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How stupid was it to let Benoit Pouliot walk?

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Old
02-20-2013, 01:49 PM
  #201
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Originally Posted by BamBamCam View Post
Dan Shaunessy? Is that you buddy?
More of a KPD disciple...

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02-20-2013, 01:51 PM
  #202
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Originally Posted by BamBamCam View Post
Sorry but I remember the red slash through the face of Claude Julien along with replacing his name with Clode, so spare me people don't want to hear the criticism.
Point.

Fair and constructive criticism is one thing. Knee-jerk "fire Clode," "Krejci is lazy," etc. is quite another, and there is plenty of the latter on this board.

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02-20-2013, 01:55 PM
  #203
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Originally Posted by Artemis View Post
Point.

Fair and constructive criticism is one thing. Knee-jerk "fire Clode," "Krejci is lazy," etc. is quite another, and there is plenty of the latter on this board.
You're right, but I would also say there is plenty of the former as well. Unfortunately, it seems there is rarely room for discussion around the former without a reminder of the Cup, brilliant moves made in the past, or a reminder of the team's record.

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02-20-2013, 01:56 PM
  #204
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Originally Posted by Artemis View Post
Point.

Fair and constructive criticism is one thing. Knee-jerk "fire Clode," "Krejci is lazy," etc. is quite another, and there is plenty of the latter on this board.
What will always get me is how freaking lucky we are to be Boston fans. I have lived in; some college in Philly, finished college in Portland Oregon and currently live in Seattle. As a Bostonian, trust me we have it good. And if I remember right we are second only to New York in championships and not that far behind in total amount. take away the Skanks and NYC is nothing in the sport's world.

And you are correct,there is criticism and then some of the BS that goes on around here, I believe I just read a post from someone claiming there is something wrong with this 9-2 team. 9-2 doesn't keep us happy anymore.


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02-20-2013, 02:06 PM
  #205
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Originally Posted by BamBamCam View Post
Do you think that is truly the case because I don't.

Pouliot was never going to get top 6 minutes in Boston, he is too far down the depth chart in Boston. However, down in Tampa; he is getting those first and second line minutes because the Lightning have been a one line team since they won the Cup. It's a no brainer he is lighting up the point sheet, his role in Tampa is not the same role he had in Boston. Trying to compare the two in their current situations is impossible.
Facts are a curious thing: http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.h...Name=timeOnIce

Pouliot is 9th amongst TB Fs in time on ice per game, which makes him a 3rd liner in Tampa. Not sure what makes you think he is getting 1st or 2nd line minutes.

He's getting 12:53 min. a game. Chris Bourque is getting 12:35 min. a game.

Does this mean Chris Bourque is a 1st liner too?

Know what else is funny? Tampa, the 1 line team, has 13 goals scored by Fs not in their top 6 in goals scored. Boston, once you get past their top 6 of Krejci, Bergeron, Marchand, Lucic, Seguin and Horton has 7 goals scored.

So TB's bottom Fs have outscored Boston's 2-1.

Now if you want to talk about D or G that's a whole different matter (glad I traded Lindback for Craig Anderson in HFL land).

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02-20-2013, 02:07 PM
  #206
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Originally Posted by Dr Quincy View Post
Facts are a curious thing: http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.h...Name=timeOnIce

Pouliot is 9th amongst TB Fs in time on ice per game, which makes him a 3rd liner in Tampa. Not sure what makes you think he is getting 1st or 2nd line minutes.

He's getting 12:53 min. a game. Chris Bourque is getting 12:35 min. a game.

Does this mean Chris Bourque is a 1st liner too?
The last few weeks he has been seeing time with the top 6. TOI doesn't tell you who he is skating with.

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02-20-2013, 02:10 PM
  #207
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Originally Posted by Dr Quincy View Post
Facts are a curious thing: http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.h...Name=timeOnIce

Pouliot is 9th amongst TB Fs in time on ice per game, which makes him a 3rd liner in Tampa. Not sure what makes you think he is getting 1st or 2nd line minutes.

He's getting 12:53 min. a game. Chris Bourque is getting 12:35 min. a game.

Does this mean Chris Bourque is a 1st liner too?

