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Patrick Kane vs Nicklas Backstrom

View Poll Results: Patrick Kane vs Nicklas Backstrom
Patrick Kane 99 62.66%
Nicklas Backstrom 59 37.34%
Voters: 158. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
04-08-2013, 12:11 AM
  #51
ottawa
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Kane, Patrick

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04-08-2013, 12:13 AM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HyPnOtiK View Post
It's not infantile, Nor is it an argument.. It's just my opinion and how I break players down... Their offense is similar and Backstrom is much better defensively, did I say something wrong?
Yes. To define "offense" and "defense" as broad categories that can be summed up with ">" and "<" signs is... well, incredibly simplistic, let's leave it at that. And the more obvious issue with such rationale is that it implies an equal weighting of offense and defense. Which is, of course, ridiculous. An above average defensive player is far less remarkable than an above average offensive player. But that line of reasoning is lost on these boards, where goals and assists lose their meaning because a player isn't Datsyuk in his own end of the rink.

(Also, I don't think it's a difficult argument to make that Kane has a clear edge on Backstrom offensively).

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04-08-2013, 12:19 AM
  #53
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Well, despite the spelling difference:


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04-08-2013, 12:21 AM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Hansen View Post
Yes. To define "offense" and "defense" as broad categories that can be summed up with ">" and "<" signs is... well, incredibly simplistic, let's leave it at that. And the more obvious issue with such rationale is that it implies an equal weighting of offense and defense. Which is, of course, ridiculous. An above average defensive player is far less remarkable than an above average offensive player. But that line of reasoning is lost on these boards, where goals and assists lose their meaning because a player isn't Datsyuk in his own end of the rink.

(Also, I don't think it's a difficult argument to make that Kane has a clear edge on Backstrom offensively).

So much wrong with this post..

Breaking down players simplistically is all anyone does on HF, no one is here getting paid for their opinions, hell most media " experts" don't have a clue for that matter.

I do agree with you that for a forward offense is far more important than defense, which is why I don't consider Datsyuk a top 5 forward... And a defenseman should be better defensively, which is why I don't feel Karlsson is the clear cut #1 D.

Yes It would be hard for you to argue Kane clearly is better offensively, Backstrom has outscored him throughout his career, better career numbers and better peak.

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Old
04-08-2013, 12:25 AM
  #55
Chris Hansen
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Originally Posted by HyPnOtiK View Post
So much wrong with this post..

Breaking down players simplistically is all anyone does on HF, no one is here getting paid for their opinions, hell most media " experts" don't have a clue for that matter.

I do agree with you that for a forward offense is far more important than defense, which is why I don't consider Datsyuk a top 5 forward... And a defenseman should be better defensively, which is why I don't feel Karlsson is the clear cut #1 D.

Yes It would be hard for you to argue Kane clearly is better offensively, Backstrom has outscored him throughout his career, better career numbers and better peak.
What exactly is wrong with it?
Example:
"Kane > Backstrom offensively."
vs.
"Kane has a better shot than Backstrom, is a better natural goalscorer, and creates more offense for himself and his teammates."

Backstrom has been a PPG player since his 100 point season, which at this point seems to have been an aberration. Kane's taken a clear step past PPG this season while Backstrom is producing at the same clip he usually does. If you want more time than that to prove Kane has really stepped ahead of Backstrom offensively, that's fine - that's at least reasonable.

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04-08-2013, 12:28 AM
  #56
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Definitely not in terms of offense/defense. None of them are goalscorers and the difference between them is not huge when looking at their career totals, Backstrom has actually scored the most goals in a single season.
Backstrom isn't as strong a skater as Kane, and not as imaginative as Kane with the puck. That's what I was talking about in terms of being "dynamic". Kane can beat you with pure speed, his hands, or his methodical passing/vision.

And you can't look at straight points and say Backstrom's >/= to Kane. Backstrom was playing with Ovechkin when he was scoring 50 goals and 100 points a year. He was not the best offensive player on his line, or his team. Space opened up for Backstrom because other teams were more focused on Ovechkin. That's not to say Backstrom's not a talented player, he is, but do people really think he comes close to 100 points without playing with Ovechkin at the top of his game? No chance.

Patrick Kane's the best offensive player on the Chicago Blackhawks, and has been since 2007-08. Regardless of point totals, Kane's the guy other teams worry about most burning them, when they play the Hawks.

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04-08-2013, 12:54 AM
  #57
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Backstrom will get more respect soon enough.

