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Sakic+Forsberg vs. Crosby+Malkin

View Poll Results: Which combo is better (prime on prime)?
Sakic + Forsberg 135 52.33%
Crosby + Malkin 116 44.96%
both are equal 7 2.71%
Voters: 258. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
02-04-2013, 01:08 PM
  #76
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I am still in awe of Forsberg's playoff performances.

Were he born in Canada, my god...

Statues.

Monuments.

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02-04-2013, 01:21 PM
  #77
Luigi Lemieux
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Originally Posted by Ferros View Post
Comparing awards/point-/goal finishes isn't really going to do much since it is not against the same competition and I think most of us believe that the competition was a lot tougher during Sakic/Forsbergs primes than it is now.

Also @ "Malkin is much better than Forsberg", guess you just started to watch NHL.
The only players that really skewed any awards for them are Lemieux and Jagr. If you erase them from history you can add 2 art rosses for sakic, and 1 art ross for forsberg. And that's over the course of their entire careers.

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02-04-2013, 01:36 PM
  #78
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Avs fan here. Joe Sakic is my hero. Peter Forsberg is my second fav player ever and I picked Sid and Geno fairly easily here. The question states in their prime. Sid and malkin have a lot left to do to match what sakic and forsberg have done but if you take an individual best season from these players and call it their prime, Crosby and Malkin beat the colorado boys fairly easily.

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02-04-2013, 02:21 PM
  #79
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I don't even understand why people are comparing today's talent to previous talents... I believe the NHL had better talent before the 05' lockout than they do now (or ever will)...so saying Crosby/Malkin won an award in such year(s) and Forsberg/Sakic did not, does not really separate the duos any further...
Do you realize how illogical it is to say that the NHL will never have as high of a talent level as during that time period? I think your nostalgia is clouding your judgement.

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02-04-2013, 06:52 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by live playoff hockey View Post
really? Cause I would take him over Stamkos, Giroux, and Tavares. The only player that is arguably better is Malkin.
Like I said, I question his spot at the top until he can stay healthy and equally productive. Until then, it's hard to not take the scoring machine Stamkos ahead of Crosby.

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02-04-2013, 06:56 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by bambamcam4ever View Post
Do you realize how illogical it is to say that the NHL will never have as high of a talent level as during that time period? I think your nostalgia is clouding your judgement.
You know why they said that right? The idea is that some veteran NHL'ers have been squeezed out of the league by cheaper young talent in the cap era. Combine the league rule changes with the infusion of players lacking experience (especially in the playoffs) and it's not completely illogical.

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02-04-2013, 06:57 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by glovesave_35 View Post
You know why they said that right? The idea is that some veteran NHL'ers have been squeezed out of the league by cheaper young talent in the cap era. Combine the league rule changes with the infusion of players lacking experience (especially in the playoffs) and it's not completely illogical.
Maybe some veteran 3rth and fourth liners, but never a case of a veteran than can finish in the top 10 or challenge Crosby, Malkin.

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02-04-2013, 07:07 PM
  #83
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Maybe some veteran 3rth and fourth liners, but never a case of a veteran than can finish in the top 10 or challenge Crosby, Malkin.
Point being the league was more difficult to play against top to bottom. It's a fundamental difference that effects the way the game is played in the league, not a case of a few individual players who might challenge for league MVP getting pushed out.

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02-04-2013, 07:18 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by glovesave_35 View Post
Point being the league was more difficult to play against top to bottom. It's a fundamental difference that effects the way the game is played in the league, not a case of a few individual players who might challenge for league MVP getting pushed out.
Not sure, depends of the year, because 92-93 with the new expensions was pretty easy for the stars, until 96 would not say that the league was more difficult for all-stars.

And for the 97-98-99-00-01 part Forsberg-Sakic had a very great team.

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02-04-2013, 08:35 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by yuri28 View Post
Are you kidding me? (and that's coming from a huge Geno fan)
No I am not.

There are a few players here that get mentioned in the "hockey god" realm, and he is one of them, along with Jagr, Datsyuk and Federov.

Someone said that if guys like this were Canadian, there would be statues and monuments namd after them or something.

I say just the opposite is true. If they were Canadian, people would go, "Not as good as twenty other guys from Canada".

Instead....god status is achieved. I think Feds, Jagr and Forsberg easily belong in the top 50 of all time. But mentioning them in the same breath as Gretzky, Orr, Lemieux, Howe, Beliveau, the Rocket, even guys like Mike Bossy or Bobby Hull...it's not accurate.

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02-04-2013, 08:39 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by fly4apuckguy View Post
I think Feds, Jagr and Forsberg easily belong in the top 50 of all time. But mentioning them in the same breath as Gretzky, Orr, Lemieux, Howe, Beliveau, the Rocket, even guys like Mike Bossy or Bobby Hull...it's not accurate.
Fedorov shouldn't be mentioned with Jagr and Forsberg though. Talk about a guy that gets overrated, Fedorov is one of them. He should be mentioned with the Modano's of the world, a step below Jagr and Forsberg.

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02-04-2013, 08:42 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by glovesave_35 View Post
Fedorov shouldn't be mentioned with Jagr and Forsberg though.
Do you think Forsberg peaked that much higher than Fedorov 93-94 ? hart + selke.

missing the art-ross to only Gretzky ?

Federov is a good comparable to Forsberg in a lot of way, elite world junior, multiple great playoff (4, 20 points playoff in a row).

Elite two way play, etc...

jagr is also a clear step above Forsberg.

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02-04-2013, 08:45 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by fly4apuckguy View Post
No I am not.

