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George McPhee II

View Poll Results: Do the Caps need a new GM? Fire George, or keep George?
Fire George 80 81.63%
Keep George 18 18.37%
Voters: 98. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
07-21-2013, 02:11 PM
  #476
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Johansson is Robin.

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07-21-2013, 03:22 PM
  #477
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Barely a question. The teams he's responsible for the building of have won 3 playoff series in 14 seasons. No GM should ever be able to hire six coaches.

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07-21-2013, 06:19 PM
  #478
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Barely a question. The teams he's responsible for the building of have won 3 playoff series in 14 seasons. No GM should ever be able to hire six coaches.
Haven't read much of this board have you.

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07-22-2013, 07:29 AM
  #479
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Yeah, we 'learned' that Brooks Laich 'evolved' into our 2C and John Erskine 'evolved' into our top 4D. I'd be positively shocked if they don't advance further in the playoffs with those developments. I mean, Feaster 'learned' that Blake Comeau was a 1C with great success did he not.

And Real Life Batman gets his spinal chord completely severed when that asian 'knocks' it back into place and dies in the hole from malnutrition. Which actually seems to be where the Real Life Caps are headed, so there's that.
I feel your cynicism. Fact is that if you doubt Batman then thats just how you view things. You are Matthew Modin (altho I'm sure you can act better) who didn't believe until up at the end and things didn't go so well for him.

In 1990 no human being in existence could have forseen John Druce going on the loose.

The next year the North Stars made one of the most improbable runs to the finals I've seen. LA was an 8 seed who struggled all season a couple years ago and just DOMINATED in the playoffs. Name one person who saw that?

Lombardi was just about out of time and his past results did not indicate a dominant run to the finals.

Then you have Pasani time in 2006. Sure Pronger was key and Roloson played at a very high level but a random no name like Pasani came up HUGE.

History is littered with improbable playoff runs and performances. Some after years and years of futility.

Sometimes you just have to believe and keep doing so. For as incompetent as you may think GMGM is (and there is an argument that can be made for sure) one thing he is not is indifferent. The guy cares and seriously wants to win. He does not have a Jeff Schultz type of mindset and he never played that way.

Stanley Cup victory will be far far sweeter when we win with this group of players and management.

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07-22-2013, 08:18 AM
  #480
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Yes. Who could forget the time that John Druce led Washington to its first Cup.

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07-22-2013, 08:24 AM
  #481
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To use a line from the great Reginald VelJohnson in the timeless classic Die Hard...

"Why don't you wake up and smell what you shoveling?"

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07-22-2013, 08:34 AM
  #482
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I get it. I know I'm probably the lone voice of belief here and thats cool.

Fact is the most all of you think the Caps are beyond saving. The GM needs to go, the owner needs to be changed, we need to boycott the Verizon center so Ted will feel it in his wallet, Green is addition by subtraction, Johansson is sux, Erskine/Oleksy/Hillen should be #7 dmen, Brooks Laich needs to shut up and be traded, Oveckin needs to be bought out or goto Russia (oh wait..this one was at the beginning of last year), etc etc etc

You get the idea. You all feel the Caps need major reconstruction at the very least. That they need to be destroyed in order to be fixed. A necessary evil.

Sounds like the League of Shadows to me....hmmmmmmm

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07-22-2013, 08:38 AM
  #483
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I feel your cynicism. Fact is that if you doubt Batman then thats just how you view things. You are Matthew Modin (altho I'm sure you can act better) who didn't believe until up at the end and things didn't go so well for him.

In 1990 no human being in existence could have forseen John Druce going on the loose.

The next year the North Stars made one of the most improbable runs to the finals I've seen. LA was an 8 seed who struggled all season a couple years ago and just DOMINATED in the playoffs. Name one person who saw that?

Lombardi was just about out of time and his past results did not indicate a dominant run to the finals.

Then you have Pasani time in 2006. Sure Pronger was key and Roloson played at a very high level but a random no name like Pasani came up HUGE.

History is littered with improbable playoff runs and performances. Some after years and years of futility.

Sometimes you just have to believe and keep doing so. For as incompetent as you may think GMGM is (and there is an argument that can be made for sure) one thing he is not is indifferent. The guy cares and seriously wants to win. He does not have a Jeff Schultz type of mindset and he never played that way.

Stanley Cup victory will be far far sweeter when we win with this group of players and management.
Problem is most of those teams came up short. And the one that didn't, the Kings, had amazing possession numbers and terrible luck in the regular season.

