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Are you all phonies / Help me watch the game better?

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Old
02-18-2013, 04:56 PM
  #26
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once you watch enough games, its pretty simple to name every team in the leagues top 6 and top pairing.

playing EA NHL games certainly helps too.

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02-18-2013, 04:58 PM
  #27
IDuck
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i think you make a great point..i know i cant watch my team LIVE and the best breakdown because i get kind of emotionally caught up at times and will tend to be a "homer" or have a "whipping boy", however if i watch a replay and if my team isnt playing im very good (which i would imagine most people fall into this aswell) at breaking down teams/players as long as i dont get emotionally caught up in the game/player...but then again, about 90% of the threads in here are made because people are emotionally caught up in the game, and what happens after that is.....well.....entertaining

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Old
02-18-2013, 05:03 PM
  #28
Bluesman91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malcolmedge View Post
Top 6 Forwards: Crosby, Malikin, Giroux, D. Sedin, H. Sedin, Stamkos

Top 4 Defensemen: Karlsson (Probably top 3 players before injury) Weber, Chara, Suter

Crosby is just a dominant player all around. Great vision, hands, skating. Full meal deal. More a passer than shooter, but not by much.

Malkin is the exact same as Crosby with a deadly shot.

Giroux is a great playmaking center who can pot good goal when he decides to shot a puck. Which he hasn't done much of this year. Also lacking due to loss of Jagr.

D. Sedin/H. Sedin are two of the smartest, most hard working players in the league. Being twins helps them a lot. They have amazing vision, and ability to physically with stand any defensemen in the NHL. They take the cycle game to a whole new level. Daniel is the better one at shooting and Henrik is the genius passer. He scores occasionally as well, like last night...I still dont think he meant it.

Stamkos is in my opinion the best shot in the NHL and easiest superstar to defend on paper. He has the fastest release in the NHL and has the ability to get open to get his shot off.

Any of those Top 6 are guys you'd want to build a team around, and they all have.

Erik Karlsson is truly something special. He has amazing vision, he is the most powerful skater in his position and has a deadly shot. He is essentially a forward who plays defense. Yet he also plays that part of his game very well. Go back and watch some of the Sens games before his injury and watch how he controlled play whenever he was on the ice
Well this is a good post on what it's like to be a Sens fan.

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Old
02-19-2013, 01:48 AM
  #29
Kaphis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluesman91 View Post
Well this is a good post on what it's like to be a Sens fan.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lampshade View Post
There are three better players then Karlsson listed above. Crosby needs no explanation nor does Malkin the two most dominate players. Stamkos is the best goal scorer in the NHL. There are a few goalies also that would be a more important part to a team also. This is a case of Karlsson being over valued.
LOL funny enough that comes up in a thread like this.

These two messages are good example of people the TC is talking about. People who talk about hockey as if they know the player but doesn't really.

Not a Sens fan here but I watch a lot of games just because I enjoy watching hockey players develop. I can probably do this with a few other players as well.

Karlsson scores most of this goals actually from the point. As much as Crosby, Malkin and Stamkos are great players. Karlsson is one of the smoothest skaters and have a crazy wrist shot from the blue line. His wrist shots are accurate and low close to the ice or just above pad level.

He was leading the league in shots for all skaters as a defensemen not because he is a 4th forward but because of his ability to shoot a hard heavy puck along the ice from the blueline that hits the net. He has good vision but not the same as a forward per say. Crosby and St.Louis. Those guys have eyes on the back of their head, Karlsson from what I've seen doesn't have that same ability. But hes a defensemen, his vision comes from reading the play and breaking out offensive threats which he excels at whether is in the neutral zone, offensive zone or defensive zone. His speed of course helps with that and his ability to rotate and take a wrist shot quick is what separates him from not just a lot of defensemen, but a lot of forwards as well.

So although a lot of people think hes a 4th forward, I think Karlsson would be terrible as a forward. He isn't a pure sniper and his vision I believe isn't as great when he is pass the faceoff dot. His bread and butter and sneaking in with speed from the blue line as the backdoor. Counter attack on the rush. Firing hard wrist shots for rebounds and tips.

