HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Pittsburgh Penguins
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

MacIntyre and the changing role of the enforcer

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-14-2013, 03:44 PM
  #1
STLPensFan
Registered User
 
STLPensFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: STL, MO
Posts: 129
vCash: 500
MacIntyre and the changing role of the enforcer

Are people happier to have MacIntyre sitting in the AHL now? I know there were some rumblings when we resigned him and parked him in WBS. Will Engo be sufficient to keep the peace at the end of the season when we play again? Do we sit Cooke? Do we sit Crosby? Both? Neither? Bring Smacker up? Does Cooke have to fight his own battle? Does Smacker lineup along with him on Cooke's first shift like he did when Vitale had to answer the call against Philly?

The larger questions here are does this incident illustrate the value of an enforcer or illustrate how long gone that era is?


Last edited by STLPensFan: 02-14-2013 at 03:45 PM. Reason: wording
STLPensFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 03:49 PM
  #2
Darth Vitale
Moderator
Dark Matter
 
Darth Vitale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Darkness
Country: United States
Posts: 27,513
vCash: 500
I've never been a big fan of enforcers being part of hockey but sometimes I do wonder if the Pens' "toughness by committee" approach works in situations like last night. In the end though Cooke handled it well and the refs took care of problem before it got out of hand... technically that's what we want to happen. Anyway while we have a number of guys willing to fight, only one of those guys is actually a good fighter / can throw some heavy punches, and that's Engo.

Even so I don't think we'd call him a "heavyweight". Thing is heavyweights are useless most of the time and you don't know which games they'll be needed. Last night a good example of that: no coach would anticipate needing an enforcer against Ottawa. Most likely he'd get called vs. Philly, NYI, maybe Boston. So for times when needed against non-rivals, chances are good they won't be there unless you're going to use up a roster slot on a bum who gets 4 minutes a game every night.

Darth Vitale is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 04:03 PM
  #3
billybudd
5 cups pls
 
billybudd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 18,720
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by STLPensFan View Post
Are people happier to have MacIntyre sitting in the AHL now? I know there were some rumblings when we resigned him and parked him in WBS. Will Engo be sufficient to keep the peace at the end of the season when we play again? Do we sit Cooke? Do we sit Crosby? Both? Neither? Bring Smacker up? Does Cooke have to fight his own battle? Does Smacker lineup along with him on Cooke's first shift like he did when Vitale had to answer the call against Philly?

The larger questions here are does this incident illustrate the value of an enforcer or illustrate how long gone that era is?
I see what you're getting at, but MacIntyre's a bad example. Even by "enforcer" standards, this guy really can't play hockey. I'm not convinced he could have cemented a roster spot in this league back when every team had at least one 3 shift a night enforcer dressed every night.

billybudd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 04:17 PM
  #4
MichiganWolverines
Big Mac Attack
 
MichiganWolverines's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Brampton, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,657
vCash: 500
I understand why people don't like enforcers, but I wouldn't see a problem dressing Steve MacIntyre for games against teams who have toughness. There are many teams in the Eastern Conference that have an enforcer, and I don't want to see Deryk Engelland fighting enforcers too often since he's a solid bottom-pairing defenseman. Deryk Engelland's first two fights of the season were against Colton Orr and Krys Barch, who can't play hockey for ****.

MichiganWolverines is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 04:27 PM
  #5
Zen Arcade
Seen Spaling?
 
Zen Arcade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Pittsburgh
Country: United States
Posts: 18,713
vCash: 500
It wouldn't surprise me if MacIntyre was up for the game in April.

Although, Ottawa doesn't really have much after Neil.

You've got a couple decent, willing fighters in Zach Smith and Mark Borowiecki, and then pretty much nothing. There's no comparison, to say, the Isles situation where they could roll out Gillies, Haley, Martin and Konopka.

Zen Arcade is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 04:31 PM
  #6
Tasty Biscuits
with fancy sauce
 
Tasty Biscuits's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 7,055
vCash: 500
Engo is good enough for us I'd say.

Mac is much more needed in the minors, where things tend to get out of hand a bit more often.

Tasty Biscuits is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 04:49 PM
  #7
Ziggyjoe21
Registered User
 
Ziggyjoe21's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Pitt
Country: Ukraine
Posts: 7,911
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Ziggyjoe21
Enforcers like Mac and Godard are not just useless, they're a liability and an embarrassment.

