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Old
03-21-2013, 05:11 PM
  #576
Ulf Hullberg
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Burmi is a 21 yr old loaded with skill and defensive smarts, so there is absolutely no need to give up on such a valuable young asset with these types of tools.

I'd like to see him play LW on a "shutdown/offensive" 3rd line for the remainder of this year and thru next year. Once Jokinen's contract is up, plant Burmi back at ctr behind Little and Scheifele, and give him Telegin and Wright to play with.

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03-21-2013, 11:19 PM
  #577
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I've commented on this before, but I take solace in looking at Nazem Kadri's trajectory as Burmi struggles along.
They're going crazy over Kadri in TO, as he has 8 points in his last 3 games and is a plus 7. That is more points than he scored all of last season (7 pts in 21 GP).
Kadri is a year older than Burmi (#7 in the '09 draft) and was looking like he was all flash but no substance till he exploded this year.
Here's hoping...

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03-21-2013, 11:22 PM
  #578
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Originally Posted by scelaton View Post
I've commented on this before, but I take solace in looking at Nazem Kadri's trajectory as Burmi struggles along.
They're going crazy over Kadri in TO, as he has 8 points in his last 3 games and is a plus 7. That is more points than he scored all of last season (7 pts in 21 GP).
Kadri is a year older than Burmi (#7 in the '09 draft) and was looking like he was all flash but no substance till he exploded this year.
Here's hoping...
exactly
remember all the stories about kadri being a huge bust, and all that crap

well they were patient and now look

i hate to say it, but we could learn a few things from toronto, coaching, and fans

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03-21-2013, 11:47 PM
  #579
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exactly
remember all the stories about kadri being a huge bust, and all that crap

well they were patient and now look

i hate to say it, but we could learn a few things from toronto, coaching, and fans
Yep they should put him on the farm club for a few more stretches like they did with Kadri. Might learn a few things and make him a smarter player.

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03-22-2013, 12:07 AM
  #580
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Yep they should put him on the farm club for a few more stretches like they did with Kadri. Might learn a few things and make him a smarter player.
he has to go through waivers now

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03-22-2013, 12:11 AM
  #581
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he has to go through waivers now
Oh yeah, I forgot. That's a shame. I was mostly being facetious anyways. MOSTLY.

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03-22-2013, 05:56 AM
  #582
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Originally Posted by scelaton View Post
I've commented on this before, but I take solace in looking at Nazem Kadri's trajectory as Burmi struggles along.
They're going crazy over Kadri in TO, as he has 8 points in his last 3 games and is a plus 7. That is more points than he scored all of last season (7 pts in 21 GP).
Kadri is a year older than Burmi (#7 in the '09 draft) and was looking like he was all flash but no substance till he exploded this year.
Here's hoping...
I think they just developed kadri better. He was a beast in the Ahl. put up 107 pts in 117 games in the AHL (including lockout).

Burmi was 11 pts in 22 games in the AHL. Too bad we could not put him down for a whole season so he can find his offensive game.

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03-22-2013, 09:22 AM
  #583
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It's a risk, but I still think he should be on Kane's line. I don't just mean a few shifts where they never develop chemistry, but make it stick for a few games at least and see what develops. Kane is a beast this year and wants to win desperately, as such I think Kane would whip Burmi into shape pretty fast as evidenced by a play a few games ago where Burmi missed a play and Kane skated over to him immediately after the whistle to tell him what he should have done in that case.

Kane needs speedy, skilled linemates and doesn't seem like he's going spare anyone's feelings right now in order to succeed and Burmi has the skills, but needs an opportunity ( a REAL opportunity) to work with someone like Kane.

All is IMO, but I think you have to see what develops over a couple of games. Instead of juggling shifts and where when a 30 second shift doesn't look good Noel pulls the plug.

LLW didn't look great at the beginning of the year until they gelled again. Takes time sometimes.

BTW, I think we are ruining Burmi's confidence. He looked worse last night than ever.

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03-22-2013, 09:59 AM
  #584
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It is all about give and take. Very simple.
Jets (Thrashers) rushed him to the league instead of letting him develop in AHL. I think Alex did a very good job adjusting to the league despite been not ready. During lock-out he wanted to play in KHL, for a team of his childhood, team based in the city he was born. Yes we all understand it wasn't only the reason he wanted to play there. He also wanted to be close to his family and friends. But do you blame him? He is 21 years old kid after all. My first thought was "let him go and enjoy, show him we appreciate him and his effort". Actually everyone I know thought same way. But not the management, they sent him to AHL. It is funny how it works.
St. Louis haven't had issues with Tarasenko playing in KHL, Ottawa haven't had issues with their young Swedes in Swedish league and I could go on and on. All I my saying is when you treat people with respect you more likely to benefit with loyalty and respect back.
His latest "dog-house" assignment only increased Burmi's grudge towards the organization (if there was any). I don't blame Alex if he doesn't want to play for Jets today as much as he wanted to play before this stupid lock-out started. I just hope it is all just possible scenario and this scenario is WRONG. But if this is the case it is 100% our management fault.

