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Old
02-02-2013, 05:49 PM
  #226
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Originally Posted by cassius View Post
Tough crowd around here.

Today was about as perfect as a win as you'll find, so I think it's best to just soak it up and enjoy it.

It's easy to be cynical and poking hole in everything, but honestly this was a textbook performance all around.
It's more fun to complain about things so you can say "I told you so" when the inevitable losses come.

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02-02-2013, 05:51 PM
  #227
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Originally Posted by Chancellor Vitale View Post
No need to get dramatic about it.

All I'm talking about is making smart passes and trying to move the puck with the help of our D as well, not just a low-cycle-and-grind game. I do get your point and I know that pretty much all of our wingers not named Neal are ham-fisted passers / shooters, but they're not so retarded as to be unable to involve the D (most of whom are decent passers and good skaters) in the offensive possession game for example.

That's all I'm talking about. Not some complicated Soviet Era offensive system that relies heavily on skill at every position, just move the damn puck around the boards (whatever you have to do) to get the D involved a little more, spread things out a little more.

Whether at the beginning of a zone possession or moving it out for a shot from the point... there has to be more than this collapse on the puck behind the net and hope we don't lose it crap.

I'm also not saying we don't need more skill on the wings / replace some of our wings. We obviously do and I've said so many times. But for what I'm talking about, an upgrade to freakin' Corey Perry or Ryane Clowe should not be a requirement for doing a better job of making the offense a little less predictable / more fluid in terms of who's taking the shots, where they're coming from, etc.
Ugh, and the bolded part is exactly my point.

"More fluid in terms of who's taking the shots, where they're coming from..." are just words. They make absolutely no sense and have no substance, and it's like a politician with a really great speech, even though he's said absolutely nothing.

Before I really go off, I want you to explain to me what you mean by any of it. I have a feeling you won't have an answer.

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02-02-2013, 05:55 PM
  #228
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I want to say that I cannot believe Cassius just posted that, but I'd be lying.

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02-02-2013, 05:55 PM
  #229
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cassius View Post
Tough crowd around here.

Today was about as perfect as a win as you'll find, so I think it's best to just soak it up and enjoy it.

It's easy to be cynical and poke holes in everything, but honestly this was a textbook performance all around.
No offense to you at all, but when you're the voice of reason here (being a natural pessimist on most things) there's an issue. We may lose 5-0 tomorrow. But let's just all enjoy this one and stop picking apart menial details.

Kirk, man, this win means nothing for future playoff series good or bad. Quit playing the what-if game and relax a little. There will be better opportunities to push your agenda down the line.

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02-02-2013, 05:56 PM
  #230
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Originally Posted by JTG View Post
I want to say that I cannot believe Cassius just posted that, but I'd be lying.
Somehow my account is bugged that I can't see his posts even if he's not on my ignore list.

I couldn't be happier.

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02-02-2013, 05:58 PM
  #231
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Originally Posted by MtlPenFan View Post
Ugh, and the bolded part is exactly my point.

"More fluid in terms of who's taking the shots, where they're coming from..." are just words. They make absolutely no sense and have no substance, and it's like a politician with a really great speech, even though he's said absolutely nothing.

Before I really go off, I want you to explain to me what you mean by any of it. I have a feeling you won't have an answer.
I think he's just saying that our offense should be better than it is with better execution or a better system. Better players would obviously be good, but these players can do better than they are. This offense as is right now has the ability to be better than it has been so far.

then again, I could be wrong. That's what I think he means though.

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02-02-2013, 05:58 PM
  #232
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Originally Posted by Malkin4Top6Wingerz View Post
This. According to behindthenet, Sid has taken twice as many defensive zone draws as Geno. Geno has taken more offensive zone / neutral zone draws. That accounts for their differences in ES TOI. This should be fairly obvious from watching the games, and the raw numbers support it.

I honestly do no think there's anything DB could do to make KIRK happy. There will always be something he can find to complain about, even if it's something as trivial as Crosby getting an extra shift or two per game more than Geno.
3 more minutes equates to about about 1.5 extra shifts a period.

That folks, is the difference between winning or losing.

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02-02-2013, 05:58 PM
  #233
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Pens could go 16-0 in the playoffs en route to the Cup, and Kirk would still complain about it if Malkin got less ice time than Crosby throughout the run.

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02-02-2013, 06:00 PM
  #234
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Originally Posted by MrBurgundy View Post
Somehow my account is bugged that I can't see his posts even if he's not on my ignore list.

I couldn't be happier.
He blocked anyone who would stand up to him.

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02-02-2013, 06:02 PM
  #235
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He blocked anyone who would stand up to him.
It's certainly made my time posting here more enjoyable, so I should thank him.

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02-02-2013, 06:02 PM
  #236
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Originally Posted by Dr Frasier Crane View Post
No offense to you at all, but when you're the voice of reason here (being a natural pessimist on most things) there's an issue. We may lose 5-0 tomorrow. But let's just all enjoy this one and stop picking apart menial details..
Keep on trollin. Displaying anti-social behavior on the internets is what all the cool kids do!

