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Trade Deadline: Who will we see in red? (Part 2) (MOD warning #661)

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Old
04-02-2013, 05:48 PM
  #626
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Originally Posted by Henkka View Post
But he does. Franzen _does_ provide more goals per buck since 2009. I didn't even took those Franzen's best seasons (07-08 & 0809) in count. I'm not saying he is the better overall player, but last time I heard, goalscoring is pretty big thing in hockey.

Whole point was just give some perspective for this ridiculous discussion, how people in here are bashing our own players and praising others with this "grass is always greener on the other side" & "Holland picked the wrong guy" -mentality.
Nobody even bothers arguing that Franzen was better than Hossa anymore.

Time to let it go

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04-02-2013, 05:50 PM
  #627
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Pominville has submitted a list of 8 teams he would accept a trade to. I don't know if we are one of them but he is a guy I'd love to get. Right-handed winger who can play in all situations and has put up numbers in terms of both goals and points in the past. Plus he brings leadership and wore the C in Buffalo.
Should we hate the re-alignment?

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04-02-2013, 05:52 PM
  #628
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Should we hate the re-alignment?
I wonder if we are one of the teams on the list? Maybe we're not just because of the re-alignment.

If not he would be a great addition to our team in my opinion.

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04-02-2013, 05:52 PM
  #629
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Holland wouldn't know what to do if someone put a top 6 winger on the block anyways. Lowball and be surprised when they take a team's better package of prospects/picks.

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04-02-2013, 05:53 PM
  #630
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I know hes older, but would anybody be interested in a 2nd or a mid prospect for Tanguay? The way Feaster is going full ****** he probably wont be expensive and could help as a stopgap while Jarncrok and co develop. Could make losing Filppula expendable too


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04-02-2013, 05:53 PM
  #631
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Wasn't that article just from buyers view? I'm not expecting to trade for anybody, I expect them just sell White and some forward.

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04-02-2013, 05:54 PM
  #632
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I know hes older, but would anybody be interested in a 2nd or a mid prospect for Tanguay? The way feaster is going full ****** he probably wont be expensive and could help as a stopgap
I might. But you could have him for a 6th. You're dealing with Feaster, after all.

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04-02-2013, 05:55 PM
  #633
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Originally Posted by redwingsnow View Post
franzen

hossa
drink!

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Old
04-02-2013, 05:56 PM
  #634
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I know hes older, but would anybody be interested in a 2nd or a mid prospect for Tanguay? The way feaster is going full ****** he probably wont be expensive and could help as a stopgap
Don't see the point. Then we would not only be metaphorically becoming Calgary, but literally too.

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04-02-2013, 05:56 PM
  #635
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It makes 0 sense for us not to try Ian White by tomorrow. Absolutely zero. Unless we hate acquiring easy assets. Or we want to keep 20 defensemen.

Honestly I'll be pissed if he's not traded for at least a 2nd.

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04-02-2013, 05:57 PM
  #636
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Originally Posted by EZBAKE View Post
I know hes older, but would anybody be interested in a 2nd or a mid prospect for Tanguay? The way feaster is going full ****** he probably wont be expensive and could help as a stopgap
Rather see Nyquist or Tatar play in the top 9.

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04-02-2013, 06:00 PM
  #637
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I know hes older, but would anybody be interested in a 2nd or a mid prospect for Tanguay? The way feaster is going full ****** he probably wont be expensive and could help as a stopgap
No chance.

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04-02-2013, 06:03 PM
  #638
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Why is Bert retiring tomorrow if it wasn't to help the Wings contract situation? Unless they then take the full hit now this season using up the cap space the Wings have and Holland isn't going to use ie add via trades.

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04-02-2013, 06:03 PM
  #639
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It is a delicate balance that Holland, and every GM is trying to maintain - "Improve their team but not at the expense of their future".

Making a move for a move sake isn't going to help us.

We are most certainly not in the conversation for a potential Cup run - but as the Kings proved, anything is certainly possible when the playoffs start. How many times have we all seen an abnormal performance from a confident high goaltender lead a team deep into the playoffs? It doesn't take much for a team to believe and to do some damage. There is still enough experience and talent in our core, that given the right conditions could make an impact in the playoffs. Any redundant players we have at this point aren't really going to be valuable to another team if at all, and those that have real tangible value would jeopardize our chances of making the playoffs or worse hurt us in the playoffs.

