HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > National Hockey League Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
National Hockey League Talk Discuss NHL players, teams, games, and the Stanley Cup Playoffs.

Datsyuk is the best 2 way player in the world

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-17-2013, 05:00 PM
  #201
StringerBell
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 10,000
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cursed Lemon View Post
...The phrasing of this post...

If you're saying "Sidney Crosby is a better player than Pavel Datsyuk," yes, and Datsyuk could arguably sit at #2.

If you're saying "Sidney Crosby is a better two-way forward than Pavel Datsyuk," hahahahahahahahahahahahahahano.
To me they're one and the same. Are Crosby and Datsyuk both elements of the set "two way forwards"? I say yes. Who is the better player in that set? I say Crosby. Therefore, via my definition, Crosby is a better two way forward than Datsyuk.

How do you differentiate between being a better "player who's a two way forward" and a better "two way forward"? The term "two way forward" seems to have a very loose set of criteria.

StringerBell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:00 PM
  #202
MFSorcerer*
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 382
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by deve View Post
he was among 4 teammates who had 7 points and 1p behind Toews. So it's clear to me that he didn't put anything incredible like he does under Bylsma's system.



and this difference is PP time.

7 game samples. Totally legit.

MFSorcerer* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:01 PM
  #203
MFSorcerer*
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 382
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by deve View Post
Well this is only sample of Crosby playing under Babcock's system.
Detroit system is not oppressive to offense but it's very different from vertical Bylsma's hockey. And yes west teams are more defense oriented.

So Babcock's system while coaching Team Canada is the EXACT same system as he uses while coaching the Red Wings?

Yeah. Totally.

MFSorcerer* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:02 PM
  #204
XLJ
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Country: United States
Posts: 1,363
vCash: 500
Datsyuk is the best 2 way player in the game. I don't think its even debatable to be honest.. The guy can dominate both ends of the ice. Just a great player. It would be sad if he is leaving after next year.

XLJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:05 PM
  #205
MFSorcerer*
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 382
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by XLJ View Post
Datsyuk is the best 2 way player in the game. I don't think its even debatable to be honest.. The guy can dominate both ends of the ice. Just a great player. It would be sad if he is leaving after next year.

PPG pace in his last 4 seasons isn't dominating at one end of the ice, IMO. For all his little tricks and dangles, he doesn't finish as much as his hype-machine would love to believe.

MFSorcerer* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:08 PM
  #206
Rob Nieds work ethic
Swarm it up Devils!
 
Rob Nieds work ethic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Lund, Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 9,637
vCash: 500
I agree. In my opinion he is the best player in the world and has been for years.

Rob Nieds work ethic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:08 PM
  #207
Semantics
Registered User
 
Semantics's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: California
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,714
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Syckle78 View Post
I don't want to make excuses, I really don't. But look at Datsyuk's line mates. One, Dan Cleary, is a human failbot who's best skill is randomly falling down. The other, Justin abdelkader, is a human backboard without any discernable skill. The guy has three goals in his last fifty games or so. I've empty netter and two where Datsyuk shot the puck in off his useless body.
Exactly. If those were Crosby's linemates, Cleary would be on pace for 50 goals and 2nd in the league in points. Datsyuk fails to make the players around him better the way Crosby does.

Semantics is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:09 PM
  #208
Mickey Mouse
Registered User
 
Mickey Mouse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: New Jersey
Country: United States
Posts: 1,351
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MFSorcerer View Post
PPG pace in his last 4 seasons isn't dominating at one end of the ice, IMO. For all his little tricks and dangles, he doesn't finish as much as his hype-machine would love to believe.
Wait...Crosby is a finisher? Then why are the majority of his points assists?

Mickey Mouse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:09 PM
  #209
Beau Knows
Captain Canada
 
Beau Knows's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,147
vCash: 500
Datsyuk is a good offensive player but he is only 2 points ahead of Kris Letang, despite being on pace for his 3rd best ppg season ever. There isn't a single player less than 8 points behind Crosby, and certainly no dmen even close. Crosby is one of the best offensive players of all time (4th all time in ppg) the difference is huge.

Beau Knows is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:09 PM
  #210
deve
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 51
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MFSorcerer View Post
So Babcock's system while coaching Team Canada is the EXACT same system as he uses while coaching the Red Wings?

Yeah. Totally.
Yes. In terms of assigning responsibilities, ice-time and line-matching it's the same.
Of course transitional game, forecheck and special team strategies was different due to different personnel he had.

deve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:10 PM
  #211
MFSorcerer*
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 382
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Nieds work ethic View Post
I agree. In my opinion he is the best player in the world and has been for years.

His defensive game is completely overrated if it is enough to boost him up to best in the world while putting up a PPG pace the last 4 seasons.

