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Old
02-07-2013, 10:38 PM
  #101
Ogrezilla
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Originally Posted by MrBurgundy View Post
Engelland is playing great, but right now I'd rather see how this d-lineup would look if everybody was healthy and Engo was on the bench with Bortuzzo in his place.
if someone has to sit, he's my choice too. dress 7 D if we ever need him in for fighting.

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Old
02-07-2013, 10:38 PM
  #102
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No, we don't. But, I've seen enough of Nisky in Dallas and Pittsburgh during the playoffs to know what he brings to the table (good and bad).
I just think Niskanen needs a good defensive minded partner. I'd like to at least see Bortuzzo tried with him when he gets healthy.

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02-07-2013, 10:39 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by IcedCapp View Post
I hate to be over the top, but Despres had made some passes (Made one today in the 1st period again) that I don't think anyone else on the team makes. He has amazing vision and can get a puck through traffic. I don't want him sat, I really don't. I hate to say that Niskanen got Wally Pipped, but he kinda did.

That's why I said he should be the one moved for whatever Shero's plan is - IF someone has to be moved.
Or just try sitting Engelland and see what Bortuzzo and Niskanen can do together.

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Old
02-07-2013, 10:40 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by shizno View Post
-Those who were writing off the team after we were down 1-0
Dude no one is writing off the team. Almost everyone who expresses concern about our system and the coaching, does so in the context that it works OK in the regular season and not at all in the post season (the last three years). No one is saying we can't win regular season games; we're sayign Bylsma needs to vary his game plan some and have a back-up plan when his dump-and-grind system doesn't work.

+ Oats is a horrifically bad coach. Like I said earlier, makes Disco look like an evil genius.

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02-07-2013, 10:42 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by MrBurgundy View Post
Or just try sitting Engelland and see what Bortuzzo and Niskanen can do together.
Yeah, that's fine, but I like what Engelland brings, too. I like that toughness and physicality.

The one thing I'll say, this is the most physical D we've had in ... a while (not an original thought, I know), but if you sit -anyone- for Nisky, it's going to get less physical. Not sure how I feel about that.

somewhat unrelated:

Hopefully what the coaches learned tonight is: when you have Crosby and Malkin on the same PP, you don't need a flashy Dman on the point. A calming presence who can make good decisions is far more important.

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02-07-2013, 10:44 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by KIRK View Post
No, we don't. But, I've seen enough of Nisky in Dallas and Pittsburgh during the playoffs to know what he brings to the table (good and bad).
That's not fair in the least. While last year's series with Philly was a team wide mess, to me Nisky was easily our best defenseman and bright spot. He played great the entire season, and continued it in the (short) playoffs, and he continued it on into this season.

I'm not going to look at his time in Dallas as sophomore, and certainly not his pairing with Lovejoy during the Tampa series.

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Old
02-07-2013, 10:44 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by IcedCapp View Post
Yeah, that's fine, but I like what Engelland brings, too. I like that toughness and physicality.

The one thing I'll say, this is the most physical D we've had in ... a while (not an original thought, I know), but if you sit -anyone- for Nisky, it's going to get less physical. Not sure how I feel about that.

somewhat unrelated:

Hopefully what the coaches learned tonight is: when you have Crosby and Malkin on the same PP, you don't need a flashy Dman on the point. A calming presence who can make good decisions is far more important
.
What's the money line on this in Vegas? Guess is bet 80 to win 30 on DIDN'T LEARN.

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Old
02-07-2013, 10:46 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by IcedCapp View Post
Yeah, that's fine, but I like what Engelland brings, too. I like that toughness and physicality.

The one thing I'll say, this is the most physical D we've had in ... a while (not an original thought, I know), but if you sit -anyone- for Nisky, it's going to get less physical. Not sure how I feel about that.
Oh I love what Engelland brings. That makes him the absolutely perfect #7 defenseman. If you need toughness in the lineup, you have a great guy to dress.

I just want to see how we play with Engelland out of the lineup for a few games before we make any decisions on whether somebody needs traded.

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02-07-2013, 10:47 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by KIRK View Post
What's the money line on this in Vegas? Guess is bet 80 to win 30 on DIDN'T LEARN.
Taking Letang off the first unit is like trying to give Sid and Geno separate units.

You wanna do it, but you kinda can't.

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02-07-2013, 10:48 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by MtlPenFan View Post
Taking Letang off the first unit is like trying to give Sid and Geno separate units.

You wanna do it, but you kinda can't.
I think the easier decision is taking Kunitz off...

He's played great lately, but that PP needs a calming presence more than a net front guy, which can be filled by Neal anyway.