If you only have time to look at his goals, check out most of them and how they are all low and often five hole.

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Old
02-19-2013, 04:35 AM
  #30
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just go watch that players highlights on youtube.

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Old
02-19-2013, 05:19 AM
  #31
SB164
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First of all, take tarheelhockey's advice.

Second of all, for one single game, instead of always focusing on your team (whose players you should know well by now), pretend you're a fan of the opposing team. I know, it won't be easy, but it'll come easier against a non-rival team.

For example, the Habs played the Canes last night. So instead of watching say Subban hitting Patrick Dywer, watch Dwyer get hit by Subban. Does that make any sense? Or don't focus on how Markov tries to pokecheck the puck away from Eric Staal, focus on how Staal attempts to get by Markov. Your perspective really changes based on the team you're rooting for.

So when Tyler Seguin scores a goal against the Habs, I'm wondering what the hell happened, cause I'm too busy blaming a Habs defenceman. But the Bruins fan knows exactly what happened, because he's watching his team, he saw the play unfold from the Bruins perspective and saw the sneaky way in which Seguin managed to get open. Instead of saying "Hey, that Seguin guy is pretty good", I'm thinking "Hey, Diaz just messed up!"

Anyways, I don't know how else to explain it. When the Habs had that terrible season last year, I really started watching the other teams, seeing the plays unfold, and noticing all the little split-decision plays that make up a hockey game.

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Old
02-19-2013, 05:34 AM
  #32
KEEROLE Vatanen
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Just go on youtube and watch every single Don Cherry video you can find, then after that, watch every Jack Edwards video you can find. You can thank me later

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Old
02-19-2013, 05:59 AM
  #33
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Honestly, playing hockey videogames has kept me up to date with jersey numbers and general position play for the last few years. The overall and stats in the games can be pretty suspect, but generally they're ok, though they tend to overvalue veterans and don't reward youngsters.

I just try to watch as much hockey as I can. I'll catch every Leafs game, but I'll also watch at least one game every day, whether the Leafs play or not, and I try to pick matchups of teams who I either haven't seen for a while, or who I feel I know little about. I'm also aware that as a uni student, I have a ton of free time that most people don't have.

To answer your question, I feel like I'd be pretty good at giving you a general report on most players in the league, though I'm sure would either be a little outdated, or may be affected by a particularly good or bad night in which I saw them.

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Old
02-19-2013, 06:19 AM
  #34
Offtheboard412
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malcolmedge View Post

Crosby is just a dominant player all around. Great vision, hands, skating. Full meal deal. More a passer than shooter, but not by much.

Malkin is the exact same as Crosby with a deadly shot.
The only thing they have in common is that their the two best players in the league and are close in overall talent. Other than that they play literally nothing alike.

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Old
02-19-2013, 06:35 AM
  #35
Shaby23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SB164 View Post
First of all, take tarheelhockey's advice.

Second of all, for one single game, instead of always focusing on your team (whose players you should know well by now), pretend you're a fan of the opposing team. I know, it won't be easy, but it'll come easier against a non-rival team.

For example, the Habs played the Canes last night. So instead of watching say Subban hitting Patrick Dywer, watch Dwyer get hit by Subban. Does that make any sense? Or don't focus on how Markov tries to pokecheck the puck away from Eric Staal, focus on how Staal attempts to get by Markov. Your perspective really changes based on the team you're rooting for.

So when Tyler Seguin scores a goal against the Habs, I'm wondering what the hell happened, cause I'm too busy blaming a Habs defenceman. But the Bruins fan knows exactly what happened, because he's watching his team, he saw the play unfold from the Bruins perspective and saw the sneaky way in which Seguin managed to get open. Instead of saying "Hey, that Seguin guy is pretty good", I'm thinking "Hey, Diaz just messed up!"

