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Roster Speculation Part V: Report - Pominville asked for his NTC list of 8

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04-01-2013, 07:14 PM
  #201
Sabresfansince1980
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OK, and WHAT a difference it's made!!! On and off ice.

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04-01-2013, 07:16 PM
  #202
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bucky Gleason View Post
Derek Roy properly used as a 2nd line center with no letter on his chest and no Lindy Ruff is a great asset to any team.
yea... like Dallas, where they are in 10th...

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04-01-2013, 07:17 PM
  #203
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At the very least, everyone who was of the opinion that we'd be a better team without Roy than we were with him the second Roy was gone--and there were many--have been proven incorrect. The Roy trade made us worse on the ice and forced players into roles they cannot and/or are not ready to handle.

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04-01-2013, 07:18 PM
  #204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BowieSabresFan View Post
Folks have to be careful of just getting rid of players to get rid of them. The team did not become better with the Ott/Roy trade.

As for failing to win with Vanek, Pominville, and Miller, perhaps the pieces around them also weren't good enough. Perhaps they can be used in a complementary role?

Mind you, I'm not against trading anyone on the roster if it makes the team better. Just be careful that it does.
Complementary roles? Too late for that. They are paid as core pieces and they need to produce, individually and team success, as such.

The reality is its not happening and they can't go back to complementary players on THIS team.

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04-01-2013, 07:19 PM
  #205
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Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
At the very least, everyone who was of the opinion that we'd be a better team without Roy than we were with him the second Roy was gone--and there were many--have been proven incorrect. The Roy trade made us worse on the ice and forced players into roles they cannot and/or are not ready to handle.
some of us held that opinion with the long game in mind...

getting Roy away from Hodgson, Ennis, etc... was important... and years down the line I will point to it, and you will go into the "correlation doesn't equal causation" argument

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04-01-2013, 07:19 PM
  #206
Karate Johnson
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Originally Posted by Sabresfansince1980 View Post
OK, and WHAT a difference it's made!!! On and off ice.
It was an attempt to succeed with Pominville, Miller, and Vanek.

Send a clear message that the Rochester Core wasn't working. Roy was the biggest problem, so he was tossed out ASAP.


It didn't work. They didn't get better and they are still a heartless bunch.

So now it's time for the rest of them to go.

Simple as that.

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04-01-2013, 07:20 PM
  #207
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Originally Posted by Sabresfansince1980 View Post
Yes I do, but the behind the scenes stuff is still speculation. We don't really know if/how bad Roy might have been. What gets me though was all the talk last summer about "addition by subtraction", when this season has shown (among other problems) that it was just subtraction by subtraction to remove him from the center position. Worse team on the ice, as much (if not more) drama from players off the ice.
We'll never know how bad, but it was bad enough. I don't remember the exact quote, but I think it was Hamilton who basically gave it away that it was Roy who threw a hissy for that guys like Leino and Ehrhoff had salaries that were absurdly out of whack (salaries for that year, not cap hits) and that some (Leino) didn't deserve them. He also publicly laid into Ruff at the end. If it got to the point where he was publicly ripping Lindy after years of giving politically correct answers with regards to his relationship with Ruff, I'm sure **** had reached a new level. Furthermore, you must have never seen Roy out and about in the Buffalo bar scene. He was and is a complete ******.

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04-01-2013, 07:21 PM
  #208
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
yea... like Dallas, where they are in 10th...
LOL, where he's 4th in scoring with 22 pts, only 4 pts behind team leader Jagr. He also leads the team with a +5. Yeah I know +/- sucks and all, but he's leading the team in un-sheltered minutes.

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04-01-2013, 07:23 PM
  #209
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
yea... like Dallas, where they are in 10th...
We'd probably be 10th with Roy.

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04-01-2013, 07:23 PM
  #210
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Irving Zisman View Post
We'll never know how bad, but it was bad enough. I don't remember the exact quote, but I think it was Hamilton who basically gave it away that it was Roy who threw a hissy for that guys like Leino and Ehrhoff had salaries that were absurdly out of whack (salaries for that year, not cap hits) and that some (Leino) didn't deserve them. He also publicly laid into Ruff at the end. If it got to the point where he was publicly ripping Lindy after years of giving politically correct answers with regards to his relationship with Ruff, I'm sure **** had reached a new level. Furthermore, you must have never seen Roy out and about in the Buffalo bar scene. He was and is a complete ******.
I don't think management ever fully comprehended the impact of giving out those contracts in the lockerroom...

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04-01-2013, 07:25 PM
  #211
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Originally Posted by Sabresfansince1980 View Post
LOL, where he's 4th in scoring with 22 pts, only 4 pts behind team leader Jagr. He also leads the team with a +5. Yeah I know +/- sucks and all, but he's leading the team in un-sheltered minutes.
No one's arguing that he's a bad hockey player. We're arguing why he had to go. Ask yourself, did Terry Pegula, a guy who's all about class and respect, want Derek Roy as a core piece going forward?

And I'll say it again, if Darcy doesn't **** the bed and brings in anything that can even kinda play some D, we're not this bad and most of are generally happy with the trade.

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04-01-2013, 07:26 PM
  #212
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Did we just trade for Roy?