The Caps are a terrible possession team lately. I am of the opinion that if you aren't in the top 5-7 teams in possession you aren't going to get to the Cup much less win. Caps should be better than 7th or 9th worst this year. Erat is a positive possession player and Laich is pretty even overall and Ribs was a big negative. But will that get us into the top 10? 7? 5? I am guessing, with no further moves, Caps end up middle of the pack and that even with a great run of luck in the playoffs would at best net a loss in the finals and more likely going out far earlier. Caps need better possession players.

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07-22-2013, 08:40 AM
  #484
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I get it. I know I'm probably the lone voice of belief here and thats cool.

Fact is the most all of you think the Caps are beyond saving. The GM needs to go, the owner needs to be changed, we need to boycott the Verizon center so Ted will feel it in his wallet, Green is addition by subtraction, Johansson is sux, Erskine/Oleksy/Hillen should be #7 dmen, Brooks Laich needs to shut up and be traded, Oveckin needs to be bought out or goto Russia (oh wait..this one was at the beginning of last year), etc etc etc

You get the idea. You all feel the Caps need major reconstruction at the very least. That they need to be destroyed in order to be fixed. A necessary evil.

Sounds like the League of Shadows to me....hmmmmmmm
Im pretty sure none of us are saying that.

We're saying they need a 2nd line center, a 2LD and, a swift kick in the nuts.

And a new GM to do it...if this one fails....again.


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07-22-2013, 08:47 AM
  #485
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Originally Posted by Xaroc View Post
Problem is most of those teams came up short. And the one that didn't, the Kings, had amazing possession numbers and terrible luck in the regular season.

The Caps are a terrible possession team lately. I am of the opinion that if you aren't in the top 5-7 teams in possession you aren't going to get to the Cup much less win. Caps should be better than 7th or 9th worst this year. Erat is a positive possession player and Laich is pretty even overall and Ribs was a big negative. But will that get us into the top 10? 7? 5? I am guessing, with no further moves, Caps end up middle of the pack and that even with a great run of luck in the playoffs would at best net a loss in the finals and more likely going out far earlier. Caps need better possession players.
We had fantastic possession numbers under BB. How did our post seasons go then?

You all put far too much in those metrics IMO

The Kings won b/c they caught lighting in a bottle. All their players got confidence at the same time and their goalie went on a dominant roll. They were not simply an "unlucky" team. Lombardi was about to get himself fired! How that changed quickly eh?a

If you think those are the ONLY examples in history you are mistaken. Those just immediately came to mind.

The 93 Canadiens had no business winning a cup. Team USA won gold in 1980 with a badly outgunned and outmatched team. There have been a great many insanely dominant teams that haven't won.

How the heck did we beat the Penguins in 93-94?

The point is that there are suprise players, teams etc that make improbable runs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by strungout View Post
Im pretty sure none of us are saying that.

We're saying they need a 2nd line center, a 2LD and, a swift kick in the nuts.

And a new GM to do it...if this one fails....again.
I see it different. I see some suggest that its Ted who is the problem and needs to feel it in his pockets before he does "anything". GMGM clearly needs to go too.

Then we have players like Green and Johansson who derive tons of hate and clearly need to go. Just like Semin last year.

Then we have guys who everyone is clamouring to get shipped out as they make too much (Ward and Laich)

Oleksy's contract and roster space hurts us. Erskine makes too much for a depth guy.

Brouwer is a possession black hole.

Prior to last season there was broad support for finding a way to ditch Ovechkin.

It feels like its alot more than just a 2C+top 4LD+GMGMs head. It won't stop there and you know it. Johansson, Ward, Laich, Green will be next in line. After that there will be other goats.

Last year it was Semin who was the problem..and Green and Ovechkin. The people who are unhappy want a great deal of change. How quickly we forget the tanking crowd.

They really want to blow things up and start from scratch. They believe this version of the team is lost. They don't believe in the core. They need to see the team destroyed before they are content


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07-22-2013, 09:15 AM
  #486
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We had fantastic possession numbers under BB. How did our post seasons go then?

You all put far too much in those metrics IMO

The Kings won b/c they caught lighting in a bottle. All their players got confidence at the same time and their goalie went on a dominant roll. They were not simply an "unlucky" team. Lombardi was about to get himself fired! How that changed quickly eh?a

If you think those are the ONLY examples in history you are mistaken. Those just immediately came to mind.

The 93 Canadiens had no business winning a cup. Team USA won gold in 1980 with a badly outgunned and outmatched team. There have been a great many insanely dominant teams that haven't won.

