HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Vancouver Canucks
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Mike Gillis Discussion Thread

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-17-2013, 03:51 AM
  #801
VanCanucks53
Registered User
 
VanCanucks53's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,161
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by vector209 View Post
You should never try and adapt and derail a team's identity. The Canucks excelled best when they fostered skill, not this Frankenstein mish-mash of a few skilled players and several grinders/plugs.

Always lead, never follow. Unfortunately, Gillis seems to have never gotten that memo.
Agree with all of this. This team doesn't have much of an identity right now.

VanCanucks53 is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 03:52 AM
  #802
BoHorvatFan
Registered User
 
BoHorvatFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 9,095
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SonicY View Post
To play devil's advocate a bit, people were pissed that we had no size and were getting pushed around a ton after the B's series. Gillis was reacting to sentiment.

Plus, when you look at the West now... with the exception of Detroit and Edmonton, the teams are all big, with lock-down defense and solid goaltending. He may be trying to adapt to that.

He is, however, failing.
I agree with this to a point, but I would never sacrifice skill for size. I think the puck possession style can beat size and toughness. IMO we didn't lose in the cup finals because of size or toughness we lost because we were completely destroyed by injuries. Everyone was injured, we couldn't play our game and still made it a 7 game series even without scoring!

Then our response is to let our best puck moving D, PP star and a guy that had a big impact on the Sedins leave for nothing. Everything since the finals ended has been a disaster. brining in heads down player with no hockey sense like booth is the opposite of how we got to the finals. And i'd agrue our defence is softer than it ever was with Ehrhoff and Salo around. So we're softer on D without the skating or puck moving and we're bigger and less skilled up front.

We will get killed transition wise against a good team in a playoff series, we can't move the puck through the neutral zone anymore, and Gillis has done nothing to improve our secondary scoring which has been a huge weakness even when we were competing for the cup.

BoHorvatFan is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 04:05 AM
  #803
SonicY
Daydream Nation
 
SonicY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Vancouver/Edinburgh
Posts: 3,516
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NugentHopkinsfan View Post
I agree with this to a point, but I would never sacrifice skill for size. I think the puck possession style can beat size and toughness. IMO we didn't lose in the cup finals because of size or toughness we lost because we were completely destroyed by injuries. Everyone was injured, we couldn't play our game and still made it a 7 game series even without scoring!

Then our response is to let our best puck moving D, PP star and a guy that had a big impact on the Sedins leave for nothing. Everything since the finals ended has been a disaster. brining in heads down player with no hockey sense like booth is the opposite of how we got to the finals. And i'd agrue our defence is softer than it ever was with Ehrhoff and Salo around. So we're softer on D without the skating or puck moving and we're bigger and less skilled up front.

We will get killed transition wise against a good team in a playoff series, we can't move the puck through the neutral zone anymore, and Gillis has done nothing to improve our secondary scoring which has been a huge weakness even when we were competing for the cup.
Spot on. I said it earlier in this thread, yet was met with consternation. What has he added, forward wise? Samuelsson, Demitra, Sundin, Higgins, Lapierre, Kassian and Booth (along with fringe guys like Weise and Ebbett). Of those, Samuelsson had the best impact, but that was really only for the 09/10 season. The rest have been disappointments, or are bottom-six types. Nary an impact player among them. Worrisome.

SonicY is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 04:12 AM
  #804
Jyrki
trust in linden CREW
 
Jyrki's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: 新香
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,653
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat Tony View Post
If the league is moving back towards clutch and grab hockey, Gillis doesn't have much choice. But, I also agree, he is failing.
I think the Hawks are doing just fine with a "soft" lineup.

Jyrki is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 05:30 AM
  #805
BoeserOfTwoEvils
3rd overall? Nope!
 
BoeserOfTwoEvils's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Port Coquitlam, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,517
vCash: 500
It almost would have been better to lose to SJ in 2011.

Losing to Boston caused them to get away from what made them so successful and now they're a shell of their former selves.

