HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Central Division > Minnesota Wild
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Wild gets Jason Pominville, '14 4th for Larsson, Hackett 13' 1st + '14 2nd Part 2

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
04-05-2013, 09:16 AM
  #226
MNWILDFAN001
Registered User
 
MNWILDFAN001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Minnesota
Country: United States
Posts: 645
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nickschultzfan View Post
Pommer is not a rental. He will be re-signed.
You're more confident than me. I think it depends on a few things, how well the Wild do, how much Pommer wants and how much the Wild are willing to give. If the Wild continue to play like they have during this funk, it won't be a very attractive place to re-sign. He will be free to sign anywhere he wants after next season.

MNWILDFAN001 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 09:17 AM
  #227
rynryn
Progress to the Mean
 
rynryn's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Minny
Country: United States
Posts: 21,425
vCash: 50
and we don't even have to pay him all his salary or take on all of his cap hit? deal makes more sense now.

rynryn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 01:33 PM
  #228
thestonedkoala
Everyone! PANIC!
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 18,360
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
I just think Fletcher really misjudged the team's needs here. He went all in on a forward when the defense is nonexistant after the top pairing.
That's my thought as well. I think he was just trying to make a splash because the team was starting to slide and I have this nagging fear it's going to back fire and badly.

thestonedkoala is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 01:50 PM
  #229
rynryn
Progress to the Mean
 
rynryn's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Minny
Country: United States
Posts: 21,425
vCash: 50
i think he didn't see any available defensemen outside of rentals who would fit in with the team (cap, future, etc) and didn't want to pay just for rentals. in other words, I think he knows what he's doing...i don't think he's under the illusion that our defense is stellar. I do think with cullen being injured it became more important to get a forward.

rynryn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 01:51 PM
  #230
Jarick
Moderator
Doing Nothing
 
Jarick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: St Paul, MN
Country: United States
Posts: 23,664
vCash: 500
I don't think he got Pominville because the team was sliding but I think he honestly thought the defense was good.

IMO if you've got an okay chance to make the playoffs, make a trade and fill a hole. But don't throw away tons of assets to plug one hole and leave several other glaring holes untouched.

Jarick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 01:53 PM
  #231
DeuceMN
Really?
 
DeuceMN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Chi-Town, Il
Country: United States
Posts: 2,002
vCash: 50
We don't know what other trades Fletch was looking into, and we don't know what other potential trades fell through.

We know he was really only looking for character players who would be part of a reasonable "hockey" trade.

We needed one more top 6, preferably top 3 forward. We got that.

To be a true playoff contender, we now need to fill that hole at d.

I guarantee you, that's what he will do this summer.

DeuceMN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 01:58 PM
  #232
BuddyMcCormick
Registered User
 
BuddyMcCormick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,907
vCash: 934
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
I don't think he got Pominville because the team was sliding but I think he honestly thought the defense was good.

IMO if you've got an okay chance to make the playoffs, make a trade and fill a hole. But don't throw away tons of assets to plug one hole and leave several other glaring holes untouched.
There you go thinkin' again.

Fact of the matter is nobody knows what CF thinks are what he tried to do.

BuddyMcCormick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:00 PM
  #233
thestonedkoala
Everyone! PANIC!
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 18,360
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post

IMO if you've got an okay chance to make the playoffs, make a trade and fill a hole. But don't throw away tons of assets to plug one hole and leave several other glaring holes untouched.
Exactly. Which is why I am against this trade. Not against Pom. He fits a need. I also understand why he gave up what he gave up but right wing wasn't a huge hole that we needed to blow a ton of assets on. Coyle was doing fine at right wing. I mean God forbid, we don't make the playoffs, this trade will look even worse.

thestonedkoala is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:02 PM
  #234
Blizzard6411
#benchstoner
 
Blizzard6411's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Seattle
Country: United States
Posts: 1,493
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
I don't think he got Pominville because the team was sliding but I think he honestly thought the defense was good.

IMO if you've got an okay chance to make the playoffs, make a trade and fill a hole. But don't throw away tons of assets to plug one hole and leave several other glaring holes untouched.
Tons of assets? Really?

