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Rumor and Proposal Thread Vol. 8: The North Remembers

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Old
03-23-2013, 03:39 PM
  #451
armandh01
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Originally Posted by Oilbleeder View Post
Consider how many teams look for top-4 D-man.

Paying a guy like Smid 1M more to keep him isn't bad. Cap space doesn't win you games, players do. With how hard it has been shown to add top-4 D-man to the Oilers in the past, a little overpayment doesn't hurt. Especially considering the gap idea means we take another step back. A Potter/Peckham replacing Smid for a whole season would be terrible.

No team is going to be perfect with regards to cap space, you just have to pick where you overpay. Considering how hard it's been shown to acquire top-4 D-man recently, overpaying a guy like Smid 0.5-1M to keep him isn't the end of the world.
It is not necessarily being perfect for cap space but it is using the capspace wisely. If we going to overpay for someone, it should be someone who can fundamentally change our D situation.


We sign Smid for 4.25, we still have N Schultz for 3.5 (assume Whitney is gone), that is 7.75 million for a number 4 and a number 5. I'd rather spend the money offersheeting Piet or Shat. Then yes every bit helps.

Overpaid players: Hemsky, Horcoff, N. Schultz, R. Smyth

We don't need more.

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03-23-2013, 03:41 PM
  #452
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Smid is the same type of defenseman as Brad Stuart who signed in SJ for $3.6M/yr. I hope the Oilers can get him for $3.6M to $4, but he could probably get more as a UFA.

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Old
03-23-2013, 03:44 PM
  #453
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Originally Posted by KlimasLoveChild View Post
As per Cloutier:

-Whitneys fate this season is tied to Smid's. If Smid is kept, Whitney stays. If Smid isn't dealt, Whitney goes.

I'm guessing if Smid is traded, Whitney stays or goes. I hope this clears things up
You realize Richard Cloutier is a guy from Boyle or whatever with zero connections, who is essentially an HF Poster, but worse, who has admitted to making stuff up.

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03-23-2013, 03:45 PM
  #454
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Originally Posted by Oilbleeder View Post
Consider how many teams look for top-4 D-man.

Paying a guy like Smid 1M more to keep him isn't bad. Cap space doesn't win you games, players do. With how hard it has been shown to add top-4 D-man to the Oilers in the past, a little overpayment doesn't hurt. Especially considering the gap idea means we take another step back. A Potter/Peckham replacing Smid for a whole season would be terrible.

No team is going to be perfect with regards to cap space, you just have to pick where you overpay. Considering how hard it's been shown to acquire top-4 D-man recently, overpaying a guy like Smid 0.5-1M to keep him isn't the end of the world.
This is 100% correct.

It's easy to say you're gonna let Smid walk if he demands $4M/season, but that extra cap space isn't gonna win any games, seeing as how he'd be replaced by Peckham or a serious overpay to get an aging, declining veteran (ie: Regehr).
For a team trying to establish a winning culture and start making the playoffs, losing your most reliable defencman, (a guy who is just hitting his prime, is undoubtedly a leader, and who will do anything to win) with no upgrade in sight is just plain wrong.

It's so obvious that even I can see it.

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03-23-2013, 03:46 PM
  #455
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Originally Posted by armandh01 View Post
It is not necessarily being perfect for cap space but it is using the capspace wisely. If we going to overpay for someone, it should be someone who can fundamentally change our D situation.


We sign Smid for 4.25, we still have N Schultz for 3.5 (assume Whitney is gone), that is 7.75 million for a number 4 and a number 5. I'd rather spend the money offersheeting Piet or Shat. Then yes every bit helps.

Overpaid players: Hemsky, Horcoff, N. Schultz, R. Smyth
If we sign Smid to that money and Whitney is gone and we don't add a top pairing LHD, then Smid and Schultz become our defacto 1st and 2nd pairing LHD-men.

If the Oilers bring in a top pairing LHD or re-sign Whitney (which I hope they do NOT do), then IMO Schultz has to go and Fistric becomes your #5 on the left side.

Money can work that way then can't it?

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Old
03-23-2013, 03:50 PM
  #456
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Quote:
Originally Posted by armandh01 View Post
It is not necessarily being perfect for cap space but it is using the capspace wisely. If we going to overpay for someone, it should be someone who can fundamentally change our D situation.


We sign Smid for 4.25, we still have N Schultz for 3.5 (assume Whitney is gone), that is 7.75 million for a number 4 and a number 5. I'd rather spend the money offersheeting Piet or Shat. Then yes every bit helps.

