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The first 100 Games ...

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Old
02-26-2013, 10:39 AM
  #1
pcanuck
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The first 100 Games ...

http://www.cbc.ca/manitoba/features/...-winnipeg.html

I agree with the author. My dedication to this team will be made on the decisions Chevy makes this off season. I couldn't wait for Winterpeg to get a team back but TNSE, the GM and coaches are renovating this team like we're close to a contender. Atlanta was terrible. I prefer rebuilding and critiquing each player and determining if they fit within a system (or a systems approach). I'm not sure that's happening now.

So what are your grades over the first 100 Games? 4 Categories....

Drafting (GM and scouts)? Solid B.
It seems that the scouts have hit several diamonds in the rough in the later rounds while Scheifele and Trouba appear to be first round quality. It's not an A because underclassmen were selected and will require longer terms of development.

UFA acquisitions? Not good, D.
With two years of UFA, we've signed almost no one to better this team, even in the short term. Signing marginal players is simply not good enough when you've been a non-playoff team forever. Changing the culture means winning. That has not happened.
Living/ working in Winterpeg with hockey crazed fans can lead to criticism (like Kane has received). I predicted Jokinen and Montoya would be UFA signings (check back) but all told, they haven't worked out well. There has not been any sense of urgency. The GM has not done anything significant to this roster other than use previous pieces from the former GM.

RFA signings? C.
The good - Ladd was overpaid but has become a pleasant surprise! I like Kane and think he is our ONE and only superstar but he was overpaid. Don't get me wrong and misinterpret what I'm saying. As a RFA he should have received far less (Subban $$) but we chose to buy out his free agency years so we had to overpay. This contract could work out. The bad - We significantly overpaid Pavelec. With one of the worst GAA and save %, we gave him a five year deal. Shelling out NHL money to AHL players is also foolish. Long term contracts have hurt many NHL teams and my worry is that overpaying over the long term for non-franchise players is foolish. We have lots of RFA and this summer will be telling.

Decision to hire Noel? C. The status quo.
Chevy knew the risks of hiring a rookie coach (never mind from Columbus). We're also no better and no worse a year and a half later. There isn't much good. The bad and perhaps more disturbing is that last season leading the division, the team choked away any chance of a playoff spot. That's not developing a culture of winning. The veteran players are playing inconsistent hockey and seem unmotivated at times. This is troubling when rookies and younger players aren't taught properly. There are few players who lead by example. There is also no system in place. Players roles are chosen as if names are pulled out of a hat (easily identifiable with the line mixing during games).

Record? C. Status quo again.
It might be fine if the team was still in Atlanta but in hockey crazed Winnipeg, a losing record is unacceptable. The GM and coaching staff are finding that out. A .500 record does not cut it in any market or league (well, unless you're the Cubs, lol). The media has been VERY LENIENT on this team. The fish bowl effect has many upsides and downsides. I lived through the ol' Jets. When they won, people came to the arena. When they were competitive and still lost, I was among only a few to see the entire game. I was the first fish thrower, lol.

The Jets 2.0 - Winterpeg has lived with losing a team but with increased ticket prices and a status quo approach, who knows what will happen. I can't imagine coupon central Winnipeg fans dishing out $4000-$7000 for season tickets each year to watch the status quo. Don't tell me how loaded fans are either when you see people buying season tickets and distributing them with friends and/or family. Never mind more people are realizing it's cheaper to pay $10 a month for the TSN Jets and there is no line to the pisser. A Jets ticket is much easier to get and the initial celebration is over.

While I haven't given up, I don't see any significant changes from the Atlanta franchise, other than a colder change of climate.

How do you grade Chevy?

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02-26-2013, 12:13 PM
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PaperRockChamp
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I'm easy to please.. We've got our team. I like Wright, Peluso, Wellwood (last year), Noel, etc... In one off-season we jumped to one of the biggest teams in the league. I see the potential on the ice. Trouba and Scheif seem to be great picks.. Lowry/Kos/Sutter/Yuen; All solid.

I give him an "A".. He has improved the personnel, has started stocking the cupboards nicely, and hasn't royally messed up in any way.

Things are looking up.

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02-26-2013, 12:22 PM
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viper0220
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcanuck View Post
http://www.cbc.ca/manitoba/features/...-winnipeg.html

I agree with the author. My dedication to this team will be made on the decisions Chevy makes this off season. I couldn't wait for Winterpeg to get a team back but TNSE, the GM and coaches are renovating this team like we're close to a contender. Atlanta was terrible. I prefer rebuilding and critiquing each player and determining if they fit within a system (or a systems approach). I'm not sure that's happening now.

