HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Toronto Maple Leafs
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Phil Kessel Discussion Thread. (no goals as of Feb 4, 2013)

View Poll Results: kessel goals, 15 over or under, this year
over 86 51.50%
under 81 48.50%
Voters: 167. You may not vote on this poll

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-05-2013, 01:49 PM
  #876
Ciccio1980
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 362
vCash: 500
Kessel for getzlaf
Then sign perry as a f a

Ciccio1980 is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 01:50 PM
  #877
Pilky01
@JamesD_TO
 
Pilky01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: London
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,819
vCash: 500
It is not luck.

That a player leads the league in shots, but has zero goals, tells me he is not going to goal scoring areas.

If you have 40 shots, but haven't been able to put a rebound into a yawning cage, you aren't playing good positional hockey.

Pilky01 is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 01:51 PM
  #878
DaveT83*
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 3,760
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilky01 View Post
It is not luck.

That a player leads the league in shots, but has zero goals, tells me he is not going to goal scoring areas.

If you have 40 shots, but haven't been able to put a rebound into a yawning cage, you aren't playing good positional hockey.
See examples Jason Blake + Matt Lombardi

DaveT83* is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 01:53 PM
  #879
Superstar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,592
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gobias Industries View Post
It's not supportable though, you honestly think if Kessel was breaking league scoring records, we'd throw him up on the cross after six games?

Not true, invalid point, waste of time.
But some of us are happy to throw a 25 year old 4 time consecutive 30+ goals PPG elite sniper out of town for some picks and prospects...go figure.

Superstar is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 01:57 PM
  #880
Superstar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,592
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gobias Industries View Post
Obviously the flip side is that this can't help his trade value.
Every sane GM knows that Kessel is going through a slump at the moment -- 9 games without a goal will not all of a sudden erase the last 4 years of 130+ goals playing without a #1 C. But some of these internet GM's think it does.

Superstar is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 01:58 PM
  #881
egd27
#freethebigpicture
 
egd27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 3,782
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by diceman934 View Post
Had you read my posts you would have understood that I was not attacking Kessel about his lack of scoring at all......I understand slumps etc. Read my posts and you will find that I have always focus on his willingness to compete.

I fully understood you point about Gretzky was but it was not valid as I have never attacked Kessel about his production. So hence why I asked what you point was.

I guess I expected that you had read my post before posting....sorry I will not make that same mistake again.

This is a debated about Kessel and his slump has nothing at all to do with my opinion regarding him. He is a very soft frighten player and he could score 30 goals from this point to the end of the season and my opinion of him will not change unless his play on the ice changes....that he shows that he is willing to engage in the physical aspect of the game. Not expecting him to be a bruiser or anything close, but at least be willing to be take a check to score a goal, or to get the puck out of the D zone.
Still don't think you're getting what I was trying to say, but let's move on.

egd27 is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 02:02 PM
  #882
Superstar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,592
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by diceman934 View Post
Maybe if you read my opinion of Kessel you would understand what my whole point is......I do not for a minute believe that Kessel does not understand what to do when he does not have the puck or where to be defensively in the D zone.....I believe that his is an intelligent player. My premise is that he lacks the guts/nuts etc to do it as seen by his play.
Nice jab at a guy who survived testicular cancer and left with one testicle. And you must be watching a different game than some of us.

Superstar is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 02:10 PM
  #883
Gobias Industries
Registered User
 
Gobias Industries's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,386
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Superstar View Post
Every sane GM knows that Kessel is going through a slump at the moment -- 9 games without a goal will not all of a sudden erase the last 4 years of 130+ goals playing without a #1 C. But some of these internet GM's think it does.
Notice how I said it can't help his trade value.

If you think that this slump will elicit calls from GMs (which is what I responded to), presumably it would be at a perceived value.

Gobias Industries is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 02:12 PM
  #884
Alflives
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,539
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ciccio1980 View Post
Kessel for getzlaf
Then sign perry as a f a
Kessel is not worth even close to Getzlaf.

Alflives is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 02:17 PM
  #885
Gobias Industries
Registered User
 
Gobias Industries's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,386
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Superstar View Post
But some of us are happy to throw a 25 year old 4 time consecutive 30+ goals PPG elite sniper out of town for some picks and prospects...go figure.
There's a huge difference, and that was my point.

I try not to ignore the fact he has a NMC and will be looking to renegotiate his deal, or that this team has been questionable defensively and he represents this on some level. I also think that if the value is comparable (picks/prospects) that given the current state of the team, questionable core, and questionable direction, it calls for a review of a potential transaction.

Gobias Industries is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 02:55 PM
  #886
The Apologist
Kessel Supporter
 
The Apologist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Soviet Kanukistan
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,101
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gobias Industries View Post
There's a huge difference, and that was my point.

I try not to ignore the fact he has a NMC and will be looking to renegotiate his deal, or that this team has been questionable defensively and he represents this on some level. I also think that if the value is comparable (picks/prospects) that given the current state of the team, questionable core, and questionable direction, it calls for a review of a potential transaction.
It's not his job to defend anymore than its Gunnarssons job to light the lamp.

The Apologist is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 02:56 PM
  #887
Gobias Industries
Registered User
 
Gobias Industries's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,386
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazeeEddie View Post
It's not his job to defend anymore than its Gunnarssons job to light the lamp.
That's the kind of logic that has this team where it is defensively.

Go tell the Kings, Bruins or Blackhawks that.

Gobias Industries is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 02:58 PM
  #888
The Apologist
Kessel Supporter
 
The Apologist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Soviet Kanukistan
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,101
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilky01 View Post
It is not luck.

That a player leads the league in shots, but has zero goals, tells me he is not going to goal scoring areas.

