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2013 NHL Entry Draft Thread | "Don't Be A Moran, Draft Monahan"

View Poll Results: Who Would You Draft Of These Options?
Sean Monahan 141 52.61%
Elias Lindholm 26 9.70%
Valeri Nischushkin 34 12.69%
Darnell Nurse 45 16.79%
Rasmus Ristolainen 8 2.99%
Curtis Lazar 14 5.22%
Voters: 268. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
04-24-2013, 04:34 PM
  #851
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1) Jones AINEC if we get 1st overall

2) IMO Barkov is more impressive than Mackinnon

3) For those worried about Barkov's skating - he's by no means "slow" for his size. He's a solid skater and it's been his biggest improving skill over the last year or so. A Finnish poster pointed out that every time he goes through a mini growth spurt, there's a 3-4 month period for which his skating gets awkward, but recovers soon after. He recently added another 1.5 inches to his frame, and there was a bit of a buffer period - but apparently towards the end of the season he was looking solid once again.

No one ever seems to complain about Getzlaf/Koivu/Thornton's speed - these players dominate the game using possession, puck-protection, and pace-control. They don't need to be going 100mph like Hall/Yak/RNH/Ebs to produce. It'll be refreshing to have a player like that on this roster.

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Old
04-24-2013, 04:36 PM
  #852
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How would people compare Drouin to Eberle? Seem to be similar sized and have a lot of the same strengths.
Drouin has the drive and X- factor that Eberle doesn't have. I see Drouin as much more of a competitor than Eberle has even shown.

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04-24-2013, 04:36 PM
  #853
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I don't know, I think about it from the reverse, would you want to trade down to 4? I know I wouldn't personally. I think the Oilers would be hard pressed to trade up. Jones is pretty beastly.
It would depend a lot on how big I think the gap is between the top four. If I think it's miniscule, then perhaps I see trading down as an opportunity to nab two fine young players instead of one. I'm not too familiar with Flordia's situation--are their forwards or defence prospects stronger? Assuming Florida gets the pick, anyway. Could be anyone this year.

If I think Barkov, Druin and MacKinnon are better than Jones, or maybe just safer bets at forward, I would actively look to trade down to a team that was high on Jones, get something, and still end up with one of the three. The price might only be a second round pick if you trade down to three, but you might get a pretty good young player (like Paajarvi) or a pretty good young prospect (like Marincin) for your trouble.

A lot of it depends significantly on factors that we won't know until we see the final draft order, who's at number one, etcetera, and one very important factor we won't know, the opinion of that particular organization on the top prospects.

But if you're MacTavish, and you've promised a big splash, you might consider getting aggressive on this in a way you haven't in the past, simply because there's only one of the big four that fits a gaping organizational need. That being a clear, all-around number one defenceman. You've already got your franchise centre in Nugent-Hopkins, already got your franchise wingers in Hall and Yakupov, and you've got some other nice pieces up front with Eberle and Gagner and Paajarvi. But is Justin Schultz someone who evolves into a number one defenceman, or a second-pairing even strength defenceman that kills on the powerplay? I don't know, but I think having someone you know who will be able to dominate tough minutes eventually in the system helps. If Schultz gets to that level too, all the better.

If you have a long-term top-four of:

Jones-Petry
Klefbom-Schultz

I think you're doing pretty well. AS LONG AS THEY GET GOOD VETERANS TO FILL IN THE GAP WHILE THEY LET THE YOUNG PLAYERS GROW INTO THOSE ROLES.

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04-24-2013, 04:39 PM
  #854
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I would personally love to draft Monahan. The guy is an automatic on draws and has the size and skill to be a good 2C for us. Also, he has maintained his offensive production even though he is on a crappy team.The guy does everything well. If we were to pick in that 4th/5th spot I would pick this guy ahead of Barkov and Lindholm (I know I'm in the minority)

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04-24-2013, 04:39 PM
  #855
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Honestly in this scenario I wouldn't go nuts if they took MacKinnon and then turned around and dealt Gagner for a solid NHL seasoned d-man who was in their 20s.

