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Old
03-06-2013, 11:00 PM
  #951
Hugo Sham
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Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
Curious but what about the blatant elbow that sent Shaw out of game that went uncalled?
there were calls both ways, but in the last period, particularly last 10 mins hawks got away with some pretty flagrant ones. knocking Mcginn's stick out led directly to a goal.

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03-06-2013, 11:52 PM
  #952
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Really, any attempt to quantify play beyond goals, assists and even more flawed numbers like +/- or hits.

We all know there's no magical formula, and the article makes it clear you aren't getting a job in hockey if you don't watch games first and rely on everything else second, but you should use every tool available to evaluate performance.
and that's why some peeps should avoid those stats, too many times I've seen posters pass judgement on player(s) they never seen based on those stats alone.

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03-06-2013, 11:53 PM
  #953
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
and that's why some peeps should avoid those stats, too many times I've seen posters pass judgement on player(s) they never seen based on those stats alone.
You see that too much these days. On HF.

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Old
03-07-2013, 01:20 AM
  #954
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In other news, one by one NHL teams are admitting to using advanced stats: http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/opin...tatistics.html I guess it's not just us HFboards nerds after all.

Shame it seems like the Habs management is extremely old fashioned.
An interesting quote from the article: "We're looking to determine what is random, and what is true performance."

It's rare to hear an NHL insider admit to anything as being random, even though hockey is obviously a chaotic sport. It makes sense that to parse through numbers to isolate true talent, you'd have to figure out what is statistical noise, or the result of dumb luck.

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Old
03-07-2013, 02:04 AM
  #955
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Originally Posted by Marc the Habs Fan View Post
Holy ****

Reimer is shaky as hell.

3 point game avoided.
I was at the game. Reimer was very good.

He faced 43 shots and got us the regulation win.

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Old
03-07-2013, 12:32 PM
  #956
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Chris Bourque on waivers by BOS, why not?

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03-07-2013, 12:43 PM
  #957
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Because he's a career AHLer and people have interest for him only because he's Raymond's kid?

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03-07-2013, 12:45 PM
  #958
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Chris Bourque on waivers by BOS, why not?
He's not very good.

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03-07-2013, 12:46 PM
  #959
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He's not very good.
Smelling a trade to get Clowe in Boston, now...

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Old
03-07-2013, 12:46 PM
  #960
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Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
In other news, one by one NHL teams are admitting to using advanced stats: http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/opin...tatistics.html I guess it's not just us HFboards nerds after all.

Shame it seems like the Habs management is extremely old fashioned.
It's stupid not to use them. Stats are used in every day life for just about everything, they are quintessential. Why wouldn't an NHL front office use them to evaluate players? Seems pretty asinine and arrogant in a way.

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Old
03-07-2013, 12:51 PM
  #961
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Chris Bourque on waivers by BOS, why not?
Pittsburgh have been looking for a winger to fill in on their 2nd line all season, maybe they'd give Bourque an audition?

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Old
03-07-2013, 12:54 PM
  #962
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He's not very good.
neither are Moen and Armstrong :S

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Old
03-07-2013, 12:56 PM
  #963
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Originally Posted by Morgan Gardiner View Post
I was at the game. Reimer was very good.

He faced 43 shots and got us the regulation win.
I was watching the game. No he was NOT! Making it look hard doesn't mean it's a hard save. It's a reverse Price. (Excluding 125 mins of questionable hockey). He's lucky Komisarek is out and the Leafs D is FAR better than it used to be, while still letting Binghampton score all those late goals.

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Old
03-07-2013, 12:57 PM
  #964
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Chris Bourque on waivers by BOS, why not?
Let him go to Chi so he can win a Cup before retirement.

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Old
03-07-2013, 12:59 PM
  #965
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Originally Posted by Roulin View Post
Pittsburgh have been looking for a winger to fill in on their 2nd line all season, maybe they'd give Bourque an audition?
Didn't they already try that last year?

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Old
03-07-2013, 01:02 PM
  #966
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Bourque got the perfect size to play for the Habs...

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Old
03-07-2013, 01:08 PM
  #967
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roulin View Post
An interesting quote from the article: "We're looking to determine what is random, and what is true performance."

