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v26: Chuckers Gonna Chuck II: Chuck Harder

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Old
02-21-2013, 06:00 PM
  #801
Kb21
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wish OKC would of taken anderson and lucas for maynor. that is the backup PG i would of liked to see us get. pass first and good shooting the 3.

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02-21-2013, 06:06 PM
  #802
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wish OKC would of taken anderson and lucas for maynor. that is the backup PG i would of liked to see us get. pass first and good shooting the 3.
the $2.2m trade exception is worth more to the Thunder than Anderson's expiring deal and team-option on Lucas.

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02-21-2013, 06:12 PM
  #803
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I still think Telfair is a much better pg then Lucas, JL3 is pretty much a spot up shooter and not much more. I Personally think Telfair brings much more to the Raptors then and most of all gives us a bit of depth there as Eyedea said.

On a side note, The Raptors really need to start figuring out what to do with Terrence Ross and his minutes. Looking at his stats it says he's averaging about 16.6 per game averages out to about 4 mins a quarter (4.14) . He's a rookie tho and prone to rookie mistakes, his shot has been off maybe nerves or adjusting to the speed of the NBA game.

I think if given a fair opportunity Ross will start breaking over the second half of the season. And by next season will be a much more productive player for the Raptors. If anyone remembers a similar thing happened back when Tracy McGrady was drafted by Toronto. (Though T-Mac was a high school kid) but he was only averaging about 4.6 mins a Q and just over 5 1/2 the following year.

I still think the main reason he left Toronto was because he was disgruntled about his playing time the first two seasons in Toronto. And even in 99 when he finally broke out he didn't really get his chance until the 2nd half of the season. You could see he was past it at that stage and pretty much already made his mind up.

I just hope the same thing doesn't happen with Terrence Ross and by the time he's ready he's already gone. I personally think this is perhaps the same sort of thing that was going on with Ed Davis, who even though was having a big season was still not in the game when it was on the line, and most nights found him self sitting on the bench when the game was in the balance.

Terrence Ross does deserve more, I personally think he should be upwards of 20 minutes + a night. Like any rookie he's going to have his ups and downs but I just feel that there is no real benefit of having him ride the bench as much as he does, and or get the kind of garbage minutes he gets on a nightly basis.
Agree with everything you said here, I prefer Telfair over Lucas any day of the week. Better all around point guard.
I also get frustrated with lack of minutes ross gets sometimes. One thing I have noticed, he gets alot of minutes in 2nd half, which is a good thing since it means casey trusts him when game is on the line. than again, I prefer his minutes get a little more spread out, so he doesn't become rusty in second half. I think he releases ball to early, which has on occasion led to airballs, gets too excited.

He looks like a player that will get better with minutes. I think with that, he will breakout out. I also like the fact he plays good defense, he can be used in many situations when his minutes go up, 20 minutes a game sounds good.


Last edited by mikebel111: 02-21-2013 at 06:18 PM.
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Old
02-21-2013, 06:17 PM
  #804
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Casey's infatuation with Chuckerson (and the fact that every few games he goes of for 12-20 points because he manages to stick a reasonable % of his shots for once) is what blocks Ross

I suspect that as long as Anderson doesn't come back next season, Ross will get more minutes as the primary backup to DeRozan at the 2, and potentially as a reserve for Rudy Gay when they want to keep a similar style of player in the lineup.


Last edited by The Nemesis: 02-22-2013 at 01:13 PM. Reason: Don't worry, it only took 18 hours to realize my mistake with the names.
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02-21-2013, 07:44 PM
  #805
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so for a guy who is just interested in raps now...is this a good trade or horrible?

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02-21-2013, 08:00 PM
  #806
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It was a necessary trade imo.

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02-21-2013, 08:15 PM
  #807
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Just a question for you big time NBA fans (since im new)

What are the prospects of the Raps being able to go out in the offseason and assuming they can free up some money by getting rid of Bargnani and Amnesty Klieza to bring in anyone decent either Free Agency or Sign and Trade?

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02-21-2013, 09:10 PM
  #808
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Very low. This team won't be a player during FA this summer.

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02-21-2013, 09:30 PM
  #809
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Just a question for you big time NBA fans (since im new)

What are the prospects of the Raps being able to go out in the offseason and assuming they can free up some money by getting rid of Bargnani and Amnesty Klieza to bring in anyone decent either Free Agency or Sign and Trade?
A Paul Millsap or Josh Smith acquisition would be HUGE for the Raps in the off-season, but realistically the chances of that happening is literally 0%. The only chance the Raps have in acquiring big talent, is through trade.

