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Phaneuf talks contract

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Old
02-18-2013, 03:36 PM
  #26
sangreale
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Originally Posted by Parkdale View Post
I like Phaneuf...as a second pairing D. We still need a better #1 for this team.
And we can find one of those guys under which rock?

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02-18-2013, 03:36 PM
  #27
LEAFSIN4
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he'll probably get 5 years 30 mil if he keeps his play up...

Phaneuf - Reilly
Gardiner - Franson
Gunnarson - Percy/Finn/Holzer

In 2 years our entire D core is going to be making 15-20 mil which is perfect.

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02-18-2013, 03:37 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parkdale View Post
I like Phaneuf...as a second pairing D. We still need a better #1 for this team.
Name five teams he's not a top-pairing defenseman for.

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02-18-2013, 03:41 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by sangreale View Post
Unlike the fans who are always criticising him ... you know the ones suffering from don'thaveaclueitis.
Come on, he's well overpaid for what he brings to the table! Why can't some people see this. He needs to be a lot more consistent at 6.5. Too many times he gets blown by or he misses a clear defensive assignment.

As for his shot, well, when we really need a goal on a PP he completely seems to fail and hits a player (Lupul) or shoots it way wide.

I want consistency from a number one D, not a clown D some of the time.

He does not always compare favorably to most of the number one D players around the league.

Sorry, just my opinion.

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02-18-2013, 03:44 PM
  #30
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yes, he does.

again, one of only 3 defensemen in hockey last year to finish top-15 in goals, points, hits, and quality of competition.

the other two were Weber and Chara, aka norris nominees.


if you don't see Chara or Weber getting burnt defensively a couple of times every game, you're not watching closely enough.

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02-18-2013, 03:45 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Al14 View Post
I don't dislike him, but, I find that he suffers from too many defensive brain farts (pilonitis) and can't hit the net to save his life (missitalotitis)!
I have no problem trading our captain.

Even if we could get him for less he still is Dion:

-hiccups in the defensive zone
-wild slap shot
-needs more heart / should fight a little more (sorry, but Sittler fought and Dougie spent time in the penalty box too)

We need to move into the future with another player

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02-18-2013, 03:45 PM
  #32
sangreale
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Originally Posted by Al14 View Post
Come on, he's well overpaid for what he brings to the table! Why can't some people see this. He needs to be a lot more consistent at 6.5. Too many times he gets blown by or he misses a clear defensive assignment.

As for his shot, well, when we really need a goal on a PP he completely seems to fail and hits a player (Lupul) or shoots it way wide.

I want consistency from a number one D, not a clown D some of the time.

He does not always compare favorably to most of the number one D players around the league.

Sorry, just my opinion.
No problem. Just wrong that's all.

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02-18-2013, 03:46 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by FlareKnight View Post
If he doesn't, sure makes it seem like that. He winds up and I'm only wondering how loud the sound will be when it goes high and hits the glass. Maybe if Phaneuf just wristed the puck more rather than too often going for an inaccurate kind of shot.
There's no "if" about it - he doesn't.

And he doesn't make it "seem" like that, either.

The only thing that makes it "seem" like that is you being a hometown fan who doesn't watch the other top scoring D on a regular basis.

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Old
02-18-2013, 03:50 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by McClements New A View Post
I have no problem trading our captain.

Even if we could get him for less he still is Dion:

-hiccups in the defensive zone
-wild slap shot
-needs more heart / should fight a little more (sorry, but Sittler fought and Dougie spent time in the penalty box too)

We need to move into the future with another player
Everyone hiccups now and then. You are probably watching just one team.

Slap shot is fine. How about his slapper on the second goal last night?

Don't want the D man playing 20+ in the box with a chump playing 5 or less. We have others for that role.

Need to keep some of the good vets around.

That being said if he is traded for equal talent (esp. youth) would have zero problem. It just irks me that he so easily dismissed by some fans as expendable under any circumstance.

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Old
02-18-2013, 03:55 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Frank Stallone View Post
Name five teams he's not a top-pairing defenseman for.
To clarify, 2nd pairing D meaning the 2nd best D on the team like the way the Leafs use defensemen pairings. Dion has many great aspects to his game, and I'm glad he is on the team, but I think there is room for improvement for our #1. Hard to get in a trade, probably has to be developed from within.

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02-18-2013, 03:57 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parkdale View Post
To clarify, 2nd pairing D meaning the 2nd best D on the team like the way the Leafs use defensemen pairings. Dion has many great aspects to his game, and I'm glad he is on the team, but I think there is room for improvement for our #1. Hard to get in a trade, probably has to be developed from within.
I had a feeling you were referring to #2. To be fair when you say "second pairing" it sounds like a #3/4 Dman not top pairing.

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02-18-2013, 03:59 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parkdale View Post
To clarify, 2nd pairing D meaning the 2nd best D on the team like the way the Leafs use defensemen pairings. Dion has many great aspects to his game, and I'm glad he is on the team, but I think there is room for improvement for our #1. Hard to get in a trade, probably has to be developed from within.
No argument there.

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02-18-2013, 04:02 PM
  #38
Dangles McGavin
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I'm very critical of Dion at times, but man he has been fantastic this year.

We need another solid defensive partner for him.

Joe Colborne for Shea Weber sounds good

From what I've seen of Matt Finn, he seems like he'd be a great partner for Dion if he pans out.

Like the article- I like how he emphasizes that the TEAM is making steps forward (with the Marlies being promoted) and that he wants to be here when we have success.

