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David Desharnais Discussion Part II: The 'Stay on your Feet' Edition

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Old
05-09-2013, 06:49 AM
  #626
Monctonscout
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
I'm not sure that DD is tradeable.

His best case potential is 60 points when he gets privileged, big, scoring, linemates, offensive zone starts, easier opposition, plays a full 81 games, gets all the lucky bounces with an anomalous shooting percentage on his line, and PP time. He cannot play in the bottom 6, he cannot be the one to score goals himself, and he is a defensive liability.

In other words, he has negative value over replacement... and he is signed at 3.5 million per year for four more years.
Not sure where you get that he has negative value. 3.5 mil for a #2 center is hardly a huge cap hit/salary and teams are always looking for centers. If Lombardi can be traded, Desharnais will have value in a trade.

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05-09-2013, 07:54 AM
  #627
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Originally Posted by WakeUpNHL View Post
Good post.

However, why a 4 year contract extension??
With the development of Eller and Chuckie, I can't see DD a hab past next year at most.
I'm afraid we have another 'Gomez' situation developing. Bergevin really f**ked up on this one.
I wonder if Bergevin would give DD the same contract right now?
Pretty sure the numbers wouldn't be the same.

4 years? I don't get it. But then again, i don't get the contract in the first place.
Not because DD sucked, but because the 3.5M coud've been used to really help this team. Like getting a tough D or a big size winger....welll hings the Habs REALLY need.

With Plek, Galchy and Eller.....signing the smallest center in the league is the last thing in the world the Habs need. They don't more small player, they need less small player.

We lost against the Flyers in 2007-2208: cause we we're too smal and weak
We lost against the Bruins in 2008-2009: cause we we're too small and weak
We lost against the Flyers in 2009-2010: cause we we're too small and weak
We lost against the Bruins in 2010-2011: cause we we're too small and weak
We are almost loosing against OTT now: cause we are too small and weak

And some still don't get that the only way we changed that routine is to get rid of small and weak players. DD is the smallest and one of the weakest of them all.

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05-09-2013, 08:22 AM
  #628
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Originally Posted by thebinne4pres View Post
I wonder if Bergevin would give DD the same contract right now?
Pretty sure the numbers wouldn't be the same.

4 years? I don't get it. But then again, i don't get the contract in the first place.
Not because DD sucked, but because the 3.5M coud've been used to really help this team. Like getting a tough D or a big size winger....welll hings the Habs REALLY need.

With Plek, Galchy and Eller.....signing the smallest center in the league is the last thing in the world the Habs need. They don't more small player, they need less small player.

We lost against the Flyers in 2007-2208: cause we we're too smal and weak
We lost against the Bruins in 2008-2009: cause we we're too small and weak
We lost against the Flyers in 2009-2010: cause we we're too small and weak
We lost against the Bruins in 2010-2011: cause we we're too small and weak
We are almost loosing against OTT now: cause we are too small and weak

And some still don't get that the only way we changed that routine is to get rid of small and weak players. DD is the smallest and one of the weakest of them all.
If size is the be all and end all why is the biggest team in the NHL(Winnipeg) out of the playoffs AGAIN this year?

Blaming every playoff loss on being "small and weak" is beyond ridiculous.

Zibanejad turned the tide last game with our biggest player 5 feet away...all 6'6" of him. Game 3 the turning point was Pageau being able to walk in and Tinordi giving the blueline. Pageau is barely 160lbs.

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05-09-2013, 08:53 AM
  #629
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How about DD to a western team for a 1st rounder ? He's already a proven player and that would give the Habs 4 picks in the top 35 of a pretty deep draft. Then sign a decent 3rd Center.

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05-09-2013, 08:56 AM
  #630
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Originally Posted by Monctonscout View Post
If size is the be all and end all why is the biggest team in the NHL(Winnipeg) out of the playoffs AGAIN this year?

Blaming every playoff loss on being "small and weak" is beyond ridiculous.

Zibanejad turned the tide last game with our biggest player 5 feet away...all 6'6" of him. Game 3 the turning point was Pageau being able to walk in and Tinordi giving the blueline. Pageau is barely 160lbs.
Well, size is not all of course......we don't need to be the biggest team to win.....but i'm not talking about being the biggest team, i'm talking about not being the smallest team of the league!

And just for the record, The Kings and the Bruins don't think this is beyond ridiculous.

If you want to win the cup, you have to go throught the big and tough team, and i'm still waiting for our small team to do that, but after 6 years of failure to do so, i think it's fair to say it's not a good way to go.

There is a lot of talented player out there with size.....can we get some?

