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kindl 27 points, + 49 over a 82 game season

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Old
03-26-2013, 04:45 PM
  #226
14ari13
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Originally Posted by RedWingsNow View Post
Losing Sammy, Bert and CC have been addition by subtraction.
We've been able to give Tatar, Nyquist and Kindl looks they wouldn't have gotten.
Andersson too.

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03-26-2013, 04:50 PM
  #227
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I forgot about the SOs. That's true.
But I think his injury is the kind that will never really let him get into his best at this point in his career.
I remember reading an update that the pain from his back is now affecting his leg(s). If that's true I don't think he's coming back (given his age and previous back issues), one more year on LTIR and then he hangs em up.
Sad way for his career to end and I'd love to be proven wrong, he is still (somewhat) useful.

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03-26-2013, 04:50 PM
  #228
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Originally Posted by 14ari13 View Post
Andersson too.
Andersson took Helm's spot. Pretty big downgrade.

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03-26-2013, 04:52 PM
  #229
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Originally Posted by 14ari13 View Post
Andersson too.
Andersson couldn't skate at this level last year, he was woeful in his callup. I am happy he continues to improve there, plus they are finally using him on the penalty kill. When guys are that excellent at it in the AHL level I hate when they don't get tried out in that job right away. Will be pulling my hair out if upon callup Ferraro and Sheahan aren't used in that role. That befuddled me to no end last year when Andersson was up of course the skating could have played a role there. If he can pick up just a little more speed this off-season he is an interesting player going forward. If he cannot than there are likely better options on the horizon and he will likely lose his spot. Andersson and Lashoff try hard, but there are still serious limitations to their games at the NHL level. Andersson is a lot closer to sorting his out though.

By the way since Andersson seems to be up for good, can we please get him a normal number now.

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03-26-2013, 04:54 PM
  #230
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Originally Posted by EZBAKE View Post
I guess you can say he's been a "Kindl Surprise" this year.


No?


Alright, I tried.
There, there. Have a seat, we'll take it from here

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03-26-2013, 05:01 PM
  #231
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Kindl looked mediocre in his first 100 NHL games = Just needs consistent playing time/still has upside

Smith looks average his first 36 games = Overrated/Bust.

Come on.

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03-26-2013, 05:04 PM
  #232
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Originally Posted by Kronwalled55 View Post
Kindl looked mediocre in his first 100 NHL games = Just needs consistent playing time/still has upside

Smith looks average his first 36 games = Overrated/Bust.

Come on.
It's funny.

I'm a big supporter of playing the kids but I understand there will be growing pains and a learning curve.

Seems like a lot of people here want the kids to play and expect them to be finished products already.

That's not how it works with where we draft, and even our best players were not close to the players you see today when they first broke on the scene.

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03-26-2013, 05:06 PM
  #233
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Originally Posted by Frk It View Post
Andersson took Helm's spot. Pretty big downgrade.
Babcock called Helm the best 3rd line center in the league, so that is obvious. If you look at it that way.
But if I remember right Tatar was called up 1st and Andersson later. Of course Andersson is nowhere near Helm.

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03-26-2013, 05:10 PM
  #234
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Originally Posted by 14ari13 View Post
Babcock called Helm the best 3rd line center in the league, so that is obvious. If you look at it that way.
But if I remember right Tatar was called up 1st and Andersson later. Of course Andersson is nowhere near Helm.
I'm not sure in terms of when he was called up, just was saying that Helm is hurt and usually plays 3rd line center. Now Andy is in and playing 3rd line center. Andy's done a fine job, just wouldn't say that is a situation where 'addition by subtraction' works.

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03-26-2013, 05:13 PM
  #235
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Originally Posted by Frk It View Post
It's funny.

I'm a big supporter of playing the kids but I understand there will be growing pains and a learning curve.

Seems like a lot of people here want the kids to play and expect them to be finished products already.

That's not how it works with where we draft, and even our best players were not close to the players you see today when they first broke on the scene.
I am not really in that crowd you're talking about. But I have been wondering clear back to the Griffins during the lockout where Smith's top end gear went? This is the worst I have seen him skate since his freshman year at Wisconsin. I am assuming he did something in the off-season programming that hurt it a little or he is carrying some kind of nagging injury, hoping he can pick up some of the explosion I have seen from him in the past it is missing and I cannot explain it.

