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The Caps new nastier direction

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Old
04-23-2013, 11:49 AM
  #251
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Originally Posted by Kegger View Post
The match up is just not ideal. Maybe their speed?
Playoffs are a different beast. If the Isles make them they will soon find out.

Personally I don't think they are physical enough up and down their lineup. Guys like Vishnovsky and Strait are undersized dmen who play a ton of minutes. They have scant few forwards who play a gritty game. Matt Martin and Okposo can only do so much.

If the team that plays them correctly siezes on this advantage the Isles will be in trouble. As good as Nabakov has been vs the Caps in his career his playoff record is mixed at best.

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04-24-2013, 07:10 AM
  #252
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I realized last night, that it is probably not a coincidence that Wolski and Sarge are our regular scratches.

To all those that doubt tougher players are beneficial to a team, why are those 2 always scratched?

Going further, why is Oleksy in the lineup over Kundratek?

Its not a Randy and Rouse LLC conspiracy theory still, is it?

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04-24-2013, 07:25 AM
  #253
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The Caps being 9-1-0 in their last 10 convinces me that they are high contenders with the Penguins and the Islanders. As we've seen before; the last regular season games have implications in the playoffs.

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04-24-2013, 07:27 AM
  #254
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Its funny. Many posters will ignore this and its not just them. JP at Japersrink and RMNB they don't understand either. They pine for guys like Wolski based on advanced metrics mathematics or whatever while calling stats like "hits" useless since they are not consistent.

I am not going to deny...it sure felt good to see Johnny Rockstar make those plays.

The guy has been a beast all season and he came up huge for us in the biggest game of the year.

Oleksy and Erskine were leading the hit parade. Ovechkin crushed fools. Erat is finishing checks like a demon.

Once again we were more physical than our opponent. Its been a reoccuring trend during this streak.

What is our record with both Oleksy and Erskine in the lineup??? I'd be curious to see.

Give GMGM credit. He has come a long way in learning the ingredients necessary. He's still collecting them.

Also give Oates credit for promoting physical play. I would have never imagined he would

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04-24-2013, 07:34 AM
  #255
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There are no toughness metrics to drool over. You have to use your eyes. Watch the team come together, look at wins and losses.

I love that Oates sat down with each player and defined their roles on the team. You know what he told the tough players and they are doing it.

I wonder if Erat was targeted in part because he finishes checks. A hitter with talent in our top 6 is always welcome. Ovi cannot do it all himself. Conversely, does Forsberg have anything at all resembling a physical game?

You can almost see Erat getting better game by game. I don't know if our system is tough for an old vet like him to pick up. And I don't know if he was rushed back from injury what with Laich and the lack of potential callups, but he is impressing me with his physical and overall improving play.

Volpatti after a slow start is showing well. I don't mind Ward out if our 4th line keeps giving teams fits.

Who is odd man out if Ward comes back - Fehr?

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04-24-2013, 07:39 AM
  #256
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Right you are.

No physical play metrics so to the stat geeks this simply does not factor in. Its not just posters here like I said. Its pretty much every blogger and beat writer too.

I too am impressed with Volpatti. CHEESE call last night on him and horrible officiating by the crew all around. But the Caps won inspite of it. They dominated inspite of it. Good teams do that.

Erat has sure shown alot. What a player he is. Skill, speed, physical play, grit, solid two way play..he is the definition of a complete player.

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04-24-2013, 07:48 AM
  #257
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Going out with a bunch of bouncers to a bar, you are fearless. Running over Anderson with Patti Hendy and the boys at your back, you are fearless.

Toughness breeds confidence, which helps prevent over thinking anything that which has to be done. Thinking slows you down. It's is a fast game of reactions. If you think, you are dead. Maverick knows.

How to measure toughness. Hits and PIM's barely touches on it. Teams tire of facing those rough and tough teams. They are dreaming about Ovi trucking them in their pregame nap. They are thinking about it in pregame watching Oglethorpe circling around. Toughness spans more than just our own team. Players know they are going to get clobbered. No big deal. But it is a problem when they know they will never get clobbered. Like facing Sarge and others not too long ago.

Heck even Alzner last night was showing a little snarl, dropping the gloves and grabbing the shield of a much larger player. It almost seems like he has a little temper buried down in an otherwise even keeled player.


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04-24-2013, 08:26 AM
  #258
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Personally, I think Wolski and Schultz are scratches because they suck. I'd guess that if they were better players, they'd be getting jerseys despite their lack of toughness.

Now, don't get me wrong, I don't want the Caps to even have the option of dressing soft players.

I frankly don't want a move towards toughness via fringe players (Oleksy, Volpatti). I want a move towards toughness with major contributors. Get more Brouwers, or get a Beauchemin/Gleason/Robidas/Bieksa type.

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04-24-2013, 08:32 AM
  #259
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
Personally, I think Wolski and Schultz are scratches because they suck. I'd guess that if they were better players, they'd be getting jerseys despite their lack of toughness.

Now, don't get me wrong, I don't want the Caps to even have the option of dressing soft players.

