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Alain Vigneault/Coaching Discussion Repository - Part V

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Old
04-13-2013, 06:49 PM
  #151
jigsaw99
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Originally Posted by TallPoppySyndrome View Post
I was just thinking today that Pahlsson would be good to have at the moment.
o_O helllllll nooooooo

Pahlsson is currently a 13th forward in SEL right now for a reason.

not a NHLer and not worth line matching against Kopitar in the playoffs like stupid AV did.

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04-13-2013, 08:07 PM
  #152
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o_O helllllll nooooooo

Pahlsson is currently a 13th forward in SEL right now for a reason.

not a NHLer and not worth line matching against Kopitar in the playoffs like stupid AV did.
well things were a lot different on the second of April...

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04-13-2013, 09:05 PM
  #153
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Originally Posted by Sergei Shirokov View Post
AV <3's his Blender.
now don't get me wrong: if i were MG i'd have fired AV a long time ago, and i'd fire him right this minute if i could.

but still a part of me wants to say, you've got a relatively new center in the lineup, plus kesler pretty freshly back. if you can't mix and match in a mean-nothing april game against colorado with the division lead in hand, then when can you try things out?

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04-13-2013, 09:13 PM
  #154
Sergei Shirokov
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Originally Posted by vadim sharifijanov View Post
now don't get me wrong: if i were MG i'd have fired AV a long time ago, and i'd fire him right this minute if i could.

but still a part of me wants to say, you've got a relatively new center in the lineup, plus kesler pretty freshly back. if you can't mix and match in a mean-nothing april game against colorado with the division lead in hand, then when can you try things out?
There is no problem with mixing and matching.

But there is a difference between that, and putting different players out on every shift and on every line.

You need to give players time to show what they can do on a line, not plug them right away.

This is why I don't get his thing with Kassian. What does he expect from Kassian? To score? He gives him like 2 shifts with good linemates then if he does nothing he gest benched.

I just don't see how you can expect him to make a big offensive impact when you are moving him around from line to line all the time, and giving him half of that time (or more) on the 4th line.

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Old
04-13-2013, 11:02 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by Sergei Shirokov View Post
There is no problem with mixing and matching.

But there is a difference between that, and putting different players out on every shift and on every line.

You need to give players time to show what they can do on a line, not plug them right away.

This is why I don't get his thing with Kassian. What does he expect from Kassian? To score? He gives him like 2 shifts with good linemates then if he does nothing he gest benched.

I just don't see how you can expect him to make a big offensive impact when you are moving him around from line to line all the time, and giving him half of that time (or more) on the 4th line.
Well I'm just going to assume that AV has told Kassian what he expects of him, and perhaps he dose not expect him to make a big offensive impact, like some fans seem to expect.

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04-13-2013, 11:48 PM
  #156
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So it only takes 1 loss to revive this thread?

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04-13-2013, 11:59 PM
  #157
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Originally Posted by Sergei Shirokov View Post
I just don't see how you can expect [Kassian] to make a big offensive impact when you are moving him around from line to line all the time, and giving him half of that time (or more) on the 4th line.
You can't expect Kassian to have an offensive impact when he isn't skating. The team took a bench minor cause he cruised to the bench FFS. I would love to see Kassian succeed but he's never going to if he coasts shift after shift.

Kassian is playing himself (through his lack of compete) into the minors and that's not on AV.

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04-14-2013, 12:03 AM
  #158
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Originally Posted by LeftCoast View Post
So it only takes 1 loss to revive this thread?

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04-14-2013, 12:42 AM
  #159
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So it only takes 1 loss to revive this thread?
1 lost to the worst team in the NHL

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04-14-2013, 12:49 AM
  #160
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You can't expect Kassian to have an offensive impact when he isn't skating. The team took a bench minor cause he cruised to the bench FFS. I would love to see Kassian succeed but he's never going to if he coasts shift after shift.

Kassian is playing himself (through his lack of compete) into the minors and that's not on AV.
Guys have been 'cruising' to the bench on a change for decades. They dont usually get called and its his replacements job to WAIT until hes close enough for him to jump on.

Both AV and Kassian nor his team mates have any problem with his play. Its the Cody Hodgson fanboys who will rip him a new one for as long as he is a Vancouver Canuck. Regardless of how good he does or doesnt do.

There are still guys who secretly wait for a bad game to tell us how Ryan Kesler is still a glorified third liner .

Its not Kassian's fault he was traded for Hodgson. I would invite people to stop comparing him to the guy and just give Zak a chance to grow and mature into the great player he is going to be.

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04-14-2013, 01:25 AM
  #161
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Both AV and Kassian nor his team mates have any problem with his play. Its the Cody Hodgson fanboys who will rip him a new one for as long as he is a Vancouver Canuck. Regardless of how good he does or doesnt do.
But it's not just the Cody Hodgson fanboys that are ripping into him. Team 1040 was all over him today. Are they Hodgson fan boys too? He was sent to the minors, then Gillis tried to find a replacement for him at the deadline. Not exactly a show of trust.

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04-14-2013, 01:31 AM
  #162
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Originally Posted by vadim sharifijanov View Post
now don't get me wrong: if i were MG i'd have fired AV a long time ago, and i'd fire him right this minute if i could.

but still a part of me wants to say, you've got a relatively new center in the lineup, plus kesler pretty freshly back. if you can't mix and match in a mean-nothing april game against colorado with the division lead in hand, then when can you try things out?
Too bad he didn't do this last year with Daniel out. Instead he does it this year when Higgins is out?

