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Has Adam Oates Been Fired Yet????

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Old
03-11-2014, 11:08 PM
  #651
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
At heart, Adam Oates is a brilliant diplomat. He's managed to do something that hasn't really been done in a decade:

Unite this board in our view of the coaching staff.

Well done Adam.
Silver lining!!!!!


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03-12-2014, 10:06 AM
  #652
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Part of the issue with this team and their possession numbers, or lack there of, is the friggen "style" they play, known as the "Dump and chase" which to me is the same as throwing a deep pass to no one in particular hoping your guy catches it or even the opposing guy catching it and somehow scoring off of that. It's like many little Hail Mary's during the coarse of the game. Why giving up the puck on a routine basis is considered a solid offensive strategy is mind boggling.

The dump and chase is good for two things:

1) line changes
2) the name of a blog

That's it. How many times have they played the dump and chase and the only chasing they end up doing is chasing a 2 on 1 or 1 on none break on our goalie? That they are told to keep doing it makes me want to punch a baby. Watch any of the top teams, I don't care who it is, they don't regularly play that way. Scoring is never going to come from giving the opponent puck. Period.

The coaching staff here is primarily to blame for the product on the ice. I am no fan of GMGM and will be delirious when he packs his stuff and moves on but he has done a pretty decent job of drafting talented players and making moves that put the team in a better position all in all. I think he does stick his nose in on the day to day management of the team and how they play. See Gabby on that. Oates with his OCD handed crap, bizarre line combos and the running of players back and forth on the "Hershey Highway" is maddening. I'm not sure what Latta or Oleksy have done to be banished to the AHL. It would be tough for anyone to convince me that Casey Wellman is better than Latta or Carrick is better than Oleksy but then again to quote our GMGM, if I knew anything about hockey I would be in the game.

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Old
03-12-2014, 10:11 AM
  #653
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PucktotheHead View Post
Part of the issue....
Good stuff, post more often!

You dump the puck in, when you want to avoid a turnover, and have no better option.

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Old
03-12-2014, 10:18 AM
  #654
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
At heart, Adam Oates is a brilliant diplomat. He's managed to do something that hasn't really been done in a decade:

Unite this board in our view of the coaching staff.

Well done Adam.
Well done, you! Agreed wholeheartedly. I keep waiting for the team that surged ahead of everyone in the latter part of last season. Now I know that's not going to happen. Not with a team that has no discernible defense.

I was so hopeful for this season, thinking that with a full training camp, the team would learn the system to its fullest. But blech, after all we've seen, there's nothing.

I wish for Laviolette to be hired, but I don't see that happening.

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Old
03-12-2014, 10:19 AM
  #655
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyHolt View Post
You dump the puck in, when you want to avoid a turnover, and have no better option.
Oh if you're huge and fast and want to wallpaper a defenseman.

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Old
03-12-2014, 10:30 AM
  #656
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Originally Posted by Acallabeth View Post
Oh if you're huge and fast and want to wallpaper a defenseman.
Exactly, when you have no offense, you do what teams to do to us.

You slow dump in, and start crushing the weakest link on defense, over and over. They will cough it up, and get you a prime scoring chance.

Oates is living in fantasy land thinking his offense is successful. I don't even know what we are trying to do.

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Old
03-12-2014, 10:32 AM
  #657
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyHolt View Post
Good stuff, post more often!

You dump the puck in, when you want to avoid a turnover, and have no better option.
Hey thanks!

So what you are inferring is the 60+ times they dump it they have no better option? Right.

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03-12-2014, 11:18 AM
  #658
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PucktotheHead View Post
Hey thanks!

So what you are inferring is the 60+ times they dump it they have no better option? Right.
It's likely what we are doing before we get to the point of being forced to decide, that is the problem. A 1 on 3 entering, 2 on 4.

Maybe its rooted in our horrid defensive play. Completely disorganized, or we are gassed from all the running around, dump for a line change. See Pitts first goal? I am not sure if I have ever seen 4 lost players on a goal. A 3 on 5 no less.

But look no farther than Pitt to see teams just running circles around us in all zones. And its not just their superstars, either. They have space, they have the puck, they move with speed. They are a well oiled machine.

Meanwhile, we look like a couple of boobgies


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03-12-2014, 11:20 AM
  #659
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyHolt View Post
Exactly, when you have no offense, you do what teams to do to us.

You slow dump in, and start crushing the weakest link on defense, over and over. They will cough it up, and get you a prime scoring chance.