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03-26-2013, 05:49 PM
  #236
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"Kindl Suprise" is good, but I'm still hoping for Jakub "the E-Reader" Kindl to catch on.

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03-26-2013, 05:50 PM
  #237
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Originally Posted by TheGelatinousCube View Post
"Kindl Suprise" is good, but I'm still hoping for Jakub "the E-Reader" Kindl to catch on.
I like saying, "He read that like a book" when he does something good.

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03-26-2013, 05:57 PM
  #238
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He's turned the page on his early-career struggles. This is a new chapter in the Kindl story.

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03-26-2013, 07:00 PM
  #239
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He's turned the page on his early-career struggles. This is a new chapter in the Kindl story.
I like this guy.

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03-26-2013, 08:50 PM
  #240
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Originally Posted by The Zetterberg Era View Post
I am not really in that crowd you're talking about. But I have been wondering clear back to the Griffins during the lockout where Smith's top end gear went? This is the worst I have seen him skate since his freshman year at Wisconsin. I am assuming he did something in the off-season programming that hurt it a little or he is carrying some kind of nagging injury, hoping he can pick up some of the explosion I have seen from him in the past it is missing and I cannot explain it.
To be frank, he looked like a completely different player last year to me. I don't know what the deal is. Definitely notice the difference in skating. He was way more of a game-breaker last year offensively and looked way more mobile. I'm actually very confused by what could be causing the change myself.

I still have high hopes for the kid. Hopefully it's not a work ethic or motivation issue.


Last edited by Frk It: 03-26-2013 at 09:04 PM.
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Old
03-26-2013, 10:11 PM
  #241
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Andersson took Helm's spot. Pretty big downgrade.
Andersson is capable and will play as either 4th line center or as wing on a checking line.

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Old
03-26-2013, 10:52 PM
  #242
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Originally Posted by Frk It View Post
It's funny.

I'm a big supporter of playing the kids but I understand there will be growing pains and a learning curve.

Seems like a lot of people here want the kids to play and expect them to be finished products already.

That's not how it works with where we draft, and even our best players were not close to the players you see today when they first broke on the scene.
I'm still really high on Smith and see little value in evaluating his career potential so early in his career, but I'll say this in defense of others: I think people expected Smith to come in and commit the same defensive mistakes he has been...but at the expense of offense. I don't think anyone expected a player touted so highly for his skating, puck-moving, creativity, and offense to have 1 point and 0 goals through his first 20 games of the season and have a habit of putting the puck off the glass instead of making the outlet pass.

Granted, I personally blame Babcock for Smith's lack of offense/puck-moving.

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03-26-2013, 10:56 PM
  #243
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Originally Posted by detredWINgs View Post
I'm still really high on Smith and see little value in evaluating his career potential so early in his career, but I'll say this in defense of others: I think people expected Smith to come in and commit the same defensive mistakes he has been...but at the expense of offense. I don't think anyone expected a player touted so highly for his skating, puck-moving, creativity, and offense to have 1 point and 0 goals through his first 20 games of the season and have a habit of putting the puck off the glass instead of making the outlet pass.

Granted, I personally blame Babcock for Smith's lack of offense/puck-moving.
Kindl is tentative.
Some of it is orders from coach.
Some of it is that things move faster than he expects.

He's going to get a lot better. I just hope the Wings live through his mistakes instead of benching him and trading for bums like Quincey instead.

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03-27-2013, 12:31 AM
  #244
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Originally Posted by detredWINgs View Post
I'm still really high on Smith and see little value in evaluating his career potential so early in his career, but I'll say this in defense of others: I think people expected Smith to come in and commit the same defensive mistakes he has been...but at the expense of offense. I don't think anyone expected a player touted so highly for his skating, puck-moving, creativity, and offense to have 1 point and 0 goals through his first 20 games of the season and have a habit of putting the puck off the glass instead of making the outlet pass.