There are a few players here that get mentioned in the "hockey god" realm, and he is one of them, along with Jagr, Datsyuk and Federov.

Someone said that if guys like this were Canadian, there would be statues and monuments namd after them or something.

I say just the opposite is true. If they were Canadian, people would go, "Not as good as twenty other guys from Canada".

Instead....god status is achieved. I think Feds, Jagr and Forsberg easily belong in the top 50 of all time. But mentioning them in the same breath as Gretzky, Orr, Lemieux, Howe, Beliveau, the Rocket, even guys like Mike Bossy or Bobby Hull...it's not accurate.
If Forsberg was Canadian he would be even more popular, given his "Canadian" style of play. And Jagr is probably the 3rd best RW of all-time behind Howe and Richard imo ahead of Bossy.

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02-04-2013, 09:09 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by MadLuke View Post
Do you think Forsberg peaked that much higher than Fedorov 93-94 ? hart + selke.

missing the art-ross to only Gretzky ?

Federov is a good comparable to Forsberg in a lot of way, elite world junior, multiple great playoff (4, 20 points playoff in a row).

Elite two way play, etc...

jagr is also a clear step above Forsberg.
I feel like Fedorov was a clear step behind Forsberg offensively and that his career resume reads a lot better than the body of work would suggest due to one particularly magnificent season.

Jagr may be a clear step above Forsberg but that isn't so much domination on a game to game basis as it is due to career longevity/continued productivity. Cherry pick whichever 5-6 seasons of Fedorov's career and compare them to Forsberg's best 5-6 years and it's not really even a discussion as to who the better player is.

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02-04-2013, 09:16 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by glovesave_35 View Post
I feel like Fedorov was a clear step behind Forsberg offensively and that his career resume reads a lot better than the body of work would suggest due to one particularly magnificent season.

Jagr may be a clear step above Forsberg but that isn't so much domination on a game to game basis as it is due to career longevity/continued productivity. Cherry pick whichever 5-6 seasons of Fedorov's career and compare them to Forsberg's best 5-6 years and it's not really even a discussion as to who the better player is.
your right Federov peak may be the same but not as good prime/career than Forsberg.

Jagr also had a very very dominant game to game period at the end of the 90's.

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02-04-2013, 11:20 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by MadLuke View Post
Do you think Forsberg peaked that much higher than Fedorov 93-94 ? hart + selke.

missing the art-ross to only Gretzky ?

Federov is a good comparable to Forsberg in a lot of way, elite world junior, multiple great playoff (4, 20 points playoff in a row).

Elite two way play, etc...

jagr is also a clear step above Forsberg.
Fedorov's peak was way too short for him to be put in the same category as Jagr.

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02-04-2013, 11:32 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Luigi Lemieux View Post
Fedorov's peak was way too short for him to be put in the same category as Jagr.
I Never did, but peak can be only an instant, a season if long enough to be considered as the peak of a player, your talking prime probably.

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02-04-2013, 11:41 PM
  #93
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easily Malkin and Crosby

people tend to overrate older players because of nostalgia

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02-04-2013, 11:45 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by SteelFish87 View Post
easily Malkin and Crosby

people tend to overrate older players because of nostalgia
Or putting together all their best 20 year's moment in one condensed memory.

Put all the best of sakic and forsberg in a 7 seasons format and they had more success than Crosby-Malkin, about 2 art ross / near season each, one more cups, better olympics, etc....

They do not compare their career before 26 year old i'm pretty sure, and instead of saying let's wait to see if they can have success as long as one time great like sakic... they assume they will never do, even if they had better start.

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02-05-2013, 01:09 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by fly4apuckguy View Post
No I am not.

There are a few players here that get mentioned in the "hockey god" realm, and he is one of them, along with Jagr, Datsyuk and Federov.

Someone said that if guys like this were Canadian, there would be statues and monuments namd after them or something.

I say just the opposite is true. If they were Canadian, people would go, "Not as good as twenty other guys from Canada".

Instead....god status is achieved. I think Feds, Jagr and Forsberg easily belong in the top 50 of all time. But mentioning them in the same breath as Gretzky, Orr, Lemieux, Howe, Beliveau, the Rocket, even guys like Mike Bossy or Bobby Hull...it's not accurate.
Jagr definitely belongs in the same discussion as the Rocket, Beliveau etc. BTW, Bobby Hull was miles better than Mike Bossy and most people would rank him even ahead of the Rocket.

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02-05-2013, 01:24 AM
  #96
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This thread detoriated fast. I went with Sakic Forsberg as it is more prowess in that duo. Besides I hold Malkin a step below the other three, which settles the score.

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02-05-2013, 01:30 AM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Goalsfordinner View Post
Tell me when Super Joe wins an Art Ross and Or a Richard.
Ill just take a Hart trophy and Conn Smythe instead thank you.

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02-05-2013, 01:34 AM
  #98
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Originally Posted by MadLuke View Post
Maurice richard
Guy Lafleur
Gretzky
Lemieux

are also very good choice.
Sakic has the most playoff overtime goals in history...im still taking him.

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02-05-2013, 01:35 AM
  #99
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Ill just take a Hart trophy and Conn Smythe instead thank you.
Pretty sure both Malkin and Crosby have Hart's as well. Also Lindsays.

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02-05-2013, 01:42 AM
  #100
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Originally Posted by bambamcam4ever View Post
In reality, easily Crosby and Malkin. On HF, where players of the past are always greater than those currently playing, Sakic and Forsberg.
Also, for anyone that "easily" takes Crosby and Malkin has clearly never seen super joe and forsberg play...or has even seen highlights or career stats. or probably doesnt even know who they are.

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