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Old
03-13-2013, 02:59 AM
  #726
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Originally Posted by wolfgaze View Post
Yeah he hasn't been bad on the power play but at even strength he's be largely ineffective and a non-threat... I don't understand why a guy with so much speed struggles to beat defenders or to stick-handle around or through them... He's really bad at using his speed and shifting directions to elude defensemen when he has the puck. He basically has 2 ineffective moves in his repertoire:

1) Try and push the puck past the defenseman and go around the opposite side (which inevitably results in the defenseman just playing the body and Gabby can't get to the puck to progress forward)

2) Stop moving his legs and try to push the puck under the defenseman's stick (through the gap) - which for some reason he really sucks at and this never seems to work

It just baffles me that a player with so much speed and such a great shot is so bad at beating defensemen and so easily matched up against in one-on-one situations.... He has great hands when it comes to receiving passes and releasing his shot, and great hands around the net jumping on rebounds, but when it comes to stick-handling he apparently has Jed Ortmeyer hands for some reason. I'm not sure I'll ever fully understand.
Exactly. Even today we saw Cally use speed to beat Myers (obviously huge reach) and create a goal. He almost did it later in the game as well. I haven't seen Gabby try and do that once. He isn't applying pressure. He skates 5 feet into the zone and slows up on the wall and shovels it or makes a pass that doesn't usually lead to much. He needs to PRESS the D. Be aggressive offensively with his speed.

Secondly, the thing that worries me is that when it comes to playoff time, if anything I'd imagine he'd become less effective. That's a scary thought. He's too soft. If he's injured then he needs to recover. Not like we would be missing much until then.

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03-13-2013, 03:27 AM
  #727
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Originally Posted by jBuds View Post
This has me perplexed as well.

Burn 'em wide, no? Protect the puck with your leg and drive! I know that's more of a power move, but even that aside.... Use the speed
There's just such a lack of creativity on his part. If he can't be a magician with the puck since apparently he can't stick-handle well, he should be using his speed and shiftiness to beat defenders, and by that I mean you sell your move like you're going to commit one direction and then you need to explode and KEEP SKATING in the other direction. Not every player can get away with this because with the slower skating forwards, the more mobile defensemen will just backskate at a quick enough pace to keep up with the forward even when he changes direction. But Gabby has the speed to make this move effective. He just needs to get the timing down where he gets the defensemen committing one direction before he shifts his balance and takes off in the opposite direction. Gaborik has some of the fastest acceleration among forwards in the league, very fast few steps. There's no reason why he hasn't figured out how to use this to his advantage. Of course I have no hope that Gabby will learn to do this but it baffles me that he hasn't figured this out or worked on it.

When he comes down the left-hand side he stops skating and glides allowing the defenseman to easily match his speed, and then tries to pull or push the puck under the defenseman's stick to get by. Problem is he telegraphs this move a mile away and the defensemen see exactly what's coming. D-man knows Gabby is going to try and cut inside at a slow rate of speed. Most of the time the puck gets poke-checked away. Even if the puck made it through the gap between the defenseman's stick and his body, Gabby isn't moving fast enough to bypass the defenseman and create a scoring chance....

Only other move he can try is trying to blow by the defensemen without selling any fakes/moves but just with pure speed..... Maybe not as reliable but I'd rather see him try and do this and take the puck into the corner if he can't get through to the net as opposed to those 2 ineffective moves of his that I mentioned in the other post.... His lack of creativity with the puck and his repetition of his same moves/tactics makes him quite easy to match-up against. I can't think of the last time he took advantage of the opposing team having their 3rd pairing defensemen out there or the last time he made defensemen look silly with any regularity. The thought of matching up against the Pens is unnerving because Gaborik gets shut down by Orpik with what seems like relative ease.

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03-13-2013, 03:40 AM
  #728
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Originally Posted by wolfgaze View Post
There's just such a lack of creativity on his part. If he can't be a magician with the puck since apparently he can't stick-handle well, he should be using his speed and shiftiness to beat defenders, and by that I mean you sell your move like you're going to commit one direction and then you need to explode and KEEP SKATING in the other direction. Not every player can get away with this because with the slower skating forwards, the more mobile defensemen will just backskate at a quick enough pace to keep up with the forward even when he changes direction. But Gabby has the speed to make this move effective. He just needs to get the timing down where he gets the defensemen committing one direction before he shifts his balance and takes off in the opposite direction. Gaborik has some of the fastest acceleration among forwards in the league, very fast few steps. There's no reason why he hasn't figured out how to use this to his advantage. Of course I have no hope that Gabby will learn to do this but it baffles me that he hasn't figured this out or worked on it.

