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Nazeem* 'The Dream' Discussion: Part 2

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Old
03-07-2013, 09:19 AM
  #201
7even
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Originally Posted by theIceWookie View Post
which is pretty common for young players. like rnh, or eberle or hodgson. it happens
Definitely. In fact, that's how I prefer it. Just tempering expectations moving forward. The kid's not Crosby. Yet

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03-07-2013, 09:40 AM
  #202
Lebanese Leaf
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One thing that hasn't been mentioned yet...

Last night, especially in the third, we were getting soft in front of our own net. Guys were getting too close to Reimer without being punished for it. The very next shift after Reimer gets a body on top of him, Kadri is on and a scrum in front of the net ensues. What does he do? He full out shoves a Senator with both hands onto his ass and away from Reimer. I forget which Sens player it was, but he was definitely bigger. Plays like that are very valuable to a team, and don't think his teammates don't notice!

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03-07-2013, 10:44 AM
  #203
Atomos2
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For the record, i do feel like we'll make the post season. But as a hypothetical question, who thinks kadri would be invited to represent canada in the WC.

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03-07-2013, 10:59 AM
  #204
ULF_55
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he's a 22 year old player. its hardly uncommon for high potential young players to get higher offensive starts and protected play before slowly bringing them into higher pressure situations. rnh and eberle had that last year, as did hodgson. hardly something that should be used against kadri currently.

People have to stop being so defensive about Kadri.

Stating facts is not attacking, it is providing information and insight into reality.

Carlyle is trying to use players in situations that are best suited for their games. If that means Kadri gets more offensive starts than defensive starts that is just because that is best for the team.

Carlyle is an active coach during games, and wants to win. If he thinks using Grabovski in the defensive zone with McClement and Kulemin is better for the team that's why he'll start Grabovski's line in the defensive zone most often.

As you point out it is hardly uncommon to give the heavy lifting to more experienced players.

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The 197475 season saw another change to its playoff system to accommodate the league of 18 teams, twelve of which qualified for the playoffs. The top team from each division would earn a bye to the quarterfinal, while the second- and third-place teams from each division started their playoff run from a best-of-three preliminary round.
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03-07-2013, 11:02 AM
  #205
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keeps rolling

#thedream

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03-07-2013, 11:15 AM
  #206
Derek Synak
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I was pretty skeptical about this kid, but he has made me eat my words to this point.

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03-07-2013, 11:21 AM
  #207
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wtf? this guy is gold lol

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03-07-2013, 11:22 AM
  #208
ULF_55
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Originally Posted by BrownieLeafer View Post
I was pretty skeptical about this kid, but he has made me eat my words to this point.
I think it is called being patient.

Some had him penciled into the line up the year he was drafted, the next year some were calling him to be in the top 6, while some were calling him a failure.

It is funny because we see 26 year old rookies getting praise and 20 year old prospects being written off all on this board.

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03-07-2013, 11:55 AM
  #209
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wtf? this guy is gold lol
LOL @ the Morgan Rielly one.

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03-07-2013, 12:19 PM
  #210
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LOL @ the Morgan Rielly one.

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03-07-2013, 12:28 PM
  #211
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Originally Posted by 7even View Post
http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_stati...34+45+46+63+67

He's also seeing the easiest competition out of all the forwards save the 4th line.
If that's the reason of his point streak then as a coach WHY THE **** WOULD I MOVE HIM ANYWHERE ELSE??

goal is a goal is a goal against any lineeeeeee.. If it counted as half a goal against 2nd line d-men then I'd move him on the first.

PUT A THINKING CAP ON GUYS. If he puts up goals against 2nd liner d-men then I AM HAPPYYYYYYYYYY.

WHY WOULD ANYONE COMPLAIN ABOUT IT IS BEYOND MEEEEEE......

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03-07-2013, 12:38 PM
  #212
ULF_55
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Originally Posted by caramelontop View Post
If that's the reason of his point streak then as a coach WHY THE **** WOULD I MOVE HIM ANYWHERE ELSE??

goal is a goal is a goal against any lineeeeeee.. If it counted as half a goal against 2nd line d-men then I'd move him on the first.

PUT A THINKING CAP ON GUYS. If he puts up goals against 2nd liner d-men then I AM HAPPYYYYYYYYYY.

WHY WOULD ANYONE COMPLAIN ABOUT IT IS BEYOND MEEEEEE......
Quote:
Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
People have to stop being so defensive about Kadri.

Stating facts is not attacking, it is providing information and insight into reality.

Carlyle is trying to use players in situations that are best suited for their games. If that means Kadri gets more offensive starts than defensive starts that is just because that is best for the team.

Carlyle is an active coach during games, and wants to win. If he thinks using Grabovski in the defensive zone with McClement and Kulemin is better for the team that's why he'll start Grabovski's line in the defensive zone most often.

As you point out it is hardly uncommon to give the heavy lifting to more experienced players.

I think it is brought up because people are confusing contributions to points.

More Points <> Better

Player X sucks because he isn't putting up a lot of points.
Player Y is great because he's putting up a lot of points.