Anyways, I don't know how else to explain it. When the Habs had that terrible season last year, I really started watching the other teams, seeing the plays unfold, and noticing all the little split-decision plays that make up a hockey game.
That was so well said

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Old
02-19-2013, 07:22 AM
  #36
Lonny Bohonos
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tarheelhockey View Post
Of course we use other people's opinions as our own. That's natural when dealing with close to 1000 players. Generally, though, there are about 200-300 players who are really relevant to the league and if you make a point to closely watch a handful of good ones in each game, plus knowing the players on your own team very well, you're going to pick up on the important players over the course of a few years. The day-to-day news and the churn of forgettable players becomes background noise to the most important players' long-term changes in role and ability.



Here's a suggestion for changing your perspective when watching a game:

1) First, stop watching the puck. Literally forget about it and ignore it completely.

2) Now, stop watching individual players. Let your eyes un-focus and view the two teams like schools of fish -- look at the team, not the players. By this time, you should be basically seeing two patterns interacting with each other. Roughly square-shaped, with the wingers and defensemen forming the corners and the center roaming around the middle.

3) Now, looking only at those patterns, try to pick out the moments when one pattern seems to get an advantage over the other. You'll spot moments when the defensive team starts fluttering around, confused and unable to hold a geometric shape. Note the reasons for that change -- is it that the forwards on the successful side were simply faster, or that they are physically overwhelming their opponents, or is it a case of one player making a dynamic move that threw everything into chaos? Are the defenders just standing around like statues, or are they moving too much?

4) Once you feel like you've got a handle on what's happening at the team level, THEN check which players were involved. There's a very good chance that by the end of the game, you'll have spotted the same players consistently doing the same things right, and the same players consistently doing the same things wrong.

5) At this point you can pretty much write up a scouting report about the strongest and weakest players from both teams, as well as those who made themselves irrelevant by failing to get involved in anything important.

It helps to be in the arena. TV is a terrible medium for judging these things, especially in transition. If you must watch on TV, it really helps to make liberal use of a DVR rewind button when you see something interesting happen. There's a very good chance that there were 2-3 players involved in making one player look good or bad.
Good advice. I think the defocussing is a good way to do it.

Its interesting not only seeing how a player starts a chain of events but also how that the other player react.

Usually its not one player whos at fault.

I remember the Bieksa dive against Chicago when Versteeg scored. Bieksas mistake was most notable but when you looked at the whole play you have 4 other guys in the around the goal line.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Plante View Post
Hockey isn't rocket science. If you've played the game before its remarkably easy to keep up with whats going on and how to judge talent.

Its not the people who only watch one team who should worry you, its the people who have never played hockey giving an opinion on hockey that you should worry you.

Theres an element of truth to this. Especially when it comes to understanding what a player may be thinking in a particular situation.


Quote:
Originally Posted by silkyjohnson50 View Post
Read more HFBoards. Seriously. You can get pretty good scouting reports from team forums.

But seriously, the best tip I can give is to watch more games not involving the team you follow. When I watch games that involve my team, I tend to focus too much on what they're doing rather than both sides. When you watch a game from a neutral standpoint it's easier to evaluate the game as a whole. I find myself analyzing the game better and learning more about players that way.
Emotional detachment goes a long way.

My favorite team is the nucks. But I love the sport more than the nucks and have been out of the loop not living in vancouver and not having access to hockey for some years that I just dont get caught up in the "fever".


Last edited by Lonny Bohonos: 02-19-2013 at 07:28 AM.
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Old
02-19-2013, 07:33 AM
  #37
DarrenBanks56
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im aware of how other players are doing.
dont think i could give an accurate report on top6/top4.
I pick up things while watching games though.

I could tell you probably every jersey number of every player ive seen play, and I could tell you if they shoot left or right handed. I pick up on stuff like that.

Im a Bruins fan, and I mainly watch them. So, if you tell me a past Bruins game, I could tell you everything I did that whole day. Tats how i remember crap from years past.

im a season ticket holder, so I usually get to see the whole ice. best way for me to put it, is Im watching the game as if I am picking players for the last spots on a team. I watch for players that stand out. Dnt focus on one skater. Its harder to do whiole watching on tv, but I still do it when watching on tv

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