It's rare to hear an NHL insider admit to anything as being random, even though hockey is obviously a chaotic sport. It makes sense that to parse through numbers to isolate true talent, you'd have to figure out what is statistical noise, or the result of dumb luck.
If any of you are into stats and the theory behind them, I encourage the books by Nicholas Nassim Taleb: "Fooled by Randomness", "The Black Swan" and now (not AS related, but still a great read) "Antifragile". I come from a science background and as much as we have to respect stats, they can lead us down the wrong path even with a ridiculously high threshold of confidence. Broadly, they help, and it's fine to want to look at the stats as part of the management (what are all those pens for?), but at the end of the day, it's something I've learned not to guide my opinions on what is intrinsically very subjective. Fine, a guy has a lot of giveaways. Put that into perspective - how often is he on the ice, normalize it to his puck possession time (if you can do that). Point being that it's at best a crude predictor and while it helps in general, it's not going to tell you who to put out their on that final shift. A good coach knows what to do and good scouts know what to look for.

Just to clarify - Use stats by all means, but don't make any huge decisions in hockey based solely on them.

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Old
03-07-2013, 01:21 PM
  #968
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Originally Posted by Bask View Post
neither are Moen and Armstrong :S
Moen is better than Bourque, Armstrong is sub par, but there's a certain thing called roster spots and contract limits in the hockey world.

Doesn't make much sense to switch one scrub for another, especially if you take on an extra contract. Especially that Bourque is 5"8, and we really don't need a small marginal player on the roster at the moment.

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03-07-2013, 01:21 PM
  #969
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Originally Posted by Bask View Post
neither are Moen and Armstrong :S
Yes. Black and white. No gray area in between.

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Old
03-07-2013, 01:32 PM
  #970
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Originally Posted by Habtchum View Post
Smelling a trade to get Clowe in Boston, now...
You must not watch alot of Shark games

Clowe wasn't very good last year and this year he has been an absolute waste of a roster spot in SJ

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Old
03-07-2013, 01:45 PM
  #971
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Originally Posted by Dr Gonzo View Post
Moen is better than Bourque, Armstrong is sub par, but there's a certain thing called roster spots and contract limits in the hockey world.

Doesn't make much sense to switch one scrub for another, especially if you take on an extra contract. Especially that Bourque is 5"8, and we really don't need a small marginal player on the roster at the moment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by overlords View Post
Yes. Black and white. No gray area in between.
love the attitude, you guys really need to talk down to people like this?

i'm just saying, he's 27, he's on waivers, and I don't see how he could be any worst than Armstrong, I never said we NEEDED him right now nor that we had the space for him.

Sorry for bringing up a discussion about something thats happening out of town in the out of town thread.

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Old
03-07-2013, 01:46 PM
  #972
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Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
You must not watch alot of Shark games

Clowe wasn't very good last year and this year he has been an absolute waste of a roster spot in SJ
A change of scenery might help him. he is not the only player thsi year to have problems getting back in the groove after such a long lockout.

And don't you think he would be re-energized wearing the Bruins jersey and playing on their third line with Kelly and Peverly ?

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Old
03-07-2013, 01:47 PM
  #973
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Originally Posted by Bask View Post
love the attitude, you guys really need to talk down to people like this?

i'm just saying, he's 27, he's on waivers, and I don't see how he could be any worst than Armstrong, I never said we NEEDED him right now nor that we had the space for him.

Sorry for bringing up a discussion about something thats happening out of town in the out of town thread.
All the Habs need is ANOTHER small/short player...

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Old
03-07-2013, 01:50 PM
  #974
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Originally Posted by Habtchum View Post
All the Habs need is ANOTHER small/short player...
gotta admit I thought he was bigger...

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Old
03-07-2013, 01:50 PM
  #975
habtastic
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Originally Posted by Habtchum View Post
A change of scenery might help him. he is not the only player thsi year to have problems getting back in the groove after such a long lockout.

And don't you think he would be re-energized wearing the Bruins jersey and playing on their third line with Kelly and Peverly ?
Like anything, it's a situation where you don't know how he'll respond. Could be a horrible acquisition or the steal of the century. IF boston acquires him, we've got to hope that the former is true. Changes of scenery do generally help though. The bruins can afford to have Clowe play subpar for some time so actually it's a good deal for them. For us...it's a bigger gamble.

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