HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Buffalo Sabres
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Roster Speculation III: No, Really, What's the BIGGEST Problem?

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-08-2013, 04:49 PM
  #251
1972
Registered User
 
1972's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,113
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stop Winnin View Post
I don't give a **** about how many points our players produce if we win.

Just win when it matters and we could have a team of 50 pt scrubs for all I care.
same, the nices teams to watch and most consistent are the ones that get contributions from every player on the roster, MTL is a text book example of this.

1972 is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 04:52 PM
  #252
New Sabres Captain
ForFriendshipDikembe
 
New Sabres Captain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 38,770
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BUCKSHOT View Post
pretty sure that ship has sailed already
Wouldn't be so sure of that...plenty of examples of a player returning "home" after a stint with another team. Mike Grier being a recent example on the Sabres itself.

Unless you are referring to Tallinder's ability to play hockey...in which case I might agree. He needs to prove he can be healthy and contribute...which he's not been able to do.

New Sabres Captain is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 08:17 PM
  #253
TehDoak
General Zad
 
TehDoak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 18,103
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to TehDoak
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrigsAndGirgs View Post
Wouldn't be so sure of that...plenty of examples of a player returning "home" after a stint with another team. Mike Grier being a recent example on the Sabres itself.

Unless you are referring to Tallinder's ability to play hockey...in which case I might agree. He needs to prove he can be healthy and contribute...which he's not been able to do.
I have a shiny nickel that says Tallinder ends up wherever Ruff coaches next.

TehDoak is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 10:27 PM
  #254
SundherDome
Jhonas is an Ewok
 
SundherDome's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Minneapolis,MN
Country: United States
Posts: 1,682
vCash: 500
i want greg zanon. mainly as a bottom pairing defensive dman and well because of this.

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-pu...5838--nhl.html

SundherDome is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 10:56 PM
  #255
ZZamboni
Puttin' on the Foil
 
ZZamboni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Buffalo, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 10,567
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stop Winnin View Post
I don't give a **** about how many points our players produce if we win.

Just win when it matters and we could have a team of 50 pt scrubs for all I care.
Since when are any 50 pt. players ever considered scrubs? Not in the NHL they're not. In the NHL 50 pt. players are considered pretty good.

And since points convert to wins... The more guys getting points the better chance your team has of winning. Therefore points matter. That's nice you don't care about points players get. 99.999% of other fans do.

ZZamboni is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 10:58 PM
  #256
SabresFanNorthPortFL
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: North Port, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 1,788
vCash: 500
To add to the discussion....

I think Pomms could be a top line player on a winning team; and yes, he already has. I believe the issue is that when Pomms was THAT top RW'er on a President Trophy winning team, he was a complimentary piece. That team had two bonifide leaders in Drury and Briere and a guy like Grier also on the team. There is not a veteran guy on the Sabres right now (maybe Ott) that can compare with those 3, and by that I mean leadership, clutch and production.

Whatever you want to call it, when Drury/Briere were on the ice, they had a look in their eye, they directed traffic, they plain and simple led. Pomms is not that guy, and never will be. NOW, Pomms on Crosby or Malkin's wing would put up ridiculous numbers points wise and be probably Pittsburgh's best two way player. BUT HE IS NOT CAPTAIN MATERIAL ON A CONTENDING TEAM.

Vanek doesn't have it.
I don't see it in Ennis.
Hodgson the jury is still out.
Foligno and Grigs are too young to tell.
Stafford doesn't have it.
Myers doesn't have it.
Sekera doesn't have it.
Gerbe has it but is just too damn small.
Kaleta is a punk.
Ott's the type but I'd prefer him to have an "A" not the "C"
Ernhoff's play speaks for itself but I don't know about the vocal leader part. Good team guy though.

So my input is that Darcy assembled a team of individual skill but doesn't get what it takes to win. He has shown the lack of identification three times now in his tenure. 1. Peca. 2. Drury/Briere. 3. It's been over five years since they left and he has not brought in a character/skill/leader in to give the team that identity.

Epic fail by Regier. I hope with Ruff being outed, that Black/Pegula realize this and over the summer address it. We will never win with this core.

We will never win with this core.

I will also point out that this above post was written a few years ago too. Epic fail.

