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Old
03-11-2013, 05:45 PM
  #76
TheRightWay
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Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
Neither is an exact match, but yeah, I'd consider myself closer to your first rather than your second list of possibilities.

I don't have to bend, buckle and break to your stereotype of what must be.
I don't have to be rigidly endorsed by some precedent you feel is required post lockout to be correct.

Second, just to demonstrate I am not entirely alone, let's look at the Chicago Black Hawks. Combination of luck and skill as to their plans. They won recently. Went for draft/developing. Had a good D corps which didn't kick on all cylinders and crap for G. Then low and behold, that horrid netminder is unbeatable, and the D is so solid, first round draft picks can't crack their line up.

Yes, they played for now.
But they ALSO took care of tomorrow.

I would have been correct on the merits with or without the corroboration.
But the fact is the Black Hawks, thanks, have provided proof bernmeister's way can be done, it does not have to be all 100% all eggs in one basket, cup or development.

Case closed.

Except that as for your below the belt remark about wanting to "masturbate", I'm reminded of that Billy Joel song, Captain Jack.


John Nash is that you?

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Old
03-11-2013, 05:48 PM
  #77
bernmeister
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Originally Posted by 16 To Stanley View Post
...
Quote:
Well to be fair to Bernmeister, the package he recommended would probably get you Kane.
Thank you.

Quote:
Gaborik
Stepan
Girardi

is a pretty absurd offer. It would never happen because it would gut the Rangers and we'd be back to being a non-playoff team.
We disagree there.
It's 2 steps back, 5 steps forwards.
After this year there will be help internally at C, maybe a step down, but still not enough to give up the benefit of EKane

Quote:
But he did propose something that WPG would likely do!
On paper, we both should.

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Old
03-11-2013, 05:49 PM
  #78
Che vy Teemuchuk
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Wow. Funny stuff. For sure, one of the few deals where Gaborik is the centrepiece of a Kane deal would work is one where Girardi & Stepan are tossed in. hahaha. Do we have to shake hands, or is a verbal agreement fine before sending off the paperwork?

But seriously guys, let this thread die. Gaborik is the least likely player we'll see on the Jets, unless we pick him up as wiley vet on our run to the 2018 Cup.

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Old
03-11-2013, 05:50 PM
  #79
bernmeister
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Originally Posted by Grind View Post
I agree
if yuou take out all the bizarre pick juggling and postma, i would call Gaborik Stepan and Girardi a big enough overpayment for me to sell Kane.
NO.

Now you are being greedy.
You throw in postma the picks and a throw in or no deal

unless
you want to keep postma the picks and the throw in and modify to take less than Gaborik Stepan + Girardi for EKane alone.

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Old
03-11-2013, 05:53 PM
  #80
bernmeister
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Originally Posted by goal1228 View Post
Bernmeister ... Your my Idol man!!!!!!!!
I decline.

Serve the Lord.
Him alone shall you worship, Him alone shall you adore.

That said, responding to your kind comment, there is a difference between adoration and admiration, the latter which I accept with thanks.

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Old
03-11-2013, 05:58 PM
  #81
bernmeister
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Originally Posted by 16 To Stanley View Post
Love how you choose to bold the part of my sentence that makes me look like an idiot, than ignore the part which causes it to make sense.

Fact is, Miller isn't ready to be a 2nd line center at this point in time. He's barely h andling our 3rd line duties and isn't putting up any sort of points right now.

We can't afford to trade Stepan for a winger. We have Hagelin, Gaborik, Callahan and Nash on the wing. We have Richards, Stepan, Miller, Halpern and Boyle as our centers.

I love how your argument is "Miller's proven he can do the 3 line center job, so why can't he do it on the 2nd line!" Worst logic ever. Brian Boyle has the physical gifts to be a 1st line player, that doesn't make him one.

I have the physical gifts to be an NHL player, doesn't make me one.
We disagree to disagree , no and I won't go on for pages about it. Let's just on it.

However, I must end with a Peter Falk 'Columbo' impression....

just one thing,

If Miller has the speed to play with Hags and Cally, does it really matter if Hags and Cally are our 2nd, as opposed to our 3rd line?

Thank you.

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Old
03-11-2013, 05:58 PM
  #82
Lundsanity30
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I don't care how good Kane is.. He's not worth Gaborik + Girardi + Stepan. holy crap.

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Old
03-11-2013, 05:59 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
Thank you.