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02-02-2013, 06:05 PM
  #237
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Originally Posted by cassius View Post
Keep on trollin. Displaying anti-social behavior on the internets is what all the cool kids do!
I'm on your side. Sorry if that wasn't clear.

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02-02-2013, 06:06 PM
  #238
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- myself, for going to med express this morning and being diagnosed with multiple ulcers on my cornea. So I somewhat 'watched' the game today. lol.

+ This was the best game I've seen them play. I know it's only 1 game, but I'll eat crow about Boychuk. He looked pretty good out there today.

+ Defense. Every single guy played great. Again, only 1 game, but damn did that Engo-Bort pairing look nasty. Despres had a good game, as did Martin.

+ Sid. His best game by far. He definitely had some jump today. It's scary to think what he'd do w/ even 1 legitimate winger.

+ Just about everyone gets a + today, even Disco. He at least somewhat stuck w/ his lines today, and the PP at least got a few shots.

- Matt Cooke and TK. I'm just not seeing it guys. At least Cooke can PK. But these guys really don't do a whole lot. Cooke refuses to play physically, and TK is too little to play physically. That 3rd line needs to do something if we're going to be great.

- I really like Clarkson. Can we trade Cooke and TK for him?

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Old
02-02-2013, 06:06 PM
  #239
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Originally Posted by MrBurgundy View Post
It's certainly a different situation than the average waiver wire pickup. He actually has 1st round pedigree, and it sounds like Carolina was really wishing that nobody was going to pick him up.

We'll see, but I liked what I saw from him today. I just wish he'd get a shot with Crosby too just to gauge who he has the best chemistry with. Malkin has Neal, and Crosby has... Dupuis? Kunitz just isn't fairing very well at this point, despite what his stat line reads today.

It would be awesome though if Boychuk could become one part of the winger equation we've been trying to solve. That would make the trade deadline a lot easier on Shero.

Boychuk - Crosby - X
Kunitz - Malkin - Neal
Cooke - Sutter - Dupuis
Glass - Vitale - Adams

Not too bad if you ask me. What would be even better is if Boychuk worked out AND Shero still got 2 more wingers...

Boychuk - Crosby - X
X - Malkin - Neal
Kunitz - Sutter - Dupuis
Glass - Vitale - Cooke
From what I read somewhere Boychuk can play any forward position.

Kunitz - Crosby - Boychuk
Jeffrey - Malkin - Neal
Cooke - Sutter - Kennedy
Glass - Vitale - Dupuis/Adams
Adams/Tangradi

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02-02-2013, 06:07 PM
  #240
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Forgot to mention this, but I liked what I saw from Boychuk - especially on Sid's line.

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02-02-2013, 06:09 PM
  #241
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Originally Posted by Ugene Malkin View Post
From what I read somewhere Boychuk can play any forward position.

Kunitz - Crosby - Boychuk
Jeffrey - Malkin - Neal
Cooke - Sutter - Kennedy
Glass - Vitale - Dupuis/Adams
Adams/Tangradi
Can he? Interesting. I didn't know that about him. As far as Jeffrey in the lineup goes, I can't see him getting back in until Boychuk or Vitale comes out.

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02-02-2013, 06:12 PM
  #242
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Originally Posted by Ogrezilla View Post
I think he's just saying that our offense should be better than it is with better execution or a better system. Better players would obviously be good, but these players can do better than they are. This offense as is right now has the ability to be better than it has been so far.

then again, I could be wrong. That's what I think he means though.
I'll just use Dupuis as a primary example. God bless him, he's as hard a worker as this franchise has ever had. Seems malleable in terms of coaching, where the guy will be willing to do whatever is asked of him.

But there's a limit to what he can do. Pascal Dupuis can score 30 goals...but he wouldn't be a 30 goal scorer if you catch my drift. It's heart breaking, because he has very good hockey sense, but his body/hands just simply don't allow him to make the right play as often as he'd like to. Imagine how many more goals he would have, and how many more points Sid would have if he had softer hands.

In other words, no "system" is going to change him into anything more than he already is. He's a straight line player that you'll never be able to trust to feather a pass over a stick, or put a put a pass in Sid's wheelhouse, or draw two men towards him and dish off to an open man. He is what he is.

Kunitz is a slightly more talented version than Dupuis. He's got a better touch near the net and has a deceptively good snapper, but even he is nothing more than a straight line guy. The way he butchered two opportunities towards the end of the (second?) when he was on with Sid and Geno is a perfect example. He to, is what he is.

Sorry Ogre, but what's pissing me off today is the phantom stretch passes everyone supposedly saw today. I have no qualms with that argument when it comes to the Isles game, but it was much less against the Rags and this afternoon, it was practically non existent.

