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Devils lose another SO to Sabres

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Old
04-08-2013, 01:22 AM
  #76
njdss4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinnie View Post
Keeping the #29 pick when we have to forfeit a first rounder was awful. Inexplicable and inexcusable.
I would have said that BEFORE seeing who we got and seeing him play, but not now. Matteau has a lot of potential, and didn't look outclassed for a good amount of the time he was on the team. Given some time to mature and develop, I can easily see him as a full time roster player for NJ. It was a risk for Lou to keep the pick, and I didn't get it at the time, but he won that bet.

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04-08-2013, 01:25 AM
  #77
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I almost would sign Woltek Wolski or a shootout specialist next year. This team is never gonna stop playing for the shootout no matter how many times they lose one.

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04-08-2013, 01:27 AM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Bleedred View Post
I hate bringing this guy up again cause it's in the past, and he ain't ever coming back. Remember the run with Lemaire? We went to overtime A LOT under him during that 3 month run in 2011. How many of those games went to a shootout? I can only remember just one. It was a game against the Islanders at Nassau Coliseum which we won after like 8 rounds or something. It was a long one. And then there was one with Pittsburgh in which Marty and MAF got dual shutouts, but we lost in the shootout. That was in late March after the team had run out of gas.

I remember so many OT games back then, and the team took care of business in OT. Kovy had a few OT winners, Tedenby had an OT winner, even Salmela had an OT winner. We also lost 2 games to the Deboer coached Panthers around that time in OT.
We were great in OT under Lemaire for two reasons:

-Puck luck - It wasn't sustainable.
-We were a rush team rather than a possession/forecheck team so the open ice helped. Now we're totally dependent on three man pressure which exposes us in 4v4 situations. Since we suck on the rush and our defense isn't fast enough to jump up to create dangerous odd-man rushes, we end up playing soft passes into space the same way we do when we're running the cycle in regulation. It's really, really ugly.

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04-08-2013, 01:29 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by njdss4 View Post
That's one of the big reasons I stopped going to games. Imagine the smug bandwagon drunk attitude of the home fans AND the Devils losing every game you go to. It's a horribly depressing combination.
Yup especially rivalry games. Those are the absolute WORST. I've been to 1 Devils/Rangers game in my lifetime and it was during the 97 playoff series. I don't remember a whole lot because I was 8 years old but from what my dad tells me it wasn't fun. That was the game when Kovalev won it OT lol. I went to a White Sox/Cubs game back in 2006. God awful experience

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04-08-2013, 01:34 AM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yakitate304 View Post
We were great in OT under Lemaire for two reasons:

-Puck luck - It wasn't sustainable.
-We were a rush team rather than a possession/forecheck team so the open ice helped. Now we're totally dependent on three man pressure which exposes us in 4v4 situations. Since we suck on the rush and our defense isn't fast enough to jump up to create dangerous odd-man rushes, we end up playing soft passes into space the same way we do when we're running the cycle in regulation. It's really, really ugly.
You would think at least we could win more than one game in the OT period out of our 10 OT games in which we didn't lose in the OT period. We lost 2 games in OT on the PP, and another one even strength. Then we've had 10 other OT games with all but one going into a shootout. The first OT game of the season with Kovy scoring with about less than 20 seconds remaining.

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04-08-2013, 01:35 AM
  #81
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I'm still torn about keeping the pick from last year. After seeing Matteau this year I think he can be real solid player for us. The problem is he doesn't really seem like a goal scorer, more of a 3rd liner and that might be a problem because lord knows this team needs guys who can score. It's obviously too early to grade that selection. I think we obviously forfeit the 2014 pick. We should all hope and pray we have damn good year next season because if we don't and we give that pick up and it ends up being top 10-15 then there wont be many happy campers around here lol

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04-08-2013, 01:51 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by njdss4 View Post
I would have said that BEFORE seeing who we got and seeing him play, but not now. Matteau has a lot of potential, and didn't look outclassed for a good amount of the time he was on the team. Given some time to mature and develop, I can easily see him as a full time roster player for NJ. It was a risk for Lou to keep the pick, and I didn't get it at the time, but he won that bet.
You can't say that because you don't know what we're giving up next year.

