HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Philadelphia Flyers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

The Rumours and Speculation Thread Part 3

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
04-02-2013, 10:03 AM
  #301
dats81
Registered User
 
dats81's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Carinthia
Country: Austria
Posts: 2,087
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
Simmonds, yes. Voracek, no. Hartnell I'd say is on the same level as Clowe so the $25k more for Clowe is not an issue. Also, Simmonds and Voracek are on RFA deals, that is a completely different situation. If you want a guy who is going to score 50 points a year and is a UFA, the rate is going to be around $5 million. If Clowe was an RFA on this team, yes he would probably get less from the Flyers. But he is a UFA, which means he is going to get more money. When Simmonds and Voracek are UFA, they will probably get around the same. If you want a big, physical winger who will drop 50 or so points a season (which I assume we all do), you are going to have to pay for him. I know, I know, let Ben Holmstrom develop a couple more years and maybe he will be that guy!

EDIT: Again, I am not saying trade everything we have for this guy. I am saying that if he can be had for cheap, a hypothetical 5 year $25 million deal would be fine with me. Trading Couturier straight up and signing him for $6 million, is not.
I would not put my money on 28 year old Ben Holmstrom suddenly starting to put up 50pts a season let alone claiming a top-6 role on the NHL roster.

But there is this guy called Tye McGinn who may be the upcoming 3rd power foward behind Hartnell and Simmonds for this team who plays a hard nosed style of play and can score a little as well. No need to waste a lot of cap space on Clowe when the most urgent need should still be to fix the defense in the off-season.

dats81 is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:04 AM
  #302
gallagt01
Registered User
 
gallagt01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sloan
Posts: 8,333
vCash: 500
Your guys' thoughts on Dave Davis' tweet that Philly has asked about Vanek?

gallagt01 is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:05 AM
  #303
Prongo
Beer
 
Prongo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 13,880
vCash: 500
http://kuklaskorner.com/tso/comments...ed-about-vanek

Quote:
Flyers GM Paul Holmgren has kicked the tires on Anaheim Ducks sniper Bobby Ryan, Phoenix Coyotes defenseman Keith Yandle, Dallas Stars right wing Jaromir Jagr and Buffalo Sabres star Thomas Vanek.
Keith Yandle is the player I could see Homer trading Couts for. He would greatly improve this teams offense from the blue line and quarterback the PP top unit.

Vanek I don't know how I feel about him. No doubt the Sabres would have to take back salary in a deal for him though. 7 million cap hit for this year and next, it would be hard to fit him under our cap I think.

Prongo is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:06 AM
  #304
Giroux It
Rookie User
 
Giroux It's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Elizabethtown, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 451
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loods View Post
Your guys' thoughts on Dave Davis' tweet that Philly has asked about Vanek?
I'd like Vanek more than Clowe, but his price is probably even stupider

Giroux It is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:07 AM
  #305
Prongo
Beer
 
Prongo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 13,880
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loods View Post
Your guys' thoughts on Dave Davis' tweet that Philly has asked about Vanek?
There would have to be salary going back for it to work most likely. Especially for next year.

Of course you guys would start the asking price with Couts.

Prongo is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:07 AM
  #306
DrinkFightFlyers
Grave Before Shave
 
DrinkFightFlyers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 12,548
vCash: 155
Send a message via AIM to DrinkFightFlyers
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prongo View Post
http://kuklaskorner.com/tso/comments...ed-about-vanek



Keith Yandle is the player I could see Homer trading Couts for. He would greatly improve this teams offense from the blue line and quarterback the PP top unit.

Vanek I don't know how I feel about him. No doubt the Sabres would have to take back salary in a deal for him though. 7 million cap hit for this year and next, it would be hard to fit him under our cap I think.
I could see him trading Couturier for Ryan too. Either of those players I would be fine with giving up Couturier for.

DrinkFightFlyers is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:09 AM
  #307
Protest
C`est La Vie
 
Protest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Deptford, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 4,294
vCash: 500
I'd like Vanek, but I imagine it would cost way too much. Holmgren asking could be a sign that he's looking to move Briere as soon as he's healthy, or buying him out.

Protest is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:10 AM
  #308
Giroux It
Rookie User
 
Giroux It's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Elizabethtown, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 451
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
I could see him trading Couturier for Ryan too. Either of those players I would be fine with giving up Couturier for.
The problem I have is Yandle is way more valuable to the team in its current state. Otherwise Ryan just says we are going to go out and try to score 6 goals, and hopefully Bryz only gives up 5

Giroux It is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:10 AM
  #309
Prongo
Beer
 
Prongo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 13,880
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
I could see him trading Couturier for Ryan too. Either of those players I would be fine with giving up Couturier for.
I just feel we should get a corner stone defenseman for Couts. Yandle would supply that. He is only 26 as well. Put up 59 points in Phoenix in a defensive system. He would thrive here I believe.