We have Engo and Glass and even Adams to fight if needed.

Ziggyjoe21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 05:07 PM
  #8
wej20
Registered User
 
wej20's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Bracknell,UK
Country: Wales
Posts: 24,778
vCash: 500
I don't mind having him as a nuclear option down in WBS who can be called on if desperate but even if you fight, to play regular at the NHL level you have to be able to handle 8-10 mins of ice time.

wej20 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 05:11 PM
  #9
Jacob
Registered User
 
Jacob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 33,481
vCash: 549
Quote:
Originally Posted by wej20 View Post
I don't mind having him as a nuclear option down in WBS who can be called on if desperate
I agree with this. A guy like him might only be needed for a half dozen games a year (Islanders last year, Flyers at the end of the season, Ottawa this year) but its nice to have a *legit* heavyweight somewhere in the system.

And in between those games he can be a good deterrent in the minor league. Less cheap shots can only help our prospects.

Jacob is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 05:45 PM
  #10
Honour Over Glory
Registered User
 
Honour Over Glory's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: North America
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 17,539
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by STLPensFan View Post
Are people happier to have MacIntyre sitting in the AHL now? I know there were some rumblings when we resigned him and parked him in WBS. Will Engo be sufficient to keep the peace at the end of the season when we play again? Do we sit Cooke? Do we sit Crosby? Both? Neither? Bring Smacker up? Does Cooke have to fight his own battle? Does Smacker lineup along with him on Cooke's first shift like he did when Vitale had to answer the call against Philly?

The larger questions here are does this incident illustrate the value of an enforcer or illustrate how long gone that era is?
I'd call up Mac for the next Sens game, just for insurance in case Neil decides to jump players instead of going with a willing combatant (which Engelland gladly would have been had he asked).

Honour Over Glory is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 05:46 PM
  #11
Honour Over Glory
Registered User
 
Honour Over Glory's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: North America
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 17,539
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggyjoe21 View Post
Enforcers like Mac and Godard are not just useless, they're a liability and an embarrassment.

We have Engo and Glass and even Adams to fight if needed.
Glass & Engo can actually win fights, Adams is just am embarrassment.

Honour Over Glory is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 05:50 PM
  #12
lampshade*
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 2,301
vCash: 500
if Mac is dressed for next Sens game Neil will run like a scared dog. I would like to see Big Mac in that game

lampshade* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 05:55 PM
  #13
Terrapin
Registered User
 
Terrapin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 5,986
vCash: 500
Nowadays, the best 'enforcers' are guys like Neil and Engelland; guys that can actually play. But I would definitely have Mac in the lineup for Ottawa next game, against the Bruins, and maybe the Leafs (who have seemed to turn into the Isles from a few years ago). Craig Adams, Vitale, Kennedy, etc are solid players. But sitting them for one game here and there isn't going to kill us. And as someone else said, even though Engo's awesome, I don't want to see him taking on goons like John Scott.

Terrapin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 05:58 PM
  #14
Terrapin
Registered User
 
Terrapin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 5,986
vCash: 500
As far as the next Sens game, what 'happens' is going to be up to Cooke. If he immediately squares off with Neil to get it over with, then it'll likely be done. Similar to how he answered in Boston to Thorton. But if he doesn't, or if he doesn't play that game, then it'll probably be open season on Sid, Geno, etc.

Terrapin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 06:03 PM
  #15
Jacob
Registered User
 
Jacob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 33,481
vCash: 549
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terrapin View Post
As far as the next Sens game, what 'happens' is going to be up to Cooke. If he immediately squares off with Neil to get it over with, then it'll likely be done. Similar to how he answered in Boston to Thorton. But if he doesn't, or if he doesn't play that game, then it'll probably be open season on Sid, Geno, etc.
Not comparable situations. Cooke shouldn't have to fight a legit enforcer for a completely accidental play.

Jacob is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 06:09 PM
  #16
turd
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 896
vCash: 500
The thing with Thornton or Parros or even Orr lately is that they can take a semi-regular shift and chip in offensively now and again. MacIntyre has less than zero skill. He's worthless.

turd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 06:17 PM
  #17
Zen Arcade
Seen Spaling?
 
Zen Arcade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Pittsburgh
Country: United States
Posts: 18,713
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by turd View Post
The thing with Thornton or Parros or even Orr lately is that they can take a semi-regular shift and chip in offensively now and again. MacIntyre has less than zero skill. He's worthless.
Yeah, but there's still nothing wrong with keeping a guy like him in the AHL, just in case.

