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Oldest Core/Team In Worst Condition for the Future?

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Old
03-12-2013, 11:13 AM
  #126
Rob Nieds work ethic
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Originally Posted by flyin_finn View Post
Devils.

Their both goalies are middle-aged, the leading scorer is 36 (Elias) and their top-3 defenseman (Salvador, Greene & Zidlicky) average age bit over 34 years.

Although they will likely continue pulling it off, thanks to their system...
The system of great scouting and development is working fine yes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingsfan2965 View Post
This. The only problem New Jersey might run into that Detroit doesn't have is goaltending.
We'll never replace Brodeur but we have Kinkaid, Wedgewood and Clermont. One of which should become our version of Jim Howard.


Last edited by Rob Nieds work ethic: 03-12-2013 at 11:19 AM.
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Old
03-12-2013, 11:13 AM
  #127
Honour Over Glory
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Originally Posted by Man Bear Pig View Post
Gotta be the Flames. Never understood what exactly their ownership is thinking. It really reminds me of the John Ferguson Jr. days in Toronto. Slap together mediocre rosters, don't deal away the best player while they hold great value, mediocre prospect pool, continually make playoff pushes when you really shouldn't be.
That team is such a mess, they need to do a full rebuild. That team is over due for one.

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Old
03-12-2013, 11:28 AM
  #128
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Right now its the flames but that could change very soon..

If Calgary continues to suck and manages to get Mackinnon/Jones/Drouin at the draft and a couple extra 1sts by trading Iggy and JBo, then all of the sudden their prospect pool is pretty deep.

Its all up too management in Calgary. It seems like an easy fix to me, they just have to start the rebuild now.

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Old
03-12-2013, 11:34 AM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Rob Nieds work ethic View Post
The system of great scouting and development is working fine yes.



We'll never replace Brodeur but we have Kinkaid, Wedgewood and Clermont. One of which should become our version of Jim Howard.
We'll give you Mrazek for Larsson....

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Old
03-12-2013, 11:45 AM
  #130
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Originally Posted by maddogmark25 View Post
Defensively, Philly has virtually nothing in the pipeline. It's why guys like Timonen are getting extensions.
I think this is the year Philly finally drafts a defenseman...

...unless a center drops to them.

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03-12-2013, 11:47 AM
  #131
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Originally Posted by Love View Post
Right now its the flames but that could change very soon..

If Calgary continues to suck and manages to get Mackinnon/Jones/Drouin at the draft and a couple extra 1sts by trading Iggy and JBo, then all of the sudden their prospect pool is pretty deep.

Its all up too management in Calgary. It seems like an easy fix to me, they just have to start the rebuild now.

This sums it up for Calgary. If they tank this year, they'll have a pretty solid core of young players and prospects.

Potentially: MacKinnon (or other top prospect from the draft, Baertschi, Jankowski, Witherspoon, Sieloff, Backlund, Gaudreau, Granlund, Brodie, etc...

The Flames will add to that by trading off Iggy, Stempniak, Glencross, JBo, Sarcich, etc... Probably pull away 1-3 1sts and a few 2nd and 3rd rounders.

As a Flames fan, watching the team tank for another 20 games really isn't that big of a deal.

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Old
03-12-2013, 12:58 PM
  #132
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According to this, the Dallas Stars are in for the worst future based on age.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...leakest-future

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Old
03-12-2013, 01:04 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by hockeywoot View Post
1. Calgary. Runs away with it. Though Sven was a great find. Having him in the system already

2. Dallas. Benn, Eriksson, Lehtonen are the pillars going forward. Have some okay prospects. Some will be NHL players, but really hard to bank on as being the future core. Dillon and Eakin are nice surprises.

3. San Jose. Have decent players already playing on roster, Couture, Vlasic, Braun, Dermers, Wingels. They have lots of valuable parts they can trade, should they feel they need to get younger.

4. New Jersey. Have some decent young players, in Fayne, Larsson, Henrique, Loktionov. Have some old core players, still playing amazing at their age (Elias, Brodeur). Might feel the "Lidstrom effect", once they're done.

To be honest, the difference between an average and below average prospect pool isn't even THAT much. Might be one blue chipper, or several decent prospects.

A couple diamonds in the rough or a couple busts, changes everything.

HFBoards effect. Sometimes your prospect pool isn't as good as you're telling everybody. Sometimes your prospect pool isn't as bad everyone is telling you.
Shouldn't the Oilers and Islanders be celebrating their respective dynasties/renewed rivalry?
10 first/second year players starting. New owner that will sign free agents. We'll be fine.

Signed,
Stars fan.

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Old
03-12-2013, 01:10 PM
  #134
Cursed Lemon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingsfan2965 View Post
We'll give you Mrazek for Larsson....
Eff that, Mrazek has potential. We need to give him some icetime.

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Old
03-12-2013, 01:18 PM
  #135
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[QUOTE=RandV;61461411]Honestly I suppose it's typical this being HF but the concept of 'having a team' is severely underrated here. Take 5 bottom teams loaded with top prospects and 5 top teams loaded with vets. 5 years from now, the smart bet would be putting money on things leaning more towards looking the same rather than a reversal of fortune. The NHL doesn't work like that.

