So the players have no responsibility to not make dumb passes and take silly penalties? You have to have loud-mouthed ass clowns like Therrien or Tortorella screaming at them all the time?
DB gotta try to do something else with all these dumb penalties. When vitale or their young def get dumb penalties he benches them. He needs to start doing this with all his players. Even if he benches them for a period you gotta do something as a coach to stop this ****. Pens players are a bunch of babies they need to be punished telling them to stop it isn't working.
If they had a hard-ass as an assistant coach I wouldn't be bothered. I just don't want to see a hard-ass as the head coach. That generally doesn't end well.
Agreed. But someone behind the bench needs to hold these guys accountable for their actions. It seems we are so undisciplined out there some nights. Who knows, maybe Bylsma goes all Randy Savage on their ***** in the room after a game like this. But I doubt it.
We are a good team. Scratch that, we are a great team when play the game our way, the right way. When we don't we are vanilla plain. And that's not going to be good enough.
I really hope we don't trade our first round pick (or any of our main prospects). We are not a Stanley Cup contender this year. Look around the league. We're in the second tier of playoff contenders. We're no match for the likes of Chicago, Boston, Los Angeles. That's the top tier. We're somewhere in that second tier. Could 1-2 trades push us up into the top tier? Perhaps. But that assumes Chicago, Boston or LA don't improve as well.
Their goaltending is better than ours. Their defense (the collection of defensemen, forwards, system and goaltending) is better than ours. We run around constantly and can look like that Philadelphia series even when we're not playing Philadelphia.
All of those teams are tougher than ours. Chicago is the only one we're close to in this category, but they react positively when something happens on the ice. Plus they have the skill.
All of those teams can out-coach us with relative ease, not to mention several other teams that aren't true Cup contenders. This ultimately the biggest problem.
So, kick the tires on wingers. Look for hockey trades. But don't sell the farm this year. We're simply not good enough.
As an aside, there's no way the four young players we're trying to develop don't deserve regular ice time. I'm talking about Beau Bennett, Dustin Jeffrey, Robert Bortuzzo and Simon Despres. They shouldn't be sharing roster spots. They should all play the rest of the way. Let's see if we can develop these guys.
Bennett has done NOTHING WRONG so far to suggest he doesn't belong here. Just keep using him. Jeffrey is probably our third-best center. If we're going to continue to go with Vitale on the fourth line (who let's face it he is a black hole offensively, although if he wasn't anchored to Glass and Adams I think he could produce SOME offense), then I think Jeffrey works better than Sutter as our third-line center for this team. Perhaps if we got that elite winger for Crosby's line I'd feel differently. But I think Jeffrey can develop into a better two-way center than Sutter. Sutter will always be a better checking center, so it depends on what we need more. But just keep Jeffrey in the lineup, even after Malkin returns.
Same thing with the defensemen. There's no reason why Despres and Bortuzzo need to be sharing a spot in the lineup. They've both earned their spot. Leave them in and let's see what they give us the rest of the way.
The target should be 2013-14 now. Hopefully, by then, we'll have a new coach...and these four younger guys can be full-time members of the team and a part of the solushun going forward.
The eyeball test suggests we're not going to win anything this year.
I'm going to have to disagree here. Just last year the entire hockey world said that Chicago couldn't win with Crawford and Emery in net....now all of a sudden they have better goalies than us?????
Just last month everyone was saying that LA winning the cup was a fluke, and now they are back to top tier??? Also, what seed were they last year???
Look, it was a frustrating loss, but by no means are the Pens not a contender. I bet nobody on this board thought that the Kings were winning the Cup, myself included.
I'm not saying DB has to be a hard ass but the fact that the undisciplined play has gone on for so long without being addressed is pretty embarassing for a SC winning coach.
That one play where Orpik x-checked a player and Vokoun glove slaps a guys face. The game was 2 or 3-1 at the time of that goal. We could've just as easily been down 2 men for another 2 full minutes if it was another ref or if this was the playoffs.
So our only options are a hard-ass coach that the players will hate 2 months in, or a complete dufus???
I'm sure if we do a search, we'll be able to find SOMEONE who can slide somewhere in the middle of those two extremes.
For the record, I don't want a Ken Hitchcock, a John Tortorella (as much as I loved the old Torts, he's past his expiration date), or ANY recycled coach.
But somewhere between Therrien's many flaws and Bylsma's many flaws is the right coach.
Of course, before we hire this new coach we (as in Shero and co.) need to figure out what kind of team we want to be moving forward. If we continue to operate like the old LA Kings of the Gretzky era (vets, vets vets, trade first round picks, vets vets vets, and more vets), we will wind up with a similar fate...except we won the Cup in our only shot and they didn't in theirs.
And we also need to figure out if we wanna be an offensive-minded team who is tough as nails and hard to play against every night, who knows how to play defense when need be, or if we wanna be losers. Those are the choices.
I was posting this in the GDT before it got closed.
Agreed. I've become less and less of a fan of his every game. Constantly out of position, constantly making dumb decisions with the puck, and always seems to take stupid penalties.
Very irritating play by #58. Also, I'm not overreacting at all when I say Vokoun sucks, he couldn't keep us in a game against Philly, and he got lit up by one of the worst offenses in the league with most of their good players out. A 3rd line checker got a HAT TRICK! 4 power play goals against Vokoun? Sorry that doesn't cut it with me, cut his ass.
+ The team's will to win, they didn't quit.
+ Marc Andre Fleury, came in and played solid, you can't blame him for that 5th goal.
- Tomas Vokoun - I gave my reason above, he's not a good player for us, he's a waste of $2M, with the cap going down next season, I don't think the Pens should pay him $2M when they can play someone league minimum to play the same way.
- Kris Letang - Wow, what an overrated player, always being stupid. Careless with the puck, out of position, acting tough and taking dumb penalties. Very irritating to watch. He can be better.
- Dan Bylsma - He's such an overrated coach, he doesn't seem to know how to coach. He's another dumb one. 1:25 left down by a goal, doesn't call time out, puts Cooke-Kennedy-Dupuis out there (LOL) and then calls time out later in the 3rd. Very poor coach, need to make a coaching change or else it's another 1st round exit...if we even make the playoffs, which after watching this team this season, it's kinda hard to think they're guaranteed for the playoffs.
I love the Penguins, I cheer for them, I wish them success, but they are such a troublesome team, the locker room lacks leadership, there is not one good coach on the staff, the backup goalie is playing like an ECHL goalie, our "best defenseman" is not playing decent hockey AT ALL. Seriously, the Penguins need to give their heads a shake, they should be embarrassed and ashamed of themselves. They're an overrated hockey team, and that's not overreacting, it's just being honest, the team's in trouble.
I really do think the Steelers parallel applies here. The further removed the franchise becomes from the previous coaching regime which, for all its faults, was about structure and discipline, the further removed it becomes from being a championship team. And, just as the Steelers front office engages in personnel moves that, politely put, are mind-boggling, the Penguins front office has done likewise since winning the cup in 2009.
it's tricky. Yes, the players need to play better, but when the same issues keep happening over and over and over, something has to change.
Can't our Captain step up get on guys for bad play/decisions. You know, the roll of Captain isn't just about how you play yourself, but getting the best out of your teammates......including their mental game.
Agreed. As pissed as I am at tonight's performance, I've got no doubt we're a contender with a full roster.
Really need to get this discipline thing in check though - it's out of hand.
Our roster only is missing Malkin. Are you telling me that alone makes the Pens a legit contender? Malkin and two legit top six wingers, I'll be the first to grant you. Malkin alone . . . this team has to same problem as 2012 and 2010.