When he comes down the left-hand side he stops skating and glides allowing the defenseman to easily match his speed, and then tries to pull or push the puck under the defenseman's stick to get by. Problem is he telegraphs this move a mile away and the defensemen see exactly what's coming. D-man knows Gabby is going to try and cut inside at a slow rate of speed. Most of the time the puck gets poke-checked away. Even if the puck made it through the gap between the defenseman's stick and his body, Gabby isn't moving fast enough to bypass the defenseman and create a scoring chance....

Only other move he can try is trying to blow by the defensemen without selling any fakes/moves but just with pure speed..... Maybe not as reliable but I'd rather see him try and do this and take the puck into the corner if he can't get through to the net as opposed to those 2 ineffective moves of his that I mentioned in the other post.... His lack of creativity with the puck and his repetition of his same moves/tactics makes him quite easy to match-up against. I can't think of the last time he took advantage of the opposing team having their 3rd pairing defensemen out there or the last time he made defensemen look silly with any regularity. The thought of matching up against the Pens is unnerving because Gaborik gets shut down by Orpik with what seems like relative ease.
Real good post.

But in reality, if you want to simplify it, how creative does he really even need to be? He's BLESSED as an elite skater; that alone should be used as his differentiator to create more for himself and his linemates. Marian Gaborik bearing down on a defenseman at full speed automatically should create a larger gap, as the D needs to compensate for such a noticeably faster threat. Why isn't that accented more? Very, very perplexing to me. Really is. This guy should have a ton of helpers, too, as linemates should be banging home garbage goals off of rebounds from his shots.

You guys see him more than I: am I wrong in asserting that he's a little too much East/West this year, and not enough North/South?

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03-13-2013, 03:55 AM
  #729
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Originally Posted by jBuds View Post
Real good post.

But in reality, if you want to simplify it, how creative does he really even need to be? He's BLESSED as an elite skater; that alone should be used as his differentiator to create more for himself and his linemates. Marian Gaborik bearing down on a defenseman at full speed automatically should create a larger gap, as the D needs to compensate for such a noticeably faster threat. Why isn't that accented more? Very, very perplexing to me. Really is. This guy should have a ton of helpers, too, as linemates should be banging home garbage goals off of rebounds from his shots.

You guys see him more than I: am I wrong in asserting that he's a little too much East/West this year, and not enough North/South?
It's his feet. They aren't moving, he's not pressing. He just waits on the circles for the perfect pass, or if he's carrying the puck, he starts skating, but he has this weird thing where he stickhandles as fast as his feet are moving and, I swear I'm not exaggerating, the puck is knocked off his stick by a stiff wind. It's a guaranteed turnover. If Gabby isn't already set up in the offensive zone and he has the puck, I just sigh, because we know what's coming.

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03-13-2013, 05:04 AM
  #730
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Originally Posted by Heyoooo View Post
Well, if someone told me at the start of the "season" that Gaborik would be playing on the LW with Boyle and Miller coming off shoulder surgery, I dont think id be too optimistic in expecting a 40 goal pace.
He played 2 games with those guys! Holy **** wake up and take off the blinders! There's a reason why he got placed there too in case you were wondering.

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03-13-2013, 05:24 AM
  #731
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I've been a big Gaborik supporter in the past, but he's having a pretty bad year.

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03-13-2013, 07:52 AM
  #732
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Can't help but feel like we're seeing "injured Gabby" and not "40 goal scorer Gabby" this year.

Is this going to be another case of us ragging on him for months and then finding out after the fact that he was playing injured the whole time?

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03-13-2013, 09:22 AM
  #733
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Originally Posted by Parker View Post
Can't help but feel like we're seeing "injured Gabby" and not "40 goal scorer Gabby" this year.

Is this going to be another case of us ragging on him for months and then finding out after the fact that he was playing injured the whole time?
We've seen him in each state several times over his tenure here. I think it's very possible. He looks awful, completely disengaged, and afraid. I love Gabby, but don't think he plays well injured. I can easily see them making a decision together (him and the team) to just deal with it this year.

Richards on the other hand, is a moron. Not sure you can recover from that.

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03-13-2013, 09:35 AM
  #734
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Originally Posted by Parker View Post
Can't help but feel like we're seeing "injured Gabby" and not "40 goal scorer Gabby" this year.