Player Note Tue, Feb 19
Pouliot has quietly turned up the offense in February. He had three assists Tuesday against Toronto to stretch his current streak to four games and seven points, and he has 10 points (four goals, six assists) in his last nine games.
Recommendation: Va-va-va-VOOM. Pouliot is seeing time on the top two lines and seems to be fitting in, whether it's with Vinny Lecavalier or Steven Stamkos. Remember, it's not your top-round choices who win you a title, but your mid-round and waiver picks who ultimately deliver. Pouliot's one of those guys.
(Rotowire.com)

-------------
You're right facts are a curious thing. Better to know than speculate using frivolous and unrelated stats like TOI to prove your point about who he is playing with .. eh?


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02-20-2013, 02:13 PM
  #208
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Facts: Stamkos and St. Louis play 16 minutes a night ES. Lecavalier 14. Pouliot 10.

Explain the 6 minutes difference.

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02-20-2013, 02:18 PM
  #209
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Stop moving the goalposts Sir. You claimed he was getting top 6 ice time, not that he was playing with better teammates. He's TENTH on the Bolts among F in even strength ice time per game.

Thus, he's not getting "top 6" minutes as you claimed. Does he occasionally see action with some top 6 players? Sure, but that's not what you claimed. You were the one who said he was getting top 6 MINUTES and the FACTS are that you are wrong.

But I'll concede that he gets more pp time than Bourquey.

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02-20-2013, 02:36 PM
  #210
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Originally Posted by BamBamCam View Post
What will always get me is how freaking lucky we are to be Boston fans. I have lived in; some college in Philly, finished college in Portland Oregon and currently live in Seattle. As a Bostonian, trust me we have it good. And if I remember right we are second only to New York Shytie in championships and not that far behind in total amount. take away the Skanks and NYC is nothing in the sport's world.

And you are correct,there is criticism and then some of the BS that goes on around here, I believe I just read a post from someone claiming there is something wrong with this 9-2 team. 9-2 doesn't keep us happy anymore.
There us a certain loud segment of New England fans who will never be happy, and I have no idea why. Toronto wins three in a row and they plan a parade. Montreal fans are all about Les Glorieux and their 234 Cups. The Bruins could be undefeated and it'd be "Get rid of Horton!" and "Seguin is ruined!" yada yada

Either people have amnesia, or they became fans last year and have no idea what a bad team looks like.

Disclaimer: I am not referring to reasonable discussion. I would like to think this disclaimer is unnessescary, but that's not the nature of a disclaimer. Please do not ingest. Not meant for human consumption.

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02-20-2013, 02:56 PM
  #211
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Pyatt is who he is on the ice with most. Lecavalier 2nd. St. Louis 9th and Stamkos isn't in his top 10. TOI is still low but climbing.

He has doubled his production rate. Some of it is PP time, some of it is linemates, some of it is a high shooting %. He likely wouldn't have done the exact same here, but anyone who thinks he was a bad player here last year doesn't know what they are talking about.

I said his production would be hard to replace and it has been. It isn't often that your 9th best player scores 32 points in limited minutes. He had production of a mid tier 2nd line player and it wasn't the first time either. He was good in Montreal too. He is a plus player, physical, worked hard, good on the forecheck, backcheck and boards, incredible takeaway/giveaway ratio & positive penalties for vs against.

People had a bias against him when he came here and obviously still do. All they want to remember is his failed dump in and a slashing penalty in the playoffs. He took very few dumb penalties here. The slashing call was terrible. I see 20 worse slashes every game I watch. On the failed dump in Zanon was still back and didn't take Ward, Thomas gave up a bad rebound and was also interfered with. There was plenty of blame to go around and the goal shouldn't have counted. And if it all it takes is a failed dump in by a 3rd liner to lose then your top 6F, your top 4D and your goalie didn't play well enough.

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02-20-2013, 03:12 PM
  #212
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however, I don't think Pouliot would have been the answer.
I don't think Pouliot is necessarily the answer for a cup run, but he would be at this point a better trading piece for an upgrade than Bourque, Caron (who always gets tossed in as a trade piece), or some of our roster players (and I think where Chia has burned himself with contracts is that almost everyone has a NTC or some kind of limited one-which means a trade with a bottom team may be difficult). When your roster players can't be moved for upgrades and your prospects aren't exactly NHL ready (or you want to hang onto them) it makes trades difficult.