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Old
04-08-2013, 01:03 AM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Hansen View Post

(Also, I don't think it's a difficult argument to make that Kane has a clear edge on Backstrom offensively).
It is pretty difficult to make that argument considering Kane has never once outscored Backstrom until this season, where Kane is only ahead by a small margin....


Maybe you're thinking of the goalie Backstrom? Because, yeah, Kane is better offensively than him.

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Old
04-08-2013, 08:20 AM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HossTheBoss View Post
Backstrom isn't as strong a skater as Kane, and not as imaginative as Kane with the puck. That's what I was talking about in terms of being "dynamic". Kane can beat you with pure speed, his hands, or his methodical passing/vision.

And you can't look at straight points and say Backstrom's >/= to Kane. Backstrom was playing with Ovechkin when he was scoring 50 goals and 100 points a year. He was not the best offensive player on his line, or his team. Space opened up for Backstrom because other teams were more focused on Ovechkin. That's not to say Backstrom's not a talented player, he is, but do people really think he comes close to 100 points without playing with Ovechkin at the top of his game? No chance.

Patrick Kane's the best offensive player on the Chicago Blackhawks, and has been since 2007-08. Regardless of point totals, Kane's the guy other teams worry about most burning them, when they play the Hawks.
Have to disagree with that. Bäckström is much stronger on his skates. Incredibly hard to knock off the puck. He's not really fast or agile but is very strong.

If that was what you meant. Kane is better skater but not the stronger skater.

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04-08-2013, 08:25 AM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Red Line View Post
It is pretty difficult to make that argument considering Kane has never once outscored Backstrom until this season, where Kane is only ahead by a small margin....


Maybe you're thinking of the goalie Backstrom? Because, yeah, Kane is better offensively than him.
6 more points (and 14 more goals) in 1 less game is a pretty significant difference.

TRL, the day I see you vote for or even give credit to a Blackhawk player in an HF poll, I tell you...

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04-08-2013, 08:47 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by InjuredChoker View Post
Have to disagree with that. Bäckström is much stronger on his skates. Incredibly hard to knock off the puck. He's not really fast or agile but is very strong.

If that was what you meant. Kane is better skater but not the stronger skater.
Yeah, perhaps I should have worded that differently. I meant it as Kane's faster, has better acceleration and is more agile/elusive; A stronger all-round skater.

Kane's got very good lower-body strength as well. Would say that's pretty close, with a lean/edge towards Backstrom.

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Old
04-08-2013, 09:58 AM
  #62
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Right now it should be Kane. Bäckström is probably better defensively but Kane's looking really good offensively atm.

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Old
04-08-2013, 10:21 AM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HossTheBoss View Post
Patrick Kane's the more dynamic player. Neither player lacks hockey sense, and both players are high-end playmakers. The biggest differences between the two is Kane's the better goal-scorer and has better hands.
Kanes a better scorer that's about it. Playmaking goes to Backstrom as does two way play. We've both seen them break open games. Kane has more explosion but puck possession goes to Backstrom. But hey screw sample size whatve you done the last two periods.

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04-08-2013, 10:24 AM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HossTheBoss View Post
Backstrom isn't as strong a skater as Kane, and not as imaginative as Kane with the puck. That's what I was talking about in terms of being "dynamic". Kane can beat you with pure speed, his hands, or his methodical passing/vision.

And you can't look at straight points and say Backstrom's >/= to Kane. Backstrom was playing with Ovechkin when he was scoring 50 goals and 100 points a year. He was not the best offensive player on his line, or his team. Space opened up for Backstrom because other teams were more focused on Ovechkin. That's not to say Backstrom's not a talented player, he is, but do people really think he comes close to 100 points without playing with Ovechkin at the top of his game? No chance.

Patrick Kane's the best offensive player on the Chicago Blackhawks, and has been since 2007-08. Regardless of point totals, Kane's the guy other teams worry about most burning them, when they play the Hawks.
Backstrom is better at puck protection, controlling the play, along the boards/better cycle game, and he's much stronger. They play a completely different style of game, you can't just look at Kane's strengths, while ignoring Backstroms, because they have strengths in completely different areas of the game. Kane's a much shiftier skater, while Backstrom's a much stronger skater. Kane's the player looking for a breakout pass, while Backstrom's the one making the pass. Kane's better at gaining entry into the zone, while Backstrom's better at maintaining posession.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Hansen View Post
Backstrom has been a PPG player since his 100 point season, which at this point seems to have been an aberration. Kane's taken a clear step past PPG this season while Backstrom is producing at the same clip he usually does. If you want more time than that to prove Kane has really stepped ahead of Backstrom offensively, that's fine - that's at least reasonable.
Why do you consider Backstrom's 100 point season an abberation, while not doing so for Kane this season?
Backstrom likely would of gotten ~90 points last year(minimum of 80 IMO), Kane had 66, if anyone wants to claim a player is "clearly the better offensive player", give it more then a year, otherwise it's nothing more then a wash.