Is this going to be another case of us ragging on him for months and then finding out after the fact that he was playing injured the whole time?
this can very well be the case, but wouldn't he be shut down by now? at least for maintenance?

the assets of Gaborik's game are: shifting speed, acceleration, offensive awareness, and pure sniping.

he's an offensive zone glider right now who can only score if he's left open in the slot, which only happens against the Islanders...

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03-13-2013, 10:38 AM
  #735
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Originally Posted by NikC View Post
the assets of Gaborik's game are: shifting speed, acceleration, offensive awareness, and pure sniping.
Feel like all but the last one have been there, at least in terms of being capable. Whereas I've not seen him snipe, dig or do anything with his arms since maybe the Boston game. He's not gotten off one of his classic snappers in a real long time.

I'm glad to see him passing well, and otherwise creating, but I think he might be compensating for an inability to use one of his big assets.

Either way, between him and Richards, they have a major problem in the top 6.

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03-13-2013, 12:32 PM
  #736
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Originally Posted by Callagraves View Post
It's his feet. They aren't moving, he's not pressing. He just waits on the circles for the perfect pass, or if he's carrying the puck, he starts skating, but he has this weird thing where he stickhandles as fast as his feet are moving and, I swear I'm not exaggerating, the puck is knocked off his stick by a stiff wind. It's a guaranteed turnover. If Gabby isn't already set up in the offensive zone and he has the puck, I just sigh, because we know what's coming.
Bingo.

He never has any momentum.

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03-13-2013, 12:32 PM
  #737
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Torts plays him on his off wing when he openly admits he's not comfortable there.

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03-13-2013, 12:36 PM
  #738
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Originally Posted by Kershaw View Post
Torts plays him on his off wing when he openly admits he's not comfortable there.
As illogical as that may be, Gaborik hasn't really looked comfortable on either wing, on any line or with any combination of players.

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03-13-2013, 12:53 PM
  #739
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Originally Posted by Parker View Post
Can't help but feel like we're seeing "injured Gabby" and not "40 goal scorer Gabby" this year.

Is this going to be another case of us ragging on him for months and then finding out after the fact that he was playing injured the whole time?
Here's my question... Why is it assumed that the guy is infallible when he's healthy? I get the sense that some fans don't believe he can struggle or slump mentally when he's healthy... That the only reason his play could ever struggle is because he must be injured. I don't really understand it...

When I watch him play I don't see a player inhibited by a bum shoulder.. I see a player who's not skating hard, not moving his feet, not attempting to play with any intensity or passion.

If Gaborik were injured then Torts would not be benching him at times or calling him out (among other players) in his post-game conferences...

I'm not buying the injury excuse this time around. I see a guy who's got problems between his ears right now. His shot/release is not suffering, it's what he's doing with his feet and with his positioning without the puck... He's not thinking the game very well at all... Making bad decisions....

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03-13-2013, 01:44 PM
  #740
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Originally Posted by SomebodySaveKreider View Post
I've been a big Gaborik supporter in the past, but he's having a pretty bad year.
Exactly what I came here to post.

It's indefensible at this point.

If he and Richards are going to be horse poop we aren't goin anywhere.

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03-13-2013, 01:48 PM
  #741
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The biggest problem with Gaborik IMO is his toughness. The rest of this team seems to have a certain toughness and willingness to fight that Gaborik seems to be lacking. Sure moving back to the right wing would help him, but to me he just seems out of place on this team.

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03-13-2013, 01:53 PM
  #742
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The biggest problem with Gaborik IMO is his toughness. The rest of this team seems to have a certain toughness and willingness to fight that Gaborik seems to be lacking. Sure moving back to the right wing would help him, but to me he just seems out of place on this team.
It's not only that. He's not even trying on some shifts. He just stands there at times doing nothing.

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03-13-2013, 02:06 PM
  #743
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It's not only that. He's not even trying on some shifts. He just stands there at times doing nothing.
That's his MO, no surprise there. He also needs someone to feed him the puck, I don't think Boyle is the man that should be doing it TBH.

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03-13-2013, 02:10 PM
  #744
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That's his MO, no surprise there. He also needs someone to feed him the puck, I don't think Boyle is the man that should be doing it TBH.
How about his lack of speed? His bread and butter: he's not even shooting the puck as many times. A bit too passive on the defensive side of the game. That lethal wristshot of his, not scaring anyone.

