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Bouwmeester for Cundari, Berra, protected 1st

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04-02-2013, 10:23 PM
  #201
Mike Liut
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Originally Posted by ikeman79 View Post
I would assume Petro but I did hear Armstrong say he would make Shatty better also.

I really wonder if the organization sees Bouwmeester as the number 1 guy and sees him eating major minutes with multiple partners at times.

I'm hoping Petro. I think that makes the most sense. That will be one hell of a pairing.

J-Bo / Petro
Leopold / Shatty
Jac / Polak

That's my guess

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04-02-2013, 10:27 PM
  #202
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Originally Posted by Mike Liut View Post
I'm hoping Petro. I think that makes the most sense. That will be one hell of a pairing.

J-Bo / Petro
Leopold / Shatty
Jac / Polak

That's my guess
Why not flip Jac and Leo?

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04-02-2013, 10:27 PM
  #203
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Originally Posted by Mike Liut View Post
I'm hoping Petro. I think that makes the most sense. That will be one hell of a pairing.

J-Bo / Petro
Leopold / Shatty
Jac / Polak

That's my guess
I am hoping this is the scenario also.
Yes I agree its one heck of a pairing and really one heck of a defense. I hope they put Jax back with Shatty and Leopold with Polak though.

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04-02-2013, 10:33 PM
  #204
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Originally Posted by Mike Liut View Post
I'm hoping Petro. I think that makes the most sense. That will be one hell of a pairing.

J-Bo / Petro
Leopold / Shatty
Jac / Polak

That's my guess
Highly doubt that Jackman doesn't go back with Shattenkirk.

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04-02-2013, 10:43 PM
  #205
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Guys....I'm not sure how many of you have actually watched Jay Bouwmeester play....It's tough to gauge reading this thread.

Jay Bouwmeester isn't soft guys.. I can't believe there are people on here in this thread saying Russel is more physical than Jay Bouwmeester... Perhaps the mass delusion of how soft he is will be broken when he actually suits up and plays and some of you guys watch him.. I'm under the personal belief from watching him play for years against us and on my center ice and in person at Blues games when Calgary and Florida came to visit that actually he is pretty physical.

As far as skating goes, he's a lights out skater. He is also an excellent passer. He's big and no matter what you guys say, I have seen him use his size many times, he is physical, he's a large body, with loads of skill. I'm not really sure what more could be expected of him. He was on two abysmal teams. Yes two. I didn't think Calgary would make the playoffs when they got him either, not because of him, because their forwards were lackluster, old, and mainly undersized.

Bouwmeester is an absolute upgrade to physicality on any of our defenceman except Polak and Jackman, and really neither of those two have been a dominating physical force for us this year... So really I'm going to laugh when I'm thinking of this thread and Jay is in the Blue Crease paint sending people flying and knocking people into the oppositions bench and getting into a few scraps along the way, then skating circles around every player on Detroit while knocking them flying out of the crease. I repeat, repeat, repeat, how a guy can get a dogma and everybody believes it is beyond me.

I mean really this guy has a bad name because he played on two pretty bad teams and he didn't get them a cup? I mean really that's kinda out there. I'm excited to see what he can do in the note. He is going to be fun to watch. I personally and glad that Stillman stepped up to make the team better and it's going to be fun to watch these guys transition past just about anybody easily. We have 3 premier transition defenceman now. Not to mention no matter what you guys say, we just stepped up the physical play of our backend by getting Bouwmeester. Most teams would salivate to have this backend. I think we our one piece away from a championship. I believe that's a top flight center, let me sign the for the love of all things sacred, move backes back to wing you are killing me thread.
Do you know how many hits Bouwmeester threw last season? Here's a hint Berglund threw more hit then him. Also Russel was not far behind in over 20 less games played.

Your post comes across as someone that does not know much about Bouwmeester. Pietrangelo threw more hits last season then Bouwmeester.

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04-02-2013, 10:57 PM
  #206
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I'm not commenting on Bouwmeester one way or the other, but there's much more to playing physical than hits.

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04-02-2013, 10:58 PM
  #207
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Originally Posted by HooliganX2 View Post
Do you know how many hits Bouwmeester threw last season? Here's a hint Berglund threw more hit then him. Also Russel was not far behind in over 20 less games played.

Your post comes across as someone that does not know much about Bouwmeester. Pietrangelo threw more hits last season then Bouwmeester.
do you know how subjective the term hit is in hockey? in some arenas only the home team can "hit" a player. in others every tiny little bump is "hit". you have to watch players play to see how physical they are you cant just look at the stats.

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04-02-2013, 10:58 PM
  #208
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Easton, Global Moderator? This is new, correct?