So what are your grades over the first 100 Games? 4 Categories....

Drafting (GM and scouts)? Solid B.
It seems that the scouts have hit several diamonds in the rough in the later rounds while Scheifele and Trouba appear to be first round quality. It's not an A because underclassmen were selected and will require longer terms of development.

UFA acquisitions? Not good, D.
With two years of UFA, we've signed almost no one to better this team, even in the short term. Signing marginal players is simply not good enough when you've been a non-playoff team forever. Changing the culture means winning. That has not happened.
Living/ working in Winterpeg with hockey crazed fans can lead to criticism (like Kane has received). I predicted Jokinen and Montoya would be UFA signings (check back) but all told, they haven't worked out well. There has not been any sense of urgency. The GM has not done anything significant to this roster other than use previous pieces from the former GM.

RFA signings? C.
The good - Ladd was overpaid but has become a pleasant surprise! I like Kane and think he is our ONE and only superstar but he was overpaid. Don't get me wrong and misinterpret what I'm saying. As a RFA he should have received far less (Subban $$) but we chose to buy out his free agency years so we had to overpay. This contract could work out. The bad - We significantly overpaid Pavelec. With one of the worst GAA and save %, we gave him a five year deal. Shelling out NHL money to AHL players is also foolish. Long term contracts have hurt many NHL teams and my worry is that overpaying over the long term for non-franchise players is foolish. We have lots of RFA and this summer will be telling.

Decision to hire Noel? C. The status quo.
Chevy knew the risks of hiring a rookie coach (never mind from Columbus). We're also no better and no worse a year and a half later. There isn't much good. The bad and perhaps more disturbing is that last season leading the division, the team choked away any chance of a playoff spot. That's not developing a culture of winning. The veteran players are playing inconsistent hockey and seem unmotivated at times. This is troubling when rookies and younger players aren't taught properly. There are few players who lead by example. There is also no system in place. Players roles are chosen as if names are pulled out of a hat (easily identifiable with the line mixing during games).

Record? C. Status quo again.
It might be fine if the team was still in Atlanta but in hockey crazed Winnipeg, a losing record is unacceptable. The GM and coaching staff are finding that out. A .500 record does not cut it in any market or league (well, unless you're the Cubs, lol). The media has been VERY LENIENT on this team. The fish bowl effect has many upsides and downsides. I lived through the ol' Jets. When they won, people came to the arena. When they were competitive and still lost, I was among only a few to see the entire game. I was the first fish thrower, lol.

The Jets 2.0 - Winterpeg has lived with losing a team but with increased ticket prices and a status quo approach, who knows what will happen. I can't imagine coupon central Winnipeg fans dishing out $4000-$7000 for season tickets each year to watch the status quo. Don't tell me how loaded fans are either when you see people buying season tickets and distributing them with friends and/or family. Never mind more people are realizing it's cheaper to pay $10 a month for the TSN Jets and there is no line to the pisser. A Jets ticket is much easier to get and the initial celebration is over.

While I haven't given up, I don't see any significant changes from the Atlanta franchise, other than a colder change of climate.

How do you grade Chevy?


Wait until this offseason to grade anyone. This is the first offseason that Chevy will have the cap space and freedom to do make trades and sign players. Chevy needs to put his stamp on this team in the offseason and we will see what he does, until then lets not pass any judgement.

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02-26-2013, 12:27 PM
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Far too early to grade the drafts.
I don't know why you are acting like its stanley cup or bust in the next few years. It's been said over and over, this team will build through the draft.
If you look at players who scored 30 goals last year, not too many of them get payed drastically less than Kane.

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02-26-2013, 12:31 PM
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I find Chevy to be a canny and prudent GM.
He'll continuously follow his mantra of "always looking to buy and improve the team without mortgaging the future".

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02-26-2013, 12:50 PM
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Drafting (GM and scouts)? Far to early to tell. I like the players that he has nabbed, but he went in a different direction that I would have.

Grade: Incomplete

UFA acquisitions? I really like the additions or Wellwood, Poni and Olli. I like the idea of stop gap additions. He hasn't hit any home runs, but I can't complain. I don't expect this team to be overly aggressive at the moment.

Grade: C

RFA signings? I really like what he got done with Ladd, Bogo and Kane. Got all 3 players for decent value. I hate the Pavi deal. The big decisions will come this year.