I've said that I don't think he's done enough, even in Wilkes-Barre, but it's still in the back of other players' minds that if he goes off, pretty much no one can do anything about it.

Zen Arcade is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 06:36 PM
  #18
turd
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 896
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zen Arcade View Post
Yeah, but there's still nothing wrong with keeping a guy like him in the AHL, just in case.

I've said that I don't think he's done enough, even in Wilkes-Barre, but it's still in the back of other players' minds that if he goes off, pretty much no one can do anything about it.
No doubt. If the writing is clearly on the wall, I have no problem with dressing him, but if not, I'll take my chances with Engo/Glass/Kennedy or whoever else wants to step up.

turd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 06:41 PM
  #19
Terrapin
Registered User
 
Terrapin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 5,986
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob View Post
Not comparable situations. Cooke shouldn't have to fight a legit enforcer for a completely accidental play.
Yeah, but it doesn't really matter if you, I, or Cooke thinks it's accidental does it? Ottawa certainly doesn't, as evidenced by the statements of their idiot coach and GM. And to be honest, I don't really blame them.

Terrapin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 06:42 PM
  #20
MetalheadPenguinsFan
Disco Is Dead!!!
 
MetalheadPenguinsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Kitchener, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 28,172
vCash: 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob View Post
Not comparable situations. Cooke shouldn't have to fight a legit enforcer for a completely accidental play.
I agree.

Plus Neil had his fun roughing up Cooke last night.

As of now, this whole thing should be over...period.

MetalheadPenguinsFan is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 06:45 PM
  #21
Terrapin
Registered User
 
Terrapin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 5,986
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by turd View Post
No doubt. If the writing is clearly on the wall, I have no problem with dressing him, but if not, I'll take my chances with Engo/Glass/Kennedy or whoever else wants to step up.
Having a lineup consisting of Mac, Engo, Glass, and Bortuzzo, plus guys like Vitale, TK, etc easily makes us the 'toughest' team in the league, or close to it. I doubt all those guys will ever dress at once, and rightfully so. But no other team could match that, except maybe Boston. Now if Ottawa calls up a few goons from the AHL next game, then it could get ugly.

Terrapin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 06:47 PM
  #22
MetalheadPenguinsFan
Disco Is Dead!!!
 
MetalheadPenguinsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Kitchener, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 28,172
vCash: 114
It's times like this where I miss Asham.

MetalheadPenguinsFan is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 07:10 PM
  #23
Zen Arcade
Seen Spaling?
 
Zen Arcade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Pittsburgh
Country: United States
Posts: 18,713
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terrapin View Post
Having a lineup consisting of Mac, Engo, Glass, and Bortuzzo, plus guys like Vitale, TK, etc easily makes us the 'toughest' team in the league, or close to it. I doubt all those guys will ever dress at once, and rightfully so. But no other team could match that, except maybe Boston. Now if Ottawa calls up a few goons from the AHL next game, then it could get ugly.
They really don't have anyone.

Mark Borowiecki is a physical defenseman that will fight from time to time, similar to Bortuzzo, but they don't really have anything else, Darren Kramer fights a lot, but he's in the ECHL and he's really nothing special.

Like I said, they can't roll out a lineup like the Isles did.

Zen Arcade is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 07:22 PM
  #24
Ogrezilla
Nerf Herder
 
Ogrezilla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 44,583
vCash: 500
if a guy can't play at least 10 minutes a night when needed, I don't want him on my team.

As far as the idea of bringing Mac up for teams with a tough guy so Engo doesn't have to fight him, I have a simple question. How about nobody fights him? Let them waste a roster spot. Staged fights are the dumbest thing in the world. Do Engo and Orr ever fight for a reason? No, they are a damn side show. Just play hockey

Ogrezilla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-14-2013, 07:27 PM
  #25
Ogrezilla
Nerf Herder
 
Ogrezilla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 44,583
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honour Over Glory View Post
I'd call up Mac for the next Sens game, just for insurance in case Neil decides to jump players instead of going with a willing combatant (which Engelland gladly would have been had he asked).
serious question, what will Mac do to prevent this from the bench?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MetalheadPenguinsFan View Post
It's times like this where I miss Asham.
and then we play the rangers and its pretty obvious Glass is a better hockey player

Ogrezilla is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:36 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2016 All Rights Reserved.