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Old
09-22-2003, 09:09 PM
  #1
orcatown
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Allen

I missed the game and thus this might be a totally ignorant comment but from the highlights Allen looked bad. Especially on the first goal. If he is still struggling the Canucks should consider moving him while he has value.

Also any word on how Vydarney looked or any of the rest. Whoever 28 is sure made a bad turnover on the Dvorak chance.

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09-22-2003, 09:11 PM
  #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orcatown
I missed the game and thus this might be a totally ignorant comment but from the highlights Allen looked bad. Especially on the first goal. If he is still struggling the Canucks should consider moving him while he has value.

Also any word on how Vydarney looked or any of the rest. Whoever 28 is sure made a bad turnover on the Dvorak chance.
Bouck is 28.

Allen played bad... horrible positioning on the first goal. He has had a bad camp so far imo. Everyone was bad tonight. Jovo, Komarniski were the only ones who seemed interested.

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Old
09-22-2003, 09:49 PM
  #3
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I don't know if he has had a bad camp, but he has not really stood out much, that is for sure. Not asserting himself physically enough. They said he was strong on the PK tonight though.

Vydareny and Sopel were both very quiet. Didn't sound like they made any gaffes out there though.

EDIT-at the intermission they said the first goal was more a result of bad backchecking by Naslund, and Allen just looked bad because he took a guy crashing the net instead of the shooter, who he thought was going to be covered. Don't know for sure though...

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Old
09-22-2003, 11:41 PM
  #4
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Originally Posted by Waveburner
EDIT-at the intermission they said the first goal was more a result of bad backchecking by Naslund, and Allen just looked bad because he took a guy crashing the net instead of the shooter, who he thought was going to be covered. Don't know for sure though...
That is what was reported on CKNW and I will take their work for it. Especially knowing Naslund and Defence don't really mix very well.

Allen being still somewhat inexperienced with the team doesn't know Naslund doesn't give a damn about defence. He'll learn not to trust the top line in time.

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Old
09-23-2003, 06:26 AM
  #5
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Allen is going to have a break out year.

I watched Allen closely in Vernon during training camp. He looks to be much faster and stronger than last year. He played excellent defensive hockey in the intrasquad games, but did not rush the puck often. I think that Crawford has told him to concentrate on the defensive zone coverage first.

I don't know how he looked last night (didn't listen to the game) however, I sure notice how Canuck fans are quick to jump on him for any mistake he makes. Instead of making a deal about Naslund (or a few other forwards on this team) not paying attention to defense, it is easy to berate the young defense or the goalie.

Crawford seems to have the same attitude, for whatever reason, with Allen. After a defensive gaff last year, Allen would ride the pine or be sent down to Winnipeg. I can't understand why the Canucks haven't given him a longer stretch of games (with substantial minutes) to see if he is the real deal.

Crawford likes veteran defense (which does not sit well for Koltsov or Mojis seeing any appreciable time with the Canucks this year either) and Allen is not going to get a good look. He is slated behind Ohlund and Malik on the left side, and possibly even Slegr.

For this reason, I am guessing that Allen will be traded. I hope that I am wrong, as I believe Allen bring items to the defense that are in short supply on this team (toughness and crease clearing). Allen also has showed character and loyalty to the team (has not *****ed once over being jerked back and forth to the minors). I also think that if traded and given a chance, Allen will blossom into a top defensive defenceman who will also pop a few goals with his big shot.

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Old
09-23-2003, 07:18 AM
  #6
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Originally Posted by membleypeg
I watched Allen closely in Vernon during training camp. He looks to be much faster and stronger than last year. He played excellent defensive hockey in the intrasquad games, but did not rush the puck often. I think that Crawford has told him to concentrate on the defensive zone coverage first.

I don't know how he looked last night (didn't listen to the game) however, I sure notice how Canuck fans are quick to jump on him for any mistake he makes. Instead of making a deal about Naslund (or a few other forwards on this team) not paying attention to defense, it is easy to berate the young defense or the goalie.

Crawford seems to have the same attitude, for whatever reason, with Allen. After a defensive gaff last year, Allen would ride the pine or be sent down to Winnipeg. I can't understand why the Canucks haven't given him a longer stretch of games (with substantial minutes) to see if he is the real deal.

Crawford likes veteran defense (which does not sit well for Koltsov or Mojis seeing any appreciable time with the Canucks this year either) and Allen is not going to get a good look. He is slated behind Ohlund and Malik on the left side, and possibly even Slegr.

For this reason, I am guessing that Allen will be traded. I hope that I am wrong, as I believe Allen bring items to the defense that are in short supply on this team (toughness and crease clearing). Allen also has showed character and loyalty to the team (has not *****ed once over being jerked back and forth to the minors). I also think that if traded and given a chance, Allen will blossom into a top defensive defenceman who will also pop a few goals with his big shot.
I think you've summed Allen's situation up quite nicely and do tend to agree with your pov.

I have mixed feelings about Allen being a Canuck. One part of me would hate to see him go and another part of me would like to see him "blossom" on another team. Not the Western Conference though.

 
Old
09-23-2003, 07:50 AM
  #7
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Everybody is overstating Allen's poor play based on one comment by Tom Larscheid. Yes, he screened Cloutier on the first goal...mostly because Hemsky turned him inside-out and all of the sudden Allen was out of position.