I do think Chia is generally good at evaluating players he thinks will fit well here, but the last few signings/trades and moves after the cup run have seemed to be bargain bin, maybe it will work typed deals rather than a move for a player who may actually contribute.

Quote:
Peverley is more versatile playing any situation, and any forward position, as well as point on the PP.
Peverly is one of the most versatile forwards this team has-and that is his main strength-the fact that he can play on any line and in any situation and is comfortable both at center and wing. He is the kind of player every team needs.


Last edited by TCL40: 02-20-2013 at 04:10 PM.
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02-20-2013, 04:10 PM
  #213
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Originally Posted by sjaustin77 View Post
Pyatt is who he is on the ice with most. Lecavalier 2nd. St. Louis 9th and Stamkos isn't in his top 10. TOI is still low but climbing.
Where can I find such statistics?

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02-20-2013, 04:27 PM
  #214
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Where can I find such statistics?
behindthenet.ca

The linemate detail link is at the bottom of the main page.

See if this link works. Once there you can sort per team, and a bunch of different things.

http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_time_...27+28&ds=8&f5=

Only goes to top 10 linemates.

leftwinglock.com is great too. Lots of info there.

I think this will link to Tampa's line combos for the season: http://www.leftwinglock.com/line-com...gametype=ALL#A

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02-20-2013, 04:28 PM
  #215
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^ that thing is wicked freaking cool. I've been wondering if that data was kept anywhere.

/nerd

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02-20-2013, 04:32 PM
  #216
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Originally Posted by Dr Quincy View Post
Stop moving the goalposts Sir. You claimed he was getting top 6 ice time, not that he was playing with better teammates. He's TENTH on the Bolts among F in even strength ice time per game.

Thus, he's not getting "top 6" minutes as you claimed. Does he occasionally see action with some top 6 players? Sure, but that's not what you claimed. You were the one who said he was getting top 6 MINUTES and the FACTS are that you are wrong.

But I'll concede that he gets more pp time than Bourquey.
Read the freaking news blurb about who the freak Benny is playing with. Whatever weird TOI angle you are trying to pull is not working, I posted it, now accept it and move on. He is playing on the 1st and 2nd line now. He was moved up recently to Vinny and sometimes Stamkos's line just like the report said. Got it? Good!


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02-20-2013, 04:36 PM
  #217
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Originally Posted by BamBamCam View Post
Read the freaking news blurb about who the freak Benny is playing with. Whatever weird TOI angle you are trying to pull is not working, I posted it, now accept it and move on. He is playing on the 1st and 2nd line now. He was moved up a few weeks ago. Got it? Good!
Who cares? He's a garbage player. I figured an entire year of watching this loser would have proved that, guess not.

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02-20-2013, 04:39 PM
  #218
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Sample size people.

Guys get on hot streaks. It happens. His career numbers are a lot more reflective of who he is - a JAG.

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02-20-2013, 07:13 PM
  #219
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02-20-2013, 07:15 PM
  #220
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Originally Posted by sjaustin77 View Post
Pyatt is who he is on the ice with most. Lecavalier 2nd. St. Louis 9th and Stamkos isn't in his top 10. TOI is still low but climbing.

He has doubled his production rate. Some of it is PP time, some of it is linemates, some of it is a high shooting %. He likely wouldn't have done the exact same here, but anyone who thinks he was a bad player here last year doesn't know what they are talking about.

I said his production would be hard to replace and it has been. It isn't often that your 9th best player scores 32 points in limited minutes. He had production of a mid tier 2nd line player and it wasn't the first time either. He was good in Montreal too. He is a plus player, physical, worked hard, good on the forecheck, backcheck and boards, incredible takeaway/giveaway ratio & positive penalties for vs against.