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04-08-2013, 01:54 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by ChicagoDevilsfan26 View Post
I'm still torn about keeping the pick from last year. After seeing Matteau this year I think he can be real solid player for us. The problem is he doesn't really seem like a goal scorer, more of a 3rd liner and that might be a problem because lord knows this team needs guys who can score. It's obviously too early to grade that selection. I think we obviously forfeit the 2014 pick. We should all hope and pray we have damn good year next season because if we don't and we give that pick up and it ends up being top 10-15 then there wont be many happy campers around here lol
I think Matteau has a ceiling of being a Zubrus, as many others have pointed out. If he bulks up, skates hard, crashes the net, he can be a huge part of the core of the future of the team. Not leading the team in any category, but a solid contributor who wins battles along the boards and gets garbage goals and in-close deflections. Just gotta make sure he gets the proper amount of time to develop...

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Originally Posted by Vinnie View Post
You can't say that because you don't know what we're giving up next year.
If that's your reasoning, then neither do you, so you can't call anything 'Inexplicable and inexcusable' yet. Matteau has real potential.

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04-08-2013, 01:58 AM
  #84
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Not gonna lie glad i watched wreslemania instead. oh im drunk

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04-08-2013, 02:10 AM
  #85
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I have a feeling we wont be making the playoffs..

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04-08-2013, 04:45 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by Bleedred View Post
I don't know about you guys but the Maclean half season just seems to be getting further and further away after this season. It's becoming a distant memory after the last two months. Honestly the team hasn't been much better the last 7 or 8 weeks. The defense is much better than that half season. It was non existent the entire time. The offense though isn't any stronger. Only that team has a better group of forwards even when Parise went down injured. This team really does not. Even Zajac had 22 points by game 39 of that season, as opposed to 14 in 39.
I don't understand how so many can say that that group of forwards was better:
Kovalchuk-Zajac-Palmieri
Rolston-Elias-Zubrus
Zharkov-Arnott-Tedenby
Pelley-Sestito-Clarkson

Nick ****ing Palmieri is on the top line. Kovalchuk carried the top line (and arguably the entire offense). Second line was OK (primarily carried by Elias IMO). Tedenby had a good season, but Zharkov Pelley and Sestito are three forwards who did absolutely nothing. Arnott was OK but nothing special, then got traded and was replaced by Josefson I believe (who had a decent stretch of 20 games or so?). Clarkson also did nothing special that season.

Just because Kovalchuk carried that team and Lemaire got the most of that lineup does not make them a better group of forwards. All things being equal, under PDB's coaching I would take the current lineup over that one any day.

They have not played up to their abilities this season. End of story.


Last edited by guitarguyvic: 04-08-2013 at 04:54 AM.
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04-08-2013, 05:43 AM
  #87
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If you want to look at the glass as half-full, as long as we're within 3 points of the Rangers going into the last week, we technically could still get in...


(but more likely is this -> )

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04-08-2013, 06:47 AM
  #88
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I miss Zach, I really do. I've watched the team bleed superstars through the years and gotten over it faster than this. I think all the losing just adds salt to the wound.
Thing is they still had enough guys around to compensate when Stevens/Nieds/Holik/etc left. Parise leaving was the final straw though. There's just not enough depth in the organization to compensate for him, and him leaving as captain also compelled us to fill the void with Salvador, creating other on-ice issues.

Quote:
Nick ****ing Palmieri is on the top line.
And who's been on the top line this year? A too-young Matteau, too-old Sullivan or too-invisible Poni? Not like that's been any better.

How many goals you honestly think this forward core puts up in a season if they weren't 'underachieving'?

Kovy (35), Elias (20-25), Clarkson (20-25), Henrique (15-20), Zajac (post-Parise probably 15), CBGB (20-25 goals combined), Loiktonov (15-20), Zubrus (10-15), current fourth line fill-ins (about another 7-10). That's like barely 180+ in a 'best' case scenario. And you ain't getting much from the D either. Pretty easy to shut down that forward core with barely two other 20+ scorers besides Kovy, and one can't create his own offense.


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04-08-2013, 07:01 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by NJDevs26 View Post
Thing is they still had enough guys around to compensate when Stevens/Nieds/Holik/etc left. Parise leaving was the final straw though. There's just not enough depth in the organization to compensate for him, and him leaving as captain also compelled us to fill the void with Salvador, creating other on-ice issues.