He was quietly effective for the rest of the game, I thought. He consistently stood the Oilers up at the blueline and was his diligent self in his own end.

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Old
09-23-2003, 10:04 AM
  #8
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From the sounds of things he was one of the few guys playing physical last night. We really need that presence on our blue line.

http://www.canada.com/vancouver/spor...7-A963009A14C9

Defenceman Bryan Allen played belligerently, Nathan Smith skated with purpose and Zenith Komarniski jolted awake teammates with a big hit on Oiler golden boy Ales Hemsky in the second period.

Allen crushed Smyth along the boards, then steamrolled Radek Dvorak a couple of shifts later

We are going to need him this year. I can't say it enough. Someone has to clear the crease and move bodies back there, and he is the only one with the skill set to do the job.

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Old
09-23-2003, 10:36 AM
  #9
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Originally Posted by maruk14
From the sounds of things he was one of the few guys playing physical last night. We really need that presence on our blue line.

http://www.canada.com/vancouver/spor...7-A963009A14C9

Defenceman Bryan Allen played belligerently, Nathan Smith skated with purpose and Zenith Komarniski jolted awake teammates with a big hit on Oiler golden boy Ales Hemsky in the second period.

Allen crushed Smyth along the boards, then steamrolled Radek Dvorak a couple of shifts later

We are going to need him this year. I can't say it enough. Someone has to clear the crease and move bodies back there, and he is the only one with the skill set to do the job.
I couldn't agree more. Team toughness is definately lacking

 
Old
09-23-2003, 01:32 PM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by membleypeg
I don't know how he looked last night (didn't listen to the game) however, I sure notice how Canuck fans are quick to jump on him for any mistake he makes. Instead of making a deal about Naslund (or a few other forwards on this team) not paying attention to defense, it is easy to berate the young defense or the goalie.
Yup, the curse of being young. The other defensemen on the team will make dozens of mistakes a game, hardly anybody says a thing. But if Allen makes a mistake, it's "send him to the minors, trade him, cut him!"

He's young, inexperienced, he's going to make mistakes (as every defenceman does). Accept it, it's a natural part of development.

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Old
09-23-2003, 02:05 PM
  #11
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Originally Posted by cnukfan
I couldn't agree more. Team toughness is definately lacking
Bertuzzi
Jovanovski
Allen
Landgdon
May

^How's that for you?

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Old
09-23-2003, 02:42 PM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by monster_bertuzzi
Bertuzzi
Jovanovski
Allen
Landgdon
May

^How's that for you?
Sedin
Sedin
Chubarov
Salo
Malik
Chubarov
Morrison
Naslund
Arvedson
....etc how that list for you?



Yes but you have to realize this. If Allen doesn't play much then take him off that list. Langdon doesn't play much at all so take him off that list. May plays 5 minutes a game. So basically you have Bertuzzi, Jovo, and May. Cooke and Ruutu have a different kind of toughness about them.

Also note that if you take Allen off that list then you have only 1 d-man as a real tough kind of guy. (Though Jovo isn't a guy that mucks it up in front of the net all that well. I'd rather take Ohlund in front of the net. Jovo does have the nasty streak about him though.)

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Old
09-23-2003, 02:55 PM
  #13
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Originally Posted by monster_bertuzzi
Bertuzzi
Jovanovski
Allen
Landgdon
May

^How's that for you?
You don't want either of the first two getting into fights at all anyways so they aren't really tough guys.

 
Old
09-23-2003, 03:03 PM
  #14
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You don't need them to get into fights though. That's something else. You need players who play with grit and have a nasty streak. Peole who aren't afraid of mixing it up and just get the job done. Baron never got into fights but he is a player people have described as tough and nasty.

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Old
09-23-2003, 03:17 PM
  #15
maruk14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by monster_bertuzzi
Bertuzzi
Jovanovski
Allen
Landgdon
May

^How's that for you?
Of that list only Jovo and Allen are defenseman, and we need more than just Jovo back there hitting.

Jovo - He fits, but he is also our best offensive defenseman. He isn't a true stay at home, mean defender. Even if he does fill that role, don't you think we need more than one, especially when the one guy who does throw his weight around also likes to pinch on offense?

Ohlund - Love the guy, but he is far from being nasty. We haven't seen the big, open ice hit from him in a few seasons.

Salo - Good positionally, doesn't use his weight as much as he should

Sopel - Ditto to Salo, but hits even less

Malik - Gentle Giant

Allen - He needs to fill that role

Slegr - Kind of a hybrid, a bit more physical than Salo, but still doesn't throw his weight around.

Allen definitely fills a need. Give him time. We are going to need him or someone like him come playoff time.

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Old
09-23-2003, 03:25 PM
  #16
ping
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Originally Posted by FBI
Who are these people?
No clue. I can't even name the people who said he was soft..those just aren't things I remember. I just remember reading that. Anyway Baron wasn't afraid of doing the little things even if he wasn't the most talented player out there.

Anyway the void on the defence for a tough stay at home d-man is still there regardless of whether Baron was tough or not. Lots of goals were scored on Cloutier because of screens specifically on the power play. The Canucks need a big hulking tough d-man who'll sit there and get rid of the screens and make people afraid of coming to the front of the net. Think of it this way. You're a defenceman..who'd you rather play against, Bertuzzi or Henrik? You're a center. Who'd you rather go up against in the offensive zone...Foote or Malik?

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