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Old
04-08-2013, 10:44 AM
  #65
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It's just a bad poll. 1C vs 1RW, uhg.

Backstrom is incredible. I think his play away from the puck and "intangibles" are his most underrated asset. He's a good scorer and I think being in the southwest makes him look like a great scorer. It's just stupid that people don't even think it matters that one division that is absolutely abhorrent at the defensive end of the game doesn't contribute to more points for it's best forwards. Meanwhile, Kane gets no credit for the types of plays he creates like he did last night in the 3rd..went in to the boards towards two guys on the forecheck, lifted sticks, and dished a beautiful backwards pass to the slot where Toews buried the goal. Kane has modeled so much of his game after Hossa it's incredible. I remember during interviews before last year he discussed how points aren't as important at controlling the game and last year was certainly a transition period for his play. That said, you really can't pick one or the other.

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04-08-2013, 12:22 PM
  #66
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This is close, but I just think Backstrom is slightly better overall due to his defensive play.

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04-08-2013, 12:23 PM
  #67
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That's what I was thinking.. Weird comparison.
Agreed. ALthough if it were upto to me I'd go with Backstrom. I love that guy too much Sorry for the homer vote folks!

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04-08-2013, 12:44 PM
  #68
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Kane, not really close. Backstrom's career numbers are inflated imo. He's a great player but I take Kane.

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04-08-2013, 01:12 PM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by backs4mvp View Post
Why do you consider Backstrom's 100 point season an abberation, while not doing so for Kane this season?
Backstrom likely would of gotten ~90 points last year(minimum of 80 IMO), Kane had 66, if anyone wants to claim a player is "clearly the better offensive player", give it more then a year, otherwise it's nothing more then a wash.
Because it was years ago that Backstrom put up those numbers. Hasn't replicated them since and has hovered at about a point-per-game pace for quite a while now.

Kane had 66 playing center for more than half the season. As a winger he's put up PPG every season of his career (or better) after his rookie season. This year he seems to be breaking out. Could it be an aberration, like I label Backstrom's 100 point year as? Maybe. I don't think it is, though - and after all, this is just an opinion. I have a hard time believing Kane's fluking into a career year when playing with pretty terrible linemates all season and not putting up some kind if unsustainable point total on the PP or something to that effect. Sharp - Kane's best linemate by a mile - has been injured for a good chunk of the year and was playing horrid offensive hockey before getting hurt. And I like Sharp.

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04-08-2013, 01:26 PM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HossTheBoss View Post
Patrick Kane's the more dynamic player. Neither player lacks hockey sense, and both players are high-end playmakers. The biggest differences between the two is Kane's the better goal-scorer and has better hands.
How can Kane be a the "more dynamic player" when Bäckström is a the better two-way forward with a good defense, playing both PP and BP, i agree Kane is the better offensively..

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04-08-2013, 02:11 PM
  #71
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Have to disagree with that. Bäckström is much stronger on his skates. Incredibly hard to knock off the puck. He's not really fast or agile but is very strong.

If that was what you meant. Kane is better skater but not the stronger skater.

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Old
04-08-2013, 02:16 PM
  #72
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04-08-2013, 02:45 PM
  #73
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Backstrom

Backstrom is better offensively and much better defensively.

Offensively could be argued but the fact is Backstrom is averaging over a point per game in his career while Kane is about 20 points under point per game status.

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04-08-2013, 02:48 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by Chris Hansen View Post
Yes. To define "offense" and "defense" as broad categories that can be summed up with ">" and "<" signs is... well, incredibly simplistic, let's leave it at that. And the more obvious issue with such rationale is that it implies an equal weighting of offense and defense. Which is, of course, ridiculous. An above average defensive player is far less remarkable than an above average offensive player. But that line of reasoning is lost on these boards, where goals and assists lose their meaning because a player isn't Datsyuk in his own end of the rink.

(Also, I don't think it's a difficult argument to make that Kane has a clear edge on Backstrom offensively).
Given that Backstrom has a higher career PPG it may well be.

Even this season where everyone concedes Kane has been playing the best hockey of his career on a team that has been clicking, to say the least, he's still a whopping 6 points ahead of Backstrom.

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04-08-2013, 03:13 PM
  #75
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That wasn't Bäckstrom, that was Peter Forsberg.

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