That being said, if there isn't a suitable pick up (Top 6 forward, Top 4 Defenseman) at a reasonable price, why mortgage our picks and prospects, the lifeblood of any organization to pick up a mediocre addition at this point? We already have too many skaters as it is to find suitable playtime for all of them now.

The best case scenario is to remain patient, maintain our salary flexibility for next season, slowly rotate choice prospects into the line up (which we are doing whether or not you believe they are getting enough time or not), and hope we make the playoffs.

It's a different world when playoffs begin...

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04-02-2013, 06:05 PM
  #640
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I definitely agree with a lot of what you've said. A lot of this decline simply has to do with the salary cap and aging players. However, Holland has tried, and more importantly failed, to improve the team multiple times. Trying only gets you so far.

- Summer 2009: You said it, signing Franzen instead of Hossa. Obviously this is clearer in hindsight, but many people thought Hossa was the one to keep. Hell, they could've kept both and traded away some of the "depth" players to make room.
No, they couldn't have. Others have gone through Cap geek to determine that it was impossible to keep both and ice a full 25 man roster.


Quote:
- Summer 2011: swings and misses on Burns, Jovanovski, Fleischmann, and (thankfully) Upshall. Decides it isn't worth it to pursue Jagr or Ehrhoff. Signs Ty Conklin, who has nothing left in the tank. White's a decent band-aid, would've rather seen Smith develop.
Are you serious? First off, how did he swing and miss on Burns? There were NO reports that Holland was in on Burns. None. There were no indications, as far as I could tell that the Sharks were going to make those moves in the first place. Is Ken Holland supposed to know every trade that is about to happen? It was just Babcock being ticked off that they weren't able to make a move.

In any case, you have got to be joking when you use Jovanovski as someone whom Holland should have signed. They weren't going to sign those guys, because they were being massively overpayed. If Holland had signed those guys to equal term and dollar, we'd all have been calling for his his head.

Quote:
- Deadline 2012: trades a first for Quincey, an inadequate replacement for the guy he was brought in to replace.
Debatable, but that was the going price, and we were buyers looking to make a move to contend.
Quote:
- Summer 2012: swings and misses on Suter, Parise,
They weren't coming to Detroit. They were never coming to Detroit.
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Salo, and Nash.
These moves never really existed. Signs Samuelsson, Gustavsson, and Colaiacovo, who have all been disappointments. Tootoo was a good move. Doesn't go for Semin, who Carolina ends up signing to a five-year extension.

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- Deadline 2013: doesn't up the ante for Bouwmeester, a guy who is 29 years old and might've been their best defenseman.
No. He would not be our best defensman. Don't even insinuate such nonsense.
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Derek Roy wouldn't have been a bad move, considering he's 29 years old and Datsyuk will likely leave soon.
Datsyuk leaving is just a rumor at this point, and there's no point in going after a rental with the state the team is in. That would be a stupid move.
Quote:
Doesn't appear to be willing to sell any of the veterans they do have,
Some are on the IR, the rest are the last of depth we have at forward. But in anycase, I thought you wanted this team to get better? Do you want to sell or buy? Make up your mind. You can't have it both ways.
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leaving no room for the young players to develop.
BS. You just don't want to wait until they come up. They'll come up. They have come up.

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All the while, he's been signing and re-signing guys like Holmstrom, Bertuzzi, Eaves, Miller, Colaiacovo, and Samuelsson to two-year deals instead of giving prospects real NHL time. We'll be able to add Cleary to that list this summer.
Aside from Samuelsson, whose value is impossible to gauge right now since he's been on the IR for the whole season, every one of those guys have played an important and invaluable role on this team. Yes, even Cleary.

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04-02-2013, 06:05 PM
  #641
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Don't see the point. Then we would not only be metaphorically becoming Calgary, but literally too.
I just figured he'd help just as much as a guy like Pominville would right now and would help the post Datsyuk transition period while we wait for Jarncrok and co to develop. Since we're not going the tank route I feel like he could be a cheaper alternative to Filppula next year.

Then again I always felt Tanguay was criminally underrated. Maybe more than he really is.

