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Are we in the midst of another epic second-half collapse this season?

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Old
03-21-2013, 05:59 PM
  #376
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Originally Posted by Rinzler View Post
I've been where you have been. I absolutely hated this team during the JFJ years.

If you hate this current team, then so be it, but let's not call out fans who like this group and the direction the team is going currently.

The Leafs are finally respectable again and are going to be a very strong team for years to come. That's the prevailing opinion around here. For now you are going to have to deal with it.
The leafs have missed the playoffs 8 years in a row and are 2 points away from 9th place.

You're calling that "respectability"?

Unbelievable.


Last edited by Epictetus: 03-21-2013 at 09:11 PM.
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03-21-2013, 06:15 PM
  #377
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This is hilarious. The same group that love to rub it in our faces with "we haven't made the playoffs in ___ years" are now telling us we should forfeit 2 or more contributors this year so we may get a chance at possible quality draft pick which may or may not help us in 3 - 5 years. Our latest and greatest achievement in the draft was picked 7th overall and took 3 years before he made an impact on this team.

You're agenda's are crystal clear now. Keep losing so you have something to argue about while your here and the length of time out of the playoffs helps your cause that much more. Amazing how the lot of you showed up during a losing streak but we're almost completely silent while the team was doing well.

Yeah I'd say you've exposed yourselves quite well.
Like I said, same group calling for a tank love to bring up the length of time out of the playoffs. Your act is getting old son.


Last edited by Epictetus: 03-21-2013 at 09:11 PM. Reason: QEP.
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Old
03-21-2013, 06:18 PM
  #378
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Originally Posted by hotpaws View Post
It's this short sighted line of thinking that led to Grabo/JML being resigned .

But lets be honest , if Nonis traded our UFA's a week from now you'll be on this board praising him . You're just a follower who doesn't have an opinion on this team except to defend/excuse every move they make .

Try thinking for yourself for once , you may just like it .
So a team that deems that important players should be signed is short term thinking? That just makes a whole lot of sense. You see, the thing is when you filter through all the noise here, you find posters who truly arent Leaf fans, some that feel the need for attention, some that find any reason to complain, and other that like to troll. Aside from that and others, there are actual fans, who enjoy debate and conversation about their favourite team. Your agenda is crystal clear, and as for having my opinion, this is indeed fact.

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03-21-2013, 06:44 PM
  #379
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hotpaws View Post
It's this short sighted line of thinking that led to Grabo/JML being resigned .

But lets be honest , if Nonis traded our UFA's a week from now you'll be on this board praising him . You're just a follower who doesn't have an opinion on this team except to defend/excuse every move they make .

Try thinking for yourself for once , you may just like it .
Your post is maybe a little more harsh/blunt than what I would go with.

But I definitely think this applies to literally like 50% of fans. Every single bad move this organization has made for the past 8 years has some silly excuse attached to it, and every positive move was the best move any GM made everrrr!

Every single season is the same thing. We're a playoff team! Because we added Raycroft/Kubina/Gill/Blake/Komi/Beauchemin/Kessel/Phaneuf/Bozak/Gustavsson/Connolly/etc. Make the slightest suggestion in any year over the past 7 that the Leafs probably wouldnt be a playoff team, and you get ridiculed for being pessimistic, not a fan, not objective, etc. suggest that the Leafs actually sell some players, and you get ridiculed as giving up on this season.

Well guess what, the deal that broughht in Lupul/Gardiner, the guys currently proclaimed as definitely a 1st line winger and Scott Niedermayer 2.0 by these people, were both brought in via a "selling" deadline deal.

Doesnt matter what the team does. They sell the future? Great! We just added a franchise player. We sell a veteran for something? Great! The veteran was a bum anyways, and the prospect we added is going to be a franchise player! We sign a questionable UFA contract? Great! That player is definitely going to match or exceed their career high!

Ever play that game Lemmings?

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Old
03-21-2013, 08:45 PM
  #380
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Originally Posted by MajorityRules View Post
Like I said, same group calling for a tank love to bring up the length of time out of the playoffs. Your act is getting old son.
He said that the leafs had reached "respectability".

