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2013 NHL draft lacks depth of talent

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Old
02-05-2013, 03:00 PM
  #26
George Maharis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandV View Post
Yeah I'm really not sure what you're talking about, did you bother to look at how few 1st liners come out of other drafts?

Plus from your list I'd qualify Michalek and Horton as 1st liners. Not star players but they're more than adequate as a top line winger. A.Kostytsin played in that range as well, but rather than bust of course he simply left for the KHL. You also have two dmen in the list, Coburn who's a legit top 4 dman (comparable enough to a 1st line winger like Horton/Michalek) and Shawn Belle who was a bust.

You're not really doing your homework here. But the 2003 draft was as much about depth as it was talent. The very top end in it wasn't all that great compared to other years.
Their article isn't talking about other drafts.... it's talking about 2003 and 2013. They are talking about 1ST LINE PLAYERS, not players "in that range" or "top-4".. and to top it off, the defensive position has a first line too..

Just because Horton and Michalek are more adequate on the first line, doesn't mean that they are first liners.. The fact is that they aren't on the first line on their team, so I don't count them.

How can they say that one draft that is predicted to have 8-10 first liners is "lacking in depth" when the one they compare it too has, from what i've shown (and lines may be different because of the source) basically the same..?? It makes no sense.. and that's what i'm trying to show.

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02-05-2013, 03:19 PM
  #27
Riellyfan04
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They said that 2011 was crap too but it looks like it was pretty good.. So you never know.. Hopefuly these 2 scouts are wrong.

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02-05-2013, 03:59 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by rey72335 View Post
I think it should be more like that.

1991 NHL Draft gave 10 All Stars in the first round (13 by #30)
1993 NHL Draft gave 11 All Stars in the first round (11 by #30)
1997 NHL Draft gave 10 All Stars in the first round (10 by #30)
2003 NHL Draft gave 14 All Stars in the first round

What makes '03 so superior to '91, when there was only a 1 All Star difference? I never hear about '91 in regards to "the best drafts".. And you can't play the "they had 12 years more to play" card, because '03 gets compared to '79 all the time.
Because with any draft you start at the top. when picks #2 & #4 are pretty much busts (in terms of top 5 talent) and 4 of the top 10 don't look like they should have been anywhere near the top 10 it makes the draft not look as good as it was.

Plus using all-star appearances is kind of a poor way to judge since the all-star selection format has always been a joke.

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02-05-2013, 04:03 PM
  #29
DuckJet
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Why am I not surprised to see this thread?

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02-05-2013, 05:36 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by The Great Below View Post
Lot of good players predicted to go in second round. Way more than most drafts.


Last edited by BrimStone64: 02-05-2013 at 11:45 PM.
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02-05-2013, 05:42 PM
  #31
joe89
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Not sure why it's so intriguing to compare draft classes in the first place. Maybe the first few picks in every draft, but after that you'll have to wait 5-10 years before you can pass judgement anyway.

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02-05-2013, 05:50 PM
  #32
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The Top 8 is mind bloggling.

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02-06-2013, 01:53 PM
  #33
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I don't agree that this draft class lacks depth. But I can see how scouts might see it that way. Players who were suppose to provide depth to the first round haven't been living up to expectation (like Alex Forsberg, Curtis Lazar, Anthony Duclair and Hudson Fasching.)

In Europe, there's been some impact on prospects by NHLers taking ice time during the lockout.

There's going to be really good players coming out of the later rounds, but they might not be as well-known or guaranteed as it might have looked coming into the season.

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02-06-2013, 02:06 PM
  #34
Nullus Reverentia
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Difference of opinion others disagree with this and their opinions matter just as much.

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02-06-2013, 02:49 PM
  #35
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The first round this year is WAY beyond the last three years in terms of where they all are predraft.

And 2003 was an amazing draft because of the elite talent found in the first round(14 i believe) but look at rounds 2-7 and you will see some amazing players.

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02-06-2013, 02:53 PM
  #36
DuckJet
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I'm not buying this. If guys like Gauthier, Morrissey, Lazar, Domi, Mantha, Duclair, Erne, Hagg, Horvat can be had past pick 15 I don't think it's weak at all. We're gonna see this be said about every draft year from now on I think.

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02-06-2013, 02:58 PM
  #37
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If it does lack "depth of talent", that will only be proven in hindsight.

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02-06-2013, 03:08 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ToursLepantoVienna View Post
If it does lack "depth of talent", that will only be proven in hindsight.
As it usually is. 2011 sucked. Until 2013 when we realized it didn't actually suck that badly. 2012 was great until January when we realized it sucked. Until 2013 when we realized it didn't suck too bad. 2013 was great until February and we later will find out that it didn't suck as bad as we thought but 2014 is obviously going to lack a depth of talent.

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02-06-2013, 03:27 PM
  #39
zjh
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What does depth mean? They only talk about there being a lack of talent from the second half of the 1st round. I think this years 30-120 is better than last year.

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02-06-2013, 04:26 PM
  #40
arsmaster
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There are approximately 25 guys you would generally consider top 25 picks this year IMO.

That is depth.

There is also a significant number of players who would also generally be ranked top 30 that are not this year.

I'd say the top end is very good, and the depth is excellent....hit me back in 2018 to see if I was right LOL.

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02-06-2013, 04:38 PM
  #41
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I find the top 6 in MacKinnon, Jones, Barkov, Lindholm, Drouin, and Monahan to be as good or better than any recent draft, after that their are still very good players who have very high potential, this will be a very good draft.