Prongo is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:10 AM
  #310
Curufinwe
Registered User
 
Curufinwe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Country: New Zealand
Posts: 7,688
vCash: 500
Vanek has a huge cap hit. I don't want to give up a 20 year old still on an ELC for him.

Especially when Briere is out with an concussion. Make sure you can buy him out before you bring in someone like Vanek.

Curufinwe is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:11 AM
  #311
Sentrix
Registered User
 
Sentrix's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Buffalo
Country: United States
Posts: 81
vCash: 500
What do you all think is a reasonable return for Vanek?

Sentrix is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:14 AM
  #312
GoneFullHextall
adios Holmgren
 
GoneFullHextall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Somewhere in NH
Country: United States
Posts: 31,465
vCash: 50
Trading Couturier for a winger or even a defenseman would not make sense.
We don't have the center depth due to injuries to make a deal.
I am still opposed to dealing for Clowe because he is not what this team needs. nmind the fact that he hasnt been good this season and wants an insane contract extension.
Hopefully Holmgren plays it smart and doesn't overpay for him.

GoneFullHextall is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:19 AM
  #313
Beef Invictus
Global Moderator
Beefitor
 
Beef Invictus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Centreville
Country: Lord Howe Island
Posts: 37,839
vCash: 156
There's that Jagr rumor again.

__________________
Down in the basement, I've got a Craftsman lathe. Show it to the children when they misbehave.
Beef Invictus is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:19 AM
  #314
Prongo
Beer
 
Prongo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 13,880
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sentrix View Post
What do you all think is a reasonable return for Vanek?
Not Couts and a First like some are mentioning on the Sabres boards. Especially if that 1st is from this year. It would have to be lottery protected, and still then I don't see it being included.

Prongo is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:29 AM
  #315
DrinkFightFlyers
Grave Before Shave
 
DrinkFightFlyers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 12,548
vCash: 155
Send a message via AIM to DrinkFightFlyers
Quote:
Originally Posted by dats81 View Post
I would not put my money on 28 year old Ben Holmstrom suddenly starting to put up 50pts a season let alone claiming a top-6 role on the NHL roster.

But there is this guy called Tye McGinn who may be the upcoming 3rd power foward behind Hartnell and Simmonds for this team who plays a hard nosed style of play and can score a little as well. No need to waste a lot of cap space on Clowe when the most urgent need should still be to fix the defense in the off-season.
Yeah I could see McGinn being that guy too (though it is far from a guarantee). That still doesn't mean I wouldn't go after Clowe, even if he does turn into that guy. Clowe brings a lot, despite his lackluster season this year. Having Hartnell, Clowe, Simmonds, and McGinn isn't a bad thing. Simmonds is the better all around player of that group. Hartnell and Clowe are the best pure power forwards (though Clowe is a more complete player) and McGinn I think tops out at what Hartnell and Clowe are, which again is not guaranteed to happen. Putting one (or two) of them on every line is not a bad thing. Imagine something along the lines of this for next year (assuming Briere is bought out and no roster players are traded for Clowe):

Hartnell-G-Voracek
Clowe-Schenn-Read
Mcginn-Couturier-Simmonds
Rinaldo-Talbot/Laughton-UFA/Talbot

That is a big, defensively sound, team with a lot of offensive potential. Here's a Capgeek Roster which includes Mez and Briere getting bought out (I also didn't know how to LTIR pronger so I "retained" 1% of his salary on a trade to simulate the LTIR):

CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Tye McGinn ($0.775m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Ryane Clowe ($5.000m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Zac Rinaldo ($0.650m) / Scott Laughton ($1.138m) / Maxime Talbot ($1.750m)
Jay Rosehill ($0.650m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Luke Schenn ($3.600m) / Braydon Coburn ($4.500m)
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m)
Bruno Gervais ($0.825m) / Marc-Andre Bourdon ($0.613m)
GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.667m)
OTHER
Buyout: Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
Buyout: Danny Briere ($0.000m)
Buyout: Andrej Meszaros ($0.000m)
RETAINED SALARY TRANSACTIONS (0.077% of upper limit)
Chris Pronger ($0.049m—1.0%)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $56,926,024; BONUSES: $3,012,500
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $10,386,476

Ten million + to get a backup goalie and a defenseman or two. I would be more than happy with that roster and that cap space with the ability to sign or trade for a solid defenseman.