MFSorcerer* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:10 PM
  #212
StringerBell
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 10,000
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Syckle78 View Post
Why resort to juvenile exaggerations? No one is saying Crosby wouldn't lead the league in response were reversed. Just that the gap between the two wouldn't be as large, sheesh.
It's a meaningless argument. You can say Crosby wouldn't produce as much offense in Babcock's system, but you can just as easily postulate that his defensive game would reach new heights.

StringerBell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:10 PM
  #213
MFSorcerer*
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 382
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by deve View Post
Yes. In terms of assigning responsibilities, ice-time and line-matching it's the same.
Of course transitional game, forecheck and special team strategies was different due to different personnel he had.

So apples and oranges.

MFSorcerer* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:11 PM
  #214
DanZ
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Country: United States
Posts: 8,135
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MFSorcerer View Post
PPG pace in his last 4 seasons isn't dominating at one end of the ice, IMO. For all his little tricks and dangles, he doesn't finish as much as his hype-machine would love to believe.
He's a setup man, always has been.. and the past 2 years he was top 5 in scoring in the NHL before suffering injuries... wasn't the same after. This year's different. He has horrible linemates but is still over a PPG and I feel like he is heating up

DanZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:11 PM
  #215
MastuhNinks
Registered User
 
MastuhNinks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: The Iron Throne
Posts: 4,542
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cursed Lemon View Post
Boy, it's a good thing HOF entry isn't solely based on numbers, now isn't it?
Tell that to Eric Lindros.

MastuhNinks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:11 PM
  #216
MFSorcerer*
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 382
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mickey Mouse View Post
Wait...Crosby is a finisher? Then why are the majority of his points assists?

Because an assist leads to a goal which is a finish.

MFSorcerer* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:12 PM
  #217
MFSorcerer*
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 382
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanZ View Post
He's a setup man, always has been.. and the past 2 years he was top 5 in scoring in the NHL before suffering injuries... wasn't the same after. This year's different. He has horrible linemates but is still over a PPG and I feel like he is heating up

How many excuses does this guy get?

MFSorcerer* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:12 PM
  #218
Mickey Mouse
Registered User
 
Mickey Mouse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: New Jersey
Country: United States
Posts: 1,351
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MFSorcerer View Post
Because an assist leads to a goal which is a finish.
LMAO! Riiiiight. Good logic there.

Mickey Mouse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:13 PM
  #219
DanZ
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Country: United States
Posts: 8,135
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Semantics View Post
Exactly. If those were Crosby's linemates, Cleary would be on pace for 50 goals and 2nd in the league in points. Datsyuk fails to make the players around him better the way Crosby does.
not a chance. Kunitz is significantly better than Cleary and so is Dupuis. Cleary is god awful, he needs to get off the team.

DanZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:13 PM
  #220
PensFanSince1989
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 9,834
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mickey Mouse View Post
Wait...Crosby is a finisher? Then why are the majority of his points assists?
You realize he has a Rocket Richard, right?

PensFanSince1989 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:14 PM
  #221
Legionnaire
Kill! Jeff, Kill!!!
 
Legionnaire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: LA-LA Land
Country: United States
Posts: 35,484
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mickey Mouse View Post
Wait...Crosby is a finisher? Then why are the majority of his points assists?
Because when you are as talented as he is, you usually draw double coverage. And when that happens, that leaves a man open for a better opportunity than trying to beat two D-men - so you pass the puck.

Gretzky was well known for taking shots that would not go in but would be saved and redirected to a waiting teammate. I've seen Syd do this as well.

Oh, and Rocket Richard trophy.

__________________
"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics." - Mark Twain
Legionnaire is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:14 PM
  #222
deve
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 51
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MFSorcerer View Post
So apples and oranges.
No. I have no idea how you came to this conclusion.

deve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:14 PM
  #223
Cursed Lemon
Registered Bruiser
 
Cursed Lemon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Nashville, TN
Country: United States
Posts: 3,892
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Cursed Lemon Send a message via MSN to Cursed Lemon Send a message via Yahoo to Cursed Lemon
Quote:
Originally Posted by MastuhNinks View Post
Tell that to Eric Lindros.
It's also a good thing Pavel Datsyuk didn't ******* the league over by holding his drafting team hostage.

Cursed Lemon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:15 PM
  #224
DanZ
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Country: United States
Posts: 8,135
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MFSorcerer View Post
How many excuses does this guy get?
excuses? Guy's a PPG+ perrenial Selke candidate... He doesn't needs excuses, it's pretty commonly accepted that he's a top 5 player

DanZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-17-2013, 05:15 PM
  #225
Mickey Mouse
Registered User
 
Mickey Mouse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: New Jersey
Country: United States
Posts: 1,351
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Legionnaire View Post
Oh, and Rocket Richard trophy.
In a year when it was won with 51 goals

Mickey Mouse is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:50 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.