 5'8, 170 but dropped to the back of the first round.

It wasn't his height that caused him to drop, his height was the one constant.

What changed was the belief in his ability to play in the NHL.

And I think you have it Right.

Most smaller guys play a fast paced almost frantic style. Schroeder didn't really play that way. He skated very well back then but tended not to move his feet and played at a much slower pace then one would expect.

That's my guess as to why he dropped so much over the course of the season.

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02-25-2013, 03:59 PM
  #756
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Originally Posted by Wizeman View Post
But he wont let newbies kill penalties. Raymond never got to kill em , and neither did Hansen. Ive been watching this with amazement for years.

Schroeder is tailor made for something like this with his defensive awareness, speed and his chemistry with Raymond. Yet AV never puts him out there .

A Raymond Schroeder PK tandem would be a shorthanded threat as well.

I think Hansen could PK with just about any partner. Hes a natural. Man what a steal for a 9th rounder
Hansen and Raymond were both on the PK very early in their careers. Hansen was a regular in his rookie season and Raymond played a lot there in his second year.

As for Schroeder, he might one day be used in that role but right now he is behind Kesler, Burrows, Lappy, Higgens, Hansen, and Raymond. I don't see how it makes sense to play a rookie ahead of those guys.

One of the most difficult things to do as a young player is to keep your energy up and play at a high level for the full season. I would rather see Schroder focus on his current role and see him be consistent over a long period of time before piling more ice time on him.

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03-20-2013, 07:17 AM
  #757
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Just wanted to bring this back. It's been almost a month!

Thought he did pretty good against the Blues, playing his patented 200-ft game. Played 17:52. What a pass to Weise though!

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03-20-2013, 07:40 AM
  #758
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epic bump

well deserved

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03-20-2013, 09:13 AM
  #759
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Originally Posted by Wizeman View Post
Excellent post. Well said

Its true newbies dont get pk time under AV, which is a good philosophy but not all coaches follow it.
As pointed out that isn't true. AV will use who he feels are the best guys for the job even if they are rookies. Raymond and Hansen got PK time right away in the NHL because they were good at it. In the case of Hansen it was his 5-on-5 play that had him in and out of the lineup. He didn't bring the same effort or defensive awareness 5-on-5 as he did on the PK and it landed him in the doghouse. We are seeing the rewards in his play from that tough love the last couple of years. Hard to imagine Hansen not moving his feet or pushing the play but it was certainly the case.

On Schroeder...as pointed out in a recent article on Schroeder he started having trouble when the speed of the NHL picked up. He wasn't making plays or decisions quick enough which are things he needs to be comfortable doing if he is to see PK time. If he plays like he did the last couple of games each and every night then yes he may be ready for PK time. But then as Pot pointed out he's behind an awful lot of good PKers.

Schroeder needs to watch the tape of this game and bring that every single shift. Carry the puck with speed and back the D-men off. Quick passes in the transition to spring his wingers. Exceptionally hard on the back check. He does that and he's an NHLer and will likely fill that third line center spot very well going into next season and beyond.


Last edited by tantalum: 03-20-2013 at 09:18 AM.
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03-20-2013, 11:04 AM
  #760
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Originally Posted by live playoff hockey View Post
epic bump

well deserved
Sweet, sweet pass. Only guy on the team not named Henrik with playmaking skills like that.

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03-20-2013, 11:13 AM
  #761
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wizeman View Post
Many dont keep their jobs. Some coaches do pull tactics like that. And you are right. It is Pee Wee mentality.

The opposite is of course power play time . Rewarding players.

Coach AV tends to reward his players who hustle with power play time. This is true for most coaches.

But he wont let newbies kill penalties. Raymond never got to kill em , and neither did Hansen. Ive been watching this with amazement for years.

Schroeder is tailor made for something like this with his defensive awareness, speed and his chemistry with Raymond. Yet AV never puts him out there .

A Raymond Schroeder PK tandem would be a shorthanded threat as well.

I think Hansen could PK with just about any partner. Hes a natural. Man what a steal for a 9th rounder
Schroeder hasn't shown a strong ability to block shots or win faceoffs. Why use him when we have six players that can do the job better than him?

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03-20-2013, 11:15 AM
  #762
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Originally Posted by tantalum View Post
As pointed out that isn't true. AV will use who he feels are the best guys for the job even if they are rookies. Raymond and Hansen got PK time right away in the NHL because they were good at it. In the case of Hansen it was his 5-on-5 play that had him in and out of the lineup. He didn't bring the same effort or defensive awareness 5-on-5 as he did on the PK and it landed him in the doghouse. We are seeing the rewards in his play from that tough love the last couple of years. Hard to imagine Hansen not moving his feet or pushing the play but it was certainly the case.

On Schroeder...as pointed out in a recent article on Schroeder he started having trouble when the speed of the NHL picked up. He wasn't making plays or decisions quick enough which are things he needs to be comfortable doing if he is to see PK time. If he plays like he did the last couple of games each and every night then yes he may be ready for PK time. But then as Pot pointed out he's behind an awful lot of good PKers.

Schroeder needs to watch the tape of this game and bring that every single shift. Carry the puck with speed and back the D-men off. Quick passes in the transition to spring his wingers. Exceptionally hard on the back check. He does that and he's an NHLer and will likely fill that third line center spot very well going into next season and beyond.
This.