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03-22-2013, 10:54 AM
  #585
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Originally Posted by Fuelled by Passion View Post
It is all about give and take. Very simple.
Jets (Thrashers) rushed him to the league instead of letting him develop in AHL. I think Alex did a very good job adjusting to the league despite been not ready. During lock-out he wanted to play in KHL, for a team of his childhood, team based in the city he was born. Yes we all understand it wasn't only the reason he wanted to play there. He also wanted to be close to his family and friends. But do you blame him? He is 21 years old kid after all. My first thought was "let him go and enjoy, show him we appreciate him and his effort". Actually everyone I know thought same way. But not the management, they sent him to AHL. It is funny how it works.
St. Louis haven't had issues with Tarasenko playing in KHL, Ottawa haven't had issues with their young Swedes in Swedish league and I could go on and on. All I my saying is when you treat people with respect you more likely to benefit with loyalty and respect back.
His latest "dog-house" assignment only increased Burmi's grudge towards the organization (if there was any). I don't blame Alex if he doesn't want to play for Jets today as much as he wanted to play before this stupid lock-out started. I just hope it is all just possible scenario and this scenario is WRONG. But if this is the case it is 100% our management fault.
I agree with some of this. If you want to see what Burmi can do, then **** or get off the pot. Give him real time with real linemates and see what develops. I understand when people say start him on the third or fourth line and let him work his way up, but that's not where his skill and apttitude lay. Playing with slow 'energy' lines won't do anything for someone with Burmi's abilities.

I don't know, I'm no NHL coach, but this all seems a little absurd. If you are looking for a player with potential to become that player, then you had better put them in a position to develop that skill not a different skill. Allow him to develop skill and confidence or get rid of him to some team that will.

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03-22-2013, 11:02 AM
  #586
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The spin here in this thread is ridiculous in scope at times. If Burmistrov had played in the manner he was requested to play then he wouldn't be in the doghouse with regularity. The fault then lies with the player, not with coaching or management.

This is a guy that has been a borderline healthy scratch of late and probably is tonight as well, yet some here think he should be gifted a spot on the top lines tonight? Yikes. They've continually given him the opportunity to play his way into that sort of a spot over the past two seasons and instead he finds himself where he currently sits. That should tell you something, the reasoning should be self-evident in other words.

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03-22-2013, 11:12 AM
  #587
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Come on kid time to pick it up big time!!!!!

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03-22-2013, 11:13 AM
  #588
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I find myself back and forth all the time with Burmi. It's frustrating to watch.

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03-22-2013, 11:15 AM
  #589
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I agree with some of this. If you want to see what Burmi can do, then **** or get off the pot. Give him real time with real linemates and see what develops. I understand when people say start him on the third or fourth line and let him work his way up, but that's not where his skill and apttitude lay. Playing with slow 'energy' lines won't do anything for someone with Burmi's abilities.

I don't know, I'm no NHL coach, but this all seems a little absurd. If you are looking for a player with potential to become that player, then you had better put them in a position to develop that skill not a different skill. Allow him to develop skill and confidence or get rid of him to some team that will.
I agree. After Scheifele played his 4 games everyone said "well evaluating him on the 4th line is hardly fair, because that's not his game, he won't succeed there."

If we want Burmi to be top6, we have to put him in the top six for long enough to see if playing there helps make it happen. (Would little put up near as many points playing with Thorburn and Tangradi? I would guess not...) Maybe he clicks with Kane and there is magic there. But you need to give him enough time to either see that that IS the case or it isn't. You can't just guess that it's not there because it wasn't there right away. Give it 5 games and if you see nothing, then bail on it. But give it 5 games.

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03-22-2013, 11:20 AM
  #590
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I agree. After Scheifele played his 4 games everyone said "well evaluating him on the 4th line is hardly fair, because that's not his game, he won't succeed there."

If we want Burmi to be top6, we have to put him in the top six for long enough to see if playing there helps make it happen. (Would little put up near as many points playing with Thorburn and Tangradi? I would guess not...) Maybe he clicks with Kane and there is magic there. But you need to give him enough time to either see that that IS the case or it isn't. You can't just guess that it's not there because it wasn't there right away. Give it 5 games and if you see nothing, then bail on it. But give it 5 games.