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04-01-2013, 07:27 PM
  #213
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Is that not what's happening?

Roy was the worst of the bunch. Traded to try to salvage the rest.
Didn't work out.
Poms is the second worst.
He's now likely getting traded.

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04-01-2013, 07:27 PM
  #214
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Irving Zisman View Post
We'll never know how bad, but it was bad enough. I don't remember the exact quote, but I think it was Hamilton who basically gave it away that it was Roy who threw a hissy for that guys like Leino and Ehrhoff had salaries that were absurdly out of whack (salaries for that year, not cap hits) and that some (Leino) didn't deserve them. He also publicly laid into Ruff at the end. If it got to the point where he was publicly ripping Lindy after years of giving politically correct answers with regards to his relationship with Ruff, I'm sure **** had reached a new level. Furthermore, you must have never seen Roy out and about in the Buffalo bar scene. He was and is a complete ******.
Like I said, if he really was like that I'd have dumped him down the laundry chute. To say, as others have, not you, that Hodgson or anybody else would somehow forget who they were and cave in to some high school age peer pressure and turn into ****** bags too is WAY over the top. If Hodgson was that mentally weak he wouldn't be the player we want on the roster anyway...ridiculous.

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04-01-2013, 07:30 PM
  #215
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Can we stop talking about Roy? This is a thread about roster speculation, not rehashing the past. It's almost as if our captain wasn't asked to submit his no-trade list two days before possibly the biggest firesale in Sabres history.

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04-01-2013, 07:30 PM
  #216
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Irving Zisman View Post
No one's arguing that he's a bad hockey player. We're arguing why he had to go. Ask yourself, did Terry Pegula, a guy who's all about class and respect, want Derek Roy as a core piece going forward?

And I'll say it again, if Darcy doesn't **** the bed and brings in anything that can even kinda play some D, we're not this bad and most of are generally happy with the trade.
No, Jame is throwing out a lame off-center comment to try and make a point since Dallas is in 10th.

In case you haven't seen my arguments here and in other threads, my point is not that Regier should've kept Roy long-term. Roy should've been kept until this deadline where he'd get a better return. Of course, maybe Buffalo's medical staff never does the right thing and have his shoulder surgery done, and he doesn't bounce back with 22 pts right now.

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04-01-2013, 07:32 PM
  #217
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhett4 View Post
Can we stop talking about Roy? This is a thread about roster speculation, not rehashing the past. It's almost as if our captain wasn't asked to submit his no-trade list two days before possibly the biggest firesale in Sabres history.
Good point.

If you guys wan to continue the discussion, someone please open a "Rochester core" type thread.

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04-01-2013, 07:33 PM
  #218
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Originally Posted by Sabresfansince1980 View Post
LOL, where he's 4th in scoring with 22 pts, only 4 pts behind team leader Jagr. He also leads the team with a +5. Yeah I know +/- sucks and all, but he's leading the team in un-sheltered minutes.
Hodgson also has 28 points and is only a -1 in un-sheltered minutes. Therefore, Hodgson was a good replacement for Roy isn't missed.

Or points aren't everything. Wonder which one it is.

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04-01-2013, 07:33 PM
  #219
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I'd love to get Couturier. TSN was just suggesting that he could be had for a top winger or defenseman.

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04-01-2013, 07:33 PM
  #220
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Originally Posted by Karate Johnson View Post
Is that not what's happening?

Roy was the worst of the bunch. Traded to try to salvage the rest.
Didn't work out.
Poms is the second worst.
He's now likely getting traded.
You pass off a lot of opinion as fact.

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04-01-2013, 07:33 PM
  #221
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Regehr asked to waive NMC to go to Kings and intends to do so.
-Per Dreger

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04-01-2013, 07:34 PM
  #222
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Originally Posted by Sabresfansince1980 View Post
No, Jame is throwing out a lame off-center comment to try and make a point since Dallas is in 10th.

In case you haven't seen my arguments here and in other threads, my point is not that Regier should've kept Roy long-term. Roy should've been kept until this deadline where he'd get a better return. Of course, maybe Buffalo's medical staff never does the right thing and have his shoulder surgery done, and he doesn't bounce back with 22 pts right now.
i think it's relevant, that when someone says if in the proper role, Roy is a worthwhile asset... to then point out that the team where he is in exactly that scenario is seeing no benefit from it

secondly... if the Sabres had kept Roy... and your argument is that they would be better with him... then wouldn't they be in the playoff picture (just a few points out)... so they would not be trading him at the deadline...

not to mention, that the improvement that Roy would've had on the record of the team... would also likely screw them out of the top 5 pick they are headed for.

so no... the Sabres would not have done better trading Roy at the deadline...

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04-01-2013, 07:35 PM
  #223
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Regher to LA

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04-01-2013, 07:35 PM
  #224
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If Vancouver offered Jensen and a 1st for Clowe...

I'm spending Wednesday in bed with nice beers.

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04-01-2013, 07:35 PM
  #225
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Just a quick question. Am I right in thinking that with Poms providing this list that IN THEORY now there is no obstacle to any of the big 3 being traded now since Vanek has no NTC and Miller had to give his list at the beginning of the season?

Put another way asking Poms to give the list just puts him on equal footing with the other 2

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