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05-09-2013, 09:00 AM
  #631
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Originally Posted by HabsDan93 View Post
How about DD to a western team for a 1st rounder ? He's already a proven player and that would give the Habs 4 picks in the top 35 of a pretty deep draft. Then sign a decent 3rd Center.
How about we trade him for Crosby instead?

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05-09-2013, 09:10 AM
  #632
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How about we trade him for Crosby instead?
I'm not too sure about this, Crosby is injury prone.





























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05-09-2013, 09:17 AM
  #633
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Originally Posted by Monctonscout View Post
Not sure where you get that he has negative value. 3.5 mil for a #2 center is hardly a huge cap hit/salary and teams are always looking for centers. If Lombardi can be traded, Desharnais will have value in a trade.
Agreed, but I wouldn't say that Davey is conclusively a #2 center at this point where teams will be willing to dish to take him on. He's one of those tweener 2nd/3rd liners, he can slot into both but, ideally, he's not on your team's 2nd line. And I'm not saying this to bash him, always have supported him despite his shortcomings this season and weaknesses as a player.

Lombardi is a good comparable, but he doesn't have that size stigma associated to him. Then again, that stigma may just be fan-induced more than anything, but I somehow doubt it stops there.

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05-09-2013, 09:19 AM
  #634
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Originally Posted by thebinne4pres View Post
Well, size is not all of course......we don't need to be the biggest team to win.....but i'm not talking about being the biggest team, i'm talking about not being the smallest team of the league!

And just for the record, The Kings and the Bruins don't think this is beyond ridiculous.

If you want to win the cup, you have to go throught the big and tough team, and i'm still waiting for our small team to do that, but after 6 years of failure to do so, i think it's fair to say it's not a good way to go.

There is a lot of talented player out there with size.....can we get some?
I'm not questioning the need to get bigger and meaner. I just find it ridicuous that some posters want to ship out every sub 6' 200lbs player out of town despite those players being key contributors(Plekanec Diaz Gionta) to this season's success.

We do have a fair bit of big guys too...Tinordi Emelin Bourque Pacioretty Moen Eller Galchenyuk.

LA won the cup with a lot of key peces being far from Giants...Brown Williams Richards Carter(tall but skinny) Voynov. Doughty is the same size as Subban/Markov. They were big at the bottom of their lineup, but the guys that carried the team were hardly giants other than Kopitar.

Bonston won the cup with Recchi Marchand Krejci Bergeron Ryder as 5 of their 6 top scorers. Peverley was 8th. Again they size in their bottom lines mostly. The Bergeron-Recchi-Marchand line dominated Vancouver who had the biggest team in the NHL that year.

Chicago had guys like Keith Kane Campbell Bolland Versteeg playing key roles.

San Jose dumped 2 of their biggest/slowest players and they went on a tear and swept Vancouver in round 1, so obviously being too big/slow is not good either.

No doubt you need size mixed in and right now we probably need a 2-3 bigger players added at some point in the next 12 months. The guys who have beat us for Ottawa are their smaller guys Alfredsson Karlsson Pageau Conacher. We need a 4th line that plays like it did in game 2.

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05-09-2013, 09:20 AM
  #635
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He should become a winger.

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05-09-2013, 09:24 AM
  #636
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Originally Posted by Coldplay View Post
Agreed, but I wouldn't say that Davey is conclusively a #2 center at this point where teams will be willing to dish to take him on. He's one of those tweener 2nd/3rd liners, he can slot into both but, ideally, he's not on your team's 2nd line. And I'm not saying this to bash him, always have supported him despite his shortcomings this season and weaknesses as a player.

Lombardi is a good comparable, but he doesn't have that size stigma associated to him. Then again, that stigma may just be fan-induced more than anything, but I somehow doubt it stops there.
DD is probably not a #2 center on a top 5 contender, but for sure on a bottom 10 team. If you look at non playoff teams he would be an upgrade on their top 2 in 2/3 to 3/4 of thoses cases I'm sure(without looking them up 1 by 1). Obviously not Colorado or Tampa Bay.

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05-09-2013, 09:43 AM
  #637
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Originally Posted by durojean View Post
He should become a winger.
On another team.

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05-09-2013, 09:53 AM
  #638
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Originally Posted by Habsawce View Post
Imagine having a GM that could admit his mistake and trade a player he just signed, that would take cohones and would be a breath of fresh air.

The only one I know is Holmgren and most of us rip him for it, but in this case I could stand MB doing it!
I admit my mistakes at the office every time, though I do not make many.

Any manager who cannot admit mistakes and move on is a tool. And the staff know it.

DD gets 40 more games next year, then we'll see. I hope for the best.

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05-09-2013, 10:01 AM
  #639
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I'm pretty sure 20 games isn't going to matter that much to Bergevin if he made a 4-year commitment. Bergevin has to know he's struggling this year, but he obviously saw something he liked.
I said a month ago, watch DD in playoffs. And it's not good. This is not a good thing for him or the Habs.