BoeserOfTwoEvils is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 05:38 AM
  #806
vanuck
#Gaunce4GM
 
vanuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 14,129
vCash: 500
Obviously we'd love to go for speed and skill, but the unfortunate reality of the playoffs is that refs will not penalize interference/obstruction as much. This team used to thrive off the PP, but it's hard to maintain your success because of that since you're not getting as many calls. So we're trying to go for the best combination of skill + size + speed now, i.e towards a more balanced mix that doesn't rely on PP's as much to generate offense.

vanuck is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 09:50 AM
  #807
canucksfan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: British Columbia
Posts: 31,832
vCash: 500
Still believe him not resigning erhoff was a huge mistake.

canucksfan is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 10:14 AM
  #808
Drop the Sopel
Feaster famine
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: calgary
Posts: 18,125
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SonicY View Post
Plus, when you look at the West now... with the exception of Detroit and Edmonton, the teams are all big, with lock-down defense and solid goaltending. He may be trying to adapt to that.
Chicago is a soft, skilled team with little physicality or toughness. They're one of the most dominant teams the West has ever seen...

It will be interesting to see if the skilled, puck possession teams have no success in the playoffs like last season or if it was just a one-off. If it was just a coincidence and the skilled teams beat the big, strong defensive clubs Gillis will have to really do some soul searching after he's spent the last year and a half completely avoiding small, skilled players and targeting strictly size.

Gillis' body of work with the forward corps hasn't been anywhere near good enough. He really needs to find a way to add an impact player up front and strengthen the middle of the ice. The clock is ticking.

Drop the Sopel is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 10:17 AM
  #809
canucksfan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: British Columbia
Posts: 31,832
vCash: 500
In order to get a top six forward the Canucks are going to have to give up a top prospect and/or a top draft pick. It will be interesting to see what happens.

canucksfan is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 12:04 PM
  #810
VeteranNetPresence
Disco Super Fly.
 
VeteranNetPresence's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,334
vCash: 500
seems like i was one of a very few who was critical of gillis. crazy what a couple of months does

VeteranNetPresence is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 12:07 PM
  #811
Grub
First Line Troll
 
Grub's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: B.C
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,600
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by VeteranNetPresence View Post
seems like i was one of a very few who was critical of gillis. crazy what a couple of months does
Nope you're not alone. I was just scared to come out of the closet for fear of being hanged here in hfboards for suggesting such an idea.

But I've been saying this for the last 2 years, Mike hasn't done much to improve with this team. The core is still the Nonis' era, and even the coach is still from the Nonis' regime.

Grub is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 12:14 PM
  #812
KeninsFan
Fire Benning already
 
KeninsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,220
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by canucksfan View Post
Still believe him not resigning erhoff was a huge mistake.
Ehrhoff defined our team as a skilled fast counter attacking team that could pinch its D and dominate puck possession. Losing him wasn't just losing a 45+ pt d-man.

A healthy Kesler will help but this team is in serious need of an identity.

Chicago is better at being skilled and having a lightning quick transition.
Detroit's Zetterberg - Dats - Helm dominate us in a C matchup and have ever since Manny went down.
LA can cycle better than anyone.

From all rumours Gillis knows we need a C and I desperately hope he acquires a Roy/Ott/Grabovski. My worst fear is that he stands pat at the TDL (like Nonis) because he believes the off-season is the best time for shape a roster.

KeninsFan is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 12:15 PM
  #813
petrishriekandgo
Why not us?
 
petrishriekandgo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Vancouver, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,461
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDK View Post
It almost would have been better to lose to SJ in 2011.

Losing to Boston caused them to get away from what made them so successful and now they're a shell of their former selves.
I really think it wasn't the Boston Bruins as much as it was how the league let that series be played/officiated. We saw it during the 2nd half of last season and throughout the Kings run and we're seeing it again now.

Gillis had planned to push the envelope on speed and skill and the Canucks team that made it to the cup final (and dominated like no team in 2 decades in the reg season) was almost the perfect make-up to do that. BUT, it's not a playoff winning formula.

Sure one could argue that with a healthy lineup they may have taken the cup regardless of how the game was allowed to be played BUT it doesn't change the fact that the NHL game changes when it matters the most.

Gillis isn't reacting to the Bruins, he's just succumbing (regretfully) to the type of teams the NHL system rewards.