So want to see something that will blow your mind?

Very cool! I noticed no one else has commented. No need to let facts get in the way of stats.

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Old
03-12-2013, 01:20 PM
  #136
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I'm looking forward to seeing what the Nucks will look like without the 2 Sedins. Not in a bad way, I'm just curious.

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Old
03-12-2013, 01:22 PM
  #137
Trafalgar Law
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Originally Posted by Bkennedy View Post
10 first/second year players starting. New owner that will sign free agents. We'll be fine.

Signed,
Stars fan.
Jordie Benn is going to be a Norris trophy winner...

Seriously, while Dallas certainly isn't even close to worst future, a lot of those rookies wont play very important roles with the team.

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Old
03-12-2013, 01:23 PM
  #138
Faidh ar Rud Eigin
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Originally Posted by Wingsfan2965 View Post
Prospect pool says hi.
No high end forwards, no high end defensemen. Detroit gets the benefit of the doubt when they draft prospects for whatever reason.

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Old
03-12-2013, 01:38 PM
  #139
Jurky
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Originally Posted by Faidh ar Rud Eigin View Post
No high end forwards, no high end defensemen. Detroit gets the benefit of the doubt when they draft prospects for whatever reason.
There may not be any blue chipers but there is plenty of potential "high end" talent in the prospect pool. Jarnkrok, Sproul, Nyquist, Smith, Jurco, Frk, Ouellet and others come to mind.

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Old
03-12-2013, 01:40 PM
  #140
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Hey now the Flames are one player away from contending.
It's sad that at some point in the last two years management believed that. Probably still do.

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Old
03-12-2013, 02:09 PM
  #141
jaems
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Originally Posted by Faidh ar Rud Eigin View Post
No high end forwards, no high end defensemen. Detroit gets the benefit of the doubt when they draft prospects for whatever reason.
Because they have a strong development system. People underestimate player development and overestimate draft pick position.

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Old
03-12-2013, 02:10 PM
  #142
Rob Brown
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Originally Posted by jaems View Post
Because they have a strong development system. People underestimate player development and overestimate draft pick position.
Agreed.

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03-12-2013, 02:38 PM
  #143
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Dallas comes to mind as one of them. Add to that a pretty bad D corps and yeah... I hope they do good though. I like them a lot.

Jagr, Morrow, Cole, Roy, Fiddler, Nystrom, Whitney and so on. + their D is ****. Average/meh prospects. Faksa and...? Campbell maybe too. Then what?

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Old
03-12-2013, 02:43 PM
  #144
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I love how everytime a team gets mentionned, 4 angry fans respond "NO WE HAVE GREAT YOUNG PLAYERS AND GOOD SCOUTING SHUDUP"

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Old
03-12-2013, 03:02 PM
  #145
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Originally Posted by CaptainCally View Post
Dallas comes to mind as one of them. Add to that a pretty bad D corps and yeah... I hope they do good though. I like them a lot.

Jagr, Morrow, Cole, Roy, Fiddler, Nystrom, Whitney and so on. + their D is ****. Average/meh prospects. Faksa and...? Campbell maybe too. Then what?
Ritchie? Strasnky? Chiasson? Fraser? This is why our prospect pool is underrated. Nobody knows half of our players, and it's not because they're not good. People aren't looking.

Defense is...a work in progress, but currently **** like you said. Dillon, Oleksiak, Nemeth, and Bystrom will all improve our blueline considerably. It will just take a few years to get them all phased in.

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Old
03-12-2013, 03:04 PM
  #146
Faidh ar Rud Eigin
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Originally Posted by jaems View Post
Because they have a strong development system. People underestimate player development and overestimate draft pick position.
Why? Look at their development track record since 2006? It's up there with the worst teams in the league development wise. They get too much credit for the 90s and early 2000s.

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Originally Posted by Dolph Lundgren View Post
There may not be any blue chipers but there is plenty of potential "high end" talent in the prospect pool. Jarnkrok, Sproul, Nyquist, Smith, Jurco, Frk, Ouellet and others come to mind.
What's high end talent to you? Top 6 forward or top 4 defensemen? Every team has prospects like these, whom just get less attention because they're not Detroit (Who apparently develops the best players in the world).

Out of those players, the only one who has top line/top pairing potential is Nyquist. Sproul is getting the most hype of all those prospects but in reality he lacks the defensive insticts to ever be a top pairing defensemen, and he probably won't be a big time producer in the NHL either because of his style of offense. He's a Cody Franson type player, a future. Brendan Smith just began his first full season and he's already 24. Guys like Jurco, Frk and Jarnkrok are solid players but every team has guys like them.

Right now, Detroit is kept afloat by their top talent, who are rapidly approaching their twilight years. They have no better a prospect pool than most teams, but Detroit will consistently get put into a tier of teams with far better prospect cores than them.