SabresFanNorthPortFL is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 11:18 PM
  #257
1972
Registered User
 
1972's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,113
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SabresFanNorthPortFL View Post

Vanek doesn't have it.
I don't see it in Ennis.
Hodgson the jury is still out.
Foligno and Grigs are too young to tell.
Stafford doesn't have it.
Myers doesn't have it.
Sekera doesn't have it.
Gerbe has it but is just too damn small.
Kaleta is a punk.
Ott's the type but I'd prefer him to have an "A" not the "C"
Ernhoff's play speaks for itself but I don't know about the vocal leader part. Good team guy though.
Hodgson has shown that he will be a very good player in this league, anyone who can identify talent will tell you that. Myers is a 23 year old defenceman who has been a top pair guy for us for 4 years and will only get better..but he doesn't have it most 23 year old blueliners are just getting a sniff of the NHL. Sekera is a realiable top 4 guy on a nice contract, steady player. Vanek is a top 15 winger in the NHL and has been for nearly a decade but he doesn't have it...

1972 is offline  
Old
03-09-2013, 01:17 AM
  #258
schpaff
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 217
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SabresFanNorthPortFL View Post
To add to the discussion....

I think Pomms could be a top line player on a winning team; and yes, he already has. I believe the issue is that when Pomms was THAT top RW'er on a President Trophy winning team, he was a complimentary piece. That team had two bonifide leaders in Drury and Briere and a guy like Grier also on the team. There is not a veteran guy on the Sabres right now (maybe Ott) that can compare with those 3, and by that I mean leadership, clutch and production.

Whatever you want to call it, when Drury/Briere were on the ice, they had a look in their eye, they directed traffic, they plain and simple led. Pomms is not that guy, and never will be. NOW, Pomms on Crosby or Malkin's wing would put up ridiculous numbers points wise and be probably Pittsburgh's best two way player. BUT HE IS NOT CAPTAIN MATERIAL ON A CONTENDING TEAM.

Vanek doesn't have it.
I don't see it in Ennis.
Hodgson the jury is still out.
Foligno and Grigs are too young to tell.
Stafford doesn't have it.
Myers doesn't have it.
Sekera doesn't have it.
Gerbe has it but is just too damn small.
Kaleta is a punk.
Ott's the type but I'd prefer him to have an "A" not the "C"
Ernhoff's play speaks for itself but I don't know about the vocal leader part. Good team guy though.

So my input is that Darcy assembled a team of individual skill but doesn't get what it takes to win. He has shown the lack of identification three times now in his tenure. 1. Peca. 2. Drury/Briere. 3. It's been over five years since they left and he has not brought in a character/skill/leader in to give the team that identity.

Epic fail by Regier. I hope with Ruff being outed, that Black/Pegula realize this and over the summer address it. We will never win with this core.

We will never win with this core.

I will also point out that this above post was written a few years ago too. Epic fail.

Fire Lindy!!

schpaff is offline  
Old
03-09-2013, 03:32 AM
  #259
jBuds
pretty damn valuable
 
jBuds's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: NYC Suburbs
Country: Lord Howe Island
Posts: 27,212
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darcy Regier View Post
Hodgson has shown that he will be a very good player in this league, anyone who can identify talent will tell you that. Myers is a 23 year old defenceman who has been a top pair guy for us for 4 years and will only get better..but he doesn't have it most 23 year old blueliners are just getting a sniff of the NHL. Sekera is a realiable top 4 guy on a nice contract, steady player. Vanek is a top 15 winger in the NHL and has been for nearly a decade but he doesn't have it...
One year and a half total

jBuds is offline  
Old
03-09-2013, 06:56 AM
  #260
SabresFanNorthPortFL
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: North Port, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 1,788
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darcy Regier View Post
Hodgson has shown that he will be a very good player in this league, anyone who can identify talent will tell you that. Myers is a 23 year old defenceman who has been a top pair guy for us for 4 years and will only get better..but he doesn't have it most 23 year old blueliners are just getting a sniff of the NHL. Sekera is a realiable top 4 guy on a nice contract, steady player. Vanek is a top 15 winger in the NHL and has been for nearly a decade but he doesn't have it...
And you totally missed my point.

It isn't about production, it's abut a combination of character/skill/leadership. Vanek IS a top 15 player...I agree but he is not, nor has he shown himself to be the guy to take over the leadership of the team.