Granted, I personally blame Babcock for Smith's lack of offense/puck-moving.
He's not moving he puck badly though. He's just not getting the bounces. When you watch Smith, his offensive IQ is so visible. He reads plays very well. He's jumped in a few times and gotten a few good looks. Just didn't bury them. He also is pretty good on knowing when to pinch to keep a play alive. He's definitely going to start producing at some point.

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03-27-2013, 12:34 AM
  #245
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedWingsNow View Post
Kindl is tentative.
Some of it is orders from coach.
Some of it is that things move faster than he expects.

He's going to get a lot better. I just hope the Wings live through his mistakes instead of benching him and trading for bums like Quincey instead.
Assuming you meant Smith, Kindl isn't even really tentative anymore.

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03-27-2013, 12:38 AM
  #246
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He's not moving he puck badly though. He's just not getting the bounces. When you watch Smith, his offensive IQ is so visible. He reads plays very well. He's jumped in a few times and gotten a few good looks. Just didn't bury them. He also is pretty good on knowing when to pinch to keep a play alive. He's definitely going to start producing at some point.
One of the problems and it is odd considering that some of the other guys struggle to do it, is he seems to only work really good with Datsyuk as far as reading forwards. I actually think this speaks well to his hockey IQ, then again he has trust for Datsyuk to cover him when they are taking chances out high. Like others have pointed out I think this points to him being worried about Babcock.

He is just different for the rookies, Filppula has made a couple of backbreaker plays out by our offensive blueline this year and he didn't look like he wanted to crawl in the same hole that Nyquist did the other night. These young guys know their margin for error is much smaller than the vets.

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Old
03-27-2013, 04:16 AM
  #247
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I remember reading an update that the pain from his back is now affecting his leg(s). If that's true I don't think he's coming back (given his age and previous back issues), one more year on LTIR and then he hangs em up.
Sad way for his career to end and I'd love to be proven wrong, he is still (somewhat) useful.
My bad. For whatever reason I thought Bertuzzi was injured a lot lately. He should be a better winger for Datsyuk than Abdelkader.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Zetterberg Era View Post
Andersson couldn't skate at this level last year, he was woeful in his callup. I am happy he continues to improve there, plus they are finally using him on the penalty kill. When guys are that excellent at it in the AHL level I hate when they don't get tried out in that job right away. Will be pulling my hair out if upon callup Ferraro and Sheahan aren't used in that role. That befuddled me to no end last year when Andersson was up of course the skating could have played a role there. If he can pick up just a little more speed this off-season he is an interesting player going forward. If he cannot than there are likely better options on the horizon and he will likely lose his spot. Andersson and Lashoff try hard, but there are still serious limitations to their games at the NHL level. Andersson is a lot closer to sorting his out though.

By the way since Andersson seems to be up for good, can we please get him a normal number now.
To be honest I did not know anything about Andersson before he came up to the Wings.
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Originally Posted by Frk It View Post
It's funny.

I'm a big supporter of playing the kids but I understand there will be growing pains and a learning curve.

Seems like a lot of people here want the kids to play and expect them to be finished products already.

That's not how it works with where we draft, and even our best players were not close to the players you see today when they first broke on the scene.
I think Smith is a bit overrated on this board.

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Old
03-27-2013, 04:24 AM
  #248
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Kindl is 26. Don't they say it takes a long time to develop a Dman, specially of his size?

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03-27-2013, 11:01 AM
  #249
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Kindl is 26. Don't they say it takes a long time to develop a Dman, specially of his size?
I dont watch the Griffins, so I cant say what Kindl did or didnt do in the A.

But did he plateau there? Was he one of the Top 30 defensemen in the league for a year or two? (I would guess some of the Top30 are career AHLers)

If so, then he should have been brought along earlier so that he could hit his potential sooner than he is now.

BUT...

I dont know any of that. If he wasnt one of the Top30 in the A, and I know for a fact he has never shown **** at the NHL level before this year, then I have no problem with how the org handled him.

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Old
03-27-2013, 11:03 AM
  #250
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Kindl is 26. Don't they say it takes a long time to develop a Dman, specially of his size?

Ericsson is 29 now? We have two data points, so yes.

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