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No more penalties in the NHL? No more 5 on 4 or 5 on 3 etc Less power to refs

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02-06-2013, 11:40 AM
  #1
normalpsychology
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No more penalties in the NHL? No more 5 on 4 or 5 on 3 etc Less power to refs

Interesting idea I just had let's discuss.

What if there were no more man advantages in the NHL. Because I don't know about you guys, but to me, hockey is a 5 on 5 sport. Not 5 on 4 or 5 on 3. It allows too much influence from refs which as we've all seen this year, are highly fallible. We've all seen games where the victory was decided by the refs.

Obviously we still need repercussions for behavior that is not allowed, so here's my proposal:

If a player does something that typically warrants 2 minutes in the penalty box, instead, they are removed from the game (either to sit in penalty box or somewhere else). BUT, teams still play 5 on 5, they just can't use that player.

Go

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Old
02-06-2013, 11:42 AM
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good idea!

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02-06-2013, 11:42 AM
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How does this stop coaches from sending goons on the ice just to run people? How does this stop goons from running people without anyone asking him to just because he knows it won't hurt the team?

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02-06-2013, 11:42 AM
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So..you're willing to lose Eric Staal, Jordan Staal, Skinner in Stanley Cup game 7 if they all take penalties?

What if Cam Ward takes a penalty? Are you fine with the back up playing?

Are you saying that they can't be played for 2 mins or the entire game?

I think teams should benefit from the PP/PK...it's an important part of the game.

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02-06-2013, 11:43 AM
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Penalized players should sit in a corner with a dunce cap...they could use the trapezoid area...

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02-06-2013, 11:43 AM
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As a Rangers fan, I approve this message.

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02-06-2013, 11:44 AM
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Better idea: define what is and isn't a penalty more clearly and on any debatable penalty (how you'd determine that is up to you), review it if the officials can't come to a consensus on the ice.

But the bolded is key.

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02-06-2013, 11:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Wamsutta View Post
As a Rangers fan, I approve this message.


As an Isles fan watching our past two games, I also approve this message.

But in all seriousness, this is the worst idea ever. Imagine losing your best players for a relatively minor penalty? That would suck and it would also probably make the game much less chippy because guys would be too scared to make a mistake.

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02-06-2013, 11:45 AM
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I do think the idea of being able to decline a powerplay is interesting, though I'm not sure if it would be of any practical use.

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02-06-2013, 11:45 AM
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Change delay of game to 1 minute.

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02-06-2013, 11:45 AM
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normalpsychology
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pi View Post
So..you're willing to lose Eric Staal, Jordan Staal, Skinner in Stanley Cup game 7 if they all take penalties?

What if Cam Ward takes a penalty? Are you fine with the back up playing?

Are you saying that they can't be played for 2 mins or the entire game?

I think teams should benefit from the PP/PK...it's an important part of the game.
I was thinking 2 mins, not the entire game. But yes, if they all take penalties they should be removed. Isn't it the case currently that if a goalie takes a penalty someone else sits for them? I think in the case of goalies they could keep that. But actually personally I think I would prefer if the goalie sat and the backup took their place.

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02-06-2013, 11:46 AM
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Agree!!! With no Power play, teams like Tampa Bay and Montréal will never win a game again!

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02-06-2013, 11:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quarter View Post
Better idea: define what is and isn't a penalty more clearly and on any debatable penalty (how you'd determine that is up to you), review it if the officials can't come to a consensus on the ice.

But the bolded is key.
There has to be some ability for the referees to use their own judgment, though. Not every hook is the same. Not every trip is the same. If the rules are more clearly defined you either 1) get weighed down in what would essentially end up legalese, nearly every word having its own definition, or 2) players finding ways to get around the rules more easily.

I think we're just going to have to learn to live with the fact that we are humans, and we make mistakes. At least these mistakes will (hopefully) never be the difference between life and death.

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02-06-2013, 11:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Lennay Kekua View Post
What if there were no more man advantages in the NHL. Because I don't know about you guys, but to me, hockey is a 5 on 5 sport. Not 5 on 4 or 5 on 3.
All sports have their types of penalties (except baseball)

In football, you lose yards. In soccer, you get a free kick, a penalty kick if the foul is in the box, and you may even get a player kicked out. In basketball, you get free throws.