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03-13-2013, 02:18 PM
  #745
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the assets of Gaborik's game are: shifting speed, acceleration, offensive awareness, and pure sniping.
This is a problem, what good does this do when a D backs into the lap of his goalie while staying in the shooting lane?

This is fairly complicated. Pre lockout you could a) not create offense against a set D, and b) you could play high defense better because you could clutch and grab to recover if you failed with a high defensive play. In order to avoid going up against a set D, you played a high defense to get offense. Accordingly, Gabby -- and players like him -- played prelockout in a game where you oftener tried to make high defensive plays. In THAT game, Gabby could use these abilities more often. A D tried to step up on him, and bam he eluded him and took of. You played defense one way most of the time, then you faced a dude, like Bure/Mogilny/Bondra/Gabby, so fast that to you had to adjust and give up ice. Teams with a Bure gained so much more than those rushes, they gained ice in the neutral zone because of the fear factor a slower D had of a Gaborik.

Speed and agility with the puck is TODAY valuble when getting the puck up ice to set people up, force the Ds to scramble E-W in the attacking zone and what. It's the Pat Kane era. THE ROOM IS INFRONT OF THE Ds NOT BEHIND THEM. Gabby is a behind the Ds type of player, Kane, Giroux, Datsyuk, Zetterberg and co are infron onthe Ds type of players. In transition plays when it comes to taking the puck the shortest way to the net, like Gabby is an expert at, Gabby gets a shot to show his goods like every tenth game... He doesn't have the mind of a Kane and never explores then open ice he could use by turning up ice and so forth. Gabby was like 26 y/o when the redline offside was removed, he probably played hockey for twenty years one way and hasn't been able to adjust... Now it's just his snipe.

I saw this change in the game when the redline was removed in 98' in Europe, and has always been against these types (like Kessel/Marian Hossa) in the NHL. It's like they get the most room the worse teams they play on, and just provides very little momentum no matter what. And it just pays of so much with penalties and what not to have the puck in the game today. Best way of playing defense is to attack and so forth...


Last edited by Ola: 03-13-2013 at 02:28 PM.
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Old
03-13-2013, 07:53 PM
  #746
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parker View Post
Can't help but feel like we're seeing "injured Gabby" and not "40 goal scorer Gabby" this year.

Is this going to be another case of us ragging on him for months and then finding out after the fact that he was playing injured the whole time?
god if hes injured again that'd be ridiculous.

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03-13-2013, 07:55 PM
  #747
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Originally Posted by Parker View Post
Can't help but feel like we're seeing "injured Gabby" and not "40 goal scorer Gabby" this year.

Is this going to be another case of us ragging on him for months and then finding out after the fact that he was playing injured the whole time?
i feel the same way.. something isn't right, its not the system or torts bc the guy has proven to score and put up a lot of points with torts at the helm.. i think hes got something nagging him, maybe the shoulder isn't right yet idk?

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03-13-2013, 08:26 PM
  #748
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Originally Posted by Parker View Post
Can't help but feel like we're seeing "injured Gabby" and not "40 goal scorer Gabby" this year.

Is this going to be another case of us ragging on him for months and then finding out after the fact that he was playing injured the whole time?
When someone spends half their career injured it wouldn't exactly be shocking. I don't blame him. Management brought him in at a huge salary. My beef is with them.

In any case, who cares why he is ineffective. It's only important that he is ineffective.

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03-13-2013, 09:10 PM
  #749
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As illogical as that may be, Gaborik hasn't really looked comfortable on either wing, on any line or with any combination of players.
What? did you see how dominant the Gaborik-Richards-Nash line was early on? Gaborik has some of his own problems, but I believe his biggest problem is he was playing with Richars who was MIA for a long time, and now he's playing with Brian ****ing Boyle. The Rangers problem is their key players outside of Nash are not performing, trading Gaborik is not going to make them a cup contender, getting Gaborik and richards to perform like they can, might.

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03-13-2013, 09:13 PM
  #750
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What? did you see how dominant the Gaborik-Richards-Nash line was early on? Gaborik has some of his own problems, but I believe his biggest problem is he was playing with Richars who was MIA for a long time, and now he's playing with Brian ****ing Boyle. The Rangers problem is their key players outside of Nash are not performing, trading Gaborik is not going to make them a cup contender, getting Gaborik and richards to perform like they can, might.
I don't think that line was dominant at all. The only 'dominant' line I have seen this season is Hagelin/Stepan/Nash. Which, for some reason, was broken up.

Put Richards and Gaborik back together. Please.

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