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Trade Rumours and Proposals: Part XXXIV

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Old
02-19-2013, 11:01 AM
  #626
Holdurbreathe
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Originally Posted by BK201 View Post
I doubt people will offer much. As for value lets look at the Nash deal. No way Avs get what they are asking. I mean MDZ was a good offer tbh especially look at thier D.
I agree, too many risks involved in this trade.

This situation is all about money, there are no extraneous circumstances.

While it is always possible a desperate GM will take the leap, it wouldn't surprise me if ROR is available for quite some time unless Sherman lowers his demands.

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Old
02-19-2013, 11:02 AM
  #627
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Originally Posted by Canadian Guy View Post
Top 3 worst run teams in the NHL

Washington
New York Islanders
Avalanche
Honourable mention: Edmonton
awesome, lets underpay and get O'Rielly, Streit, Kuznetsov and nobody from the Oilers.

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Old
02-19-2013, 11:03 AM
  #628
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The biggest problem the Sens have going forward if they acquire O'Reilly is getting him the playing time that helped him get 55 points last year.

He played 191:35 on the power play - first on the team among all skaters.
He played 1,295:36 even strength - third on the team among all skaters.
He had 15 power play points - second on the team.
He had 40 even strength points - first on the team.

When Spezza comes back, I can't see any opportunity for O'Reilly to be playing first line minutes even strength barring injury. He might play on the power play but it's hard to tell what kind of impact he would have considering that his team leading TOI for PP put him 146th in the league for that category. I would need league wide stats to create an average for production vs. PP time.

And even if he did play on the first unit and saw a percentage increase in his power play point totals it would almost certainly be met with a percentage decrease in his even strength point totals.

If I'm Murray you can't pay the price for a guy who was given first line minutes and created value based on that role only to play him on the second line when the roster is healthy. I think there would have to be an additional asset from Colorado's side to justify dealing guys like MZ and PW. Obviously the parameters change and the longer he holds out the more his value decreases. But with all that said Murray would be wiser to be looking for long term solutions for our blue line and for the wing positions. Areas where we will have turn over and don't have the kind of long term stability that we currently (potentially) own at center ice.

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Old
02-19-2013, 11:09 AM
  #629
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We won't land RoR anyways. Sherman is asking for a lot of talent for Ryan and I don't think there's any scenario in which BM agrees to trade something like a Michalek or Turris and a high-valued prospect for him. Murray puts a lot of faith in our prospects and is very vocal about the fact that they'll develop into something great in time. I have no problems with that. But I still think we're in need of a high-caliber player even with a fully healthy lineup. It's not necessarily a good thing when your 2nd best offensive player is your defenceman.

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02-19-2013, 11:14 AM
  #630
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This is a pretty good article from the Denver Post:

http://www.denverpost.com/frei/ci_22...look-from-ryan
Duchene from the article

"We all have our different priorities and values," Duchene said. "With him, I don't know what the conversations are between him and the team, and I don't know what they are between him and his agent. But at the end of the day, he's a pro, he's a guy who's looking for something. You have to respect that. It's a business.

Would I have done it that way? Obviously not. I'm here right now. I have a great contract. I love my contract. There's nothing wrong with it. Would I have loved a long-term one at some point? Of course. Everybody wants a long-term contract, but you have to earn it. Obviously, I had two good first years and last year, there were some question marks. I know that.

For the Avalanche, it's a business too. They can't go out and say, 'We'll give him the benefit of the doubt.' They wanted me to prove it. They're my employer. I have to do it. That's the way I looked at it. That's the way my agent looked at it, and I was just thrilled to re-sign and get a deal done and get that distraction out of the way early in the summer.

Paychecks are great. You want to get as much money as you can in this game, but for me, I love this game so much, I love this team and this franchise and this city, there's no way I could have held out. I'm not saying what (O'Reilly) is doing is wrong or right. It's his own business and we're going to leave it at that, but when you ask me about the contrast, when that was your question to me, that was what was behind my decision."

This says it all IMO, this is a young man I would like to see on the Sens.

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Old
02-19-2013, 11:32 AM
  #631
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Originally Posted by QuattroFTW View Post
We won't land RoR anyways. Sherman is asking for a lot of talent for Ryan and I don't think there's any scenario in which BM agrees to trade something like a Michalek or Turris and a high-valued prospect for him. Murray puts a lot of faith in our prospects and is very vocal about the fact that they'll develop into something great in time. I have no problems with that. But I still think we're in need of a high-caliber player even with a fully healthy lineup. It's not necessarily a good thing when your 2nd best offensive player is your defenceman.
When you are talking about a talent like Karlsson it isn't a bad thing!!