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03-07-2013, 12:42 PM
  #213
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with success, and hype teams and players will start planning for him
will be interesting to see how he adapts and if he'll get caught with his head down

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03-07-2013, 12:45 PM
  #214
stakesishigh
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lol @ the morgan rielly one.
more gain rye lie.

Pretty good stuff.

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03-07-2013, 12:46 PM
  #215
Lebanese Leaf
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Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
I think it is brought up because people are confusing contributions to points.

More Points <> Better

Player X sucks because he isn't putting up a lot of points.
Player Y is great because he's putting up a lot of points.
No but why would you use this to discredit? Kadri's 24 points are still more impressive than Kessel's 20 points. The Art Ross race doesn't factor in strength of opponents. If he was only producing because he's avoiding top defenses, then why doesn't every young player in a secondary scoring situation flourish? Tarasenko, Yakupov, B.Schenn, Galchenyuk, Seguin are all in similar situations as Kadri, avoiding top shutdown assignments. Why does no one discredit their contributions?

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03-07-2013, 12:48 PM
  #216
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Originally Posted by pspot View Post
with success, and hype teams and players will start planning for him
will be interesting to see how he adapts and if he'll get caught with his head down
Will be interesting to see how the opponent that may catch him with his head down will adapt to Orr, McLaren, Fraser. Will definitely make them think twice before trying something dirty.

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03-07-2013, 12:50 PM
  #217
pspot
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Originally Posted by Lebanese Leaf View Post
Will be interesting to see how the opponent that may catch him with his head down will adapt to Orr, McLaren, Fraser. Will definitely make them think twice before trying something dirty.
true, didn't mean something dirty just meant a phanuef type head down across mid ice. forget the puck I'm going to go right through this kid type of hit.

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03-07-2013, 01:03 PM
  #218
ULF_55
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Originally Posted by Lebanese Leaf View Post
No but why would you use this to discredit? Kadri's 24 points are still more impressive than Kessel's 20 points. The Art Ross race doesn't factor in strength of opponents. If he was only producing because he's avoiding top defenses, then why doesn't every young player in a secondary scoring situation flourish? Tarasenko, Yakupov, B.Schenn, Galchenyuk, Seguin are all in similar situations as Kadri, avoiding top shutdown assignments. Why does no one discredit their contributions?
How is stating a fact discrediting?

Kadri is 6' tall.

Is that discrediting him?

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03-07-2013, 01:19 PM
  #219
Lebanese Leaf
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Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
How is stating a fact discrediting?

Kadri is 6' tall.

Is that discrediting him?
Because you said...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
I think it is brought up because people are confusing contributions to points.

More Points <> Better

Player X sucks because he isn't putting up a lot of points.
Player Y is great because he's putting up a lot of points.
In the bolded, you are implying that people are confusing Kadri's points to his contributions. That he may be putting up a lot of points, but somehow his contribution isn't as large and should have a * because of who he's matched up against.

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03-07-2013, 02:31 PM
  #220
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For the record, i do feel like we'll make the post season. But as a hypothetical question, who thinks kadri would be invited to represent canada in the WC.
For the WC, sure. For the Olympics-no, maybe next time.

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03-07-2013, 02:59 PM
  #221
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For the WC, sure. For the Olympics-no, maybe next time.
Okay, some people need to temper their expectations just a smidgen.

Kadri has played well but it has only been 24 games. Let's not get ahead of ourselves here.

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03-07-2013, 03:06 PM
  #222
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For the record, i do feel like we'll make the post season. But as a hypothetical question, who thinks kadri would be invited to represent canada in the WC.
If he continues this pace this season and next season, yes he will.

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03-07-2013, 03:12 PM
  #223
ULF_55
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Originally Posted by Lebanese Leaf View Post
Because you said...

In the bolded, you are implying that people are confusing Kadri's points to his contributions. That he may be putting up a lot of points, but somehow his contribution isn't as large and should have a * because of who he's matched up against.
Yes, because you can't just look at stats without knowing how those stats are compiled.

It isn't saying his contribution is less it is saying you need to know what he is asked to contribute.

Example:

Player X - no points in 13 games with plenty of opportunities
Player Y - 14 assists in 24 games

Who is contributing more? Who is the better player?

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03-07-2013, 03:17 PM
  #224
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Okay, some people need to temper their expectations just a smidgen.

Kadri has played well but it has only been 24 games. Let's not get ahead of ourselves here.
If he continues his scoring pace and Leafs miss playoffs, I believe he warrants an invite to WC. But the Olympics is not reachable. We will see how things go after Sochi. 2018 is 5 years away and I did say maybe. Is that smidgen enough for ya?

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03-07-2013, 03:32 PM
  #225
anderson3133
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If he continues his scoring pace and Leafs miss playoffs, I believe he warrants an invite to WC. But the Olympics is not reachable. We will see how things go after Sochi. 2018 is 5 years away and I did say maybe. Is that smidgen enough for ya?
I'm saying that Team Canada Olympics 5 years away is quite a stretch at this point in time. Certainly, he could play in the WC this year (Ryan Murray played last year and most players opt to take a break during this time).

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