And who's been on the top line this year? A too-young Matteau, too-old Sullivan or too-invisible Poni? Not like that's been any better.

How many goals you honestly think this forward core puts up in a season if they weren't 'underachieving'?

Kovy (35), Elias (20-25), Clarkson (20-25), Henrique (15-20), Zajac (post-Parise probably 15), CBGB (20-25 goals combined), Loiktonov (15-20), various first-line wing fill-ins (currently about 5), current fourth line (about another 5-7). That's like 175-180 in a 'best' case scenario. And you ain't getting much from the D either. Pretty easy to shut down that forward core with barely two other 20+ scorers besides Kovy, and one can't create his own offense.
Sullivan has been fantastic in the two games he's played..

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04-08-2013, 07:07 AM
  #90
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Well guy acts like the forwards this year are soooo much better than two years ago, which was also a massive underachievement. They've had 77 goals from forwards in 39 games this year. They had 153 goals from forwards in 82 games two years ago. They're BARELY ahead of that pace now.

Plus they had 148 goals from non-Parise/Sykora forwards 'last' year. Why should I be surprised they're on a similar pace, or think that pace is good?

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04-08-2013, 07:30 AM
  #91
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I remember asking where the goals were going to come from this year.

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04-08-2013, 07:37 AM
  #92
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was curious, so checked out Chicago's stats.. they are leading the league in GF right now.

They currently have 106 goals from their forwards.

We have: 84 (not sure where you got 77).

22G difference over 38 GP. Difference of .6 GPG.

That's pretty significant but that's also the gap between almost last and first. This team's forward crop isn't really too far from producing at an average level as is, which isn't too bad considering they've been down Kovy for two weeks now and missed Zubrus for most of the season (not even considering the struggles).

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04-08-2013, 08:09 AM
  #93
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I almost would sign Woltek Wolski or a shootout specialist next year. This team is never gonna stop playing for the shootout no matter how many times they lose one.
Jussi Jokinen was available last week

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04-08-2013, 08:15 AM
  #94
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Originally Posted by Devils Dominion View Post
Jussi Jokinen was available last week
Who cares about Jokinen, we picked up Sullivan and Kostopoulos.

To me, it says more about our finances then anything else. If Lou was "forced" to pick up dead beats via the waiver wire, why not take a shot at Jokinen, who's a much better player then the guys we picked up threw out the year and went unclaimed?

If that's the case, I don't see us keeping Zubrus, Elias and Clarkson this offseason and to their defense, I don't know I'd resign in NJ myself, considering we're about to lose our HOF'er netminder in the next 24 months and that we're currently on a MacLean'esq losing streak to finish out the year.

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04-08-2013, 08:21 AM
  #95
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I say we're probably going to be picking 9th. Very few forward prospects around 8-13. I hope Lou picks best available defensemen and doesnt reach for a forward. Darnell Nurse would be nice for us.

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04-08-2013, 08:21 AM
  #96
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Not even going to lie I wore my Parise wild T-shirt last night because I still love watching the guy play. When people leave the organization they're usually dead to me but this is a special case since I was fortunate enough to live in the dorms with him at UND and watch all his games live.

Its going to take us a long time to overcome that loss due to goals, leadership, etc etc. Perfect example of what hard work gets you in life. Nowhere near the most talented player in the league, but he goes anywhere on the ice, dominates the corners and has that "thats my puck and you're not going to take it from me" attitude. Hell, I still have some of his posters in my hallway. Can't bring myself to take them down...

Really tough pill to swallow at the end of the day. I understand why he wanted to go home, but God damn it hurts. He could've retired as a devil with the "C" on his chest and his number in the rafters..

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04-08-2013, 08:31 AM
  #97
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Originally Posted by BrodeursCups View Post
Not even going to lie I wore my Parise wild T-shirt last night because I still love watching the guy play. When people leave the organization they're usually dead to me but this is a special case since I was fortunate enough to live in the dorms with him at UND and watch all his games live.

Its going to take us a long time to overcome that loss due to goals, leadership, etc etc. Perfect example of what hard work gets you in life. Nowhere near the most talented player in the league, but he goes anywhere on the ice, dominates the corners and has that "thats my puck and you're not going to take it from me" attitude. Hell, I still have some of his posters in my hallway. Can't bring myself to take them down...