So, yah, we're stuck between two philosophies right now... it would be interesting to see where we'd be if we were healthy BUT everyone has issue across the league.

Bottom line is Gillis needs to make a move, a playoff structured move and the Canucks need to bear down, period.

petrishriekandgo is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 12:19 PM
  #814
Grub
First Line Troll
 
Grub's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: B.C
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,600
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by petrishriekandgo View Post
I really think it wasn't the Boston Bruins as much as it was how the league let that series be played/officiated. We saw it during the 2nd half of last season and throughout the Kings run and we're seeing it again now.

Gillis had planned to push the envelope on speed and skill and the Canucks team that made it to the cup final (and dominated like no team in 2 decades in the reg season) was almost the perfect make-up to do that. BUT, it's not a playoff winning formula.

Sure one could argue that with a healthy lineup they may have taken the cup regardless of how the game was allowed to be played BUT it doesn't change the fact that the NHL game changes when it matters the most.

Gillis isn't reacting to the Bruins, he's just succumbing (regretfully) to the type of teams the NHL system rewards.

So, yah, we're stuck between two philosophies right now... it would be interesting to see where we'd be if we were healthy BUT everyone has issue across the league.

Bottom line is Gillis needs to make a move, a playoff structured move and the Canucks need to bear down, period.
I'm pretty sure a team that went to game 7 of the Stanley Cup final is a cup winning formula. This new goon it up hockey (we just signed another random 23 year old who is 6'6 i guess because he is big), does not work with this team.

There's a reason that we got eliminated in such a humiliating fashion last season, and there is a reason why we're struggling so much at the moment. We've dwelled away from our Stanley Cup run success.

Grub is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 12:24 PM
  #815
KonaRider
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 189
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grub View Post
Nope you're not alone. I was just scared to come out of the closet for fear of being hanged here in hfboards for suggesting such an idea.

But I've been saying this for the last 2 years, Mike hasn't done much to improve with this team. The core is still the Nonis' era, and even the coach is still from the Nonis' regime.
Gillis mesmerized me for the first couple of years. It's worn off now. I distinctly remember him preaching "youth and ELC's as being critical to success" after being trounced by Chicago.

Heres a massive issue I have: In the last 7 years (since 2006), we have traded away or not used EVERY 1st and 2nd round pick with the exception of Jensen and Gaunce (and time will only tell on them).
7 years, and not a single 1st or 2nd rounder has stepped into a role with this team. That is absolutely atrocious. Either our scouts are picking duds or there is a completely awful relationship between our coaching staff and our players. And our coaching staff is a reflection of our GM.

In my opinion, the team is not very intense. And I believe that it flows down from the top. Gillis is NOT a very inspiring man. After him comes AV and his hands-off approach coaching these players. Then comes the Sedin's who basically coach themselves, yet they are not the most intense men either.

What is it going to take to light a fire under EVERYONE's ass?

KonaRider is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 12:24 PM
  #816
LolClarkson*
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Embrace the hate
Posts: 8,906
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by vector209 View Post
You should never try and adapt and derail a team's identity. The Canucks excelled best when they fostered skill, not this Frankenstein mish-mash of a few skilled players and several grinders/plugs.
You are right

LolClarkson* is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 12:26 PM
  #817
John Bender*
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 6,713
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by canucksfan View Post
Still believe him not resigning erhoff was a huge mistake.
Could have had Ehrhoff instead of Ballard. That's disturbing.

John Bender* is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 12:27 PM
  #818
John Bender*
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 6,713
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by KonaRider View Post
Gillis mesmerized me for the first couple of years. It's worn off now. I distinctly remember him preaching "youth and ELC's as being critical to success" after being trounced by Chicago.

Heres a massive issue I have: In the last 7 years (since 2006), we have traded away or not used EVERY 1st and 2nd round pick with the exception of Jensen and Gaunce (and time will only tell on them).
7 years, and not a single 1st or 2nd rounder has stepped into a role with this team. That is absolutely atrocious. Either our scouts are picking duds or there is a completely awful relationship between our coaching staff and our players. And our coaching staff is a reflection of our GM.