Grade: B

Decision to hire Noel? I like Noel. I like that he is level and the team appears to be improving even though they aren't that good.

Grade: Incomplete

Record? I am fine with what the Jets have done over the last two years. I want to see development by the youngsters and implementation of the system They are doing this and they are building long term.

Grade: Incomplete.

Overall grade: Incommplete

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02-26-2013, 12:53 PM
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I have no problem with the UFA or RFA signings necessarily. Pavelec is streaky, he looks worth the money lately but the start of the year he certainly didn't. Kane is great. Ladd is the envy of many teams (check their game threads, they all want a player like him). Bogosian was a great bridge-type contract.

Jokinen hasn't been at his best, but I don't blame the signing considering our needs. Neither Montoya, I don't think anyone was really ready to back up full time from St. John's, and guys like Gustavsson or Mason, who were available to backup, either wanted more games (Gus) or too much money (Mason). Montoya has been able to play well, he's hurt now, you can't call it a failure based on injury. I don't think he's lost either, has he? Don't know how that's a bad UFA signing. Also, I don't understand the blame for not bringing a big name into the team through UFA. I ask the same question to posters here unhappy with the UFA signings that I do with my friends who don't like the UFA picks: Who would you have signed instead, and how do you know that player would have signed here anyway?

On the drafting grade, the Scheifele argument has been beaten to death as far as whether he was a reach or not. Don't know how Trouba is an "underclassman" or a reach since he went about where he was supposed to, maybe even a couple of spots lower.

I don't understand the urgency that some people are demanding. These are the realities in the NHL. Teams that scramble for quick fixes are never successful (Toronto, Calgary). Chevy and TN have said they want to build through the draft. That doesn't mean drafting a bunch of players who don't fit the long term plan because they can play now (eg. Couturier). Winnipeg is not a "dumb" market, we can tell that there might be some short-term pain for long-term gain.

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02-26-2013, 12:55 PM
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im extremely curious and excited to see what happens with the 15 rfa/ufa players. im assuming half of these guys will be re-signed, but do we have enough youthful bodies to fill spots that would be opened up with antro, wellwood etc not returning. i have faith in Chevy. he obviously has a strict plan and will continue to follow it

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02-26-2013, 01:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcanuck View Post
UFA acquisitions? Not good, D.
With two years of UFA, we've signed almost no one to better this team, even in the short term. Signing marginal players is simply not good enough when you've been a non-playoff team forever. Changing the culture means winning. That has not happened.
Living/ working in Winterpeg with hockey crazed fans can lead to criticism (like Kane has received). I predicted Jokinen and Montoya would be UFA signings (check back) but all told, they haven't worked out well. There has not been any sense of urgency. The GM has not done anything significant to this roster other than use previous pieces from the former GM.
This I don't agree with at all. I would say the only signing that hasn't worked out has been Ponikarovsky, and we even ended up with a free 4th round pick in that deal.

Montoya has had two starts with one shut out before he got injured. How is it even fair to rate him at this point.

Jokinen has had a slow start, and I was pretty disappointed with his lack of offensive production. But he is still a leader in the dressing room, and still has a good 200 foot game. I also really like him on the point during the power play. He is good with the puck back there, and has a great shot from the point.

Why do you want a sense of urgency around our GM? To me, urgency leads to mistakes. Chevy has been patient and diligent in following the game plan the organization has put in place. To go against this simply because it's the UFA frenzy would be idiotic.

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02-26-2013, 01:21 PM
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My only disapointment is that Chevy was so focused on getting bigger that he forgot to include toughness to go with the size.

The only way fans will stop blindly supporting this team is if tnse takes on the Bombers BOG mentality. Crap all over the fans while gladly taking their money without any intention of trying to win.

Plus fans are far more educated on the business of pro sports this time around.

The team needs to draft itself a contender or disgustingly over pay in UFA or in a trade. Tough to do but it is what it is.

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02-26-2013, 01:32 PM
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Too soon to grade IMO.

UFA: not all that much out there I think we realistically had a shot at. The big names weren't coming here (Nash, Suter, Parise) anyway. Montoya is a former first rounder signed for near league minimum and he has played reasonably well. I think that was actually a pretty shrewd move considering we already had our #1, high mileage guy signed (who sucked early but has steadily improved). Poni didn't work out and they didn't beat the deal to death, seemingly moving Poni and making him happy and upgrading a pick. Nice acknowledgement that the deal didn't work out and resolution IMO. Olli has bad luck but seems to be a "team first" kind of guy - don't hear him griping about third line duties. I've never been a big fan of his from the Florida or Calgary days so I guess I was never ready to be disappointed. Not sure about our upcoming crop of UFAs though, I'm not a huge fan of most of them, but they fill roles.