Overpaid players: Hemsky, Horcoff, N. Schultz, R. Smyth

We don't need more.
Smid is a #4? You realize on this team he's easily our best defencemen. He's a #2 if paired with an elite guy or an elite #3. St. Louis will match anything on Pietrangelo and I'm not sure it's worth giving up 3 firsts which is probably what it would take for Shattenkirk.

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03-23-2013, 03:52 PM
  #457
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Originally Posted by sundog View Post
This is 100% correct.

It's easy to say you're gonna let Smid walk if he demands $4M/season, but that extra cap space isn't gonna win any games, seeing as how he'd be replaced by Peckham or a serious overpay to get an aging, declining veteran (ie: Regehr).
For a team trying to establish a winning culture and start making the playoffs, losing your most reliable defencman, (a guy who is just hitting his prime, is undoubtedly a leader, and who will do anything to win) with no upgrade in sight is just plain wrong.

It's so obvious that even I can see it.
Bang on. This team needs more Smid's not less. He has the compete, heart and defensive shutdown ability that is the glaring weakness on our team. The only way he should be let go is if he's demanding north of 5.

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03-23-2013, 03:52 PM
  #458
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Smid and N.Schultz are among the bottom-20 zone exit defensemen in the league. One of the reasons our breakout is probably bottom-3 in the league.

I'm sure having Fistric/Peckham in the mix doesn't help in that department.

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03-23-2013, 03:55 PM
  #459
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Originally Posted by Powder View Post
If we sign Smid to that money and Whitney is gone and we don't add a top pairing LHD, then Smid and Schultz become our defacto 1st and 2nd pairing LHD-men.

If the Oilers bring in a top pairing LHD or re-sign Whitney (which I hope they do NOT do), then IMO Schultz has to go and Fistric becomes your #5 on the left side.

Money can work that way then can't it?
I'd rather N. Schultz and Whitney gone and have that money to go offersheet someone but N. Schultz was just given an A so I doubt they move him.

I'd offer Smid 3.75 at most. I like Smid but the cap is shrinking and that has to play a factor.

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03-23-2013, 03:58 PM
  #460
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Shocking how many fans want to pinch pennies with our best defencemen. Who's going to be playing against the opposing top lines if Smid walks? There is no one else even close on this roster to the shutdown and defensive ability of Smid. People describing him as a #4 defencemen are equally hilarious - on this team he's the best we have and it's not all that close right now(Schultz might make it interesting next season).

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03-23-2013, 03:59 PM
  #461
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Originally Posted by armandh01 View Post
I'd rather N. Schultz and Whitney gone and have that money to go offersheet someone but N. Schultz was just given an A so I doubt they move him.

I'd offer Smid 3.75 at most. I like Smid but the cap is shrinking and that has to play a factor.
Honest question (not trying to be argumentative):
What are the chances that if a team (say the Oilers) did offer sheet Pietrangelo that the Blues would let him walk?

5%?
0%?

IMO having an offersheet as your plan to obtain hockey players is just setting yourself up for failure.
It's like planning on winning the lottery to pay for your retirement.

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Old
03-23-2013, 04:02 PM
  #462
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Originally Posted by sundog View Post
Honest question (not trying to be argumentative):
What are the chances that if a team (say the Oilers) did offer sheet Pietrangelo that the Blues would let him walk?

5%?
0%?

IMO having an offersheet as your plan to obtain hockey players is just setting yourself up for failure.
Well both Shat and Piet of RFA at the same time, I'd like the oilers to attempt something clever is all I am saying. Yes it could fail. I suppose Smid is the only option, but man does this teams D suck.

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03-23-2013, 04:05 PM
  #463
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Originally Posted by armandh01 View Post
Well both Shat and Piet of RFA at the same time, I'd like the oilers to attempt something clever is all I am saying. Yes it could fail. I suppose Smid is the only option, but man does this teams D suck.
Lol. Can't argue there.

And I have no objection to trying to obtain a top-tier d-man. But don't let Smid go beforehand on the off chance that you might be successful. Because if not, our sucky defence looks ALOT worse.

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Old
03-23-2013, 04:09 PM
  #464
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Originally Posted by sundog View Post
Honest question (not trying to be argumentative):
What are the chances that if a team (say the Oilers) did offer sheet Pietrangelo that the Blues would let him walk?

5%?
0%?