We disagree there.
It's 2 steps back, 5 steps forwards.
After this year there will be help internally at C, maybe a step down, but still not enough to give up the benefit of EKane


On paper, we both should.
We should trade Gaborik our best goal scorer, our #1 RHD who is #2 at worst, and our soon to be #1/2 C?

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Old
03-11-2013, 06:00 PM
  #84
bernmeister
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Originally Posted by 16 To Stanley View Post
That is the worst ****ing deal for the Rangers. I truly think you're the one who was responsible for the black ages.

AND IN THIS THREAD, not in this deal, this THREAD, you have been open to trading those four players. Selective reading much?
What selective reading?
Being open to those 4 and actually trading all of those 4 are 2 different things, and in the end, it comes down to the return.

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03-11-2013, 06:02 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
We should trade Gaborik our best goal scorer, our #1 RHD who is #2 at worst, and our soon to be #1/2 C?
There is a planet on which that makes sense. Forgot the name, but it rhymes with Zoron.

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Old
03-11-2013, 06:02 PM
  #86
bernmeister
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Originally Posted by Dale Teemuchuk View Post
Wow. Funny stuff. For sure, one of the few deals where Gaborik is the centrepiece of a Kane deal would work is one where Girardi & Stepan are tossed in. hahaha. Do we have to shake hands, or is a verbal agreement fine before sending off the paperwork?

But seriously guys, let this thread die. Gaborik is the least likely player we'll see on the Jets, unless we pick him up as wiley vet on our run to the 2018 Cup.
Agreed, just remember the other stuff, including the pick this year.

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Old
03-11-2013, 06:03 PM
  #87
Seanahue
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Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
I considered my offer to be proper overpayment, massive enough to land a pre-elite, not beyond that to actually ruin a team.

There is obviously a difference of opinion on this with some of my Rangers brethren, but this should be enough and then some. If not, no problem.
The main piece in your deal is Gaborik who has 1.5 years left before he would bolt out of Winnipeg. The other 2 in that deal do not get you Kane and 1.5 years of Gaborik is not enough to offset that. If that's what you consider an overpayment, then we are way to far off to even continue.

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Old
03-11-2013, 06:04 PM
  #88
bernmeister
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Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
I don't care how good Kane is.. He's not worth Gaborik + Girardi + Stepan. holy crap.
Please acknowledge you're forgetting Postma, the throw-in, the cap advantage AND not unimportantly, the first round pick, which should be decent.

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Old
03-11-2013, 06:05 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Seanahue View Post
The main piece in your deal is Gaborik who has 1.5 years left before he would bolt out of Winnipeg. The other 2 in that deal do not get you Kane and 1.5 years of Gaborik is not enough to offset that. If that's what you consider an overpayment, then we are way to far off to even continue.
Wow, you may just be more insane than him.

Gaborik (Top 5 goal scorer in the NHL)
Stepan (22 Years old #2 C)
Girardi (#2, Top Pairing D)

for

Kane.

WPG says yes and runs laughing in our stupid faces.

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Old
03-11-2013, 06:06 PM
  #90
Kwayry
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Originally Posted by Seanahue View Post
The main piece in your deal is Gaborik who has 1.5 years left before he would bolt out of Winnipeg. The other 2 in that deal do not get you Kane and 1.5 years of Gaborik is not enough to offset that. If that's what you consider an overpayment, then we are way to far off to even continue.
Bernie, I introduce you to your long lost twin brother.

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03-11-2013, 06:09 PM
  #91
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The Rangers are not a cup contender for the next 3-4 years if they made that trade.

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Old
03-11-2013, 06:10 PM
  #92
bernmeister
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Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
We should trade Gaborik our best goal scorer, our #1 RHD who is #2 at worst, and our soon to be #1/2 C?
Please look at all of the return, objectively, including the draft pick.
Kane = Gaborik as scorer but adds speed, power, defense, like Nash.
We immediately get and keep Kane for less, more reasonable $$ moderate term.
That's a premium consideration of value

On the D everybody moves up. We recover Girardi's salary, we'll add depth soon enough.

Stepan is the flip side of young potential price you pay w/Gabs, who is the now, for EKane a complete package.

The return justifies it on balance.
It helps more than it hurts.

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Old
03-11-2013, 06:11 PM
  #93
Seanahue
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Originally Posted by 16 To Stanley View Post
Wow, you may just be more insane than him.

Gaborik (Top 5 goal scorer in the NHL)
Stepan (22 Years old #2 C)
Girardi (#2, Top Pairing D)

for

Kane.