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02-07-2013, 10:50 PM
  #111
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Engelland is our only legitimate fighter I do not want him sitting out. It's nice to have him in there and know that if anyone takes liberties they'll have to deal with him.

Regardless of how the Pens do it though having 7 good defensemen is a good problem to have.

As for Malkin and his line, I'd love to make a trade for him but regardless we're winning right now so I don't know if Boychuk should be taken out. I certainly don't think Tangradi or Jeffrey would do any better and I don't want to try breaking up that third or fourth line again as the Sutter/Vitale lines look great. Glass belongs with Vitale and Kennedy belongs with Sutter and if we start ****in with that again it's gonna hurt our bottom six.

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02-07-2013, 10:51 PM
  #112
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I think I like Martin with the first PP unit in small doses. But over the long run, there's just no reason for opposing teams to respect his shot from the point, and a well-coached playoff team is going to be able to successfully cheat on the pass because of it.

Plus Martin played 28:08 (!) tonight because of that extra power play time. I think they can use him as a change-up when the first-unit isn't clicking during a game, but he's so effective playing his even-strength role with Orpik that I'd hate to dilute that.

Regardless, it's nice to have some options.

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02-07-2013, 10:53 PM
  #113
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circling back to stuff from earlier, here's the only quote I can find on Ovechkin, but I see a lot of people pushing the quote without showing the question, which changes it:

Quote:
How angry are you that you didn't start the game?...

"Angry enough."

Quote:
Originally Posted by shureshot66 View Post
I think I like Martin with the first PP unit in small doses. But over the long run, there's just no reason for opposing teams to respect his shot from the point, and a well-coached playoff team is going to be able to successfully cheat on the pass because of it.

Plus Martin played 28:08 (!) tonight because of that extra power play time. I think they can use him as a change-up when the first-unit isn't clicking during a game, but he's so effective playing his even-strength role with Orpik that I'd hate to dilute that.

Regardless, it's nice to have some options.
I was JUST looking at TOI numbers, over 6-minutes of special teams time, holy smokes.

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Old
02-07-2013, 11:00 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by shureshot66 View Post
I think I like Martin with the first PP unit in small doses. But over the long run, there's just no reason for opposing teams to respect his shot from the point, and a well-coached playoff team is going to be able to successfully cheat on the pass because of it.

Plus Martin played 28:08 (!) tonight because of that extra power play time. I think they can use him as a change-up when the first-unit isn't clicking during a game, but he's so effective playing his even-strength role with Orpik that I'd hate to dilute that.

Regardless, it's nice to have some options.
I think this season though, Martin has been shooting the puck for the purposes of a redirect. He's been able to get his shots through. If teams don't respect that when guys like Crosby are on the ice (probably the best hand-eye coordinated player in the NHL), then that's their loss.

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02-07-2013, 11:01 PM
  #115
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I think one thing is for certain...we've definitely upped Martin's stock back to where it was when he was signed by us. This is good news, because we will be able to get something for him via trade in the off-season. I still think we can't afford his salary, with Malkin and Letang needing new deals and with a new winger on the horizon (an expensive one).

Moving him to the right side and playing him with Orpik will prove to be a massive coup for us, which will end up justifying not only a Martin off-season deal but also last summer's Michalek deal (because if Michalek were still here, Martin would be playing on the left side still).

All told, this situation is panning out nicely.

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Old
02-07-2013, 11:02 PM
  #116
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Might have been posted here already, but Despres is now tied for 3rd in rookie defense scoring behind Schultz and Postma, while seeing much less TOI and PPTOI.

He leads all rookie defensemen in ES points, with 4.

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02-07-2013, 11:13 PM
  #117
shureshot66
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Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
Might have been posted here already, but Despres is now tied for 3rd in rookie defense scoring behind Schultz and Postma, while seeing much less TOI and PPTOI.

He leads all rookie defensemen in ES points, with 4.
...meanwhile, Ovechkin has zero even-strength goals through 11 games.

Not that the two are in any way comparable. But amusing all the same.

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02-07-2013, 11:13 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
I think one thing is for certain...we've definitely upped Martin's stock back to where it was when he was signed by us. This is good news, because we will be able to get something for him via trade in the off-season. I still think we can't afford his salary, with Malkin and Letang needing new deals and with a new winger on the horizon (an expensive one).

Moving him to the right side and playing him with Orpik will prove to be a massive coup for us, which will end up justifying not only a Martin off-season deal but also last summer's Michalek deal (because if Michalek were still here, Martin would be playing on the left side still).

All told, this situation is panning out nicely.
Is this what Shero told you?

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02-07-2013, 11:18 PM
  #119
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You know, Bort would make for one hell of an ugly woman.