Blizzard6411 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:04 PM
  #235
thestonedkoala
Everyone! PANIC!
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 18,360
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blizzard6411 View Post
Tons of assets? Really?
1st (in a deep draft), 2nd (who knows how 2014 is shaping up), Johan Larsson, who many in the league consider to one of the top prospects in the NHL (some have compared him to Filppula) and a starting/top 15 net prospect in Hackett. So yes, it's a lot.

thestonedkoala is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:04 PM
  #236
Jarick
Moderator
Doing Nothing
 
Jarick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: St Paul, MN
Country: United States
Posts: 23,664
vCash: 500
1st + 2nd + Larsson + Hackett is tons of assets.

Jarick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:07 PM
  #237
Blizzard6411
#benchstoner
 
Blizzard6411's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Seattle
Country: United States
Posts: 1,493
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
1st + 2nd + Larsson + Hackett is tons of assets.
I think for your argument you have placed a far greater value on Larson and the 1st then what they are deserving and Hacket would have likely been lost for nothing in return in the off season.

CF did not give up tons of assets, he gave up some assets and leveraged another one who was going to be lost anyways.

Blizzard6411 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:11 PM
  #238
Blizzard6411
#benchstoner
 
Blizzard6411's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Seattle
Country: United States
Posts: 1,493
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by the8bandarmadillo View Post
1st (in a deep draft), 2nd (who knows how 2014 is shaping up), Johan Larsson, who many in the league consider to one of the top prospects in the NHL (some have compared him to Filppula) and a starting/top 15 net prospect in Hackett. So yes, it's a lot.
Did he give up a lot or did he give up tons?

Blizzard6411 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:13 PM
  #239
MuckOG
The Brodin Effect
 
MuckOG's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Right behind you....
Country: United States
Posts: 6,157
vCash: 50
There's no question that we overpaid for Pominville...but that's the nature of the beast with deadline deals. Not to mention the fact that there were more buyers than sellers this season, as evidenced by the log jams in the standings. More buyers = better return for the sellers.

The fact is that Fletcher has done a good job building up the pool of prospects and draft picks over the past few years, and he decided that it was time to cash in some chips from his large stack. And he managed to do that without touching any of our "blue chip" prospects in the process.

MuckOG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:17 PM
  #240
Casper
30 goal grinder
 
Casper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: MN
Posts: 1,492
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
I don't think he got Pominville because the team was sliding but I think he honestly thought the defense was good.

IMO if you've got an okay chance to make the playoffs, make a trade and fill a hole. But don't throw away tons of assets to plug one hole and leave several other glaring holes untouched.
There is no way that Chuck Fletcher is happy with the bottom 2/3 of his defense. He most likely has more faith in Gilbert,Stoner, and Spurgeon then either of us but I guarantee you that CF isn't thrilled.

If Pominville was simply a rental I would be a little more upset about the assests we gave up (im not thrilled by the amount or the quality but you have to give to get). But the fact is that hole is now closed. Re-signing Cullen this offseason will give us more time to fill another hole. The D obvioiusly will be a priority in the offseason.

Casper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:18 PM
  #241
thestonedkoala
Everyone! PANIC!
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 18,360
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blizzard6411 View Post
Did he give up a lot or did he give up tons?
A lot = a ton to me. Jarick and I just have difference of an opinion but yes, he gave up a ton, a lot whatever you want to call it. You're just splitting hairs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blizzard6411 View Post
I think for your argument you have placed a far greater value on Larsson
What is the value of a top prospect in the NHL? Larsson's value is a lot higher than some would seem. He's the type of gritty player you win playoff games with. He has leadership, some scoring touch and plays a fantastic two-way game. You break the bank to get a guy like that on your team. I mean hell, if he turns out to be a Brouwer type? Yeah. He's worth a 1st alone.

Quote:
and the 1st
The 1st is hard to peg. If this team went deep in the playoffs, doesn't hurt as much. If they get bounced in the 1st round due to a low seeding. That is when it starts to hurt. If they don't make the playoffs. It hurts even more. Here's the thing, if you don't know if your team can make the playoffs, trading a 1st isn't a smart move. If Minnesota had starting running away in the Northwest/West, then yes. But since they were starting to slide and you could see holes, it's tough to swallow losing a 1st with so much uncertainty.

Quote:
Hackett would have likely been lost for nothing in return in the off season.
We don't know that. Hackett could have bounced back and become a solid starter. Goaltenders are such fickle players that they can have one bad year, bounce back and look like the starter they should have been.