WPG says yes and runs laughing in our stupid faces.
Winnipeg loses it's best chance at a 40 goal scorer who is signed for the next 5+ years for a really great scorer who would be gone in a year and a half and 2 really good assets. Realistically, Winnipeg is not going to win the cup in the next 2 years with or without Gaborik so he is essentially a lost asset after that. What we boil down to is Stepan (#1/#2 Center in Winnipeg assuming Scheifele dies) and Girardi who would fit into the #4 spot in Winnipeg on D. While we get those assets we completely DESTROY our LW position. Ladd and Kane work really well as a #1/#2 so why would we **** that up?

I am looking at this from the Jets point of view going forward with who we have drafted and what our organizational strengths and weaknesses are. Or I could just talk about how GREAT your players are if you want?

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Old
03-11-2013, 06:16 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by Seanahue View Post
Winnipeg loses it's best chance at a 40 goal scorer who is signed for the next 5+ years for a really great scorer who would be gone in a year and a half and 2 really good assets. Realistically, Winnipeg is not going to win the cup in the next 2 years with or without Gaborik so he is essentially a lost asset after that. What we boil down to is Stepan (#1/#2 Center in Winnipeg assuming Scheifele dies) and Girardi who would fit into the #4 spot in Winnipeg on D. While we get those assets we completely DESTROY our LW position. Ladd and Kane work really well as a #1/#2 so why would we **** that up?

I am looking at this from the Jets point of view going forward with who we have drafted and what our organizational strengths and weaknesses are. Or I could just talk about how GREAT your players are if you want?
Girardi a #4. LOL.

You are clueless brother. Even if you turn around and sell Gaborik, individually you'll get a sick return.

This would help your team so much down the line it's not even funny.

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Old
03-11-2013, 06:16 PM
  #95
Seanahue
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Originally Posted by 16 To Stanley View Post
Girardi a #4. LOL
Line #1
Enstrom / Buff

Line #2
Bogosian / #4

Who does he beat out?

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Old
03-11-2013, 06:17 PM
  #96
bernmeister
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Originally Posted by Seanahue View Post
The main piece in your deal is Gaborik who has 1.5 years left before he would bolt out of Winnipeg. The other 2 in that deal do not get you Kane and 1.5 years of Gaborik is not enough to offset that. If that's what you consider an overpayment, then we are way to far off to even continue.
That comes with the territory.
Gaborik has as much right to whatever his services command as anybody else.

He won't get Getzlaf 8 m +.
Barring injury, and the new cap constraints, he'll likely go for between 5.3m and 6.3m based on term and other factors.

I don't consider there to be any reason for NHL players to avoid Winnipeg, but you've got to pay the going rate, or trade that asset for upside.

PS you are proving my point. Gaborik at 1+ years is not as valuable as Gaborik "long term" although long term is subject to how much pressure there is with that salary because of diminishing salary cap available.

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Old
03-11-2013, 06:18 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Seanahue View Post
Line #1
Enstrom / Buff

Line #2
Bogosian / #4

Who does he beat out?
Buff.

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Old
03-11-2013, 06:19 PM
  #98
bernmeister
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Originally Posted by 16 To Stanley View Post
Wow, you may just be more insane than him.

Gaborik (Top 5 goal scorer in the NHL)
Stepan (22 Years old #2 C)
Girardi (#2, Top Pairing D)

for

Kane.

WPG says yes and runs laughing in our stupid faces.
Except this also works for us, has nice pieces and A FIRST

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Old
03-11-2013, 06:19 PM
  #99
Seanahue
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Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
That comes with the territory.
Gaborik has as much right to whatever his services command as anybody else.

He won't get Getzlaf 8 m +.
Barring injury, and the new cap constraints, he'll likely go for between 5.3m and 6.3m based on term and other factors.

I don't consider there to be any reason for NHL players to avoid Winnipeg, but you've got to pay the going rate, or trade that asset for upside.

PS you are proving my point. Gaborik at 1+ years is not as valuable as Gaborik "long term" although long term is subject to how much pressure there is with that salary because of diminishing salary cap available.
Why does Winnipeg take that risk when they can wait a few years and hopefully have a 40+ goal scorer in Kane who also plays on the PK and throws the body?

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Old
03-11-2013, 06:22 PM
  #100
Seanahue
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Originally Posted by 16 To Stanley View Post
Buff.
The #2 scoring D man in the league last year while only playing 66 games?

Not....a.....chance.

Also don't even start with the "He's fat and terrible at defense" because he has shut down those rumors completely with his play this year.

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