My hope, is Bargs plays lights out for the rest of the season, then we trade him for another PF this off-season.

And yes, I imagine Kleiza will be amnestied.

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02-21-2013, 10:18 PM
  #810
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val and ross at the leafs game!

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02-21-2013, 11:58 PM
  #811
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Wow. Great pick up for the raps!

Buuttt wth is Sacremento doing?

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02-22-2013, 12:27 AM
  #812
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Wow. Great pick up for the raps!

Buuttt wth is Sacremento doing?
Tanking I guess. Patterson kinda makes sense in that he pairs better with Cousins both on and off the court. But really that franchise is such a mess that it's hard to say anything they're doing can have a positive impact.

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02-22-2013, 04:46 AM
  #813
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val and ross at the leafs game!
I wonder if it's their first ever game.. Also how come Amir wasn't there with his Jersey?

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02-22-2013, 08:42 AM
  #814
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Lmao


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Old
02-22-2013, 09:39 AM
  #815
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Is Telfair really that much better than JL3? This guy is a journeyman - 7th team in his career?

I was really hoping we would get Boozer in a Bargs deal; BC must have been getting serious lowball offers to have to hang onto pasta boy.

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02-22-2013, 11:21 AM
  #816
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Is Telfair really that much better than JL3? This guy is a journeyman - 7th team in his career?

I was really hoping we would get Boozer in a Bargs deal; BC must have been getting serious lowball offers to have to hang onto pasta boy.

I've been wrong on more than one occasion in my evaluating of the Raps, but I think that holding on Bargnani in this case will prove worthwhile.

Bargnani is literally being run out of town by the fans. You can it's because of his play, because of his injuries, etc, but it really comes down to one thing: expectations. Bargnani has had to deal with expectations his whole life that are much larger than his 255 lb frame.

The truth is that he isn't as good (and definitely not as consistent) as this city wants him to be. But, he's also not that bad. He's carried our team's scoring beautifully at times, and when he gets in the zone and has the right match up he has proven that he can literally score with the best in the league. He's also a very good one-on-one defender, though terrible with help.

I am sure it was tough for BC to not trade him because of the recent public outcry, but it's hard to imagine Bargnani's value being any lower. The other fact is that we need a good power forward, which is sometimes what Bargnani brings.

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02-22-2013, 02:56 PM
  #817
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I've been wrong on more than one occasion in my evaluating of the Raps, but I think that holding on Bargnani in this case will prove worthwhile.

Bargnani is literally being run out of town by the fans. You can it's because of his play, because of his injuries, etc, but it really comes down to one thing: expectations. Bargnani has had to deal with expectations his whole life that are much larger than his 255 lb frame.

The truth is that he isn't as good (and definitely not as consistent) as this city wants him to be. But, he's also not that bad. He's carried our team's scoring beautifully at times, and when he gets in the zone and has the right match up he has proven that he can literally score with the best in the league. He's also a very good one-on-one defender, though terrible with help.

I am sure it was tough for BC to not trade him because of the recent public outcry, but it's hard to imagine Bargnani's value being any lower. The other fact is that we need a good power forward, which is sometimes what Bargnani brings.
I agree with all of your points individually, but I don't really agree with the overall sympathetic tone you seem to have in this post. Bargnani has always had very high expectations, but it's not unreasonable for a city to expect great things from a #1 Overall pick. It's true in every sport...the #1 overall is expected to have a very big impact on the franchise.

Toronto in particular might have put inflated expectations on Bargnani, but it's understandable given the state of the Franchise at the time. We had developed, and subsequently lost, two huge superstars in T-Mac and Carter...yet neither were taken as high as Bargnani.



And about the scoring aspect...it's true that Bargnani can blow up for 20-30 points on occasion. But "on occasion" are the operative words there. In the NBA, there are literally hundreds of players that have the capability to blow up for 25 points in a game. The ability to do it with consistency is what separates a "star potential" player to an actual star.

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02-22-2013, 03:41 PM
  #818
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I agree with all of your points individually, but I don't really agree with the overall sympathetic tone you seem to have in this post. Bargnani has always had very high expectations, but it's not unreasonable for a city to expect great things from a #1 Overall pick. It's true in every sport...the #1 overall is expected to have a very big impact on the franchise.

Toronto in particular might have put inflated expectations on Bargnani, but it's understandable given the state of the Franchise at the time. We had developed, and subsequently lost, two huge superstars in T-Mac and Carter...yet neither were taken as high as Bargnani.