IMO having an offersheet as your plan to obtain hockey players is just setting yourself up for failure.
It's like planning on winning the lottery to pay for your retirement.
Pretty much 0. There's no way the Blues wouldn't match on Pietrangelo. Shattenkirk would take an overpay that wouldn't be worth the 3-4 first rounders. I'm not sure what the internal budget in St. Louis is but they do have only 2 dmen signed for next year and Chris Stewart is also restricted after this year. I can see Shattenkirk possibly being available in a trade but it'd take one of our core pieces for sure.

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Old
03-23-2013, 04:10 PM
  #465
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Lol. Can't argue there.

And I have no objection to trying to obtain a top-tier d-man. But don't let Smid go beforehand on the off chance that you might be successful. Because if not, our sucky defence looks ALOT worse.
Well Andy Suttons money is gone and I will assume Whitney is gone so half of Whitneys $ is given to Smidd.

Then we got 1 good puck moving D.

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Old
03-23-2013, 04:20 PM
  #466
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Originally Posted by sundog View Post
Lol. Can't argue there.

And I have no objection to trying to obtain a top-tier d-man. But don't let Smid go beforehand on the off chance that you might be successful. Because if not, our sucky defence looks ALOT worse.
This to me should be the Oilers top priority...top pairing, minute munching LHD.

They have tonnes of potential up front and very limited potential on the back end.

LHD - J. Schultz
Smid - Petry
Fistric - RHD

The big wild card in the LHD situation is Klefbom. How far away and how much of a sure thing is he?

And when can the Oilers slot him in? I wonder if the best thing to do might be to have a stop-gap until Klefbom comes around if he's going to be in the top 4 in the next couple years.

Maybe you ride Smid and Schultz until Klefbom is ready?

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Old
03-23-2013, 08:15 PM
  #467
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Smid seems like such a humble guy, hard to imagine him demanding a huge contract or a trade. Hopefully he isn't the Smyth type who leaves it all up to his agent.
Don't they all do that?

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Old
03-23-2013, 08:24 PM
  #468
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Don't they all do that?
pretty much.

Smid isn't a goal scorer...so that should top him out at 3-3.5 IMO.

Maybe someone offers him ~4.5 as a UFA...then he would probably walk...no?

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03-23-2013, 08:29 PM
  #469
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Smid and N.Schultz are among the bottom-20 zone exit defensemen in the league. One of the reasons our breakout is probably bottom-3 in the league.

I'm sure having Fistric/Peckham in the mix doesn't help in that department.
Yup and they're also a couple of the better defensive dmen in the league. Smid more so than Schultz but they're both players that every team needs.

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03-23-2013, 08:38 PM
  #470
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Yup and they're also a couple of the better defensive dmen in the league. Smid more so than Schultz but they're both players that every team needs.
Nick Schultz is a $3.5M bottom pairing defenseman. No team needs that.

Agreed on Smid though. I think he signs for $4M

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03-23-2013, 08:40 PM
  #471
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Originally Posted by armandh01 View Post
It is not necessarily being perfect for cap space but it is using the capspace wisely. If we going to overpay for someone, it should be someone who can fundamentally change our D situation.


We sign Smid for 4.25, we still have N Schultz for 3.5 (assume Whitney is gone), that is 7.75 million for a number 4 and a number 5. I'd rather spend the money offersheeting Piet or Shat. Then yes every bit helps.

Overpaid players: Hemsky, Horcoff, N. Schultz, R. Smyth

We don't need more.
You would rather pass on overpaying a top 4 solid defenseman .5 million, so we could oversheet a better defenseman, have little chance of success, and overpay him 2-3 million if it happens.

I would trade for Shattenkirk and sign Smid. (might have to trade Smid + for Shattenkirk though)

A top 4 consisting of Smid, Shattenkirk, Schultz, Petry and maybe Klefbom is good

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03-23-2013, 08:52 PM
  #472
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Nick Schultz is a $3.5M bottom pairing defenseman. No team needs that.

Agreed on Smid though. I think he signs for $4M
Yeah Schultz is definitely not earning his paycheck right not, can't argue that. I still think he's a better dman than he's been playing though. Anyone who watched him in the past with the Wild knows that.

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Old
03-23-2013, 08:55 PM
  #473
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Any interest in Mike Weaver for this year and next 1.1m as a bottom pairing RD

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Old
03-23-2013, 09:27 PM
  #474
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Hall is 1 year away from destroying everything he touches.

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03-23-2013, 10:05 PM
  #475
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Any interest in Mike Weaver for this year and next 1.1m as a bottom pairing RD
He would be an upgrade on Potter/Peckham. He plays some quality minutes in Florida.

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