I frankly don't want a move towards toughness via fringe players (Oleksy, Volpatti). I want a move towards toughness with major contributors. Get more Brouwers, or get a Beauchemin/Gleason/Robidas/Bieksa type.
I've watched Gleason a few times this year and Erskine is a superior player at this point. The guy is a shell of what he used to be.

If you hate Green's defensive miscues you will REALLY hate Bieksa's!!

Oleksy and Volpatti are 3rd pairing and 4th line guys who fill their roles quite well.

I agree that Wolski and Schultz suck. But try telling that to the stat geeks. "Wolksi's Corsi/Fenwick/Wonderlic blah blah blah are much better than Volpatti's!! He should be playing!! All hail Wolksi!!"

Personally I like JP and RMNB. But they have a thing or two to learn.

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04-24-2013, 08:34 AM
  #260
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
I frankly don't want a move towards toughness via fringe players (Oleksy, Volpatti). I want a move towards toughness with major contributors.

The only problem is that every team in the league wants more "Brouwer" type players, especially the Caps (see: Tom Wilson). The players who have skil, snarl and leadership qualities are few and far between, and they fetch a high price on the trade market/FA.

If Wilson develops into a Lucic-type player who can plant himself in front of the net and bring the sort of positive attitude he gives off... this team is going to be very good in the next 2-3 years.

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04-24-2013, 08:35 AM
  #261
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Suck is such a vague word.

Maybe they suck because they are not physical; they appear afraid to be physical and detest physical labor. They do the absolute least they can to survive. See Erskine diving face first to save a goal to start the game? Sarge would never do that. Ever.

Why is Oleksy in over Kundratek. Kundratek seems more polished and smooth, lets call it, maybe Orlov too, even at RD. Kund and Orlov don't suck per se.

Fact is physical play has been landing guys jobs in the NHL for decades if not an entire century. On our current team alone, 2 players openly admit they started fighting to get or ensure jobs. But its more than fighting, its a win at all costs mentality.

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04-24-2013, 08:38 AM
  #262
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Originally Posted by BobRouse View Post
I've watched Gleason a few times this year and Erskine is a superior player at this point. The guy is a shell of what he used to be.

If you hate Green's defensive miscues you will REALLY hate Bieksa's!!

Oleksy and Volpatti are 3rd pairing and 4th line guys who fill their roles quite well.

I agree that Wolski and Schultz suck. But try telling that to the stat geeks. "Wolksi's Corsi/Fenwick/Wonderlic blah blah blah are much better than Volpatti's!! He should be playing!! All hail Wolksi!!"

Personally I like JP and RMNB. But they have a thing or two to learn.
Haven't seen Gleason all that much this year, so you may well be right. But you get my point about him (at least his former self). 20+ minute a night rock who's tough as nails.

I hate Green's defensive miscues, but I don't hate Green for his defensive miscues, as I think they're greatly exaggerated.

Oleksy and Volpatti have been a bit incocnsistent, but have filled their roles well at times. They're still fringe guys though. I don't think 9 or 14 minutes a night of tough play has nearly as much impact as 18+.

Are people really advocating Wolski and Schultz play due to advanced stats? I haven't seen much of it, but it wouldn't surprise me. Those people are definitely out to lunch, IMO.

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04-24-2013, 08:42 AM
  #263
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Originally Posted by OVs Gold Chain View Post
The only problem is that every team in the league wants more "Brouwer" type players, especially the Caps (see: Tom Wilson). The players who have skil, snarl and leadership qualities are few and far between, and they fetch a high price on the trade market/FA.

If Wilson develops into a Lucic-type player who can plant himself in front of the net and bring the sort of positive attitude he gives off... this team is going to be very good in the next 2-3 years.
Murray, Iginla, and Morrow all moved at the deadline this year. Seidenberg and Beauchemin were moved a couple years ago. Clarkson will likely hit the market this year.

There are plenty of examples of those types being available. Gotta go out and get them. How much better would this team be now with Seidenberg or Beauchemin?

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04-24-2013, 08:49 AM
  #264
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Right on. Physical play is so vital but its more than just fighting and toughness. The players who actively engage in it are more likely the ones who will do anything it takes such as blocking shots, diving goal saves etc. Its an extention of the player willingness to compete. Their is no higher level of competitiveness than putting your body on the line for your team.

NBTW

I have not been impressed with Gleason at all. Erskine is improving for sure but sometimes having faith in a player can go a long way to unveiling what the player can truly give. The guy never got a fair shake under BB and especially Hunter who banished him in lieu of Schultz.

JP and RMNB seem to (no they DO) throw out a weekly snide remark about their displeasure of WWs benching. Its all based on their stupid stats. BRS can probably dig up the stats to show you where they are coming from.

Clearly they don't watch the games as closely as they should.

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04-24-2013, 08:51 AM
  #265
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
Murray, Iginla, and Morrow all moved at the deadline this year. Seidenberg and Beauchemin were moved a couple years ago. Clarkson will likely hit the market this year.

There are plenty of examples of those types being available. Gotta go out and get them. How much better would this team be now with Seidenberg or Beauchemin?
Well you gotta consider the intangibles and only Ray Shero knows that. GMGM doesn't know the intangibles for a successful trade. He changes them every year. One year we have a toughness identity and the next we're a skilled team with Jeff Schultz in the lineup.