That said, I think they would make the simple choice there and just take Jones.
we aren't going to win the lottery, but lets play that game just for fun

we win the lottery but really want barkov or mackinnon (take your pick).... we trade back to #2, but part of the trade is we give up gagner, and coming back to us is that teams (whomever it may be, likely florida i guess) 2nd or 3rd line C? maybe we throw in a 2nd rounder to get their 2nd line C? would that be fair?

the other team gets to move one spot up to draft jones, gagner and a 2nd rounder, for their 1 spot lower draft position and 2nd line center

highly unlikely, but its fun to make up ridiculous trades, lol... the real show-stopper here is that the team is likely to be florida, and other than huberdeau, i don't like any of their centres

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Old
04-24-2013, 04:40 PM
  #856
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No one honestly thinks someone like Morrissey or Lazar is going to dip to the second round, right?

Wouldn't mind MacT packaging something for Morrissey. What a skater.

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04-24-2013, 04:41 PM
  #857
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Originally Posted by Hemsky_83 View Post
1) Jones AINEC if we get 1st overall

2) IMO Barkov is more impressive than Mackinnon

3) For those worried about Barkov's skating - he's by no means "slow" for his size. He's a solid skater and it's been his biggest improving skill over the last year or so. A Finnish poster pointed out that every time he goes through a mini growth spurt, there's a 3-4 month period for which his skating gets awkward, but recovers soon after. He recently added another 1.5 inches to his frame, and there was a bit of a buffer period - but apparently towards the end of the season he was looking solid once again.

No one ever seems to complain about Getzlaf/Koivu/Thornton's speed - these players dominate the game using possession, puck-protection, and pace-control. They don't need to be going 100mph like Hall/Yak/RNH/Ebs to produce. It'll be refreshing to have a player like that on this roster.
yeah i am likely one of the biggest barkov fans on the board... if we won the lottery, i would think about trading down 1 or 2 spots in order to take barkov and grab another asset from the trade-down .... i'm also very leery of drafting Dmen in the top-5

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04-24-2013, 04:42 PM
  #858
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As much as I like MacKinnon, and think he and RNH would eventually be the best 1-2 C punch in the west, a big 50p+ 25-30 min a night D man is just too rare to pass up. There are generally only ever a few in the league at a time, and the teams with them tend to be good ones.

I think we'd have to go with Jones if we win the lottery.
If MacKinnon falls to us, fantastic. I don't think that necessarily means you rush to deal Gagner, unless he's a key cog in a Weber deal. No need to expect him to be a second line centre in the league right away. If he starts to establish himself, you can always move Gagner to the wing. But I think we have a similar player type to all of the forwards. We don't have a similar player type to Jones. And I think the twenty five minutes a night defenceman who can consistently get the puck going in the right direction is more valuable than a similar impact of forward, simply because that defenceman is on the ice a lot more than a Nugent-Hopkins or a Hall.

Basically, if you can get him, draft him. But don't start him any higher in the line-up than #6. Same with Klefbom if he makes the team.

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04-24-2013, 04:42 PM
  #859
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Originally Posted by nofool6110 View Post
No one honestly thinks someone like Morrissey or Lazar is going to dip to the second round, right?

Wouldn't mind MacT packaging something for Morrissey. What a skater.
Gagner could probably net us a mid round pick and a second pairing D man. We could then use that extra pick and our seconds to move up to grab somebody like Morrisey.

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04-24-2013, 04:43 PM
  #860
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No one honestly thinks someone like Morrissey or Lazar is going to dip to the second round, right?

Wouldn't mind MacT packaging something for Morrissey. What a skater.
Lazar's size and lack of production in the playoffs will push him down there, imo.

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04-24-2013, 04:46 PM
  #861
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Lazar's size and lack of production in the playoffs will push him down there, imo.
I think Lazar is a safe bet to be a guy who brings strong two-way play and some offense to your second and third lines, as the guy who is the first choice to shift up a line if someone goes down to injury. Basically, I think he's Jarret Stoll. That's a guy I would love to grab with a late round or early second round pick. If the Oilers trade up to get him by dealing their second and another later pick, I would be okay with that. The concern I have is that they tend to overvalue Oil Kings. If they deal something important to grab a mid-round first round pick to take him, I'll be less pleased.

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04-24-2013, 04:48 PM
  #862
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It would depend a lot on how big I think the gap is between the top four. If I think it's miniscule, then perhaps I see trading down as an opportunity to nab two fine young players instead of one. I'm not too familiar with Flordia's situation--are their forwards or defence prospects stronger? Assuming Florida gets the pick, anyway. Could be anyone this year.

If I think Barkov, Druin and MacKinnon are better than Jones, or maybe just safer bets at forward, I would actively look to trade down to a team that was high on Jones, get something, and still end up with one of the three. The price might only be a second round pick if you trade down to three, but you might get a pretty good young player (like Paajarvi) or a pretty good young prospect (like Marincin) for your trouble.