He has time on the top 6 and really didnt do anything with it.

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03-22-2013, 11:31 AM
  #591
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He has time on the top 6 and really didnt do anything with it.
Not really Burmi related...

Apart from Ladd, Little, Wheeler and Kane, who has done something with those minutes?

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03-22-2013, 11:39 AM
  #592
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The spin here in this thread is ridiculous in scope at times. If Burmistrov had played in the manner he was requested to play then he wouldn't be in the doghouse with regularity. The fault then lies with the player, not with coaching or management.
Totally agree. Play the guy with Tangradi and Thorburn and then sit him because of his lack of production, totally make sense. On other hand keep playing Jokinen with his 9 points in 31 games at top-6 and give him even more PP time, cuz he is more valuable to our young organization
Funny thing is that Jokinen was signed as a potential 50-60 points guy during off season (and he gets paid for such production). Considering he wasn't in coach's dog-house and wears "A" I would guess that he is playing in the manner he is requested to play. Just a hint, Oli hasn't had a season with less then 50 points since 2002 and now is 0.3 ppg.

Good day

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03-22-2013, 11:41 AM
  #593
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The spin here in this thread is ridiculous in scope at times. If Burmistrov had played in the manner he was requested to play then he wouldn't be in the doghouse with regularity. The fault then lies with the player, not with coaching or management.

This is a guy that has been a borderline healthy scratch of late and probably is tonight as well, yet some here think he should be gifted a spot on the top lines tonight? Yikes. They've continually given him the opportunity to play his way into that sort of a spot over the past two seasons and instead he finds himself where he currently sits. That should tell you something, the reasoning should be self-evident in other words.
it's noel's call. I happen to think noel's making a mistake. Coaches sometimes do that. Numbers don't lie. Burmi has been better than half the forwards for most of the season (I agree he's been bad lately). Kane has produced more playing with burmi than he has with Jokinen. Kane has been alone for the past two weeks and his production has slipped as a result. We have lost 9 of the last 10 periods. We haven't looked dominant during our win streak. I'm not saying the sky is falling, because we've managed to win some games we shouldn't have, which is a good sign. But some shake up needs to happen.

I don't really care whether burmi gets top 6 min or top 9 min (I think he's wasted in bottom 3). But we can't afford to go on with 3 non scoring lines. It's time to mix things up. Mittens has looked ok with Kane. Antro and Burmi have both played well with Kane. Slot one of those in on that line.

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03-22-2013, 11:44 AM
  #594
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Originally Posted by Gump Hasek View Post
The spin here in this thread is ridiculous in scope at times. If Burmistrov had played in the manner he was requested to play then he wouldn't be in the doghouse with regularity. The fault then lies with the player, not with coaching or management.

This is a guy that has been a borderline healthy scratch of late and probably is tonight as well, yet some here think he should be gifted a spot on the top lines tonight? Yikes. They've continually given him the opportunity to play his way into that sort of a spot over the past two seasons and instead he finds himself where he currently sits. That should tell you something, the reasoning should be self-evident in other words.
I find it amusing that you posted this since you have been spinning it in the opposite direction hard core in this thread (mostly on your own, by the way).

The truth of the matter with Burmistrov lies somewhere between your extreme dislike for him, and the Burmi fanboys.

The fact remains this organization will not make hasty decisions with him, like it or not.

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03-22-2013, 11:48 AM
  #595
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Totally agree. Play the guy with Tangradi and Thorburn and then sit him because of his lack of production, totally make sense. On other hand keep playing Jokinen with his 9 points in 31 games at top-6 and give him even more PP time, cuz he is more valuable to our young organization
Funny thing is that Jokinen was signed as a potential 50-60 points guy during off season (and he gets paid for such production). Considering he wasn't in coach's dog-house and wears "A" I would guess that he is playing in the manner he is requested to play. Just a hint, Oli hasn't had a season with less then 50 points since 2002 and now is 0.3 ppg.

Good day
Yet this thread isn't about Jokinen or anyone other than Burmistrov. The fact that he is playing of late with Tangradi and Thorburn is a direct result of his proven inability to play well with others in a higher role over the past two years despite being given many opportunities there. I've heard it mentioned on the pregame show on 1290 more than once that many of his teammates don't like playing with him because of his continual poor decisions with the puck and that is exactly what I see as well. Too bad Burmistrov failed to accomplish much over the past two seasons when given the opportunity to play in a higher role; we wouldn't be having this discussion if he was playing up to the standard expected by the team.