How the heck did we beat the Penguins in 93-94?

The point is that there are suprise players, teams etc that make improbable runs.
The Caps were in the top 5 in Fenwick Close two times since 2007 in 2007 and 2008 and were hampered by poor goaltending in both years (Theo and Huet I think?). LA was 4th in Fenwick Close before the trade deadline and 1rst overall after the trade deadline. They were first overall last year too. Chicago was 2nd, the Bruins were 4th. Regular season Fenwick Close was 11-4 calling playoff series last year.

Being high in the list doesn't guarantee you a Cup obviously but if the Caps are going to have a shot they need to be up there for a number of years. Last 5 years it has been a team high in that metric that has won it. That is why I hold it in high regard.

I am not a blow the team up guy. I just think a fresh set of eyes on our talent would go a long way towards getting us to the promised land.

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07-22-2013, 09:20 AM
  #487
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Nope. People just want a 2C and a 2LD. Expectations are diminished to the point where fielding a complete roster can be considered a mitzvah.

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07-22-2013, 09:35 AM
  #488
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Nope. People just want a 2C and a 2LD. Expectations are diminished to the point where fielding a complete roster can be considered a mitzvah.
So people don't want GMGM fired?

They don't think Laich and Ward are way overpaid and need to be shipped out?

They don't think that MJ is a soft bust of a player who is mooching off Ovie and backstrom?

I'm not even getting into Green. The hatred for him+contract+injury history made him #1 goat before he finished the season strong.

No you will not stop there. You are part of the "burn it to the ground" club and I know this b/c even if those issues get addressed (2C and 2LD) you will just shift to the next goats.

Carlson is even starting to get very close to the edge of the volcano. Neuvirth was there all season and he's another guy people would rather see gone in lieu of a vet.

Face it..you simply do not believe in this team. Thats your view of things and fine.

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The Caps were in the top 5 in Fenwick Close two times since 2007 in 2007 and 2008 and were hampered by poor goaltending in both years (Theo and Huet I think?). LA was 4th in Fenwick Close before the trade deadline and 1rst overall after the trade deadline. They were first overall last year too. Chicago was 2nd, the Bruins were 4th. Regular season Fenwick Close was 11-4 calling playoff series last year.

Being high in the list doesn't guarantee you a Cup obviously but if the Caps are going to have a shot they need to be up there for a number of years. Last 5 years it has been a team high in that metric that has won it. That is why I hold it in high regard.

I am not a blow the team up guy. I just think a fresh set of eyes on our talent would go a long way towards getting us to the promised land.
Wait...so you are saying a 2C and 2LD is all we need to be a top 5 metric team? You feel that we need a new GM to acquire these 2 players so he can choose the 2 to make it happen? Are these players young versions of Messier and Pronger?

You say you are not a blow the team up guy. I haven't read enough of your posts to substantiate that. I am very skeptical however. People who say "2C+2LD+GMGMs head on a silver plate = PROFIT!" usually really mean they want more change than just that...those just happen to be the most pressing changes that need to be made but the MJ/Laich/Ward/Green/Erskine/Neuvirth types will be next in line on their minds.


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07-22-2013, 09:43 AM
  #489
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Someone is being overly dramatic.

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07-22-2013, 09:45 AM
  #490
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Someone is being overly dramatic.
Yeah strung you may want to check yoself in the mirror

What I say is true. Search your souls and you will see. Deep down the roots of all this comes from a strong lack of belief to the very core of the organization.

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07-22-2013, 09:49 AM
  #491
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Yeah strung you may want to check yoself in the mirror

What I say is true. Search your souls and you will see. Deep down the roots of all this comes from a strong lack of belief to the very core of the organization.
How can you even evaluate the core when they haven't had the luxury of playing on a complete team ever? It'd be nice to give them that before the core continues to peel away due to age/free agency/injury etc.

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07-22-2013, 10:27 AM
  #492
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Wait...so you are saying a 2C and 2LD is all we need to be a top 5 metric team? You feel that we need a new GM to acquire these 2 players so he can choose the 2 to make it happen? Are these players young versions of Messier and Pronger?

You say you are not a blow the team up guy. I haven't read enough of your posts to substantiate that. I am very skeptical however. People who say "2C+2LD+GMGMs head on a silver plate = PROFIT!" usually really mean they want more change than just that...those just happen to be the most pressing changes that need to be made but the MJ/Laich/Ward/Green/Erskine/Neuvirth types will be next in line on their minds.
I don't love everything about the team but I think it needs tweaked rather than blown up. I don't know if just a 2C/2LD will get us into the top 5 in FF%. I also think our 4th line is fairly weak for a championship team but that is a fairly easily addressable problem. My biggest issue is that McPhee seems unwilling or unable to actually fix these problems.