This does matter. Bergevin will not be happy about this, at all.

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05-09-2013, 10:12 AM
  #640
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Originally Posted by durojean View Post
He should become a winger.
If they shift DD to the wing, it means he's done in Montreal long term, and he'll fill in until Kristo or Collberg or Hudon or Bozon are ready.

If he is moved to wing next year, he will not be with Habs in 2014-15.

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05-09-2013, 10:56 AM
  #641
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Why not wait next season ? It happens to many, many players to have an off season. he is not the first one. The guy is no lazy bum. He will bounce back, if not in Montreal, then elsewhere.

And for a very small guy, he is never injured (or can play injured). He did not miss a single game in two seasons.


Yes he is bad, very bad, this year. But let's wait a bit.

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05-09-2013, 11:33 AM
  #642
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Why not wait next season ? It happens to many, many players to have an off season. he is not the first one. The guy is no lazy bum. He will bounce back, if not in Montreal, then elsewhere.

And for a very small guy, he is never injured (or can play injured). He did not miss a single game in two seasons.


Yes he is bad, very bad, this year. But let's wait a bit.
I'm not a fan of jumping the gun on players, but you also need to pull the trigger if the right offer comes along. If I can add a nice defensive piece + center prospect for DD plus a pick, then I'd have to seriously consider it. Unless Galchenyuk hits a big sophomore slump, you really can't justify giving DD time at C.

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05-09-2013, 12:04 PM
  #643
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I'm not a fan of jumping the gun on players, but you also need to pull the trigger if the right offer comes along. If I can add a nice defensive piece + center prospect for DD plus a pick, then I'd have to seriously consider it. Unless Galchenyuk hits a big sophomore slump, you really can't justify giving DD time at C.
Yes you can justify it. Desharnais still has a chance to bounce back and be more along of the lines of what I thought he could become. If not, he's still going to be a good 3rd line scoring center.

Eller is a 2nd liner now and Galchenyuk, if his production stays near what he's been of late, is a Top-6 forward as well, so I believe they'll keep him on the wing next year.

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05-09-2013, 12:17 PM
  #644
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Originally Posted by Monctonscout View Post
DD is probably not a #2 center on a top 5 contender, but for sure on a bottom 10 team. If you look at non playoff teams he would be an upgrade on their top 2 in 2/3 to 3/4 of thoses cases I'm sure(without looking them up 1 by 1). Obviously not Colorado or Tampa Bay.
Yes I'm sure the other gm's are thinking: hey, let's finish in the bottom 10 this year, who can help us get there? Hmmm

DD has no value point finale

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05-09-2013, 12:19 PM
  #645
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Desharnais is the worst playoff performer to ever wear the bleu blanc rouge. I hope he's in Europe next year cause he does not belong in the nhl.

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05-09-2013, 01:04 PM
  #646
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What's making matters worst is two things, his drop in performance right after signing his contract (the contract itself is a little bad as well) and his minutes. Had he been playing strictly on the 3rd, he might be ok. But MT keeps giving him top line minutes which baffles me when you look at centers like Chucky's performances.

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05-09-2013, 01:11 PM
  #647
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Desharnais is the worst playoff performer to ever wear the bleu blanc rouge. I hope he's in Europe next year cause he does not belong in the nhl.
Hyperbole like this is what makes threads on this board unbearable for those hoping to find intelligent discussion therein. Give your head a shake. Have you only watched hockey for 2 years?

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05-09-2013, 01:13 PM
  #648
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What's making matters worst is two things, his drop in performance right after signing his contract (the contract itself is a little bad as well) and his minutes. Had he been playing strictly on the 3rd, he might be ok. But MT keeps giving him top line minutes which baffles me when you look at centers like Chucky's performances.
Therrien's handling of the Desharnais vs. Eller/Galchenyuk situation was mediocre at best. They should've gratuated, especially with the #2 centerman being in a major slump.

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05-09-2013, 01:13 PM
  #649
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What's making matters worst is two things, his drop in performance right after signing his contract (the contract itself is a little bad as well) and his minutes. Had he been playing strictly on the 3rd, he might be ok. But MT keeps giving him top line minutes which baffles me when you look at centers like Chucky's performances.
The drop in performance started a week or two before the signing, which made it even more baffling. I don't for a second attribute his play to his new contract.

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05-09-2013, 01:14 PM
  #650
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Hyperbole like this is what makes threads on this board unbearable for those hoping to find intelligent discussion therein. Give your head a shake. Have you only watched hockey for 2 years?
Tell me someone who was worse in a playoff series and I'll start the head shaking

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