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Trade Rumours and Proposals: Part XXXV

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Old
02-27-2013, 03:24 PM
  #701
Holdurbreathe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondercarrot View Post
Do you think 2008 chris Phillips was as good as 2007 Chris Phillips?
Do you think 2009 chris Phillips was as physical as he was previously?
These are rhetorical questions right?

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Originally Posted by Wondercarrot View Post
Was someone else making his passes, not hitting guys and skating slower in 2010 ?
His plummet off the cliff in 2010 was, during a poor year for all involved, the single most horrible performance on the team by a country mile and ill include Elliot.
Yet he played the most minutes of any Sens player not a goaltender.

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Originally Posted by Wondercarrot View Post
Do you think he's the same player he was in 2007? of course he isnt. he's not even close.
Is Alfie, Gonchar, or dozens of other players the same as they were in 2007?

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Originally Posted by Wondercarrot View Post
He gets decent TOI now because LOOK AT THE REST OF THE D.
A stud, an aging offensive dman and 5 guys who may someday be full time NHLers.

Methot
Gonchar
Gryba
Benoit
Weircoch
Boro
Lundin
Yet the Sens are 2nd overall in the league in goals allowed and 3rd overall in PK and are 6th in the league in PK minutes.

The Sens PK is a huge reason for the team's record, a PK that Phillips has more TOI than any other Sens player.

While the goaltending has been great, Phillips has been very good, you just don't wish to give him any credit.

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Old
02-27-2013, 03:28 PM
  #702
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holdurbreathe View Post
These are rhetorical questions right?



Yet he played the most minutes of any Sens player not a goaltender.



Is Alfie, Gonchar, or dozens of other players the same as they were in 2007?



Yet the Sens are 2nd overall in the league in goals allowed and 3rd overall in PK and are 6th in the league in PK minutes.

The Sens PK is a huge reason for the team's record, a PK that Phillips has more TOI than any other Sens player.

While the goaltending has been great, Phillips has been very good, you just don't wish to give him any credit.
I love Phillips but he hasnt been very good. He's been okay. He's a great #5 at this point. Great PKer. And, I expect his play to improve as the season goes on. That said, he's only been alright so far. Not as terrible as many make him out to be, though.

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02-27-2013, 03:39 PM
  #703
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Originally Posted by Cujomi View Post
RNH is nowhere near what Spezza was, or is. Spezza is far and away the more talented player and was at the same age, too.
Dunno about that. RNH got 52 points in 62 games last year at 18. He was -2, which isn't bad considering most of the Oilers good players are 18-22 years old.

OTOH Jacques Martin clearly hated Spezza and played him on the 3rd line for his first 2 seasons. After they fired him Spezza crushed the AHL during the lockout and then got a ton of points the next 2 seasons on the top line.

So basically if Spezza didn't have a dumb, stubborn a-hole for a head coach he might have put up some impressive numbers, but I don't think we can say was clearly better at 18 than RNH was.

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02-27-2013, 03:41 PM
  #704
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Originally Posted by The OttoMan Lion View Post
I love Phillips but he hasnt been very good. He's been okay. He's a great #5 at this point. Great PKer. And, I expect his play to improve as the season goes on. That said, he's only been alright so far. Not as terrible as many make him out to be, though.
He looks pretty decent this year relative to the inexperienced, AHL level defensemen making up half our defense this year. I suspect if Karlsson and Cowen weren't lost to injury he'd look comparatively worse.

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02-27-2013, 03:43 PM
  #705
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Originally Posted by HavlatMach9 View Post
Spezza just needs one true #1 winger who is a threat on his own. If not Perry, then probably nothing for a while sadly.
Bobby Ryan would be a solid fit if Perry stays

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Old
02-27-2013, 04:03 PM
  #706
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Originally Posted by arglebargle View Post
He looks pretty decent this year relative to the inexperienced, AHL level defensemen making up half our defense this year. I suspect if Karlsson and Cowen weren't lost to injury he'd look comparatively worse.
Everything is relative for sure, while I wasn't suggesting Phillips was the top 1, 2, 3 or even 4, I do believe he has been quite effective in the minutes he as played.

IMO its not about comparing Karlsson, Cowen or any of the D to Phillips, its about what Phillips is doing to contribute to the team.

I am not sure why I even get into these discussions, opinions seldom change regardless.

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Old
02-27-2013, 04:05 PM
  #707
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holdurbreathe View Post
These are rhetorical questions right?