And about the scoring aspect...it's true that Bargnani can blow up for 20-30 points on occasion. But "on occasion" are the operative words there. In the NBA, there are literally hundreds of players that have the capability to blow up for 25 points in a game. The ability to do it with consistency is what separates a "star potential" player to an actual star
.
Agreed. Hell, Bayless or Anderson can go off for 25 points. But the ones who do it consistently are the stars, and Bargnani at this point is a big man shooter who doesn't shoot very well.

He could fill the Ryan Anderson role for a team, but all the years this franchise wasted trying to turn him into Dirk were what set us back.

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02-22-2013, 03:58 PM
  #819
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I agree with all of your points individually, but I don't really agree with the overall sympathetic tone you seem to have in this post. Bargnani has always had very high expectations, but it's not unreasonable for a city to expect great things from a #1 Overall pick. It's true in every sport...the #1 overall is expected to have a very big impact on the franchise.

Toronto in particular might have put inflated expectations on Bargnani, but it's understandable given the state of the Franchise at the time. We had developed, and subsequently lost, two huge superstars in T-Mac and Carter...yet neither were taken as high as Bargnani.



And about the scoring aspect...it's true that Bargnani can blow up for 20-30 points on occasion. But "on occasion" are the operative words there. In the NBA, there are literally hundreds of players that have the capability to blow up for 25 points in a game. The ability to do it with consistency is what separates a "star potential" player to an actual star.
Bargnani's career high is 41 points for a game, which is far from common.

I guess my point, which isn't a new one, is that Andrea Bargnani didn't pick himself first overall. It also probably didn't help that he was coming to an organization where all of our previous first rounders had almost immediately turned into world-beaters (Vince, T-Mac, Stoudemire, Camby, Bosh).

I guess my point comes down to this:

Consider what this city thinks of Andrea Bargnani now, and consider what this city might think of him if we had picked up that exact same player in the second round of the 2006 draft.

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02-22-2013, 04:31 PM
  #820
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Bargnani's career high is 41 points for a game, which is far from common.

I guess my point, which isn't a new one, is that Andrea Bargnani didn't pick himself first overall. It also probably didn't help that he was coming to an organization where all of our previous first rounders had almost immediately turned into world-beaters (Vince, T-Mac, Stoudemire, Camby, Bosh).

I guess my point comes down to this:

Consider what this city thinks of Andrea Bargnani now, and consider what this city might think of him if we had picked up that exact same player in the second round of the 2006 draft.

Well, if we got Andrea in the 2nd round he would have started his career by playing 3 years @ $600K vs. the $4.5M he actually earned each of those seasons. Paul Millsap was drafted 47th that same year and despite having career numbers that are very comparable to Bargnani, has earned a total of ~$12.5M LESS than we've paid Bargnani. Also, Bargnani wouldn't have gotten minutes handed to him as easily, and would have had to earn them.

Obviously those 2 things....combined with never having the hype of a 1st overall player...would have drastically altered the city's perception of the guy.

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02-22-2013, 04:41 PM
  #821
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Is Telfair playing tonight?

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02-22-2013, 04:51 PM
  #822
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Well, if we got Andrea in the 2nd round he would have started his career by playing 3 years @ $600K vs. the $4.5M he actually earned each of those seasons. Paul Millsap was drafted 47th that same year and despite having career numbers that are very comparable to Bargnani, has earned a total of ~$12.5M LESS than we've paid Bargnani. Also, Bargnani wouldn't have gotten minutes handed to him as easily, and would have had to earn them.

Obviously those 2 things....combined with never having the hype of a 1st overall player...would have drastically altered the city's perception of the guy.
Agreed. And yeah, once a guy signs a second contract, he's setting up his own expectations. Big money should mean big responsibility.

I guess what I am saying is that he is so disliked in this city right now, that I actually admire BC for seeing thorugh that and not just dumping him for anything he can get. As much as people hate Bargs, and as much as he's overpaid, I think he can find a role on this team and help us more than some scraps from other teams would have.

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02-22-2013, 05:27 PM
  #823
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Is Telfair playing tonight?
Looks like he won't be ready in time. He'd instead debut Monday vs the Wizards.

but I'm just basing this off some discussion from the Raptors twitter feed.

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02-22-2013, 06:35 PM
  #824
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Do you guys know if it's a 2nd rnd pick this year we traded for Telfair?

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02-22-2013, 06:40 PM
  #825
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Do you guys know if it's a 2nd rnd pick this year we traded for Telfair?
I think so, yes. The lower of either the Raps' own pick, or the one they got for sending James Johnson to the Kings.



in other news, no Terrence Ross tonight? More Alan Anderson?


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