I responded by pointing out that 8 years out of the playoffs and 2 points out of 9th place is not ANYWHERE CLOSE to respectability.
It was a good, fair, and logical point.

Has nothing to do with [what] you're talking about.


Last edited by Epictetus: 03-21-2013 at 09:11 PM.
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03-21-2013, 08:49 PM
  #381
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Originally Posted by 416Leafer View Post
Your post is maybe a little more harsh/blunt than what I would go with.

But I definitely think this applies to literally like 50% of fans. Every single bad move this organization has made for the past 8 years has some silly excuse attached to it, and every positive move was the best move any GM made everrrr!

Every single season is the same thing. We're a playoff team! Because we added Raycroft/Kubina/Gill/Blake/Komi/Beauchemin/Kessel/Phaneuf/Bozak/Gustavsson/Connolly/etc. Make the slightest suggestion in any year over the past 7 that the Leafs probably wouldnt be a playoff team, and you get ridiculed for being pessimistic, not a fan, not objective, etc. suggest that the Leafs actually sell some players, and you get ridiculed as giving up on this season.

Well guess what, the deal that broughht in Lupul/Gardiner, the guys currently proclaimed as definitely a 1st line winger and Scott Niedermayer 2.0 by these people, were both brought in via a "selling" deadline deal.

Doesnt matter what the team does. They sell the future? Great! We just added a franchise player. We sell a veteran for something? Great! The veteran was a bum anyways, and the prospect we added is going to be a franchise player! We sign a questionable UFA contract? Great! That player is definitely going to match or exceed their career high!

Ever play that game Lemmings?
Very good post.

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03-21-2013, 08:51 PM
  #382
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Originally Posted by Disgruntled Observer View Post
Very good post.
You're endorsement hurts more than helps.

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03-21-2013, 08:56 PM
  #383
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You're endorsement hurts more than helps.
Only to the apologists.

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Old
03-21-2013, 09:03 PM
  #384
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Might see the playoff in 2-3 coaches... This team has 9th place written all over it.

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03-21-2013, 09:04 PM
  #385
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Originally Posted by shakes View Post
Might see the playoff in 2-3 coaches... This team has 9th place written all over it.
They play like they have vacation plans in May and aren't sure if they want to be in the playoffs.

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Old
03-21-2013, 09:06 PM
  #386
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Disgruntled Observer View Post
He said that the leafs had reached "respectability".

I responded by pointing out that 8 years out of the playoffs and 2 points out of 9th place is not ANYWHERE CLOSE to respectability.
It was a good, fair, and logical point.

Has nothing to do with [what] you're talking about.
Has everything to do with what I'm talking about. If the Leafs miss the playoffs again this season, you'll be the first one on here screaming 9 years......but you want them to tank and sell off our UFA's while we're in a playoff spot.


Last edited by Epictetus: 03-21-2013 at 09:56 PM. Reason: Unnecessary.
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Old
03-21-2013, 09:51 PM
  #387
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rinzler View Post
I've been where you have been. I absolutely hated this team during the JFJ years.

If you hate this current team, then so be it, but let's not call out fans who like this group and the direction the team is going currently.

The Leafs are finally respectable again and are going to be a very strong team for years to come. That's the prevailing opinion around here. For now you are going to have to deal with it.
I never said I hated the team but my position is we should be building towards a cup team and not just trying to have minor short term success . I also don't think trading either of them will cripple our chances to make the playoffs this year . I also wanted Grabo and JML traded last year but heard the same arguments to keep them and now a year later it looks like they're 9 mil worth of wasted cap space .

I don't view either Bozak or Mac as key pieces moving forward and i'd rather sell them off then let them walk or sign them to long term contracts that will hamstring the team going forward . If people want to think i'm a pessimist so be it but I've had enough of mediocrity .