I do agree the Sens need to improve significantly on Latendresse, but getting young proven wingers isn't easy and even if Murray did, without Spezza, I doubt the production would increase significantly.

The team was averaging 3 goals/game with Spezza, since his injury, 1.9 goals/game and that was with Karlsson working his magic.

Unfortunately replacing Spezza just isn't possible, nor is replacing Karlsson.

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Old
02-19-2013, 11:40 AM
  #632
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Originally Posted by Holdurbreathe View Post
When you are talking about a talent like Karlsson it isn't a bad thing!!

I do agree the Sens need to improve significantly on Latendresse, but getting young proven wingers isn't easy and even if Murray did, without Spezza, I doubt the production would increase significantly.

The team was averaging 3 goals/game with Spezza, since his injury, 1.9 goals/game and that was with Karlsson working his magic.

Unfortunately replacing Spezza just isn't possible, nor is replacing Karlsson.
Small sample size but right now were averaging 0.5 goals per game xD with out spezza/Karlsson.

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Old
02-19-2013, 11:46 AM
  #633
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Originally Posted by BK201 View Post
Small sample size but right now were averaging 0.5 goals per game xD with out spezza/Karlsson.
If you don't count shootouts.

The team has also not had Michalek in the last two games either.


Last edited by Holdurbreathe: 02-19-2013 at 11:55 AM.
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Old
02-19-2013, 11:49 AM
  #634
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Originally Posted by Holdurbreathe View Post
If you don't count shootouts.

The team has also not has Michalek in the last two games either.
Who hadn't scored in how many games before that?

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Old
02-19-2013, 11:57 AM
  #635
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Originally Posted by Holdurbreathe View Post
Duchene from the article

"We all have our different priorities and values," Duchene said. "With him, I don't know what the conversations are between him and the team, and I don't know what they are between him and his agent. But at the end of the day, he's a pro, he's a guy who's looking for something. You have to respect that. It's a business.

Would I have done it that way? Obviously not. I'm here right now. I have a great contract. I love my contract. There's nothing wrong with it. Would I have loved a long-term one at some point? Of course. Everybody wants a long-term contract, but you have to earn it. Obviously, I had two good first years and last year, there were some question marks. I know that.

For the Avalanche, it's a business too. They can't go out and say, 'We'll give him the benefit of the doubt.' They wanted me to prove it. They're my employer. I have to do it. That's the way I looked at it. That's the way my agent looked at it, and I was just thrilled to re-sign and get a deal done and get that distraction out of the way early in the summer.

Paychecks are great. You want to get as much money as you can in this game, but for me, I love this game so much, I love this team and this franchise and this city, there's no way I could have held out. I'm not saying what (O'Reilly) is doing is wrong or right. It's his own business and we're going to leave it at that, but when you ask me about the contrast, when that was your question to me, that was what was behind my decision."

This says it all IMO, this is a young man I would like to see on the Sens.
If you want the pulse of the Colorado locker room over the O'Reilly hold out, there you have it right there.

Also kudos to Duchene for giving a well-thought out response that didn't include a multitude of cliches that give you no indication whatsoever of the individual's true feelings toward something. Nice to see some hockey players are able to express themselves with a good amount of detail and honesty.

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Old
02-19-2013, 11:57 AM
  #636
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Who hadn't scored in how many games before that?
True, but he still creates opportunities by his work ethic and defenders don't/can't ignore him.

The loss of Spezza has had a deep impact on the top six, there can be no minimizing his absence.

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Old
02-19-2013, 12:22 PM
  #637
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Duchene was drafted by his childhood team. I think he would play for them for free.

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Old
02-19-2013, 12:37 PM
  #638
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Originally Posted by Canadian Guy View Post
Top 3 worst run teams in the NHL

Washington
New York Islanders
Avalanche
Honourable mention: Edmonton
No Calgary?

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Old
02-19-2013, 12:40 PM
  #639
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Originally Posted by BankStreetParade View Post
The biggest problem the Sens have going forward if they acquire O'Reilly is getting him the playing time that helped him get 55 points last year.

He played 191:35 on the power play - first on the team among all skaters.
He played 1,295:36 even strength - third on the team among all skaters.
He had 15 power play points - second on the team.
He had 40 even strength points - first on the team.

When Spezza comes back, I can't see any opportunity for O'Reilly to be playing first line minutes even strength barring injury. He might play on the power play but it's hard to tell what kind of impact he would have considering that his team leading TOI for PP put him 146th in the league for that category. I would need league wide stats to create an average for production vs. PP time.

And even if he did play on the first unit and saw a percentage increase in his power play point totals it would almost certainly be met with a percentage decrease in his even strength point totals.