Really tough pill to swallow at the end of the day. I understand why he wanted to go home, but God damn it hurts. He could've retired as a devil with the "C" on his chest and his number in the rafters..
Your circumstances are different since you're a North Dakota alum and know Zach.

But as a fanbase, we have to acknowledge that we has a great player for us, one of the best overall in team history when you factor in all areas of the game, not just stats.

But, we also have to acknowledge that he chose to leave an organization that:
1. Traded up to draft him
2. Did everything in their power to develop him the right way
3. Made him captain
4. Just got to the Finals and two wins from a Cup

It's a business, but his decision to hightail it out of NJ leaves a bitter taste in the mouths of our fanbase.
Especially the manner in which him and his buddy basically premeditated the move and the lack of respect Zach gave us fans and our franchise.

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04-08-2013, 08:39 AM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Devils Dominion View Post
Your circumstances are different since you're a North Dakota alum and know Zach.

But as a fanbase, we have to acknowledge that we has a great player for us, one of the best overall in team history when you factor in all areas of the game, not just stats.

But, we also have to acknowledge that he chose to leave an organization that:
1. Traded up to draft him
2. Did everything in their power to develop him the right way
3. Made him captain
4. Just got to the Finals and two wins from a Cup

It's a business, but his decision to hightail it out of NJ leaves a bitter taste in the mouths of our fanbase.
Especially the manner in which him and his buddy basically premeditated the move and the lack of respect Zach gave us fans and our franchise.
The writting was on the wall when he signed that one year deal, making him a pending UFA. Lou should've traded his ass right then and there cause we all knew what was about to happen... well a few knew, the rest were still hoping for the best possible outcome.

I know, I know... we probably wouldn't of made it to the finals blablabla but we wouldn't be in this brutal position this year and the upcoming years as well, considering Patty and Marty are getting older and that we have no real solution long term to rectify our lack of depth up front and in nets.

Anyways, what's done is done but it would be fun to see Lou a little more proactive when a player flat out tells you that he's going to move on and that's what that one year contract ment the second he inked it.

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04-08-2013, 08:40 AM
  #99
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Originally Posted by Devils Dominion View Post
Your circumstances are different since you're a North Dakota alum and know Zach.

But as a fanbase, we have to acknowledge that we has a great player for us, one of the best overall in team history when you factor in all areas of the game, not just stats.

But, we also have to acknowledge that he chose to leave an organization that:
1. Traded up to draft him
2. Did everything in their power to develop him the right way
3. Made him captain
4. Just got to the Finals and two wins from a Cup

It's a business, but his decision to hightail it out of NJ leaves a bitter taste in the mouths of our fanbase.
Especially the manner in which him and his buddy basically premeditated the move and the lack of respect Zach gave us fans and our franchise.
Believe me I understand the venom. There's some on my end as well. I won't criticize anyone who hated on him because he did give us fans a lot of lip service throughout the year until the time he was gone. Especially at that rally outside the rock when the team returned from LA. "Dont worry about it" I think it was when everyone started chanting for him to come back.

I bought it. Honestly thought he'd come back because the team was built to win with him and he had unfinished business. Until a few days before when a few people who know him texted me that it wasn't going to be us. Huge gut punch. We won't ever see a player like that again.

BTW you want to hear something weird? I went to the Devs game in Nashville last season and bought a yellow suter player T-shirt. Forgot about it until a few months ago when I was cleaning. It was sitting in my closet sandwiched between two Parise shirts


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04-08-2013, 08:58 AM
  #100
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As bleak as things look, the Devils still really have a decent chance to make the playoffs. What's making it not seem possible is just how much they've lost over these last couple of months. But this is going to break at some point. It has to. They're just not going to keep on losing every single game they play.

I'm ditching the shootout losses. Those are ties if you ask me. If you look at it that way, NJ has 7 ties, they're a couple of game under .500 (15 - 17 - 7) and they're a team who struggles to score. They were also low on depth for a long amount of time. All things considered, their record is probably where it should be.

At the very least, they've done enough to hang around and stay relevant. They bought some time to find a way to start winning. Look at it this way, they have 9 games to play and every single one of them is still significant. It could be a lot worse when you really think about it. It's very possible that we'll be looking back at all of this frustration and laughing about it in a couple of weeks.


Last edited by Sir Fenwick Corsi: 04-08-2013 at 09:06 AM.
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