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Old
03-21-2013, 09:55 PM
  #388
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Originally Posted by hotpaws View Post
I never said I hated the team but my position is we should be building towards a cup team and not just trying to have minor short term success . I also don't think trading either of them will cripple our chances to make the playoffs this year . I also wanted Grabo and JML traded last year but heard the same arguments to keep them and now a year later it looks like they're 9 mil worth of wasted cap space .I don't view either Bozak or Mac as key pieces moving forward and i'd rather sell them off then let them walk or sign them to long term contracts that will hamstring the team going forward . If people want to think i'm a pessimist so be it but I've had enough of mediocrity .
And yet again, finding any reason to complain. If these players are so called wasted cap space, what should that cap space be used for? Is there a high priced player that can be a aquired now that is available? Not like the Leafs have cap space availale still.There will always be a player on every team making more than what their percieved value really is, and of course whipping boys for the fans. Thats par for the course, but to complain about cap space is just a reasont to complain, the Leafs have plenty of cap space available.

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03-21-2013, 09:58 PM
  #389
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Disgruntled Observer View Post
The leafs have missed the playoffs 8 years in a row and are 2 points away from 9th place.

You're calling that "respectability"?

Unbelievable.
Were in a tight locked playoff race, which other teams besides Boston and Pittsburgh aren't struggling right now? Grow up.

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Old
03-21-2013, 09:59 PM
  #390
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Originally Posted by New Liskeard View Post
So a team that deems that important players should be signed is short term thinking? That just makes a whole lot of sense. You see, the thing is when you filter through all the noise here, you find posters who truly arent Leaf fans, some that feel the need for attention, some that find any reason to complain, and other that like to troll. Aside from that and others, there are actual fans, who enjoy debate and conversation about their favourite team. Your agenda is crystal clear, and as for having my opinion, this is indeed fact.
JML has been sitting in the press box and Grabo has already been replaced as a top 6 forward .

I also don't see Nonis in any hurry to sign either Bozak or Mac so I don't see how you can say the team views them as important players moving forward .

A true fan wants what's best for the team and will look at the bigger picture . A true fan will also understand that players and mang come and go but the team always remains .

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03-21-2013, 10:04 PM
  #391
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What's the most discouraging is the team's deteriorating defense.

We were top 15 in GA for the first half of the season, our goal differential was through the roof, and our goaltending was solid.

All of those things have disappeared over the last few weeks. The GA has gone back to where it's been the last...I don't even know how many years now?, in the bottom 10 of the league. Our goal differential is still positive, but it's a much smaller margin than it was before.

And the goaltending has regressed badly.

We went from having two goalies playing at .925+ sv% to both hovering around .910-.915 now, and in their most recent cumulative performances they're playing sub .900 calibre, which is NOT good enough.

I don't know if this team has it in them to make a complete 180 and play like they were playing earlier in the season.

That 6-0 beatdown of Montreal seems like an absolute mirage at this point.

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Old
03-21-2013, 10:07 PM
  #392
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Originally Posted by New Liskeard View Post
And yet again, finding any reason to complain. If these players are so called wasted cap space, what should that cap space be used for? Is there a high priced player that can be a aquired now that is available? Not like the Leafs have cap space availale still.There will always be a player on every team making more than what their percieved value really is, and of course whipping boys for the fans. Thats par for the course, but to complain about cap space is just a reasont to complain, the Leafs have plenty of cap space available.
You're really trying to justify the Grabo/JML signings by saying we couldn't use the cap space more productively over the course of the next 3/4 years they're under contract for .

Maybe you can explain where we'll find all the cap room to sign Kadri/Frattin/Gards a goalie and maybe the odd quality ufa not to mention Mac and Bozak who you seem to want to resign .

Making excuses doesn't mean you're a fan . it just shows you really have a hard time understanding how a cap works .

I'll also add the raise Kessel is going to want .

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03-21-2013, 10:11 PM
  #393
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Originally Posted by Durrr View Post
Were in a tight locked playoff race, which other teams besides Boston and Pittsburgh aren't struggling right now? Grow up.
So you also share the definition of "respectability" as the richest team in the league missing the playoffs 8 years in a row and currently being a couple points away from 9th place?