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02-07-2013, 11:18 PM
  #120
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Joe Starkey ‏@JoeStarkey1
Bortuzzo said some fans enjoyed his work against Ovechkin tonight. This is what they told him as he sat in box ... http://sulia.com/c/pittsburgh-pengui...7d03f05bd9cc/?

Quote:
Bortuzzo said some fans enjoyed his work against Ovechkin tonight. This is what they told him as he sat in box ...
Bortuzzo made the most of his 16:59 of ice time, engaging Ovechkin more than once and delivering four hits and a blocked shot. I caught up with him for a few minutes after the game, and I wondered if he sensed how much the fans enjoyed his battles with Ovie.

“I heard a couple of '2 minutes well worth it’ when I was in the box," Bortuzzo said. "The rivalry is well-documented, and (Ovechkin's) a part of that. That’s a way I can contribute to our team."

Dan Bylsma was effusive in his praise of Bortuzzo after the game, saying he remembered Bortuzzo fighting every tough guy in the AHL and playing with some "sandpaper" in his game.

Bortuzzo said tonight was typical of the player he is.

"That's kind of the way I’m going to have to play – play hard against some of the top-end guys," he said. "(Ovechkin) is a competitor. He’s not going to back down from any of that stuff, so obviously I’m going to try to get into that stuff and play him hard."

Was it fun?
“Yeah, it’s kind of been the way I’ve played for all my career in the AHL. Some of that back and forth, I have no problem with that.”

I told Bortuzzo he might have a little Scuderi/Gill in his game and wondered if he sees himself as that kind of take-care-of-the-house defenseman:

"Absolutely. I’ve been able to see what Rob Scuderi went through in his career. He played a lot of games in Wilkes-Barre. You look at him now, and he’s a world-class defenseman. If I could watch guys like that and Brooks and Marty (Paul Martin), it can only help my game." 40 minutes ago
I love Bortuzzo's comments. His mentality is exactly what this team needs.

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02-07-2013, 11:24 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by MrBurgundy View Post
Joe Starkey ‏@JoeStarkey1
Bortuzzo said some fans enjoyed his work against Ovechkin tonight. This is what they told him as he sat in box ... http://sulia.com/c/pittsburgh-pengui...7d03f05bd9cc/?



I love Bortuzzo's comments. His mentality is exactly what this team needs.
Doesn't sound like a guy who's going to see the press box anytime soon-- even when Nisky returns-- to me.

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02-07-2013, 11:25 PM
  #122
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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
I think one thing is for certain...we've definitely upped Martin's stock back to where it was when he was signed by us. This is good news, because we will be able to get something for him via trade in the off-season. I still think we can't afford his salary, with Malkin and Letang needing new deals and with a new winger on the horizon (an expensive one).

Moving him to the right side and playing him with Orpik will prove to be a massive coup for us, which will end up justifying not only a Martin off-season deal but also last summer's Michalek deal (because if Michalek were still here, Martin would be playing on the left side still).

All told, this situation is panning out nicely.
A 64.3M cap next year makes that pretty much impossible.

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02-07-2013, 11:28 PM
  #123
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Is this what Shero told you?
Just connecting the dots.

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02-07-2013, 11:30 PM
  #124
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How you want to change the D now and go with Nisky is incredible to me. You might say, we have been good....but we can be better. But since our changes we have been on an upward trend, and statistically it mus be hard to do much better. Our goalie look comfortable. Other teams look stymied. And to me, our effectiveness on D has lead to more time on offense and cleaner break outs leading to better rushes. I dont reinsert nisky until someone shows signs of slowing down.

Loved Borts game. He and Engo are so money, and I think it has set the tone for the whole team. Glass and Cooke have more edge back too.

Could be a lot of things and I would like to give a plus to the staff. The team is playing much better. And if they maintain this grit and play with this emotion, my area to improve is addressed.

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02-07-2013, 11:31 PM
  #125
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How you want to change the D now and go with Nisky is incredible to me. You might say, we have been good....but we can be better. But since our changes we have been on an upward trend, and statistically it mus be hard to do much better. Our goalie look comfortable. Other teams look stymied. And to me, our effectiveness on D has lead to more time on offense and cleaner break outs leading to better rushes. I dont reinsert nisky until someone shows signs of slowing down.

Loved Borts game. He and Engo are so money, and I think it has set the tone for the whole team. Glass and Cooke have more edge back too.

Could be a lot of things and I would like to give a plus to the staff. The team is playing much better. And if they maintain this grit and play with this emotion, my area to improve is addressed.
The defense (and defensive play) was the only area you thought needed to be improved?

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