Yet he played the most minutes of any Sens player not a goaltender.
great, good for him. all that means is that we got to see the worst sens player on a team full of poor perfomances that year more often than any other player.


Is Alfie, Gonchar, or dozens of other players the same as they were in 2007?
obviously not but you seem to be taken with some mythical chris phillips that hasnt been with us for many years, so i was just checking


Yet the Sens are 2nd overall in the league in goals allowed and 3rd overall in PK and are 6th in the league in PK minutes.

The Sens PK is a huge reason for the team's record, a PK that Phillips has more TOI than any other Sens player.

While the goaltending has been great, Phillips has been very good, you just don't wish to give him any credit.
I dont wish to give him any credit?
ive already said Phillips has been much better this year, so i dont know what you're talking about, also goaltending has not just been great its been legendary and is the overriding contributing factor to both the PK success and overall GA.

the only one not acknowledging the obvious here is you who cant acknowledge how truly awful that season was for him and that he never really recovered.
he's an OK bottom pairing guy now who can elevate his game from time to time.

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02-27-2013, 04:36 PM
  #708
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Phillips has been quite good this year IMO. Its been pretty in vogue to hate on him the last couple of season, but it was also in vogue to hate on Alfie, Spezza, and Karlsson in the past.

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02-27-2013, 04:40 PM
  #709
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It's in vogue to criticize Phillips this year because he plays some of the easiest minutes on our D, yet can't clear the zone to save his life. Sure he's great on the PK, but otherwise it seems like every time he's on the ice, we're stuck in our own zone because when he gets the puck he doesn't do anything but send a weak clear along the boards or into the neutral zone, instead of using one of the passing lanes that Maclean's system is built around.

The result is the puck just being kept in / brought back into the zone, whereas if he passed it to a forward, it would actually drive a push into the offensive zone.

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02-27-2013, 04:58 PM
  #710
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondercarrot View Post
I dont wish to give him any credit?
ive already said Phillips has been much better this year, so i dont know what you're talking about, also goaltending has not just been great its been legendary and is the overriding contributing factor to both the PK success and overall GA.

the only one not acknowledging the obvious here is you who cant acknowledge how truly awful that season was for him and that he never really recovered.
he's an OK bottom pairing guy now who can elevate his game from time to time.
Sorry, I don't believe I said he had a great season in 2010-11.

What I was suggesting was most coaches don't give the most TOI to a player the coach believes "was atrocious, absolutely abysmal. wouldn't compete, awful decisions. terrible, terrible, terrible."

I must admit I forgot coaches are in the habit of giving their worst players the most ice time, my bad.

Then I erred again. I also pointed out which players Phillips was forced to play with in his shutdown role in 2010-11, of which all of them would be replaced by the 5 guys you think may someday be full time NHLers.

The discussion was never about Phillips being a top D, it was about some people underestimating/underevaluating his contribution.

Again I erred, forgetting that fans are much better judges of talent and performance than the coaches that continue to give Phillips 20 minutes of ice time a game.

I humbly suggest you call MacLean and inform him that "Phillips has a poor shot, poor passes, poor vision, and not that great a skater."

Its obvious MacLean hasn't realized that yet.

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Old
02-27-2013, 05:32 PM
  #711
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I'm still confident that Silfverberg will be the sniper along-side Spezza for the foreseeable future however with Alfredsson retiring we still need another top-end first line winger.

I'm thinking either Ryan or Perry will be a Senator by next year.

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Old
02-27-2013, 05:53 PM
  #712
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I was thinking, say hypothetically that Oilers deal one of their forwards, would you consider this trade?

Zibanejad+Bishop

For

Hall

Even with Hall's injury history?

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02-27-2013, 05:54 PM
  #713
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReginKarlssonLehner View Post
I'm still confident that Silfverberg will be the sniper along-side Spezza for the foreseeable future however with Alfredsson retiring we still need another top-end first line winger.

I'm thinking either Ryan or Perry will be a Senator by next year.
Damn beat me to it ... Spezza has two wingers who are top line wingers in Alfredsson & Michalek & another two or three or four who have the potential to be top line wingers & possibly elite wingers in Silfverberg, Stone, Puempel, Noesen & possibly Zibanejad. Not to mention Prince or Hoffman.