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04-02-2013, 06:06 PM
  #642
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yah KH should be done allright

how do you as a GM say you're done without even starting to try and improve your pro-sports franchise?

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04-02-2013, 06:07 PM
  #643
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Why is Bert retiring tomorrow if it wasn't to help the Wings contract situation? Unless they then take the full hit now this season using up the cap space the Wings have and Holland isn't going to use ie add via trades.
Wasn't that April fools? And there was was talk Bertuzzi could come back in two weeks.

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04-02-2013, 06:07 PM
  #644
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Just a heads up, I'll bet my life savings Bert is retiring tomorrow. My uncle knows a close friend of his...
Well not that we did not see this coming! but if true good luck to him back problems can be a very bad thing. this makes me wonder about Helm as well, they can not find out what is going on with his back either. Kenny will still stand pat with I like our team, we kicked some tires, money was not right "AKA" he would not take the D discount to play here!

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04-02-2013, 06:08 PM
  #645
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Just trade White already, will ya?

http://blogs.windsorstar.com/2013/04...fore-deadline/

.....

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04-02-2013, 06:10 PM
  #646
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They weren't coming to Detroit. They were never coming to Detroit.
Parise was never coming to Detroit, but Suter might be a different story. None of us can read minds, but it certainly seemed like he was strongly considering Detroit.

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04-02-2013, 06:11 PM
  #647
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Wasn't that April fools? And there was was talk Bertuzzi could come back in two weeks.
I dunno. It was posted earlier today, not an hour ago in this thread.

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04-02-2013, 06:12 PM
  #648
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Huskins for a 7th was our big deadline move - what else needs to be done?

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04-02-2013, 06:13 PM
  #649
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Originally Posted by JmanWingsFan View Post
In any case, you have got to be joking when you use Jovanovski as someone whom Holland should have signed. They weren't going to sign those guys, because they were being massively overpayed. If Holland had signed those guys to equal term and dollar, we'd all have been calling for his his head.
Not saying I would've liked Jovanovski, but Holland wanted him and didn't get him -- a pretty common occurrence over the past five years.

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They were never coming to Detroit.
Oh, okay.

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These moves never really existed.
Oh, okay.

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No. He would not be our best defensman. Don't even insinuate such nonsense.
Oh, okay. Second-best defenseman. By a long shot. Don't pretend like Kronwall is light years ahead of him.

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Datsyuk leaving is just a rumor at this point, and there's no point in going after a rental with the state the team is in. That would be a stupid move.
It's pretty common for teams to re-sign guys they acquire at the deadline. Especially guys under 30.

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Some are on the IR, the rest are the last of depth we have at forward. But in anycase, I thought you wanted this team to get better? Do you want to sell or buy? Make up your mind. You can't have it both ways.
The team can deal Cleary/Eaves/Miller and White and be exactly the same. Look at San Jose. They have it both ways. They're trimming fat but staying competitive.

Quote:
BS. You just don't want to wait until they come up. They'll come up. They have come up.
Explain why it makes more sense to have Cleary/Abdelkader/Miller/Eaves/etc. ahead of Tatar and Nyquist on the depth chart. They've only come up because of the ridiculous number of injuries the team has suffered.

Quote:
Aside from Samuelsson, whose value is impossible to gauge right now since he's been on the IR for the whole season, every one of those guys have played an important and invaluable role on this team. Yes, even Cleary.
Oh, okay.



You really don't think


Last edited by Ricelund: 04-02-2013 at 06:21 PM.
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Old
04-02-2013, 06:13 PM
  #650
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The best case scenario is to remain patient, maintain our salary flexibility for next season, slowly rotate choice prospects into the line up (which we are doing whether or not you believe they are getting enough time or not), and hope we make the playoffs.
But I want stuff to happen nowwwwwwwwww.

Seriously though, you're right and that's probably what will happen. And it's going to drive people insane who are banging on the desk for change.

I wouldn't mind a shakeup trade for a player of significance in his late 20s or early 30s (Vanek, Gaborik, etc), but other than that, I think the Wings need to keep the course with their player development, let the old guys phase out, and bring in the home grown talent slowly over time so they don't become an Edmonton Oilers sideshow of lottery picks.

Unless you're into that sort of thing. I'm not, but some folks seem to think unless you are in the running for the Cup, you should be collecting lottery picks. Eh, okay.

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