In hockey, we have power plays. That is how we assess penalties. That's the way it's always been. It's a big part of what makes the game exciting. To abolish our form of penalties is completely asinine.

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02-06-2013, 11:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quarter View Post
Better idea: define what is and isn't a penalty more clearly and on any debatable penalty (how you'd determine that is up to you), review it if the officials can't come to a consensus on the ice.

But the bolded is key.
As an official myself, I agree. Too much blame is put on the actual officials themselves when in reality it is the vague way that the rulebook is written which causes inconsistency in penalty calling.

The rules of hockey are specifically written to give referees as much judgement as possible, this has become obsolete due to the change in the speed at which the game is played nowadays. The rulebook needs a complete overhaul, in my opinion.

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02-06-2013, 11:49 AM
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Baseball does have penalties on certain plays, or at least I have always been under the impression that is the case. I'm not a baseball fan.

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02-06-2013, 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by ThirdManIn View Post
Baseball does have penalties on certain plays, or at least I have always been under the impression that is the case. I'm not a baseball fan.
There's interference and obstruction, but for the sake of the discussion I'd rather not confuse the OP.

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02-06-2013, 11:51 AM
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Yes, terrific idea, let's destroy the whole system and give players even more incentives to cheat than they already have, just because some refs occasionally make mistakes.

There have been plenty of horrific ideas in this place, but that has to be one of the worst ever. Players take every advantage they get. Whenever the refs slightly slack off in one area it gets exploited to the max, and you want to weaken the penalties?

If anything they have to finally manage to keep a certain standard for more than just a few months to prevent players from slipping back into their old cheater mindset.

You want to see lots of 5-on-5, get the players to play by the rules. The refs don't make penalty-calls just for the heck of it.
Hockey is supposed to be played with as many players as the rules demand. If players continue to break the rules, they sit in the box, and it's entirely their fault.

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02-06-2013, 11:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThirdManIn View Post
Baseball does have penalties on certain plays, or at least I have always been under the impression that is the case. I'm not a baseball fan.
Balk...

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02-06-2013, 11:52 AM
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normalpsychology
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IU Hawks fan View Post
All sports have their types of penalties (except baseball)

In football, you lose yards. In soccer, you get a free kick, a penalty kick if the foul is in the box, and you may even get a player kicked out. In basketball, you get free throws.

In hockey, we have power plays. That is how we assess penalties. That's the way it's always been. It's a big part of what makes the game exciting. To abolish our form of penalties is completely asinine.
I agree it's exciting but it's exciting in the way that watching 5 on 1 or 5 against a goalie would briefly be exciting. Is it fair? Is it really hockey? IDK

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02-06-2013, 11:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IU Hawks fan View Post
There's interference and obstruction, but for the sake of the discussion I'd rather not confuse the OP.
Yeah. Players and managers/coaches can also be tossed from games for certain things. There aren't really penalties in baseball like there are in other sports. I can agree with that for sure.

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02-06-2013, 11:53 AM
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normalpsychology
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Originally Posted by ThirdManIn View Post
How does this stop coaches from sending goons on the ice just to run people? How does this stop goons from running people without anyone asking him to just because he knows it won't hurt the team?
That is the most severe problem , maybe we can think up a solution ITT?

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02-06-2013, 11:53 AM
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One would like to think some of the various "fix the reffing" solutions would be preferred, before we get to such intrusive changes.

There's nothing wrong with powerplays as the repercussion of players doing things against the rules. It's just frustrating at the moment when the rules seemingly aren't applied consistently, play-to-play or game-to-game.

At least it's not automatic penalty shots for every penalty, like a 4-on-4 league.

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Old
02-06-2013, 11:54 AM
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I like it. Let's take it further:

No more desserts after any meal.

No more TV stations besides PBS.

No more of anything on the internet besides scientific data, taking it back to its original intent.

Ban all books besides reference materials.

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Old
02-06-2013, 11:54 AM
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Reduce # of penalties, make it more clear what a penalty is.

Bring back the importance of keeping your head up, and not turning your back to a player who is going to hit you. If you get hit with your head down, and if you're about to get hit and you turn around, it's honestly your fault. That's how we grew up playing the game, that's how we grew up watching the game.

If a fight comes after a clean hit, give the agitator 2 mins for instigating, brings back clean hits.

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