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Old
03-12-2013, 03:12 PM
  #147
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Originally Posted by Faidh ar Rud Eigin View Post
No high end forwards, no high end defensemen.
^No knowledge of Detroit's system, whatsoever.^

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Old
03-12-2013, 03:15 PM
  #148
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Vancouver may have the better team but their prospect pool is worse than SJ and Calgary.
Uhhhhhhh no. Corrardo is looking like a steal right now by all accounts. Lack due to surgery hasn't played but was a dominant goalie last year. Struggled at the beginning of this year but he was great last year. Schneider I believe will be like Price. We have the same situation as what Montreal had when they had both Halak and Price. Now look at where Price is...

Kassian just needs more time as he's shown flashes of his potential. I'm not overly upset that he hasn't scored in over 17 games, but he has done the little things right for the most part. Jensen was one of the top rookies in terms of goal scoring in the SEL and that was playing with limited amount of minutes. Gaunce is doing what we expect him to do and he's putting up better numbers than last year.

Cannata is another gem that doesn't get much recognition around here. A Hobey Baker nominee and he had the same coach that Tim Thomas. At the time when he was coaching Joe, he even went on record of saying that he is better than Tim Thomas in his development curve.

Patrick McNally was the PP QB for Harvard who also is looking like a good pickup at that point in the draft. Harvard's PP was clicking extremely well while he was running it, however he has been suspended due to 'cheating' on an exam (flame away).

Schroeder didn't get much of a chance to really display his offensive flare since he was playing 4th line minutes (which is why a number of people are scratching their head when we're struggling.) I would far and away take the Canucks prospects over the Flames any day. Remember how Jankowski is supposed to be the "best player of the 2012 draft."

Quote:
Originally Posted by praisealfie11 View Post
I'm looking forward to seeing what the Nucks will look like without the 2 Sedins. Not in a bad way, I'm just curious.
Personally, depends on what type of system we play. We could play a team defensive game like how the Habs and Sens are playing that works hard every shift, OR we could go out and sign a big name free agent at that point in time. Again, if we have AV here still, it's hard to say. I have been questioning his ability to trust the younger kids lately and that's the difference with Therrien and MacLean. Their trust in the younger kids just shows in their play where as with AV it's one mistake your ass is stapled to the bench. Both of those coaches seem to know the role that they want their kids to have as a younger player, where as AV has no clue. He put Schroeder on the 4th line and his the "big physical 3rd line checking C" still stuck in his head. It's really frustrating especially he gave Schroeder like 5 shifts with Kassian and Booth? It makes no sense when both players are more skilled and need a playmaker who can get them the puck not a Lappierre...

Like another poster said, the Canucks have a decent pool for where we have been drafting at the last few years. However, what they do lack is the franchise player that you can build around or a legitimate 1st line player. I liked how we started the season as they were playing the body more and really physical on the puck. It seems as though AV has gone back to his passive 1 - 2 - 2 which teams have figured out how to beat.


Last edited by The Kassian Train: 03-12-2013 at 03:27 PM.
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Old
03-12-2013, 03:21 PM
  #149
ThatGuy22
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Originally Posted by Wingsfan2965 View Post
People seriously need to read up on the Wings' prospects, because it's quite obvious that quite a few posters in this thread have no clue about them.
We have an idea about them, but they get hyped so much as future studs its lost credibility with me atleast. There was a good amount of time a year or two ago that Pulkinnen was your latest saviour, now he ranks like 6th. They have some nice pieces, but outside of Smith, Nyquist and maybe Tatar most aren't even sure bets to be in the NHL let alone impact players

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03-12-2013, 03:24 PM
  #150
Jurky
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Originally Posted by Faidh ar Rud Eigin View Post
Why? Look at their development track record since 2006? It's up there with the worst teams in the league development wise. They get too much credit for the 90s and early 2000s.



What's high end talent to you? Top 6 forward or top 4 defensemen? Every team has prospects like these, whom just get less attention because they're not Detroit (Who apparently develops the best players in the world).

Out of those players, the only one who has top line/top pairing potential is Nyquist. Sproul is getting the most hype of all those prospects but in reality he lacks the defensive insticts to ever be a top pairing defensemen, and he probably won't be a big time producer in the NHL either because of his style of offense. He's a Cody Franson type player, a future. Brendan Smith just began his first full season and he's already 24. Guys like Jurco, Frk and Jarnkrok are solid players but every team has guys like them.

Right now, Detroit is kept afloat by their top talent, who are rapidly approaching their twilight years. They have no better a prospect pool than most teams, but Detroit will consistently get put into a tier of teams with far better prospect cores than them.

If you think Nyquist has top line potential but Jarnkrok does not I think it's pretty clear you don't have deep knowledge of Detroit's pool, and are simply partaking in the age old HF tradition of stat reading.
Also I've witnessed the arguments you've had with numerous people about Sproul and Murphy and judging from your comments I'll take your comments with a grain of salt because you seem to be pretty biased.

That said, I probably won't be able to change your opinion and you won't change mine, so let's just agree to disagree.

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