If I'm Murray you can't pay the price for a guy who was given first line minutes and created value based on that role only to play him on the second line when the roster is healthy. I think there would have to be an additional asset from Colorado's side to justify dealing guys like MZ and PW. Obviously the parameters change and the longer he holds out the more his value decreases. But with all that said Murray would be wiser to be looking for long term solutions for our blue line and for the wing positions. Areas where we will have turn over and don't have the kind of long term stability that we currently (potentially) own at center ice.
This is a really thoughtful post.

Not only would we be hoping ROR continued to improve offensively, we have to keep in mind the ice time that got him the points.

Would he fit as a winger for Spezza?

I also think the amount bandied about as the price of the trade to be high. If this season has showed anything, it's that we need to continue to improve our depth.

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Old
02-19-2013, 12:52 PM
  #640
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Originally Posted by Laszlo Panaflex View Post
No Calgary?
Why Calgary it's not like they're in a rebuild

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Old
02-19-2013, 01:18 PM
  #641
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Canadian Guy;60015181]Top 3 worst run teams in the NHL
Well if that's the case lets compare senators and avs over the last 20 years;
Avs- 2 Stanley cups, senators 0
Avs 2 conf titles, senators 1
Avs 9 div titles, senators 4
Avs 13 playoffs, senators 13
Avs longest sellout (487) streak in history (lasted 11 years)

Yes the avs have been struggling the last few years, but they are working on it and have a plan. Until the senators actually win the cup, I would stop throwing stones at teams that actually have.... ONE OF THE WORST RUN!! U serious!!!
Washington
New York Islanders
Avalanche
Honourable mention: Edmonton[/QUOTE]

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Old
02-19-2013, 01:20 PM
  #642
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Well if that's the case lets compare senators and avs over the last 20 years;
Avs- 2 Stanley cups, senators 0
Avs 2 conf titles, senators 1
Avs 9 div titles, senators 4
Avs 13 playoffs, senators 13
Avs longest sellout (487) streak in history (lasted 11 years)

Yes the avs have been struggling the last few years, but they are working on it and have a plan. Until the senators actually win the cup, I would stop throwing stones at teams that actually have.... ONE OF THE WORST RUN

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Old
02-19-2013, 01:22 PM
  #643
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I'm glad to hear Murray is actually kickin tires with Sherman on O'Reilly... now if only he'd actually pull of a deal already!

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02-19-2013, 01:23 PM
  #644
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Is there any word on what next year's cap is expected to be yet?

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Old
02-19-2013, 01:28 PM
  #645
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is there any word on what next year's cap is expected to be yet?
64.3m

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Old
02-19-2013, 01:29 PM
  #646
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Originally Posted by Laszlo Panaflex View Post
No Calgary?
On paper the sens are the worst team in the NHL without Spezza and Karlsson.

Yeah the Islanders got smoked by Philly but outside of that they are far from the worst team in the NHL.

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Old
02-19-2013, 02:25 PM
  #647
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lol, ok then. i guess you don't want any 50 - 60+ point wingers. and i agree, i wouldn't make that exact deal for most of the guys i mentioned. but that wasn't the question. the question what guys could we potentially get for the package.
I asked you which true first line wing we could get with that package. You came back to me saying we could get guys like Fleischmann, Voracek, etc.. Either you have poor reading comprehension or you don't know what a true first line wing is.

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02-19-2013, 02:32 PM
  #648
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I asked you which true first line wing we could get with that package. You came back to me saying we could get guys like Fleischmann, Voracek, etc.. Either you have poor reading comprehension or you don't know what a true first line wing is.
i consider 50+ points a first line winger. obviously you don't, that's your problem.

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02-19-2013, 02:52 PM
  #649
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Originally Posted by jabubenice View Post
Well if that's the case lets compare senators and avs over the last 20 years;
Avs- 2 Stanley cups, senators 0
Avs 2 conf titles, senators 1
Avs 9 div titles, senators 4
Avs 13 playoffs, senators 13
Avs longest sellout (487) streak in history (lasted 11 years)

Yes the avs have been struggling the last few years, but they are working on it and have a plan. Until the senators actually win the cup, I would stop throwing stones at teams that actually have.... ONE OF THE WORST RUN
Yes, they are CURRENTLY one of the worst run franchises in the NHL. Their GM and coach are considered sub-par by NHL standards and their ability to make trades has been questionable to laughable. Or do you think swapping Elliott for Anderson then trading a high 1st round and 2nd round pick for Semyon Varlamov is good asset management?

The Avs great run came off the backs of the Nordiques. Since they had to move past the Joe Sakic era, they've done nothing of note since.

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Old
02-19-2013, 02:56 PM
  #650
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Would much rather have O'Reilly...a 50+ point selke level centre and move Turris to the wing...who could easily be a 50+ point sniping winger. Kill two birds with one stone.

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