A lot of it depends significantly on factors that we won't know until we see the final draft order, who's at number one, etcetera, and one very important factor we won't know, the opinion of that particular organization on the top prospects.

But if you're MacTavish, and you've promised a big splash, you might consider getting aggressive on this in a way you haven't in the past, simply because there's only one of the big four that fits a gaping organizational need. That being a clear, all-around number one defenceman. You've already got your franchise centre in Nugent-Hopkins, already got your franchise wingers in Hall and Yakupov, and you've got some other nice pieces up front with Eberle and Gagner and Paajarvi. But is Justin Schultz someone who evolves into a number one defenceman, or a second-pairing even strength defenceman that kills on the powerplay? I don't know, but I think having someone you know who will be able to dominate tough minutes eventually in the system helps. If Schultz gets to that level too, all the better.

If you have a long-term top-four of:

Jones-Petry
Klefbom-Schultz

I think you're doing pretty well. AS LONG AS THEY GET GOOD VETERANS TO FILL IN THE GAP WHILE THEY LET THE YOUNG PLAYERS GROW INTO THOSE ROLES.
Agreed, I'm just saying it makes little sense for Florida to trade the kid (or the possibility to pick the kid) because he's an elite talent and he's SO easy to market. American Kid, lots of skill, son of a former NBA player, SO easy to market.

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04-24-2013, 04:49 PM
  #863
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I think Lazar is a safe bet to be a guy who brings strong two-way play and some offense to your second and third lines, as the guy who is the first choice to shift up a line if someone goes down to injury. Basically, I think he's Jarret Stoll. That's a guy I would love to grab with a late round or early second round pick. If the Oilers trade up to get him by dealing their second and another later pick, I would be okay with that. The concern I have is that they tend to overvalue Oil Kings. If they deal something important to grab a mid-round first round pick to take him, I'll be less pleased.
If the Oilers get him with a mid first rounder, that's fine too, the kid is going to be good, imo. He's like Jarret Stoll, just tougher and with more offensive skill. I think whatever team gets him will realize right away they've found a gem. I'm not bothered by his size or the production, I'm just saying what I think might happen.

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04-24-2013, 04:52 PM
  #864
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No one honestly thinks someone like Morrissey or Lazar is going to dip to the second round, right?

Wouldn't mind MacT packaging something for Morrissey. What a skater.
Highly highly doubt Lazar drops to the second round. He'll likely be picked 20-25 IMO. Even if they do manage to take Barkov high up, I hope they trade up for Lazar. If they can have Hopkins-Barkov-Lazar down the middle they'll be in a great spot for years.

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04-24-2013, 04:54 PM
  #865
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If the Oilers get him with a mid first rounder, that's fine too, the kid is going to be good, imo. He's like Jarret Stoll, just tougher and with more offensive skill. I think whatever team gets him will realize right away they've found a gem. I'm not bothered by his size or the production, I'm just saying what I think might happen.
I think it'd be a reach to pick him in the mid first round, but that's not what bothers me--what bothers me is that I think the price to get yourself into the middle of the first round is substantially higher than trading up into the late first round with a high second round pick as part of the package. I think you get get a late first round pick to take Lazar with a second and a third. I think you got to give up a good player, potentially one with a better NHL career ahead, and a second round pick, to find him in the middle of the first round. I'm thinking that to get to 13-17, it would require their second round pick plus Marincin. That bothers me, because i think Marincin's ceiling is higher.

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04-24-2013, 04:56 PM
  #866
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Agreed, I'm just saying it makes little sense for Florida to trade the kid (or the possibility to pick the kid) because he's an elite talent and he's SO easy to market. American Kid, lots of skill, son of a former NBA player, SO easy to market.
Perhaps, but in some ways, wouldn't a more dynamic offensive player be easier to market than a guy who will likely be mostly a shutdown defender early in his career? Goals are more marketable than their prevention. I understand what you're saying, I just don't think it's a clear cut case of Jones being flat out easier to market as the shiny piece from the draft. It also helps that forwards tend to make an impact earlier in the NHL. Jones might get sent back to junior next year.

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04-24-2013, 04:59 PM
  #867
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Drouin has the drive and X- factor that Eberle doesn't have. I see Drouin as much more of a competitor than Eberle has even shown.
Wow, either you don't know much of Eberle's past or your just plain ignorant.