Better late than never, I'll give him credit for trying stuff at this point in the season.

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Old
04-17-2013, 02:28 AM
  #163
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is coach av's system the sole reason that vancouvers defense always gets decimated with injuries. They get the puck in their own end and as soon as they release the puck, the opposition has already stapled one of the dman either to a crushing hit or so. Forget about the freak injuries and what have you

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04-17-2013, 03:49 AM
  #164
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is coach av's system the sole reason that vancouvers defense always gets decimated with injuries. They get the puck in their own end and as soon as they release the puck, the opposition has already stapled one of the dman either to a crushing hit or so. Forget about the freak injuries and what have you
The concerning aspect is that AV still hasn't figured out how to coach scoring against teams that play big, stifling hockey (LA, Bos, STL).

While I think we're good enough to overcome against anyone of these teams, they'll all be 1 goal wins in a long series.

The team needs to forecheck better and with puck support. Same thing on the defensive side, forwards must be back to take the pressure off the D.

If the results are the same (can't score and get ousted primarily due to a lack of offense), AV has to go.

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04-17-2013, 10:14 AM
  #165
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If the results are the same (can't score and get ousted primarily due to a lack of offense), AV has to go.
The questions shouldn't be "If the results are the same" the question should be "how many times does it have to happen before AV goes?".

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Old
04-17-2013, 11:16 AM
  #166
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Originally Posted by Wheatley View Post
Gillis tried to find a replacement for him at the deadline.
That's a little bit dramatic, don't you think? This team has eight wingers in the lineup every night (and has lost a $4m guy for the season let's not forget) so attempting to add one at the deadline isn't necessarily a shot across the bow of any one in particular..

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Old
04-17-2013, 12:45 PM
  #167
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Originally Posted by vadim sharifijanov View Post
now don't get me wrong: if i were MG i'd have fired AV a long time ago, and i'd fire him right this minute if i could.
So you would have fired him after he got his team to game 7 of the Stanley Cup Final?

That'd be a first.

Or would it have been before?

Of course the SC Finals appearance and the Presidents Trophies have nothing to do with AV. Only the negative things are things that he has his hands on.

Man people who don't understand sports always revert to blaming 1) the coach or 2) the pitcher/quarterback/goalie.

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04-17-2013, 01:20 PM
  #168
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Originally Posted by David71 View Post
is coach av's system the sole reason that vancouvers defense always gets decimated with injuries. They get the puck in their own end and as soon as they release the puck, the opposition has already stapled one of the dman either to a crushing hit or so. Forget about the freak injuries and what have you
This couldn't be more wrong.

How many Cnauck D injuries have been due to this type of play over the years?

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Old
04-17-2013, 02:56 PM
  #169
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How does AV think "for the most part we responded well" last night.

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Old
04-17-2013, 03:05 PM
  #170
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Our defence corp has been pretty regular decimated throughout the years, so I'm not sure how you can say that it's completely wrong.

At worst, the supposition that AV's system causes injuries on the back end is debatable.

You're doing the exact same thing as the people you are chastising except in the opposite direction - you're completely dismissing what other have said about the situation. You just happen to be doing so in a way that absolves AV. They are condemning him.

Most of the evidence points towards it having some grain of truth - for example, both Ballard and Hamhuis were brought in because they were relatively injury free but both got injured as soon as they got here. Bieksa hasn't had a full season of play in four years.

As for AV's success, of course it is commendable. But he has his flaws, especially in the playoffs. And the attitude that this team has played with in the past two season to me is a cause for concern. I personally would have fired him as soon as they exited early last year.

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Old
04-17-2013, 06:40 PM
  #171
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This couldn't be more wrong.

How many Cnauck D injuries have been due to this type of play over the years?
it has happened alot. hamhuis/mitchell/ballard list goes on. his system puts pressure on his defenseman that gets put in a vulnerable position to take a hit to make a play. which results in injuries. none of the the dman can rush the puck up to avoid this.

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04-17-2013, 06:51 PM
  #172
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Bieksa hasn't had a full season of play in four years.
The bulk of that time off was from freak injuries independant of the way/style the Canucks employ.

edit: feel weird kind of defending Bieksa lately....

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Old
04-17-2013, 08:45 PM
  #173
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it has happened alot. hamhuis/mitchell/ballard list goes on. his system puts pressure on his defenseman that gets put in a vulnerable position to take a hit to make a play. which results in injuries. none of the the dman can rush the puck up to avoid this.
The less you rush the puck, the less hits you take...

AV asks our D-men to move the puck quickly to help save some hits. He also asks them to make a play with the puck rather than banging it off the boards which is going make you prone to more hits. Other than Tanev I don't really remember anyone taking big hits?

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Old
04-17-2013, 08:51 PM
  #174
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alot of the injuries to d-men were fluke instances that have nothing to do with coaching

however it's absolutely the case that bowness forces his d-men to absorb alot of unnecessary punishment by forcing them to wait until the forwards are available for a stretch pass and that leads to alot of poor decision-making late in games

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Old
04-18-2013, 11:21 PM
  #175
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when it comes to AV, I've been quiet up till now...

but...



Honestly? I've wanted him gone since the first meltdown vs Chicago, those years ago...

no accountability
brain-dead coaching
never any in game adjustments
love for his scrubs


Last edited by -TYC-: 04-18-2013 at 11:27 PM.
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