I think what people mean though is to get a top line winger who is elite right now & that is just way too expensive for the Sens right now. This team has been put together through the draft & I doubt they will sell the farm for that one elite forward. I'm quite sure Murray will look to get a guy that doesn't cost as much as he did with Turris so it's likely it will be a one for one deal, or quantity for quality or UFA signing. My guess is that Alfredsson will return for next season & they will pay him around $5 mil.

I still think that there is a possibility for ROR if & only if Colorado includes Bishop in the deal. IMO Bishop's value is skyrocketing & could be part of a package to get ROR that will not include Stone, Wiercioch, Gryba, Silfverberg or Zibanejad. If they want Lehner I would want Landeskog in return. Bishop, Regin or Da Costa & Puempel maybe for ROR would be the most I would paid & if it's not enough then Murray can keep looking, there is always somebody new that comes along & becomes available.

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02-27-2013, 06:03 PM
  #714
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We need to clear a spot beside Spezza for Petersson to hold for the next 10 years... Murray said so

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02-27-2013, 06:05 PM
  #715
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReginKarlssonLehner View Post
I was thinking, say hypothetically that Oilers deal one of their forwards, would you consider this trade?

Zibanejad+Bishop

For

Hall

Even with Hall's injury history?
is that a joke? hall is worth WAY more than that

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Old
02-27-2013, 06:08 PM
  #716
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReginKarlssonLehner View Post
I was thinking, say hypothetically that Oilers deal one of their forwards, would you consider this trade?

Zibanejad+Bishop

For

Hall

Even with Hall's injury history?
Hall is on track to be the best winger in the game in the next few years. There's no way we'd be getting him without trading, at the least, Spezza.

Seriously, if you ever watch the Oilers, he's by far the best skater on either team every night. Every time he's on the ice he's creating nonstop offense..

The only downside to him is that he plays so balls out that he's definitely going to get concussed into oblivion at some point during his career.

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02-27-2013, 06:10 PM
  #717
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Originally Posted by burf View Post
Hall is on track to be the best winger in the game in the next few years. There's no way we'd be getting him without trading, at the least, Spezza.

Seriously, if you ever watch the Oilers, he's by far the best skater on either team every night. Every time he's on the ice he's creating nonstop offense..

The only downside to him is that he plays so balls out that he's definitely going to get concussed into oblivion at some point during his career.
No, that package is not close to getting Hall, but that is an asinine statement

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02-27-2013, 06:10 PM
  #718
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I honestly think that Yakupov and Eberle will be better wingers than Hall. Only reason why I made a trade with him instead of the other 2.

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02-27-2013, 06:11 PM
  #719
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Originally Posted by Legend Killer View Post
We need to clear a spot beside Spezza for Petersson to hold for the next 10 years... Murray said so
Petersson fans must be pissed, he basically lost his shot of becoming a Senator with his injury this year. He has fallen pretty hard down the depth chart.

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02-27-2013, 06:13 PM
  #720
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I would be down with acquiring Hall. Don't know what the cost would be though.

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02-27-2013, 06:16 PM
  #721
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I honestly think that Yakupov and Eberle will be better wingers than Hall. Only reason why I made a trade with him instead of the other 2.
Would be easier to acquire Eberle or Yakupov. And Eberle would be almost impossible to acquire.

It'd be like Oilers offering Klefbom + Dubnyk for sophmore Karlsson.

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02-27-2013, 06:25 PM
  #722
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I would steer clear of any Oilers' players

That team is BAD mojo

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02-27-2013, 06:26 PM
  #723
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No, that package is not close to getting Hall, but that is an asinine statement
Eh, I meant to say "one of the best wingers in the game". Regardless, he's simply an exciting player every time he's on the ice, and his play easily justifies his draft position.

I have no idea why he's so severely underrated on HF, because his stats, his underlying numbers, and his dynamic play on the ice all justify him progressing to being a top winger in the league. Hell, people seem to think that he's somehow worse than Eberle, when if you watch the Oilers Hall is clearly the most dangerous player on his line, while Eberle's regressing back down after the extreme luck he had last year.

And I'm saying that as an Eberle fan, and as someone who hates Hall on principle because he looks exactly like a d-bag I know (and subconscious bias like that is hard to overcome).

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02-27-2013, 06:32 PM
  #724
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Gotta feel sorry for Petersson...

When did he even play last?

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Old
02-27-2013, 06:53 PM
  #725
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Petersson has a year on his contract after this one. If he does not prove himself, I feel he will be back in the SEL.

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