Wow.

I often say that arguments come down to people defining words differently.
For example, you're confused and think the word "respectability" means "utterly pathetic beyond hope or reason".
Under THAT definition, I agree with you. The leafs have "respectability" around the league.

But you should look up the REAL definition of "respectability", and then you will see that you were simply confused.

I don't want to get into an argument about something when it's clearly just you misunderstanding a word.
Look up the correct definition, and the conversation can move on from there.

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Old
03-21-2013, 10:11 PM
  #394
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Garbage team is garbage. Won't make the playoffs. 9-10th place finish.

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03-21-2013, 10:14 PM
  #395
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hotpaws View Post
You're really trying to justify the Grabo/JML signings by saying we couldn't use the cap space more productively over the course of the next 3/4 years they're under contract for .

Maybe you can explain where we'll find all the cap room to sign Kadri/Frattin/Gards a goalie and maybe the odd quality ufa not to mention Mac and Bozak who you seem to want to resign .

Making excuses doesn't mean you're a fan . it just shows you really have a hard time understanding how a cap works .

I'll also add the raise Kessel is going to want .
Are you really trying to argue who is and isn't a fan?

If the team deems all those players worthy of increases, the room will be made.


Last edited by Epictetus: 03-21-2013 at 11:24 PM.
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Old
03-21-2013, 10:16 PM
  #396
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Originally Posted by 416Leafer View Post
Your post is maybe a little more harsh/blunt than what I would go with.

But I definitely think this applies to literally like 50% of fans. Every single bad move this organization has made for the past 8 years has some silly excuse attached to it, and every positive move was the best move any GM made everrrr!

Every single season is the same thing. We're a playoff team! Because we added Raycroft/Kubina/Gill/Blake/Komi/Beauchemin/Kessel/Phaneuf/Bozak/Gustavsson/Connolly/etc. Make the slightest suggestion in any year over the past 7 that the Leafs probably wouldnt be a playoff team, and you get ridiculed for being pessimistic, not a fan, not objective, etc. suggest that the Leafs actually sell some players, and you get ridiculed as giving up on this season.

Well guess what, the deal that broughht in Lupul/Gardiner, the guys currently proclaimed as definitely a 1st line winger and Scott Niedermayer 2.0 by these people, were both brought in via a "selling" deadline deal.

Doesnt matter what the team does. They sell the future? Great! We just added a franchise player. We sell a veteran for something? Great! The veteran was a bum anyways, and the prospect we added is going to be a franchise player! We sign a questionable UFA contract? Great! That player is definitely going to match or exceed their career high!

Ever play that game Lemmings?
Hindsight is 20/20 isn't it? Doesn't take a genius to critique every crap move this team has made in the last 8 years by using hindsight. The most optimistic of us could do that to perfection too. This team is 6th in the East almost 2/3 into the season -- what was your prediction coming into this shortened season at the 2/3 mark?

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Old
03-21-2013, 10:19 PM
  #397
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Originally Posted by Superstar View Post
Hindsight is 20/20 isn't it? Doesn't take a genius to critique every crap move this team has made in the last 8 years by using hindsight. The most optimistic of us could do that to perfection too. This team is 6th in the East almost 2/3 into the season -- what was your prediction coming into this shorten season?
What about those of us that correctly criticized the leafs EVERY STEP OF THE WAY for the past 8 years?
WE WERE RIGHT!!!!!
Are we just using "hindsight" at the moment?

Go ahead, look through my post history. Start 8 years ago.
i DARE you.

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Old
03-21-2013, 10:23 PM
  #398
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GO LEAFS GO..points in 3 straight games..bring on those big bad bruins..we're due to beat their ***** cant wait

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03-21-2013, 10:31 PM
  #399
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We are in the midst of a 3 game point streak!

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03-21-2013, 10:34 PM
  #400
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We are in the midst of a 3 game point streak!
Yes we are. I said we needed 4 of 6 here, and they did that. The hard way, but still, they did that.

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