Quote:
CF did not give up tons of assets, he gave up some assets and leveraged another one who was going to be lost anyways.
He gave up a lot, a ton and cut into our depth pretty badly at two positions - one especially, that is becoming an issue for this team.

Why is it so bad to stay pat, especially when it's a seller's market and prices are going to be sky high, and evaluate?

thestonedkoala is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:19 PM
  #242
Casper
30 goal grinder
 
Casper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: MN
Posts: 1,492
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blizzard6411 View Post
Did he give up a lot or did he give up tons?
It was an overpayment. How much of an overpayment depends on how far we go in the playoffs, whether or not Pommer re-signs, and whether or not we now have enough assests to rebuild our bottom four defense.

Casper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:19 PM
  #243
Jarick
Moderator
Doing Nothing
 
Jarick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: St Paul, MN
Country: United States
Posts: 23,664
vCash: 500
Hackett probably could have brought back a 2nd or 3rd. He's played very well in the AHL and started in the NHL, still young. We've seen good goalies drafted in the 2nd or 3rd and this is way more of a sure thing.

Larsson is a blue chip prospect.

Jarick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:20 PM
  #244
Casper
30 goal grinder
 
Casper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: MN
Posts: 1,492
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
Hackett probably could have brought back a 2nd or 3rd. He's played very well in the AHL and started in the NHL, still young. We've seen good goalies drafted in the 2nd or 3rd and this is way more of a sure thing.

Larsson is a blue chip prospect.
Highly doubtful. What do other young goalies with very little NHL experience fetch?

Casper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:21 PM
  #245
mkoivu9*
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,425
vCash: 2710
The cap space and 4th offsets the 2nd round pick.

mkoivu9* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:22 PM
  #246
thestonedkoala
Everyone! PANIC!
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 18,360
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MuckOG View Post
There's no question that we overpaid for Pominville...but that's the nature of the beast with deadline deals.
Sometimes you have more sellers, than buyers. But in a shorten season, it makes no sense to buy because the prices are going to be high with so many teams bunched up.

Quote:
And he managed to do that without touching any of our "blue chip" prospects in the process.
Hackett and Larsson are as close to blue chip as you can get. It's just that we had some solid depth at top that pushed them down. On any other team, Larsson and Hackett would easily fit in the top 5-10 of any prospect group.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Casper View Post
But the fact is that hole is now closed.
What hole was that? Are we going to automatically assume Coyle isn't a legitimate top 6 winger?

thestonedkoala is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:22 PM
  #247
MuckOG
The Brodin Effect
 
MuckOG's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Right behind you....
Country: United States
Posts: 6,157
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
Hackett probably could have brought back a 2nd or 3rd. He's played very well in the AHL and started in the NHL, still young. We've seen good goalies drafted in the 2nd or 3rd and this is way more of a sure thing.

Larsson is a blue chip prospect.
I'm not sure I agree with that....but our definition of "blue chip" is probably different.

IMO, our blue chippers are Coyle, Brodin, Zucker and Granlund. Personally, I had Larsson ranked behind Dumba.

MuckOG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:23 PM
  #248
thestonedkoala
Everyone! PANIC!
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 18,360
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Casper View Post
Highly doubtful. What do other young goalies with very little NHL experience fetch?
Ben Bishop 2nd round draft pick and then Cory Conacher comes to mind immediately.

thestonedkoala is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:23 PM
  #249
Casper
30 goal grinder
 
Casper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: MN
Posts: 1,492
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoivu9 View Post
The cap space and 4th offsets the 2nd round pick.
Pommer is worth Larsson + a first. The overpayment is the perceived difference between Hackett and the 2nd round pick minus the 4th plus cap space.

Casper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2013, 02:25 PM
  #250
thestonedkoala
Everyone! PANIC!
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 18,360
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MuckOG View Post
I'm not sure I agree with that....but our definition of "blue chip" is probably different.

IMO, our blue chippers are Coyle, Brodin, Zucker and Granlund. Personally, I had Larsson ranked behind Dumba.
I have Larsson ahead of Dumba only because Dumba is so wildly unpredictable. He could be a top 4 defenseman or he could be a bust. It's scary.

thestonedkoala is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:49 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.