Good day to you as well.

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03-22-2013, 11:55 AM
  #596
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Too bad Burmistrov failed to accomplish much over the past two seasons when given the opportunity to play in a higher role
I think that Burmi's stats for a 19 and 20 years old kid are actually very-very decent, but let's agree to disagree

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03-22-2013, 11:58 AM
  #597
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I find it amusing that you posted this since you have been spinning it in the opposite direction hard core in this thread (mostly on your own, by the way).

The truth of the matter with Burmistrov lies somewhere between your extreme dislike for him, and the Burmi fanboys.

The fact remains this organization will not make hasty decisions with him, like it or not.
i would agree with this

Burmi is not garaunteed to be a top 6 player (by league standards), but he's closer (statistically) then some think.

He's also not immune to criticism.

He just... he's just somewhere in there for the time being.

If he keeps playing on the third line, thats fine by me. He was getting time up off the fourth line last night, that's good in my books.

But i understand the sentiment that you hve 3-4 players not producing at the top 6 level, but only one is getting taken out of the top 6, and he happens to be the youngest.

Obviously the decision is being based on something besisdes statistical production.

wether or not the decision is right is up for interpretation.

The sky isn't falling. Burmi isn't ruined. he's not a bum. He also isn't a top secrete superstar waiting to bust out if only noel knew how to use them. He's probably not even an average top 6 player being misused, hes kin d of a bubble guy who's got potential.

I understand the frustrations on both sides, but i think being patient and letting him play is fine. If he develops into to 6, fine, if not, that's ok too because hes already good enough to be in the bottom 6.

He can play bottom 6 very effectively, so i don't see why not be patient. if he never pans out as top six so be it, but he can already play well enough in the bottom so its hardly as if he's a bust or goods that must be removed. "as a veteran of a 178 games" he's outperforming far more veteran players on the roster, so he shouldn't be punished anymore then them (except for coaching issues, which i agree with...that benching him for being out of the system is not a bad thing)

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03-22-2013, 12:00 PM
  #598
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Not really Burmi related...

Apart from Ladd, Little, Wheeler and Kane, who has done something with those minutes?
No one has.
thats the big issue with this team

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03-22-2013, 12:07 PM
  #599
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I find it amusing that you posted this since you have been spinning it in the opposite direction hard core in this thread (mostly on your own, by the way).

The truth of the matter with Burmistrov lies somewhere between your extreme dislike for him, and the Burmi fanboys.

The fact remains this organization will not make hasty decisions with him, like it or not.
Hilarious. I don't have an extreme dislike for him at all, those are your own words, not mine; I just find his play to be lacking. You might note that I don't partake at all in any of the trade proposals involving him either here or on the trade boards. The Jets can trade him or not, I'm pretty much ambivalent. Whatever. At the end of the day though it remains that he isn't playing the way the team wants and that is the sole reason why he is in the doghouse with his coach. He needs to pick it up, soon.

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03-22-2013, 12:12 PM
  #600
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Totally agree. Play the guy with Tangradi and Thorburn and then sit him because of his lack of production, totally make sense. On other hand keep playing Jokinen with his 9 points in 31 games at top-6 and give him even more PP time, cuz he is more valuable to our young organization
Funny thing is that Jokinen was signed as a potential 50-60 points guy during off season (and he gets paid for such production). Considering he wasn't in coach's dog-house and wears "A" I would guess that he is playing in the manner he is requested to play. Just a hint, Oli hasn't had a season with less then 50 points since 2002 and now is 0.3 ppg.

Good day
The whole "Whoa is Me" argument is getting a little tiring with regards to this player. Despite the last two games Burmistrov is averaging over 15 minutes a game for icetime and has been largely used in a top 9 role this year. He has seen repeated time on a line with Kane both this year and last year and outside of a couple games this year he hasn't taken advantage of it. Has Jokinen been better? Absolutely not, but he at least has a track record of top six production unlike Burmie so from a coaching perspective it makes some since to try to get him going. Would I like to see one last attempt to but Burmistrov with Kane for an extended time, sure! But Burmistrov needs to start forcing the issue with Noel through strong play which he hasn't done the last few games.

I'm not saying I fully agree with Noel's method's, as he left Burmistrov is the PB far too long and then tried to make him work his way up. Tough love doesn't work with everyone and it seems that's the major weapon Noel uses on youngsters (Which I don't agree with). At the same time Burmistrov needs to shoulder some of the blame here for not adapting to Noel's system.

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