I have been a bigtime McPhee supporter over the years. I don't post much here so there isn't a long record of it but I have mostly liked what he has done at various times. I just think he tends to leave fatal flaws on all the teams he puts together (in different years: goaltending, 2C, defense in general). I get there is a salary cap but other teams put together teams with few if any weaknesses. Like Chicago didn't have the best 2C but the rest of their top 6 and team is so good it didn't matter.

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07-22-2013, 10:53 AM
  #493
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To use a line from the great Reginald VelJohnson in the timeless classic Die Hard...

"Why don't you wake up and smell what you shoveling?"
saw that and thought you were going to quote Carl Winslow

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07-22-2013, 11:22 AM
  #494
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My biggest problem with McPhee/Ted is we have a relatively complacent GM conducted by complacent puppeteer in Leonsis wasting a generational talent in Ovechkin.

Other teams with "generational" talents in this league-

PITT- always active in the trade/FA market, always trying to surround 87/71 with talent
CHI- Had some help through draft but have built a deep roster around Toews/Kane. Acquired Hossa when it was considered a risk because of his playoff track record, won 2 cups.
NYR- Constantly trying to put the right pieces in place to get a cup while Lundqvist is in his prime.

I think you could make an argument for DET (Datsyuk/Zetterberg) or TB (Stamkos) as well.

The obvious point is the Caps, and to an extent TB, are the only teams (of the 4-5 with "once-in-a-generation" type players) that aren't actively trying to surround their elite player with the pieces needed to win a cup.

Kuznetsov is horrible in the dot (30-40%) in the KHL.. he is not coming to the NHL to play C. I think he may be exactly what we need for goal-scoring, but unless Laich is magically the answer, this is not a cup-winning roster without a 2C. It blows my mind that we haven't signed one of VL or Grabo or make a bold/risky trade for a proven 2C, and are now counting on a huge injury risk to take over such a crucial role on this team.

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07-22-2013, 11:48 AM
  #495
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Kuznetsov is horrible in the dot (30-40%) in the KHL.. he is not coming to the NHL to play C. I think he may be exactly what we need for goal-scoring, but unless Laich is magically the answer, this is not a cup-winning roster without a 2C. It blows my mind that we haven't signed one of VL or Grabo or make a bold/risky trade for a proven 2C, and are now counting on a huge injury risk to take over such a crucial role on this team.
Perhaps its because VL is flat out of gas and a shell of the player he used to be on top of being a brutal defensive liability?

Perhaps Grabo isn't good? The guy has alot of baggage, says stupid stuff, and never once as a 2c eclipsed the 30 assist mark.

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07-22-2013, 11:59 AM
  #496
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Perhaps its because VL is flat out of gas and a shell of the player he used to be on top of being a brutal defensive liability?

Perhaps Grabo isn't good? The guy has alot of baggage, says stupid stuff, and never once as a 2c eclipsed the 30 assist mark.

Well we were in on VL according to multiple reports, and he's a 33-year-old who hasn't put up less than 20 goals since 1998-99 (we'll give him 2012-13 since he was on a 20-goal pace and TB was terrible). Most years he has put up 30-50 assists as well. A change of scenery with a player like that usually yields decent results, I'm expecting him to have a 25/35 kind of season with PHI.

We've also been in talks with Grabo acc'd to multiple sources, and I've heard about his baggage. Ribeiro also had significant baggage (which showed at times on the ice), but was exactly what we needed to elevate our powerplay to #1 in the league. Watch a highlight reel of our powerplay goals and it will make you sick hearing Ribeiro's name over and over, knowing Laich is his probable replacement. We know from several years of watching the Caps that Laich is not capable of moving the puck like Ribeiro is, the proof is right in front of our faces. Laich does bring more of a physical game though, but will it be enough to out-weigh what he doesn't bring to the table from a creativity standpoint?

I think the Caps are still in on Grabo with some low-ball offer that he could potentially take to stay in the East.. advanced statistics show he's worth the $, but probably not the figure he and his agent are asking for.