Just as a FYI, there are guys around the NHL that took over the "C" under 25 and have succeeded, it's not about age, it's about what's inside, that drive, that winning attitude....Towes, Crosby, Brown, and then look at the reports about ROR...like I said CoHo the jury is still out but Myers doesn't have that leadership look, no matter how long he plays in this league. I guess I see Myers lacking confidence, lacking physical play, lacking a killer instinct, so I don't think he will ever lead this team.

Again, not slamming anyone for just "skill" level, I agree with you about Myers, Vanek, Sekera and CoHo but my assensment was about the intangibles that Peca/Drury/Briere/Patty Lafontaine brought to the team....I don't see a player on the Sabres that brings those leadership/winners mentality on the Sabres....indivual, complimentary guys.


We need a real leader

SabresFanNorthPortFL is offline  
Old
03-09-2013, 09:32 AM
  #261
Prospector74
Registered User
 
Prospector74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Hollywood, MD
Country: United States
Posts: 546
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SabresFanNorthPortFL View Post
We need a real leader
I agree a Mark Messier would be great for the team. I think Darcy has tried in that arena (e.g. Doan) but those guys don't grow on trees. The question is, has he tried enough/done everything possible?

Looking back over the past 2 years, what/who would you have traded to bring in a specific player that meets your requirements and yet left the team roster filled out with enough talent to compete. Curious to see if there were possible (and realistic) moves that we feel Darcy did not execute based on what he had available to work with.

Prospector74 is offline  
Old
03-09-2013, 11:34 AM
  #262
Stop Winnin
TANK ON BOYS
 
Stop Winnin's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Buffalo
Posts: 8,662
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZZamboni View Post
Since when are any 50 pt. players ever considered scrubs? Not in the NHL they're not. In the NHL 50 pt. players are considered pretty good.

And since points convert to wins... The more guys getting points the better chance your team has of winning. Therefore points matter. That's nice you don't care about points players get. 99.999% of other fans do.
Look at a team like St. Louis, a smart system with the right players that is executed well doesn't need a team of stars to be good. Their highest scorers had 54 points. They had the best record in a much harder division than ours. Don't tell me having more points lead to winning, look at Washington if you want proof of that. The past 2 Cup winners have been team's that have been a team that score by committee and play a team game.

So like I said, I don't care if our team is a bunch of grinders, if they can win important games then they can be tweeners for all I care. Sorry if that irks you.

Stop Winnin is offline  
Old
03-09-2013, 12:17 PM
  #263
struckbyaparkedcar
Zemgus Da Gawd
 
struckbyaparkedcar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Upstate NY
Country: Cote DIvoire
Posts: 10,634
vCash: 500
Yeah, I'd much rather outfit the team with competent depth and role players and create the proper foundation for our prospects to develop on than trade what talent is here and hope to suck more for top picks.

It's completely inexcusable that our checking center has played 20 games down the middle prior to this season and our "future franchise defenseman" was stuck with ****ing AHL fodder 2 years ago. **** like that is exactly why we are where we are. Well that, and Lindy Ruff.

struckbyaparkedcar is offline  
Old
03-09-2013, 08:31 PM
  #264
SundherDome
Jhonas is an Ewok
 
SundherDome's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Minneapolis,MN
Country: United States
Posts: 1,682
vCash: 500
Pomms for Yandle ... straight up hockey trade

then move leopold and others for picks.

SundherDome is offline  
Old
03-09-2013, 08:36 PM
  #265
thefifagod
I'm The Survivor
 
thefifagod's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 4,043
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanekTheMvp View Post
Pomms for Yandle ... straight up hockey trade

then move leopold and others for picks.
And why is Phoenix doing that?

thefifagod is offline  
Old
03-09-2013, 08:59 PM
  #266
SundherDome
Jhonas is an Ewok
 
SundherDome's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Minneapolis,MN
Country: United States
Posts: 1,682
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by thefifagod View Post
And why is Phoenix doing that?
top line winger, who would lead the team in goals and scoring. He brings leadership which they have in doan but might be a nice transition from doan to to pomms. Pho doesn't have a real weapon outside of doan. They have gormley waiting in the wings and rundblad as well. You trade from position of strength to address a area of weakness. And salaries are very close so coyotes are not adding much more salary.