He's having a bad year, give the guy a break.

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04-24-2013, 05:03 PM
  #868
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Perhaps, but in some ways, wouldn't a more dynamic offensive player be easier to market than a guy who will likely be mostly a shutdown defender early in his career? Goals are more marketable than their prevention. I understand what you're saying, I just don't think it's a clear cut case of Jones being flat out easier to market as the shiny piece from the draft. It also helps that forwards tend to make an impact earlier in the NHL. Jones might get sent back to junior next year.
Jones is NHL ready now, he'd be better then all of the Oilers bottom-6 pairing guys (Whitney, Fistric, Peckham and Potter 'the bloggers fav'), the kid is the Real Deal.

I agree a guy like Drouin with his flashy offense would be fun to watch, but I'm saying as a sell to casual American fans from the South, the kid being American and the NBA tie in would make things relateable (kind of)

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04-24-2013, 05:08 PM
  #869
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I think it'd be a reach to pick him in the mid first round, but that's not what bothers me--what bothers me is that I think the price to get yourself into the middle of the first round is substantially higher than trading up into the late first round with a high second round pick as part of the package. I think you get get a late first round pick to take Lazar with a second and a third. I think you got to give up a good player, potentially one with a better NHL career ahead, and a second round pick, to find him in the middle of the first round. I'm thinking that to get to 13-17, it would require their second round pick plus Marincin. That bothers me, because i think Marincin's ceiling is higher.
Agreed, but I don't think the Oilers part with a piece "that valuable", nor do I think they would trade THAT far into the 1st round. I think moving out one of the "prospect" forwards and a pick might let them get into the 18-25 range, if they were to so choose, but I only see them moving Marincin if it's a larger package for a top-4 defenseman.

I get the feeling they are very happy with his development.

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04-24-2013, 05:11 PM
  #870
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if the oilers are happy with the prospects at defence we have currently then we are destined to lose for a lot longer. we have a lot of 'good' prospects that could potentially be good players in the nhl but hardly the stuff of greatness.

i want to have a balanced team with great defence and great offence. i sometimes feel like this organization does not value defencemen enough.

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04-24-2013, 05:13 PM
  #871
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if the oilers are happy with the prospects at defence we have currently then we are destined to lose for a lot longer. we have a lot of 'good' prospects that could potentially be good players in the nhl but hardly the stuff of greatness.

i want to have a balanced team with great defence and great offence. i sometimes feel like this organization does not value defencemen enough.
I think the idea is more where their "prospects" are, realizing that most defensive prospects take longer to come along then those up front.

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04-24-2013, 05:16 PM
  #872
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if the oilers are happy with the prospects at defence we have currently then we are destined to lose for a lot longer. we have a lot of 'good' prospects that could potentially be good players in the nhl but hardly the stuff of greatness.

i want to have a balanced team with great defence and great offence. i sometimes feel like this organization does not value defencemen enough.
we have a much stronger Pipeline of blue than forwards.



We lack actual NHL Dmen, drafting one other than Jones doesn't get us one for at least 2 years.

If we took a center and waited a year or two, that would be fine, since we have Gagner/Hemsky possible others we are tentatively holding on to until we feel we have the right move available or mix on our team.

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04-24-2013, 05:17 PM
  #873
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we have a much stronger Pipeline of blue than forwards.



We lack actual NHL Dmen, drafting one other than Jones doesn't get us one for at least 2 years.

If we took a center and waited a year or two, that would be fine, since we have Gagner/Hemsky possible others we are tentatively holding on to until we feel we have the right move available or mix on our team.
Pretty much, this, even if they were to get Jones, and I REALLY want them to, they would still have to get another top-4.

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04-24-2013, 05:22 PM
  #874
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I think the idea is more where their "prospects" are, realizing that most defensive prospects take longer to come along then those up front.
yeah you are right. i guess the big wildcard will be klefbom. if he can become a legit top pairing d then i will be very content!

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04-24-2013, 05:28 PM
  #875
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yeah you are right. i guess the big wildcard will be klefbom. if he can become a legit top pairing d then i will be very content!
Hell if he can become a legit top-4 in the next few years the Oilers should be laugh, top-4 defensemen don't grow on trees, lol

And to the Oilers suggestion of "trading down", I think the idea would be to Both gain assets to either help the team or help facilitate another move (top 1st + Mid 1st + prospect for Number 1 and contract, use mid 1st with Gagner/Hemsky to get something)

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