Oates is living in fantasy land thinking his offense is successful. I don't even know what we are trying to do.

THIS

I can't tell you how many people argue that the players are still learning oates system, I ask, WHAT SYSTEM?! There is nothing there, its garbage, GTFO.

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Old
03-12-2014, 11:24 AM
  #660
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There are a few reasons to dump the puck* but when you couple it with a defensive philosophy that's passive and intentionally allows shots you are not going to have good possession numbers or any kind of flow. You're going to spend all your time dumping, chasing and backchecking. Which is what we see.

Keep everything outside, fling the puck up the boards, dump, kinda chase, fail to generate a shot, chase the odd man break the other direction, repeat.

This, as I've been saying for a long time, is Hanlon Hockey. It's nearly the same style of play. Hanlon did it to protect his weak defense and spotty goaltending, and to cover up for the lack of skill in transition. Oates has a few reasons in play, but I think the main ones are the vulnerability of his system and the roster deficiencies on the blueline.


*defense stacked at the blueline preventing carrying into the zone, line change, lack of finesse players, strong forwards and weak defensemen on the other side, killing the clock, preventing a more talented team from getting possession provided you cycle well, etc.

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03-12-2014, 11:30 AM
  #661
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blades of steel View Post
THIS

I can't tell you how many people argue that the players are still learning oates system, I ask, WHAT SYSTEM?! There is nothing there, its garbage, GTFO.
Oates is obviously a control freak and a pathological systemizer and overthinker. That's good for some professions, but not for head coaching in the NHL.

He can't just turn the players loose in a Type B personality kind of way like BB did. He has to have a system and a justification for everything. "Get the puck deep" is a respected hockey cliche that Mr. Counterintuitive seems willing to cling to because what else is he going to do?

If you're going to try and play from below the goal line or along the walls, put lines together to do that instead of going with some handedness obsession first and foremost. Then work on getting SCORING CHANCES out of that effort, rather than just just grinding for the sake of grinding (which was another component of Hanlon Hockey).

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Old
03-12-2014, 11:37 AM
  #662
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Originally Posted by g00n View Post
There are a few reasons to dump the puck* but when you couple it with a defensive philosophy that's passive and intentionally allows shots you are not going to have good possession numbers or any kind of flow. You're going to spend all your time dumping, chasing and backchecking. Which is what we see.

Keep everything outside, fling the puck up the boards, dump, kinda chase, fail to generate a shot, chase the odd man break the other direction, repeat.

This, as I've been saying for a long time, is Hanlon Hockey. It's nearly the same style of play. Hanlon did it to protect his weak defense and spotty goaltending, and to cover up for the lack of skill in transition. Oates has a few reasons in play, but I think the main ones are the vulnerability of his system and the roster deficiencies on the blueline.


*defense stacked at the blueline preventing carrying into the zone, line change, lack of finesse players, strong forwards and weak defensemen on the other side, killing the clock, preventing a more talented team from getting possession provided you cycle well, etc.
EXACTLY. It's like an NHL version of the prevent defense.

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Old
03-12-2014, 12:03 PM
  #663
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Originally Posted by PucktotheHead View Post
EXACTLY. It's like an NHL version of the prevent defense.
Nearly every coach under GMGM has had to do it. Even BB went to the trap. Hunter's style was all about defense first, blocking shots, turning snipers into grinders, etc. There was Hanlon Hockey. And I can't recall if it was Butch or Wilson who used 3 d-men at one point, I think Butch.

If that's the case then EVERY coach GMGM has hired has resorted to some kind of drastic, emergency defensive system to cover up for bad defensemen, bad goaltending, or both.

This under a GM who refuses to pay for solid, top-4 stay at home d-men and insists on playing young puck-movers and waiver wire retreads.

COINCIDENCE???

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Old
03-12-2014, 12:04 PM
  #664
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But we trap on offense...

We punt on 3rd down, and try to bait them into our "allow their best shot" defensive system, knowing we will score from them falling into our trap. It is free agency time for the NFL, after all.

That's as best as I can figure it out. Exiting the zone, we are lost, zombies, disorganized.

Clearly, Oates thinks his approach on defense leads to scoring chances for us. Does he think the opponents are going to take slappers from the corner and spring our breakout? His system is far too complex, or doesn't work with our "low wattage" players.

Sad thing is, we are so close to competing. Roll the dice and go to the Bruce offense. But Oates and most coaches ego's are too strong to try such basic changes.