SundherDome is offline  
Old
03-09-2013, 11:06 PM
  #267
enrothorne
A DJ saved my life
 
enrothorne's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Downtown Buffalo
Country: Germany
Posts: 2,522
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to enrothorne
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanekTheMvp View Post
top line winger, who would lead the team in goals and scoring. He brings leadership which they have in doan but might be a nice transition from doan to to pomms. Pho doesn't have a real weapon outside of doan. They have gormley waiting in the wings and rundblad as well. You trade from position of strength to address a area of weakness. And salaries are very close so coyotes are not adding much more salary.
Doan isn't that much older than Pominville. If they want to get younger, think 25 not 30.

enrothorne is offline  
Old
03-09-2013, 11:32 PM
  #268
drinking bleach irl
don't be so serious
 
drinking bleach irl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Country: Ras al-Khaimah
Posts: 11,434
vCash: 436
He's 6 years older. That's almost half a career.

drinking bleach irl is offline  
Old
03-10-2013, 12:10 AM
  #269
Imlach a cup
Registered User
 
Imlach a cup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,641
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by enrothorne View Post
Doan isn't that much older than Pominville. If they want to get younger, think 25 not 30.
In the time it would take Poms to reach Doans age we will have won the cup twice and burnt down Lackawana. Still don't think yotes do it unless it's for someone younger but the contract is good. They have any cap dumps we could buyout?

Imlach a cup is offline  
Old
03-10-2013, 08:41 AM
  #270
HiddenInLight
Registered User
 
HiddenInLight's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 3,014
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanekTheMvp View Post
Pomms for Yandle ... straight up hockey trade

then move leopold and others for picks.
Yes, make MORE holes on this team.

HiddenInLight is offline  
Old
03-10-2013, 10:25 AM
  #271
SundherDome
Jhonas is an Ewok
 
SundherDome's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Minneapolis,MN
Country: United States
Posts: 1,682
vCash: 500
I'm not sure we are on the same page. We are adding a franchise defensemen who is young to play on a very bad defense, yandle would add stability to a shaky core. We create a decent hole where poms was but having regehr, hecht, leopold all off the books makes it easier for us to take a run at a replacement like perry, semin, or horton.

SundherDome is offline  
Old
03-10-2013, 11:19 AM
  #272
tsujimoto74
Registered User
 
tsujimoto74's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Virginia
Country: United States
Posts: 9,280
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanekTheMvp View Post
Pomms for Yandle ... straight up hockey trade

then move leopold and others for picks.
Would rather target a solid defensive d-man than another puck-moving/offensive type.

tsujimoto74 is online now  
Old
03-10-2013, 11:19 AM
  #273
1972
Registered User
 
1972's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,113
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HiddenInLight View Post
Yes, make MORE holes on this team.
I am lost here, we have more of a need for Yandle than we do Pominville.

1972 is offline  
Old
03-10-2013, 11:32 AM
  #274
Sabreality
Registered User
 
Sabreality's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Atlanta, GA
Country: United States
Posts: 3,852
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsujimoto74 View Post
Would rather target a solid defensive d-man than another puck-moving/offensive type.
agreed, Yandles offensive numbers skew how he's viewed around the league imo. He has the worst QoC of regular Yotes D men. Not a guy you play against top players, or when the games on the line.

Sabreality is offline  
Old
03-10-2013, 01:35 PM
  #275
sabresandcanucks
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,801
vCash: 500
Guys,

Moving Vanek, Pommers, or Miller just for the sake of "rebuilding" is a sure way to become a Florida or Columbus. I am not adverse to moving any of the above, but it has to make sense for this team and involve bringing back bonafide talent. Vanek and Pommers are very good forwards and Miller is a great goaltender...It will be very hard to find replacements for those players.

We have too many players being asked to play roles they are not ready for.

Grigs should be in Quebec
Myers should be getting sheltered minutes, not top pairing minutes. To be honest, we lack a D man who seems able to handle any type of top pairing minutes on a consistent basis (maybe Sekera? I don't believe he has that type of upside).
Hodgson and Ennis are not ready to be top line centers despite their offensive flash.
Folingo, one could argue is not ready to play top 6 minutes

Vanek is an elite forward
Pommers is a very solid two way forward who can score
Miller is a solid number one goalie

Be careful you don't trade away your "sure things" for potential that may not pan out.

sabresandcanucks is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:45 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.