In my opinion, the team is not very intense. And I believe that it flows down from the top. Gillis is NOT a very inspiring man. After him comes AV and his hands-off approach coaching these players. Then comes the Sedin's who basically coach themselves, yet they are not the most intense men either.

What is it going to take to light a fire under EVERYONE's ass?
Gillis is very unlikable.

John Bender* is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 12:28 PM
  #819
Grub
First Line Troll
 
Grub's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: B.C
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,600
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanGrossman View Post
Could have had Ehrhoff instead of Ballard. That's disturbing.
Also Could have had Mitchell instead of Ballard the year we let Mitchell go...

Letting go of Mitchell was another monumental mistake, he had a concussion and we just threw him away like he was garbage. Funny part is, Willie has a cup now.

Erhoff-Edler
Bieksa-Hamhuis
Mitchell-Garrison/Tanev/some other defensemen.

A man can dream.

Grub is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 12:29 PM
  #820
LolClarkson*
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Embrace the hate
Posts: 8,906
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grub View Post
Nope you're not alone. I was just scared to come out of the closet for fear of being hanged here in hfboards for suggesting such an idea.

But I've been saying this for the last 2 years, Mike hasn't done much to improve with this team. The core is still the Nonis' era, and even the coach is still from the Nonis' regime.
Not to pump my own tires but I was on him since the Grabner trade. Never forgive, never forget.

LolClarkson* is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 12:33 PM
  #821
John Bender*
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 6,713
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grub View Post
Also Could have had Mitchell instead of Ballard the year we let Mitchell go...

Letting go of Mitchell was another monumental mistake, he had a concussion and we just threw him away like he was garbage. Funny part is, Willie has a cup now.

Erhoff-Edler
Bieksa-Hamhuis
Mitchell-Garrison/Tanev/some other defensemen.

A man can dream.
Could have dropped Bieksa and had Mitchell, Ehrhoff, Hamhuis, Garrison, Tanev.

Gillis royally ****ed the team with the Ballard deal, the Mitchell decision, the Ehrhoff decision, the Booth addition, the Hodgson trade, and the Luongo contract. All in all, he really has made a series of very poor moves. I don't have any confidence in him.

John Bender* is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 12:35 PM
  #822
John Bender*
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 6,713
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldrunner View Post
Not to pump my own tires but I was on him since the Grabner trade. Never forgive, never forget.
Gillis' best moves have been the contracts he has been able to get the twins, Kesler, Hamhuis, Burrows and others to sign.

Essentially he took Nonis' and to that effect, Burke's core and added pieces that for the most part have not worked out. It's also quesionable if the contracts that Gillis got the existing core to sign would not have been agreed to regardless of the GM - of if it was actually Gilman that was the driving force.

I would love to see Gillis and AV gone.

John Bender* is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 12:38 PM
  #823
BerSTUzzi
Registered User
 
BerSTUzzi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,367
vCash: 500
I'm not suggesting a GM change but Gillman is well respected throughout the league and a far less in your face guy. If Gillis fell I would love to see Gillman in there.

BerSTUzzi is online now  
Old
03-17-2013, 12:48 PM
  #824
canucksfan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: British Columbia
Posts: 31,832
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanGrossman View Post
Could have dropped Bieksa and had Mitchell, Ehrhoff, Hamhuis, Garrison, Tanev.

Gillis royally ****ed the team with the Ballard deal, the Mitchell decision, the Ehrhoff decision, the Booth addition, the Hodgson trade, and the Luongo contract. All in all, he really has made a series of very poor moves. I don't have any confidence in him.
I think most people would have done the same with Mitchell.

canucksfan is offline  
Old
03-17-2013, 12:51 PM
  #825
John Bender*
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 6,713
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by canucksfan View Post
I think most people would have done the same with Mitchell.
Like LA did? It was a terrible move. Gillis lowballed him, like he did Ehrhoff and Salo - and he lost out.

****, even having Salo on the team right now would help. Another error. Did Gillis ever consider who would run the PP? Did they really think Hamhuis was capable of being on the 1st unit of a decent team?

John Bender* is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:53 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2017 All Rights Reserved.