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02-06-2013, 04:48 PM
  #42
EichHart
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckJet View Post
I'm not buying this. If guys like Gauthier, Morrissey, Lazar, Domi, Mantha, Duclair, Erne, Hagg, Horvat can be had past pick 15 I don't think it's weak at all. We're gonna see this be said about every draft year from now on I think.
I agree completely this draft is very deep...Especially the first 20 or so picks.

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02-06-2013, 04:53 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by ManByng View Post
^I never thought it was all that great...don't understand why people think it was?
Almost half that drafts first round are considered stars/first liners, the entire first round played in the NHL and there were some great guys taken in the second round. It was a ridiculous draft

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02-06-2013, 04:53 PM
  #44
DuckJet
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Originally Posted by Awwufelloff View Post
I agree completely this draft is very deep...Especially the first 20 or so picks.
I mean it's a slight (very slight mind you) bummer that we start playing well in a draft year like this (what I would've given to exchange that 6th overall pick in 2012 for one this year) but assuming we go deep into the playoffs but not all the way, I still like our chances of nabbing a quality prospect.

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02-06-2013, 05:09 PM
  #45
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According to Gare Joyce's Future Great's and Heartbreak's (Gare i know you read HF so if i'm miss-quoting you, i'm sorry it's been probably 4-5 years since i read the book):

Outside the top 10 1st rounders only have about a 25% chance of playing regular minutes in the NHL.

Outside that it drops dramatically. In fact, round 2 players make the nhl as often as players from round 4. Thus if possible you're usually better of trading a mid 2nd round pick for 2 round 4's or a 3rd and 4th.

Any draft that produces talent above that average, in my opinion is a good draft.

I think both 2012, and 2013 will have more than 1/4 players outside the top 10 play regular minutes in the NHL.

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02-06-2013, 05:46 PM
  #46
DuckJet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PumpkinBomb View Post
According to Gare Joyce's Future Great's and Heartbreak's (Gare i know you read HF so if i'm miss-quoting you, i'm sorry it's been probably 4-5 years since i read the book):

Outside the top 10 1st rounders only have about a 25% chance of playing regular minutes in the NHL.

Outside that it drops dramatically. In fact, round 2 players make the nhl as often as players from round 4. Thus if possible you're usually better of trading a mid 2nd round pick for 2 round 4's or a 3rd and 4th.

Any draft that produces talent above that average, in my opinion is a good draft.

I think both 2012, and 2013 will have more than 1/4 players outside the top 10 play regular minutes in the NHL.
Agreed. It likely won't be the next 2003, but then again, did anyone expect 2003 to be as good as it was pre-draft? I know the players were highly touted compared to other classes but I'm not so sure people expected that draft to be quite THAT good. I doubt anyone knew it would be the best draft class of all time.

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Old
02-06-2013, 05:54 PM
  #47
SmellOfVictory
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Originally Posted by rey72335 View Post
2003 was full of first liners eh?

(3rd) Nathan Horton - 2nd line.
(4th) Nikolai Zherdev - Not in NHL.
(6th) Milan Michalek - 2nd line.
(8th) Braydon Coburn - 2nd line.
(10th) Andrei Kostitsyn - Not in NHL.
(12th) Hugh Jessiman - AHL.
(15th) Robert Nilsson - Not in NHL.
(16th) Steve Bernier - 3rd line.
(18th) Eric Fehr - 4th line.
(22nd) Marc Antoine Pouliot - Not in NHL.
(25th) Anthony Stewart - AHL.
(26th) Brian Boyle - 3rd line.
(27th) Jeff Tambellini - Not in NHL.
(30th) Shawn Belle - Not in NHL.

Perhaps the 2003 draft wasn't as good as we thought...
Horton and Michalek are both 1st line wingers; not high-end ones, but 1st line nonetheless. And Zherdev is one of the top scoring forwards in the KHL.

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Old
02-06-2013, 06:36 PM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rey72335 View Post
2003 was full of first liners eh?

(3rd) Nathan Horton - 2nd line.
(4th) Nikolai Zherdev - Not in NHL.
(6th) Milan Michalek - 2nd line.
(8th) Braydon Coburn - 2nd line.
(10th) Andrei Kostitsyn - Not in NHL.
(12th) Hugh Jessiman - AHL.
(15th) Robert Nilsson - Not in NHL.
(16th) Steve Bernier - 3rd line.
(18th) Eric Fehr - 4th line.
(22nd) Marc Antoine Pouliot - Not in NHL.
(25th) Anthony Stewart - AHL.
(26th) Brian Boyle - 3rd line.
(27th) Jeff Tambellini - Not in NHL.
(30th) Shawn Belle - Not in NHL.

Perhaps the 2003 draft wasn't as good as we thought...
This is a horrendous post. How about you compare it to nearly every other draft instead of using some deranged strawman argument.

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Old
02-06-2013, 07:14 PM
  #49
DuckJet
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Originally Posted by Aucoin11 View Post
This is a horrendous post. How about you compare it to nearly every other draft instead of using some deranged strawman argument.
You are on a roll. I actually agree with you but apparently everyone on HF is deranged

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Old
02-06-2013, 07:52 PM
  #50
Pierce Hawthorne
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Strongly disagree with this.

This draft has very strong potential, especially for the Top 10, and IMO The Top 20.

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