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02-02-2013, 06:12 PM
  #243
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And as far as the d'men situation when Nisky returns:

I see Despres sticking, and Bort being the odd man out. I don't think it's wise to have two rookies out there in the playoffs. I loved what i saw from Bort today, and pairing him w/ Engo gives us something we haven't had in years; a scary physical pairing.

I know most people would say for Engo to be the 7th guy, but remember this, he does have more experience. And even if he isn't as physically gifted as the others, he is usually damn solid. Rarely gets out of position. And, since he's the 3rd pairing, he typically is the one playing with the rookies or Joe Melichar's of the world.

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02-02-2013, 06:14 PM
  #244
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Originally Posted by MtlPenFan View Post
I'll just use Dupuis as a primary example. God bless him, he's as hard a worker as this franchise has ever had. Seems malleable in terms of coaching, where the guy will be willing to do whatever is asked of him.

But there's a limit to what he can do. Pascal Dupuis can score 30 goals...but he wouldn't be a 30 goal scorer if you catch my drift. It's heart breaking, because he has very good hockey sense, but his body/hands just simply don't allow him to make the right play as often as he'd like to. Imagine how many more goals he would have, and how many more points Sid would have if he had softer hands.

In other words, no "system" is going to change him into anything more than he already is. He's a straight line player that you'll never be able to trust to feather a pass over a stick, or put a put a pass in Sid's wheelhouse, or draw two men towards him and dish off to an open man. He is what he is.

Kunitz is a slightly more talented version than Dupuis. He's got a better touch near the net and has a deceptively good snapper, but even he is nothing more than a straight line guy. The way he butchered two opportunities towards the end of the (second?) when he was on with Sid and Geno is a perfect example. He to, is what he is.

Sorry Ogre, but what's pissing me off today is the phantom stretch passes everyone supposedly saw today. I have no qualms with that argument when it comes to the Isles game, but it was much less against the Rags and this afternoon, it was practically non existent.
Which is why I think it would be great if Boychuk could somehow work out, AND Shero could find two more wingers on the trade market before the playoffs. That drops Kunitz and Dupuis down to line 3, which is a great situation to have.

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02-02-2013, 06:17 PM
  #245
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Originally Posted by cassius View Post
Tough crowd around here.

Today was about as perfect as a win as you'll find, so I think it's best to just soak it up and enjoy it.

It's easy to be cynical and poke holes in everything, but honestly this was a textbook performance all around.
The first period in my eyes was awful. And our PP still sucked. So whilst it was a nice win, I wouldn't say it's the best you could hope for.

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02-02-2013, 06:18 PM
  #246
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Originally Posted by Terrapin View Post
And as far as the d'men situation when Nisky returns:

I see Despres sticking, and Bort being the odd man out. I don't think it's wise to have two rookies out there in the playoffs. I loved what i saw from Bort today, and pairing him w/ Engo gives us something we haven't had in years; a scary physical pairing.

I know most people would say for Engo to be the 7th guy, but remember this, he does have more experience. And even if he isn't as physically gifted as the others, he is usually damn solid. Rarely gets out of position. And, since he's the 3rd pairing, he typically is the one playing with the rookies or Joe Melichar's of the world.
I don't see us having all three of Martin, Niskanen and Despres on this roster come postseason. I'd go even further to say within a couple weeks of when Niskanen returns, one of them is gone.

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02-02-2013, 06:19 PM
  #247
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I don't see us having all three of Martin, Niskanen and Despres on this roster come postseason. I'd go even further to say within a couple weeks of when Niskanen returns, one of them is gone.
At this point our trade chips appear to be Niskanen, Tangradi, Jeffrey, Kennedy, minor league d-prospects, and draft picks.

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02-02-2013, 06:20 PM
  #248
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I don't see us having all three of Martin, Niskanen and Despres on this roster come postseason. I'd go even further to say within a couple weeks of when Niskanen returns, one of them is gone.
I only see Martin going if he can be traded for some help on the wings.

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02-02-2013, 06:21 PM
  #249
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Originally Posted by MrBurgundy View Post
Which is why I think it would be great if Boychuk could somehow work out, AND Shero could find two more wingers on the trade market before the playoffs. That drops Kunitz and Dupuis down to line 3, which is a great situation to have.
I'm fine with Dupuis or Kunitz hanging with Sid as long as there's an established winger alongside them to be the #2. The way Kunitz is playing, I'd rather it be Dupuis. A third wheel deserves to be playing third wheel.

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02-02-2013, 06:22 PM
  #250
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Originally Posted by MtlPenFan View Post
I'm fine with Dupuis or Kunitz hanging with Sid as long as there's an established winger alongside them to be the #2. The way Kunitz is playing, I'd rather it be Dupuis. A third wheel deserves to be playing third wheel.
As am I. I'd just like to see them bumped down to the 3rd line to play with Sutter, who also is a more straight line player. That scoring depth, and defensively responsible play would be absolutely huge in the playoffs.

It certainly won't be easy to find two top 6 wingers on the trade market, but if I were him, that's what I'd go for.

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