Maybe we need the dimmest bulb former cap to be our next coach.

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Old
03-12-2014, 12:19 PM
  #665
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyHolt View Post
It's likely what we are doing before we get to the point of being forced to decide, that is the problem. A 1 on 3 entering, 2 on 4.

Maybe its rooted in our horrid defensive play. Completely disorganized, or we are gassed from all the running around, dump for a line change. See Pitts first goal? I am not sure if I have ever seen 4 lost players on a goal. A 3 on 5 no less.

But look no farther than Pitt to see teams just running circles around us in all zones. And its not just their superstars, either. They have space, they have the puck, they move with speed. They are a well oiled machine.

Meanwhile, we look like a couple of boobgies

Is that JC74 in the white hat blue shirt?

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Old
03-12-2014, 12:45 PM
  #666
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Originally Posted by RandyHolt View Post
from them falling into our trap.
The only problem is the only ones falling into our trap is us.

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03-12-2014, 12:58 PM
  #667
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Is that JC74 in the white hat blue shirt?
No, that is Mike Green

The sailor is Tom Poti.

The snob in the background is.... wait for it... Troy Brouwer.

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Old
03-12-2014, 12:59 PM
  #668
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He's got the whole world in his handedness,

He's got the whole world in his handedness,

He's got the whole world in his handedness,

He's got the whole world in his handedness.

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03-12-2014, 01:03 PM
  #669
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Originally Posted by RandyHolt View Post
No, that is Mike Green

The sailor is Tom Poti.

The snob in the background is.... wait for it... Troy Brouwer.
LOL now I get it.

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Old
03-12-2014, 02:17 PM
  #670
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''The first period, they controlled the game,'' Ovechkin said. ''The last 30 minutes, we played our game, got the puck deep, started to cycle. Maybe we were just a little bit tired, maybe we were just a little sleepy. We just weren't ready for the first period."
Why is this team always "sleepy" and never ready to play a hockey game?

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03-12-2014, 03:07 PM
  #671
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No motivation at all.

Only by Brouwer embarrassing himself between periods does everyone tick up a notch the effort level enough to compete.

Oates seems indifferent to it all. In the middle of it, refuses to start games with Ovi.

Yet cannot for the life of him, figure out why we start slow.

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03-13-2014, 08:37 AM
  #672
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Why is this team always "sleepy" and never ready to play a hockey game?
Because its the easiest way to describe "I don't have a spine" without saying "I don't have a spine"

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03-14-2014, 04:23 PM
  #673
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When and if the Caps are mathematically eliminated from the playoffs this year, how do you think Oates reacts? Does he experiment with systems and lines even more? Does he stick to his guns and just let the whole thing die a slow, painful death? Are there player meltdowns? Mutiny?

Peer into your crystal ball and tell us what you see...



edit: by my calculations it could be as early as the end of March, which would leave about 7 lame duck games on the Caps schedule


Last edited by g00n: 03-14-2014 at 04:30 PM.
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03-14-2014, 06:09 PM
  #674
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Mathematically they'll most likely be eliminated from reaching 92 points by then but they could still hold out slight hope of everyone else (or just those fighting for the last spot) utterly collapsing to prolong their hopes. When the time comes that it's actually over I expect Oates will have them just play out the string. "Honor" in defeat. Maybe it leads to Holtby getting the bulk of the remaining starts or more TOI for Kuznetsov and Wilson but I don't think he'll ever fundamentally change the system. It's philosophical.

I'd expect frustration and a lack of answers rather than mutiny or meltdowns. They'll go quietly.

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03-15-2014, 09:54 AM
  #675
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g00n View Post
When and if the Caps are mathematically eliminated from the playoffs this year, how do you think Oates reacts? Does he experiment with systems and lines even more? Does he stick to his guns and just let the whole thing die a slow, painful death? Are there player meltdowns? Mutiny?

Peer into your crystal ball and tell us what you see...



edit: by my calculations it could be as early as the end of March, which would leave about 7 lame duck games on the Caps schedule
Oates will stick to his guns and say that injuries to Laich and Grabo and the concussion to Green, Hillen dying, and Erskine's issues hampered the team's ability to snatch a playoff spot.

GMGM will add that we knew the division would be a battle to the end and that very few teams could suffer such losses throughout the season and remain as competitive in the playoff race as Washington has. Then something about league parity and being pleased with how many players in Hershey were able to step up for us throughout the season, a testament to the organizations commitment to player development and depth and likelihood for long-term success.

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