DrinkFightFlyers is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:32 AM
  #316
Karate Johnson
Zemgus is my Copilot
 
Karate Johnson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 2,619
vCash: 500
Vanek would cost you guys a fortune.

Way more than any of you on this board would wanna pay. But with your GM, who knows?

Karate Johnson is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:35 AM
  #317
flyersfan018
Registered User
 
flyersfan018's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NJ
Posts: 3,368
vCash: 50
I would want Vanek but not at the asking price Buffalo will want.

flyersfan018 is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:36 AM
  #318
BrindamoursNose
Registered User
 
BrindamoursNose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 5,789
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karate Johnson View Post
Vanek would cost you guys a fortune.

Way more than any of you on this board would wanna pay. But with your GM, who knows?
Our GM isn't known for overpaying. He wins most deals, I believe.

BrindamoursNose is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:38 AM
  #319
DrinkFightFlyers
Grave Before Shave
 
DrinkFightFlyers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 12,548
vCash: 155
Send a message via AIM to DrinkFightFlyers
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prongo View Post
Not Couts and a First like some are mentioning on the Sabres boards. Especially if that 1st is from this year. It would have to be lottery protected, and still then I don't see it being included.
Do you honestly believe that Tomas Vanek would not command that type of return or would you just not be willing to part with that? Tomas Vanek if traded, should command a top prospect and a top pick. I wouldn't give it up for him but I think it is clear that that is the type of return the Sabres would be looking for (and I imagine would get from a contender).

DrinkFightFlyers is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:43 AM
  #320
Karate Johnson
Zemgus is my Copilot
 
Karate Johnson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 2,619
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrindamoursNose View Post
Our GM isn't known for overpaying. He wins most deals, I believe.
It might not be "overpaying" Vanek just costs a fortune to pry out of Buffalo because he's one of the few guys we'd probably like to keep through the rebuild

Karate Johnson is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:44 AM
  #321
Karate Johnson
Zemgus is my Copilot
 
Karate Johnson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 2,619
vCash: 500
Oh... And the "your GM" had more to do with willingness to wheel and deal and take chances

Karate Johnson is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:47 AM
  #322
GoneFullHextall
adios Holmgren
 
GoneFullHextall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Somewhere in NH
Country: United States
Posts: 31,465
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
Simmonds, yes. Voracek, no. Hartnell I'd say is on the same level as Clowe so the $25k more for Clowe is not an issue. Also, Simmonds and Voracek are on RFA deals, that is a completely different situation. If you want a guy who is going to score 50 points a year and is a UFA, the rate is going to be around $5 million. If Clowe was an RFA on this team, yes he would probably get less from the Flyers. But he is a UFA, which means he is going to get more money. When Simmonds and Voracek are UFA, they will probably get around the same. If you want a big, physical winger who will drop 50 or so points a season (which I assume we all do), you are going to have to pay for him. I know, I know, let Ben Holmstrom develop a couple more years and maybe he will be that guy!

EDIT: Again, I am not saying trade everything we have for this guy. I am saying that if he can be had for cheap, a hypothetical 5 year $25 million deal would be fine with me. Trading Couturier straight up and signing him for $6 million, is not.
yeah we should be trading all our prospects and those measily, overrated 1st and 2nd round picks for older players. Yeah. thats what we should do!

GoneFullHextall is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:50 AM
  #323
MiamiScreamingEagles
Global Moderator
A Fistful of Dollars
 
MiamiScreamingEagles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 39,610
vCash: 1462
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
There's that Jagr rumor again.
FWIW, from Pierre LeBrun:

Quote:
Told the Dallas Stars have decided to trade Jaromir Jagr. My sense is Boston leads the list of front-runners

MiamiScreamingEagles is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:51 AM
  #324
Giroux It
Rookie User
 
Giroux It's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Elizabethtown, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 451
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MiamiScreamingEagles View Post
FWIW, from Pierre LeBrun:
I actually think Boston is a really good fit for Jagr, I hope Homer doesn't try to pry him away. I would imagine Boston is desperate after losing the Iginla sweepstakes that they might overpay for just about anybody at this point

Giroux It is offline  
Old
04-02-2013, 10:51 AM
  #325
GoneFullHextall
adios Holmgren
 
GoneFullHextall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Somewhere in NH
Country: United States
Posts: 31,465
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by MiamiScreamingEagles View Post
FWIW, from Pierre LeBrun:
I would agree with that. A similar offer to the Iginla one?

GoneFullHextall is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:48 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.