Good fact about Hansen.
Most people forget about that fact, now look how awesome Honey Badger is.

Schroeder needs to keep his feet moving, and as you stated, push the pace of the play.

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03-20-2013, 02:51 PM
  #763
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Originally Posted by PRNuck View Post
Sweet, sweet pass. Only guy on the team not named Henrik with playmaking skills like that.
Daniel?

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03-20-2013, 02:58 PM
  #764
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Originally Posted by Nuck This View Post
Schroeder hasn't shown a strong ability to block shots or win faceoffs. Why use him when we have six players that can do the job better than him?
Like AV's use of Ebbett on the PK (who's face-off ability is actually WORSE than Schroeder's)?

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03-20-2013, 03:20 PM
  #765
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Daniel?
Ok honourable mention to Daniel

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03-22-2013, 06:59 PM
  #766
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Originally Posted by hockeywoot View Post
This.

Good fact about Hansen.
Most people forget about that fact, now look how awesome Honey Badger is.

Schroeder needs to keep his feet moving, and as you stated, push the pace of the play.
Yep, he keeps doing that and the whole line is going to have success. They need to attack opposition D with speed and we saw it work against the Blues. Which is why Ebbett isn't really a long-term fit there anyway.

Individually though, it looks like JS has been getting a lot more chances in the slot (STL, PHX) as of late so it's good to see he's getting to the right areas at the right time.

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03-22-2013, 07:15 PM
  #767
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Originally Posted by vanuck View Post
Yep, he keeps doing that and the whole line is going to have success. They need to attack opposition D with speed and we saw it work against the Blues. Which is why Ebbett isn't really a long-term fit there anyway.

Individually though, it looks like JS has been getting a lot more chances in the slot (STL, PHX) as of late so it's good to see he's getting to the right areas at the right time.
Since Schroeder has come back up, this is the chance differential while he's on the ice at ES:

16-9

and the rest of the team:

13-25

Schroeder has 4 chances himself and has directly assisted on 2 others. The only person to have taken more chances is Daniel Sedin with 5 and the only person with more created and assisted chances is Raymond with 7.

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03-22-2013, 07:29 PM
  #768
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Safe to say Schroeder is making an impact and an important contribution to our success in every game so far. On top of that he is also young, developing and has alot more upside.

And people want to trade this guy. Tsk Tsk.

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03-22-2013, 07:32 PM
  #769
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Originally Posted by Tiranis View Post
Since Schroeder has come back up, this is the chance differential while he's on the ice at ES:

16-9

and the rest of the team:

13-25

Schroeder has 4 chances himself and has directly assisted on 2 others. The only person to have taken more chances is Daniel Sedin with 5 and the only person with more created and assisted chances is Raymond with 7.
Holy ****. I haven't been keeping count but that is mighty impressive. Would you say his ratio of chances for/against has gotten better since he was sent down and recalled?

But nevertheless it's no surprise that line is clicking after seeing how they did earlier in the year. I still don't know why it wasn't reunited after Kesler and then Booth got hurt again.

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03-22-2013, 07:55 PM
  #770
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Holy ****. I haven't been keeping count but that is mighty impressive. Would you say his ratio of chances for/against has gotten better since he was sent down and recalled?
He was holding his head above water until AV started juggling him around the line-up. The one big change is that this time he has managed to make himself a factor even with 4th line wingers (5 chances for, 0 chances against in his first game). He's also better at being a direct contributor to those chances, rather than just playing solid hockey and not standing out so much. Right now he's driving the play rather than just kind of tagging along.

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03-22-2013, 08:14 PM
  #771
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Originally Posted by Tiranis View Post
He was holding his head above water until AV started juggling him around the line-up. The one big change is that this time he has managed to make himself a factor even with 4th line wingers (5 chances for, 0 chances against in his first game). He's also better at being a direct contributor to those chances, rather than just playing solid hockey and not standing out so much. Right now he's driving the play rather than just kind of tagging along.
Thanks. It doesn't look like he's being any more sheltered than he was earlier either, so it's good to see. In fact I suspect Tippett was looking for that matchup too between that line and his 1st line.

When you look at the way Hansen's tip missed Labarbera's pad and goes right to him for a tap-in you hope that his bad luck from previously is starting to swing the other way now.

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03-22-2013, 08:39 PM
  #772
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It's becoming more and more clear Schroeder is a regular NHLer.

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03-22-2013, 09:44 PM
  #773
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Originally Posted by Tiranis View Post
He was holding his head above water until AV started juggling him around the line-up. The one big change is that this time he has managed to make himself a factor even with 4th line wingers (5 chances for, 0 chances against in his first game). He's also better at being a direct contributor to those chances, rather than just playing solid hockey and not standing out so much. Right now he's driving the play rather than just kind of tagging along.
Hopefully AV sees the improvement and keeps him with Hansen and Raymond, I have to give him some credit for sticking with them in Phoenix.

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03-23-2013, 07:00 PM
  #774
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Another sweet pass today for the only goal of the game!

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03-23-2013, 07:08 PM
  #775
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Saw him get outmuscled once this game, but other than that looked sharp again, great pass

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