If you have 40 shots, but haven't been able to put a rebound into a yawning cage, you aren't playing good positional hockey.
Then it would stand to reason that his shot location and distribution would be different that it has been in previous years. Based on what I've seen, this is not the case. He is taking the same shots from the same locations as always, they just aren't going in. It's called a slump. Nearly all top scorers go through it at some point in the season, and most seasons Kessel does to. Yet somehow he always ends up on pace for 30 or more. Why should I believe this season is any different?

The Apologist is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 02:59 PM
  #889
The Apologist
Kessel Supporter
 
The Apologist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Soviet Kanukistan
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,101
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gobias Industries View Post
That's the kind of logic that has this team where it is defensively.

Go tell the Kings, Bruins or Blackhawks that.
Because every single player on each of those teams can play defence an score right?

The Apologist is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 03:01 PM
  #890
The Apologist
Kessel Supporter
 
The Apologist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Soviet Kanukistan
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,101
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gobias Industries View Post
There's a huge difference, and that was my point.

I try not to ignore the fact he has a NMC and will be looking to renegotiate his deal, or that this team has been questionable defensively and he represents this on some level. I also think that if the value is comparable (picks/prospects) that given the current state of the team, questionable core, and questionable direction, it calls for a review of a potential transaction.
I don't ignore it either, however I also don't jump to conclusions that our best player is just gonna bolt for no apparent reason.

The Apologist is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 03:18 PM
  #891
Gobias Industries
Registered User
 
Gobias Industries's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,386
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazeeEddie View Post
Because every single player on each of those teams can play defence an score right?
True enough, but there aren't many players on those team that fly in the face of team defence like your statement did.

Gobias Industries is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 03:19 PM
  #892
Gobias Industries
Registered User
 
Gobias Industries's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,386
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazeeEddie View Post
I don't ignore it either, however I also don't jump to conclusions that our best player is just gonna bolt for no apparent reason.
Sure, anyway, my point is I don't consider him untradable.

Given that you don't even mention value in your posts, I assume you do?

Gobias Industries is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 03:27 PM
  #893
hullsy47
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,870
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gobias Industries View Post
Sure, anyway, my point is I don't consider him untradable.

Given that you don't even mention value in your posts, I assume you do?
i dont get the love fest for kessel ...its completely out of our hands .......i think MSLE looked at the leafs entire organization ,during the lockout and has its own agenda in mind
im not sure kessel will get dealt ,but i assure u brian burke would not have dealt him ,and hence hes gone
and nonis may not wanna trade kessel ,but if he cant justify a raise kesel may walk ,the lockout was bad timing for lots of players ,but the leafs changed owners and for all we know did research around the league and quietly asked other hockey people their evaluation of the current leaf roster
im betting they didnt get an overwhelming endoresment of the current product

hullsy47 is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 03:41 PM
  #894
ForzaZuffa
Don't stare at it...
 
ForzaZuffa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Country: Italy
Posts: 9,315
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazeeEddie View Post
So how do you explain the 99 goals as a Leaf?
How does this relate to what I said? Did I say he has never scored goals?

ForzaZuffa is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 03:49 PM
  #895
Durrrrrr
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 160
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gobias Industries View Post
Sure, anyway, my point is I don't consider him untradable.

Given that you don't even mention value in your posts, I assume you do?
Everyone is tradable.
Your opposition is questioning why you start with your best piece.
It would be like the Habs looking to trade Subban or Price for size up the middle

Durrrrrr is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 03:58 PM
  #896
johnny_rudeboy
Registered User
 
johnny_rudeboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Karlstad
Country: Sweden
Posts: 11,147
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Durrrrrr View Post
Everyone is tradable.
Your opposition is questioning why you start with your best piece.
It would be like the Habs looking to trade Subban or Price for size up the middle
Because the best piece does not fit in anymore. And potential #1 on D and legit #1 in net is not secondary pieces like a soft goal scoring wingers is so I dont know why you bring them up.

If another team is willing to pay a good price (1st + one or two good prospects) for Kessel we should accept it and wish him good luck.

johnny_rudeboy is online now  
Old
02-05-2013, 04:04 PM
  #897
mrsauve
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Toronto
Posts: 71
vCash: 500
Kessel is the softest player in the NHL!

There is no other player currently playing in the nhl that purposely gives up the puck to avoid a hit more than Kessel.Not even semin is this soft...

Having to watch him skate around the perimeter every game and never battle for a puck is extremely depressing as a leafs fan. Having to come to terms with the fact that leaf management would even entertain the possibility of resigning him long term as part of our "Core" is so depressing.
If the leafs made the playoffs he would be even more useless out there as everyone else raises there compete level.

There is no room for a player like this on a winning team regardless of how skilled he is. Trade him now well we can still get something for him...

mrsauve is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 04:13 PM
  #898
mrsauve
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Toronto
Posts: 71
vCash: 500
Do you even watch puck? Do you not realize what a team like STL would do to the leafs in a 7 game playoff series... kessel would be no where to be found.

mrsauve is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 04:14 PM
  #899
david999
Registered User
 
david999's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 646
vCash: 500
Kessel is not a soft player to begin with. Some players like to hit more because they can't score or contribute with their playmaking. I guess playing in the best league in the world against the best checkers and defence pairings most nights makes someone soft

david999 is offline  
Old
02-05-2013, 04:15 PM
  #900
Eyedea
The Legend Continues
 
Eyedea's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Country: Greece
Posts: 11,979
vCash: 500
Not to mention he's not the softest player in the league. Hemsky seems like an obvious choice, and Patrick Kane is even softer than Kessel. Kessel just doesn't have the ability to open space for himself like Kane, nor does he have players like Sharp/Hossa/Toews to assist him.

Eyedea is online now  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:29 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.