I hope he comes affordable though.

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Old
02-18-2013, 04:03 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by sangreale View Post
Everyone hiccups now and then. You are probably watching just one team.

Slap shot is fine. How about his slapper on the second goal last night?

Don't want the D man playing 20+ in the box with a chump playing 5 or less. We have others for that role.

Need to keep some of the good vets around.

That being said if he is traded for equal talent (esp. youth) would have zero problem. It just irks me that he so easily dismissed by some fans as expendable under any circumstance.
Every player to ever play has had hiccups. One can only associate Dion with abject failure. Gilmour, Sundin, etc. all can be forgiven because of their winning play. Dion will have this bad association in TO AND in CALGARY. Many nights Dion has not been our best player. There's no way he'll take a massive decrease in pay, so trade him.

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02-18-2013, 04:06 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by Mystifo View Post
I had a feeling you were referring to #2. To be fair when you say "second pairing" it sounds like a #3/4 Dman not top pairing.
Yeah, the terminology is tricky. Many teams including the Leafs do not use their top 2 D together, its more about balancing the D and playing to strengths. I think there is no consensus #2 D on the Leafs and is not likely to be the D playing with Phaneuf.

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02-18-2013, 04:09 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Dangles McGavin View Post
I'm very critical of Dion at times, but man he has been fantastic this year.

We need another solid defensive partner for him.

Joe Colborne for Shea Weber sounds good

From what I've seen of Matt Finn, he seems like he'd be a great partner for Dion if he pans out.

Like the article- I like how he emphasizes that the TEAM is making steps forward (with the Marlies being promoted) and that he wants to be here when we have success.

I hope he comes affordable though.
Reading between the lines I agree with you that too many here a quick to trade as soon as the Leafs are in any position strength. That the sort of attitude that has brought this franchise to ruin so many times. A little patience. No one is going anywhere fast just yet.

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02-18-2013, 04:10 PM
  #42
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I would love to see something like an 8 year $40 million extension. $5 mil cap hit, but front loaded, something around the lines of:

7,6,6,5,4,4,4,4

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02-18-2013, 04:11 PM
  #43
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He can show how much he loves this city and this team by giving us the cap flexibility to make us championship contenders.

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02-18-2013, 04:15 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parkdale View Post
I like Phaneuf...as a second pairing D. We still need a better #1 for this team.
Phaneuf is deff a legit 1st pairing dman and can handle the mins IMO he just needs to be paired with an above average #2 that can compliment his game to get the most out of him

I dont ever see him falling down to the second pairing unless Morgan blows the doors off this team and we want him playing 30min a night and pair him up with a shutdown guy

Im not a huge fan of his but he gets more hate then he should, id be fully content with him at about 5.5 - 5.75M (nothing higher than that though)

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Old
02-18-2013, 04:15 PM
  #45
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5 years, $7m p/y.

But I guess they could offer him a longer term so that he gets more cash right away, just as long as the cap hit does not goes north of 7m.

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Old
02-18-2013, 04:15 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Lebanese Leaf View Post
I would love to see something like an 8 year $40 million extension. $5 mil cap hit, but front loaded, something around the lines of:

7,6,6,5,4,4,4,4
I like the looks of that.

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Old
02-18-2013, 04:23 PM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parkdale View Post
I like Phaneuf...as a second pairing D. We still need a better #1 for this team.
Remember the Quinn years? I certainly do. We yearned for a true #1 who could quarterback the powerplay, and the closest we had was McCabe and Kaberle during their prime. They're generally very difficult to find, and I don't agree that we need a second one. It'd be easier to acquire a few #2's to slot in beside Phaneuf and on the second pairing. With a bit of luck and good development, it's quite possible that two of Rielly, Gardiner, Finn, Blacker, or Percy can turn into a #2.

Hypothetically, if we can get two #2's from that group (still top pairing defensemen), it would mean that we have a #1 and #2 on the top pairing, and a #2 anchoring the second pairing. Phaneuf turns 28 at the end of the season, so we still have plenty of time to enjoy him on our blueline. That also doesn't include who we acquire through trade or free agency.

I think, defensively, we're fine for the time being. The current group are adequate stop-gaps until those other players are ready for bigger assignments. Our only real concerns at this point are a #1 center and a #1 goaltender. Reimer, injuries aside, looks promising, so that really leaves Sundin's replacement. If we can get someone with a bit of size who can put up a consistent 70 points per season, we're ok. Especially if we upgrade our wings in the off-season.

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02-18-2013, 04:24 PM
  #48
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Phaneuf is going to be a lot more effective when he has a responsible #2 D-man who can consistently make up for his mistakes. Either way, I'd be willing to overpay a bit to keep him here long-term

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02-18-2013, 04:29 PM
  #49
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I don't think he'll take a significant pay cut. I think we're still looking at a minimum of 6 million per season...that said, I don't know how much the new cba will impact these type of contracts? From a bigger picture pov, is it even worth offering him a pay cut at all? Considering he's the captain and is entering his prime, what kind of endorsement is ownership and management sending their captain? That he's regressed since his early 20's? I think he'd get over 6m per on the UFA market anyways...might not be worth bruising his ego over a few hundred grand. I think those who are saying 5m per are undervalueing him by a lot.

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02-18-2013, 04:29 PM
  #50
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this team is not going anywhere if he remains at the #1 position.

he's the worst captain we had since rob ramage.

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