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04-02-2013, 11:02 PM
  #209
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Originally Posted by EastonBlues22 View Post
I'm not commenting on Bouwmeester one way or the other, but there's much more to playing physical than hits.
That was just a stat way to point out he does not initiate contact much. He is a great skater that has always been his plus. He just is not a physical player. I don't think he's a weak player. He's just not guy that is going to punish the other team. Obviously this is the player Hitchcock and Armstrong wanted for our team. I am hoping for the best but the last thing I expect is Bouwmeester to provide any physical play. I think him and Pietrangelo are pretty close in their physical play.

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04-02-2013, 11:04 PM
  #210
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Originally Posted by EastonBlues22 View Post
I'm not commenting on Bouwmeester one way or the other, but there's much more to playing physical than hits.
Congrats on Global Mod Easton

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04-02-2013, 11:10 PM
  #211
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Originally Posted by MattyMo35 View Post
Easton, Global Moderator? This is new, correct?
I thought so when I saw he was policing the trade forum. Good luck with that BTW.

Oh, and I want to hear your take on J-Bo Easton. I think a lot of this board, myself especially, could use a good lesson right about now.

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04-02-2013, 11:17 PM
  #212
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Just my thoughts on the whole "he's not physical" argument...I don't care. Hitting is very overrated. Yes, you should finish your checks, but I'd rather see the puck on your stick. Pietrangelo doesn't need to be a big hitter because he's physical and extremely smart in tight puck battles with one or two opponents. Some guys don't need to check you off the puck or expend all their energy on a hit after the puck is gone because they're that good at getting the puck off of you. Petro is godly at eliminating the man in a battle without putting him on his butt. J-Bo, in my opinion, is cut from the same mold.

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04-02-2013, 11:33 PM
  #213
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Originally Posted by CarvinSigX View Post
Just my thoughts on the whole "he's not physical" argument...I don't care. Hitting is very overrated. Yes, you should finish your checks, but I'd rather see the puck on your stick. Pietrangelo doesn't need to be a big hitter because he's physical and extremely smart in tight puck battles with one or two opponents. Some guys don't need to check you off the puck or expend all their energy on a hit after the puck is gone because they're that good at getting the puck off of you. Petro is godly at eliminating the man in a battle without putting him on his butt. J-Bo, in my opinion, is cut from the same mold.
very well said. kind of comes to the old argument the best defense is a good offense and you cant score if you don't have the puck

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04-02-2013, 11:34 PM
  #214
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Thanks all. Sorry I haven't been around quite as much. The new responsibilities and trade deadline chaos have kept me hopping.

My biggest concerns about Bouwmeester were always the asset cost that it would take to acquire him, and his associated financial cost. As it turns out, the first concern wasn't much of a stumbling block at all. We paid a minimal price for a player of his quality. We're in limbo on the second concern until we hear what the budget is for next year, and see how the offseason roster moves shake out.

As a player, I think he's a good fit here. I've always wanted a two way threat to pair with Pietrangelo, and Bouwmeester is certainly that. Playing in a structured system with defensively diligent forwards will help him quite a bit, and partnering with Pietrangelo will prevent the forecheck from actively targeting one while ignoring the other.

There's a chance the pairing could get exploited by an aggressive forecheck, but the two of them also have the puck/passing skills and mobility to badly burn such a forecheck as well. We couldn't say that before with Jackman, Redden, Cole, etc. playing with Pietrangelo, when eliminating Pietrangelo effectively neutered the puck moving ability of the pairing. Now it's going to be a razor-edge battle that comes down to who is executing better, and that's just the way it should be between two good teams in the playoffs.

The Blues have basically decided to live and die by their team philosophy. That takes guts, and it could fail spectacularly, but I would much rather see them try this than try nothing.

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04-02-2013, 11:51 PM
  #215
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Originally Posted by HooliganX2 View Post
Do you know how many hits Bouwmeester threw last season? Here's a hint Berglund threw more hit then him. Also Russel was not far behind in over 20 less games played.

Your post comes across as someone that does not know much about Bouwmeester. Pietrangelo threw more hits last season then Bouwmeester.
As I've stated several times. Bouwmeester isn't a cream puff. He knows how to use his large body to his advantage. I didn't try to say he was a heavy hitter. I said he uses his body well. I think he will surprise people and I will stick with that. I also stated in this thread his transition game and skating was his strong point. I'm just tired of getting on here and reading everybody basically stating we hired my best friends grandpa to be a top pairing d man lol.

This guy is not a cream puff. He isn't Scott Stevens either folks, didn't say he was either thank you. I did say and I will say again, I think he will surprise a lot of you. I stand by that and look forward to reading how great this was a year from now.