People had a bias against him when he came here and obviously still do. All they want to remember is his failed dump in and a slashing penalty in the playoffs. He took very few dumb penalties here. The slashing call was terrible. I see 20 worse slashes every game I watch. On the failed dump in Zanon was still back and didn't take Ward, Thomas gave up a bad rebound and was also interfered with. There was plenty of blame to go around and the goal shouldn't have counted. And if it all it takes is a failed dump in by a 3rd liner to lose then your top 6F, your top 4D and your goalie didn't play well enough.
Does anybody read what's posted? Here it is again:

Quote:
Player Note Tue, Feb 19
Pouliot has quietly turned up the offense in February. He had three assists Tuesday against Toronto to stretch his current streak to four games and seven points, and he has 10 points (four goals, six assists) in his last nine games.
Recommendation: Va-va-va-VOOM. Pouliot is seeing time on the top two lines and seems to be fitting in, whether it's with Vinny Lecavalier or Steven Stamkos. Remember, it's not your top-round choices who win you a title, but your mid-round and waiver picks who ultimately deliver. Pouliot's one of those guys.
(Rotowire.com)

See the highlighted sentence? When the season started he was down on the 3rd line but AS EXACTLY what the report says since Feb he has been moved up and seeing time on the top two freaking lines. If you go look at his game to game stats you see where he has blown up his production. This goes with my original statement that Benny never would have seen top 2 line time in Boston which explains why he is looking good right now. However like I said in Boston, Benny would not be seeing these numbers.


http://espn.go.com/nhl/player/gamelo...benoit-pouliot


3 freaking points in Jan and then he is moved up to the top 2 lines and BAM 13 points since. And please look at his TOI the last 3 games. Just like I said!

GAME SET MATCH

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02-20-2013, 09:41 PM
  #221
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Originally Posted by BamBamCam View Post
Does anybody read what's posted? Here it is again:




See the highlighted sentence? When the season started he was down on the 3rd line but AS EXACTLY what the report says since Feb he has been moved up and seeing time on the top two freaking lines. If you go look at his game to game stats you see where he has blown up his production. This goes with my original statement that Benny never would have seen top 2 line time in Boston which explains why he is looking good right now. However like I said in Boston, Benny would not be seeing these numbers.


http://espn.go.com/nhl/player/gamelo...benoit-pouliot


3 freaking points in Jan and then he is moved up to the top 2 lines and BAM 13 points since. And please look at his TOI the last 3 games. Just like I said!

GAME SET MATCH
Are you reading what is posted?

My post that you quoted wasn't addressed to anyone, I was just giving information and I'm not the one that disagreed with your statements. So you are the one that needs to read what people are writing. Since you have decided to take issue with my post saying GAME SET MATCH, I will respond. Your statements will be in bold.

No it isn't game set match. Your original statement said "However, down in Tampa; he is getting those first and second line minutes".

That is an ice time statement implying that ice time is the reason he is doing well. He is not getting 1st line minutes at all, he is barely getting 2nd line minutes and that has only been for the last 2 games that he crossed that threshold. He had not even hit 15 minutes TOI before that. His total average is still under 13min/game.

Then you said "The last few weeks he has been seeing time with the top 6. TOI doesn't tell you who he is skating with".

So now you are implying that top 6 teammates are the reason he is doing well, giving a time frame for when he started seeing that time, and are changing the argument that was disagreed with about ice time to being about teammates. I agree that he is doing well, but he was doing well before he started playing with the big guns and before he got good ice time.

That report is from Feb 19th. It does not state when he got moved up to the top 2 lines. He hasn't been getting that time for a few weeks as you claim and he hasn't been skating with the top 6 that long either. It has been 3 games since Feb 14th. Less than 1 week.

Whether your argument is ice time or linemates you are wrong on both except for 2 games on ice time which was barely 2nd line time. If it is linemates you want to argue, then that is for 3 games that he has spent the majority of time with Lecavalier & St Louis. Overall the players I stated are correct over the course of the season. He was with Pyatt & Tyrell most until the last 3 games. Because he has played so much with Lecavalier & St. Louis in those 3 games Lecavalier is up to 38.3% & St Louis 23.8%. Pyatt still leads by far at 51.8%. He has barely played with Stamkos or Purcell.

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02-20-2013, 09:44 PM
  #222
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I am inviting everybody on this board for supper at my place.

I am hiring 5 chefs, so come hungry.

Once the chefs get here I am having them clean the house, the garage and then shovel the driveway and front steps.


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