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07-22-2013, 12:36 PM
  #497
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We've also been in talks with Grabo acc'd to multiple sources, and I've heard about his baggage. Ribeiro also had significant baggage (which showed at times on the ice), but was exactly what we needed to elevate our powerplay to #1 in the league. Watch a highlight reel of our powerplay goals and it will make you sick hearing Ribeiro's name over and over, knowing Laich is his probable replacement. We know from several years of watching the Caps that Laich is not capable of moving the puck like Ribeiro is, the proof is right in front of our faces. Laich does bring more of a physical game though, but will it be enough to out-weigh what he doesn't bring to the table from a creativity standpoint?
I hope the replacement on the PP at this point is Erat. He is pretty nifty with the puck and is a good passer. I am not sure where Laich fits on the PP. He would normally be in front but that is a righty spot on this team. I would say 2nd unit is Perrault and Johannson or Laich as the two lefties at the half wall and down low.

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07-22-2013, 12:42 PM
  #498
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I hope the replacement on the PP at this point is Erat. He is pretty nifty with the puck and is a good passer. I am not sure where Laich fits on the PP. He would normally be in front but that is a righty spot on this team. I would say 2nd unit is Perrault and Johannson or Laich as the two lefties at the half wall and down low.
Erat can skate and is known for his vision so I could see that working out. Laich is a player that will go to the net though, which the Caps do need. I just think we're in trouble if we don't have 2 dangerous scoring lines and I can't see a line of Erat/Laich/Brouwer being considered dangerous by anyone.

Maybe Erat will surprise us with a big season, it would go a long way in making the playoffs.

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07-22-2013, 09:46 PM
  #499
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I feel your cynicism. Fact is that if you doubt Batman then thats just how you view things. You are Matthew Modin (altho I'm sure you can act better) who didn't believe until up at the end and things didn't go so well for him.

In 1990 no human being in existence could have forseen John Druce going on the loose.

The next year the North Stars made one of the most improbable runs to the finals I've seen. LA was an 8 seed who struggled all season a couple years ago and just DOMINATED in the playoffs. Name one person who saw that?

Lombardi was just about out of time and his past results did not indicate a dominant run to the finals.

Then you have Pasani time in 2006. Sure Pronger was key and Roloson played at a very high level but a random no name like Pasani came up HUGE.

History is littered with improbable playoff runs and performances. Some after years and years of futility.

Sometimes you just have to believe and keep doing so. For as incompetent as you may think GMGM is (and there is an argument that can be made for sure) one thing he is not is indifferent. The guy cares and seriously wants to win. He does not have a Jeff Schultz type of mindset and he never played that way.

Stanley Cup victory will be far far sweeter when we win with this group of players and management.
Screw that. The first Stanley Cup will be as sweet as it can be, doesn't matter who Owns, runs, or plays for the Caps. There are no bonus point for doing it the hard way, much less the wrong way.

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07-22-2013, 10:28 PM
  #500
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I feel your cynicism. Fact is that if you doubt Batman then thats just how you view things. You are Matthew Modin (altho I'm sure you can act better) who didn't believe until up at the end and things didn't go so well for him.

In 1990 no human being in existence could have forseen John Druce going on the loose.

The next year the North Stars made one of the most improbable runs to the finals I've seen. LA was an 8 seed who struggled all season a couple years ago and just DOMINATED in the playoffs. Name one person who saw that?

Lombardi was just about out of time and his past results did not indicate a dominant run to the finals.

Then you have Pasani time in 2006. Sure Pronger was key and Roloson played at a very high level but a random no name like Pasani came up HUGE.

History is littered with improbable playoff runs and performances. Some after years and years of futility.

Sometimes you just have to believe and keep doing so. For as incompetent as you may think GMGM is (and there is an argument that can be made for sure) one thing he is not is indifferent. The guy cares and seriously wants to win. He does not have a Jeff Schultz type of mindset and he never played that way.

Stanley Cup victory will be far far sweeter when we win with this group of players and management.
By that logic, why even have a GM? Why bother painstakingly collecting players like Ovechkin or Backstrom and filling out roster spots? Just throw some AHLers on there with the hope that a couple get bit by the Marty St. Louis bug and you've got a cup run before you know it. Screw paying McPhee money, just get some homeless guy from outside Verizon to sign people for you.

And half the board crowned LA before the season started, with everyone jumping on their bandwagon the moment it became obvious Sutter could make the pieces (such as their quality top 6 and top 4) fit.

Saying GMGM seriously wants to win is like saying a guy leaves for a month without locking his front door in a run down neighborhood deeply cares about the platinum jewelry and uncut cocaine he keeps in his shoe closet. You simply don't go into the season with our current roster without doing everything you can to plug the obvious holes if you really want to win. Sure, you can believe these guys as assembled can do it and all that crap, but then again so can Calgary fans.

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