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04-03-2013, 12:08 AM
  #216
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Originally Posted by HooliganX2 View Post
That was just a stat way to point out he does not initiate contact much. He is a great skater that has always been his plus. He just is not a physical player. I don't think he's a weak player. He's just not guy that is going to punish the other team. Obviously this is the player Hitchcock and Armstrong wanted for our team. I am hoping for the best but the last thing I expect is Bouwmeester to provide any physical play. I think him and Pietrangelo are pretty close in their physical play.
Toughness vs. physicality. Did you consider in-his-prime Zetterberg to be one of the tougher forwards in the league? Because he was and wouldn't show up near the top of any hit charts.

When it comes to most star forwards and defenseman I'm much more considered with things like compete level. Battle level. Willingness to absorb punishment.

I think ikeman is intimating that those are some of the things that Bouwmeester doesn't get enough credit for.

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04-03-2013, 01:09 AM
  #217
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Toughness vs. physicality. Did you consider in-his-prime Zetterberg to be one of the tougher forwards in the league? Because he was and wouldn't show up near the top of any hit charts.

When it comes to most star forwards and defenseman I'm much more considered with things like compete level. Battle level. Willingness to absorb punishment.

I think ikeman is intimating that those are some of the things that Bouwmeester doesn't get enough credit for.
Along this line, the ability to play well despite the threat of hits is something that cannot be ignored, especially in the playoffs. There's something Leopold did last game that I loved. Simple, subtle play where he held the puck, a Wild player had him lined up, and he made a very good little pass to get the puck out of the zone and jumpstart the rush - and got creamed into the boards. He knew that hit was coming and didn't shy away and it didn't affect his ability to make that play.

Too often, even with Jackman or Polak, I see Blues players try to dodge the hit and make the play or change their mind and reverse it or try to eat the puck and brace for the hit or something. It's not that they play scared at all, but sometimes you have to accept that in order to make the right play, you get hit. And you can't let that incoming hit affect your decision or cause you to pass the puck into skates.

I'm less concerned with the Blues' defense getting pushed around and more concerned with trying to be too smart for the game and, thus, effectively being intimidated, even if they aren't scared. If Leopold and Bouwmeester can provide that kind of veteran simplicity, these trades will be better than most people would guess.

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04-03-2013, 04:50 AM
  #218
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Well if you equate hits stats with toughness, I guess Clutterbuck and Dustin Brown are the toughest meanest SOB's in the leauge. In truth they're... well... not at all.

Put me in the camp who loves the Bouwmeester deal. He'll do great with the Blues.

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04-03-2013, 08:03 AM
  #219
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Originally Posted by TheOrganist View Post
Toughness vs. physicality. Did you consider in-his-prime Zetterberg to be one of the tougher forwards in the league? Because he was and wouldn't show up near the top of any hit charts.

When it comes to most star forwards and defenseman I'm much more considered with things like compete level. Battle level. Willingness to absorb punishment.

I think ikeman is intimating that those are some of the things that Bouwmeester doesn't get enough credit for.


Yes I was, thank you. I believe he a lot better in a lot of areas than what people are saying.

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04-03-2013, 08:04 AM
  #220
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along this line, the ability to play well despite the threat of hits is something that cannot be ignored, especially in the playoffs. There's something leopold did last game that i loved. Simple, subtle play where he held the puck, a wild player had him lined up, and he made a very good little pass to get the puck out of the zone and jumpstart the rush - and got creamed into the boards. He knew that hit was coming and didn't shy away and it didn't affect his ability to make that play.

Too often, even with jackman or polak, i see blues players try to dodge the hit and make the play or change their mind and reverse it or try to eat the puck and brace for the hit or something. It's not that they play scared at all, but sometimes you have to accept that in order to make the right play, you get hit. And you can't let that incoming hit affect your decision or cause you to pass the puck into skates.

i'm less concerned with the blues' defense getting pushed around and more concerned with trying to be too smart for the game and, thus, effectively being intimidated, even if they aren't scared. If leopold and bouwmeester can provide that kind of veteran simplicity, these trades will be better than most people would guess.


100%

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04-03-2013, 01:18 PM
  #221
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This is going to be by far the best team Bouwmeester has ever played for in the NHL. He's going to get more help from his defensive partner and from his forwards. He's going to have more opportunity to show off his play and he won't need to do nearly as much. This should be great for him and for the Blues.

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04-03-2013, 03:10 PM
  #222
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Originally Posted by Mike Liut View Post
I'm hoping Petro. I think that makes the most sense. That will be one hell of a pairing.

J-Bo / Petro
Leopold / Shatty
Jac / Polak

That's my guess
Saw Hitchcock interview that confirms these lines. http://bleedinblue.com/2013/04/03/ex...-ken-hitchcock.

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04-03-2013, 05:01 PM
  #223
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04-03-2013, 05:01 PM
  #224
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The Blues probably wouldn't have got J-Bo if they were doing better in the standings. Their 1st rounder looks better to the Flames being in the teens rather than late 20's. So glad the Wings didn't get him.

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04-03-2013, 05:02 PM
  #225
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Is he our #1 center too?

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