RFA: I like what he did. I think we got taken on Pavelec to a degree but other than a shorter contract I don't see what our other options were. Kane was signed for what similar players in the league were signed for on a production basis - add to it his young age and I think that's a win frankly. Ladd, no complaints. Enstrom, other than possibly being more fragile than we'd like no complaints either - he's a number one guy in a market hungry for that type of player - holding onto him was a great move IMO. Curious to see what happens with this summer though - we need to extend a bunch of guys. Bogo - 7 years. Burmistrov, if I can set my man crush aside for a moment, I'd say give him a bridge contract like Bogo got. Little? Keeper. Wheeler - keeper. Hoping they can sign most of the RFA guys to longish deals - 3-5 years.

Draft: shoulda taken Couturier (honestly I still wonder if the kid rubbed the brass the wrong way pre-draft and if so, good decision). But Trouba/Sheifele look solid first rounders and will have decent careers. Later rounders are looking solid this year at least, even the late round goalie picks. Obviously a long term view to evaluate but looks decent at this point.

Coach: I love Claude, would have preferred Paul MacLean. Don't remember who got hired by which team first.

Unlike the article I'm a little more patient. I think looking at the core of the team as Pavelec, Ladd, Kane, Little, Wheeler, Bogosian, Enstrom, Byfuglien, Burmistrov - the average age is down around 23-24 isn't it? That's pretty young for the NHL so I'm willing to give them time. Ask me at the end of next year and I'll be more willing to be critical.

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02-26-2013, 02:10 PM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tbcwpg View Post
I have no problem with the UFA or RFA signings necessarily. Pavelec is streaky, he looks worth the money lately but the start of the year he certainly didn't. Kane is great. Ladd is the envy of many teams (check their game threads, they all want a player like him). Bogosian was a great bridge-type contract.

Jokinen hasn't been at his best, but I don't blame the signing considering our needs. Neither Montoya, I don't think anyone was really ready to back up full time from St. John's, and guys like Gustavsson or Mason, who were available to backup, either wanted more games (Gus) or too much money (Mason). Montoya has been able to play well, he's hurt now, you can't call it a failure based on injury. I don't think he's lost either, has he? Don't know how that's a bad UFA signing. Also, I don't understand the blame for not bringing a big name into the team through UFA. I ask the same question to posters here unhappy with the UFA signings that I do with my friends who don't like the UFA picks: Who would you have signed instead, and how do you know that player would have signed here anyway?

On the drafting grade, the Scheifele argument has been beaten to death as far as whether he was a reach or not. Don't know how Trouba is an "underclassman" or a reach since he went about where he was supposed to, maybe even a couple of spots lower.

I don't understand the urgency that some people are demanding. These are the realities in the NHL. Teams that scramble for quick fixes are never successful (Toronto, Calgary). Chevy and TN have said they want to build through the draft. That doesn't mean drafting a bunch of players who don't fit the long term plan because they can play now (eg. Couturier). Winnipeg is not a "dumb" market, we can tell that there might be some short-term pain for long-term gain.
Me either.

TNSE picked up an awful team less than two years ago. There haven't been many two year builds. The Jets are one of the youngest teams in the league and they getting production from some youngsters. Acquiring starts and building quality depth takes time.

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02-26-2013, 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by buggs View Post
Unlike the article I'm a little more patient. I think looking at the core of the team as Pavelec, Ladd, Kane, Little, Wheeler, Bogosian, Enstrom, Byfuglien, Burmistrov - the average age is down around 23-24 isn't it? That's pretty young for the NHL so I'm willing to give them time. Ask me at the end of next year and I'll be more willing to be critical.
Waz was also steaming mad that Scheifele wasn't kept. He seems at odds with the idea of a slow, deliberate build. I personally love the slow, deliberate approach.

TNSE took over for a sloppy mess of an organization and they are only two years in, so I really don't understand the early fuss. I am not saying they should be free of criticism and I have openly questioned some of Chevy's draft picks, but at this point I don't know that he was wrong with any of them.

The Jets have openly stated that they are building through the draft, one and a half years is not nearly long enough to judge their success.


I want a deep team and system that can contend for years and plug in new farm players as needed. I don't want crash and burn management. I understand team like the Pred going for it last year. I don't understand people who think the Jets are at that point.

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