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04-24-2013, 08:56 AM
  #266
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RH

Right on. Physical play is so vital but its more than just fighting and toughness. The players who actively engage in it are more likely the ones who will do anything it takes such as blocking shots, diving goal saves etc. Its an extention of the player willingness to compete. Their is no higher level of competitiveness than putting your body on the line for your team.

NBTW

I have not been impressed with Gleason at all. Erskine is improving for sure but sometimes having faith in a player can go a long way to unveiling what the player can truly give. The guy never got a fair shake under BB and especially Hunter who banished him in lieu of Schultz.

JP and RMNB seem to (no they DO) throw out a weekly snide remark about their displeasure of WWs benching. Its all based on their stupid stats. BRS can probably dig up the stats to show you where they are coming from.

Clearly they don't watch the games as closely as they should.
I'm a fan of Erskine. No need to defend him to me. I do think you're over-estimating his individual impact though. I also think he'd be more effective in a slightly reduced role--one where he doesn't have to kill penalties against quick teams or match up against speedy lines. It's one of the reasons I so badly want a top-notch 2LD. Erskine would be one of the best #6's in the NHL.

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04-24-2013, 09:03 AM
  #267
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
I'm a fan of Erskine. No need to defend him to me. I do think you're over-estimating his individual impact though. I also think he'd be more effective in a slightly reduced role--one where he doesn't have to kill penalties against quick teams or match up against speedy lines. It's one of the reasons I so badly want a top-notch 2LD. Erskine would be one of the best #6's in the NHL.
Nope. I think everyone else is actually under estimating his impact!

At one point the Rags thought Mark Tinordi nothing but a goon who couldn't skate. When he got his true chance with the Northstars he showed the quality of player he was.

The key is that he always elevates his play in the playoffs and important games.

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04-24-2013, 09:06 AM
  #268
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Hendricks goal celly.


Has someone made a gif? Now that was nasty.

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04-24-2013, 09:15 AM
  #269
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Well you gotta consider the intangibles and only Ray Shero knows that. GMGM doesn't know the intangibles for a successful trade. He changes them every year. One year we have a toughness identity and the next we're a skilled team with Jeff Schultz in the lineup.
Perhaps he is doing his coach's bidding? I think his vision changes depending on his coach and what they want our of their respective systems. For Bruce he got more finesse guys because that system was predicated on scoring on the transition, and now he's getting guys that fit Oates' system - big time forecheckers, physical players, finishing checks with some offensive hockey acumen. The Erat trade makes sense, especially watching him play lately. Perfect fit for what Oates wants to do. Am I off base here?

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04-24-2013, 09:21 AM
  #270
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Perhaps he is doing his coach's bidding? I think his vision changes depending on his coach and what they want our of their respective systems. For Bruce he got more finesse guys because that system was predicated on scoring on the transition, and now he's getting guys that fit Oates' system - big time forecheckers, physical players, finishing checks with some offensive hockey acumen. The Erat trade makes sense, especially watching him play lately. Perfect fit for what Oates wants to do. Am I off base here?
As a fan I will probably never know the intangibles to a good hockey team. But the sign of system changes, coaching changes, good players dropping to UFAs, failure in the FA market, and early playoff exits is a sign of a bad GM. GMGM should of been long gone.

Ya'll should tell me if I missed anything against him in this post.

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04-24-2013, 09:27 AM
  #271
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Let's say 15 years ago you bought some shares of stock (lets say man braziers known as "Bros") at they were $100 per share.

Lets say 5 years later they drop to $75 per share and are plummeting. You erroniously hang onto them.

Lets say 5 years after that they goto $40 per share and yet you still hang onto them.

But now lets say they are back up to $60 and climbing.

Do you sell now?

At this point I say hang onto them and see how far they can climb.

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04-24-2013, 09:36 AM
  #272
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Let's say 15 years ago you bought some shares of stock (lets say man braziers known as "Bros") at they were $100 per share.

Lets say 5 years later they drop to $75 per share and are plummeting. You erroniously hang onto them.

Lets say 5 years after that they goto $40 per share and yet you still hang onto them.

But now lets say they are back up to $60 and climbing.

Do you sell now?

At this point I say hang onto them and see how far they can climb.
If winning hockey games was about money, Luongo would be a nice contract. Are you GMGM's executive?

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04-24-2013, 10:25 AM
  #273
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If winning hockey games was about money, Luongo would be a nice contract. Are you GMGM's executive?
You know nothing about the Tinner. In due time you will be enlightened.

Fact: I'm always right. Probably good to acknowledge that now and save yourself the trouble.

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04-24-2013, 10:33 AM
  #274
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only Ray Shero knows that..
does shero understand this all the time or just the one time? am i wrong or havent the penguins since winning their cup have played fewer rounds of playoffs than the caps in that time including falling prey to the same embarrassing upset to montreal that the capitals did?

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04-24-2013, 02:00 PM
  #275
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Hendricks goal celly.


Has someone made a gif? Now that was nasty.
RMNB of course has it.

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