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Old
04-14-2013, 10:49 PM
  #26
Up the Irons
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Originally Posted by copper_blue View Post
- Anyone who doesn't take 3 years to analyze his team.

- Anyone who likes gritty players

- Anyone who likes players that crash the net

- Anyone who likes players that are a pain in the ass to play against.

- Anyone who likes energy players

- Anyone who will provide a real supporting cast for our young upcoming stars
This. And i would add: anyone that doesn't develop an affection, loyalty or man crush for any of his current players. It would almost surely be Mact, and while that is better than keeping Tambo, it does prove the ol' boys club of ex Oilers never ended. Somewhat disturbing.


Last edited by Up the Irons: 04-14-2013 at 10:59 PM. Reason: o
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Old
04-14-2013, 10:54 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Paralyzer008 View Post
This is my list, once again:
Jim Nill
Stu MacGregor
Doug Risebrough
Rick Dudley
Paul Fenton
Jeff Gorton
Brad Treliving
Jason Botterill

You hire the guy with the best interview and best fit from that list.
Just adding the credentials of each guy here:
Nill-Detroit longtime assistant GM
MacGregor-Our Head Amateur Scout
Risebrough-Former Oiler VP of Hockey Operations, Rangers scout, Former Wild GM
Dudley-Former Thrashers GM, Canadiens scouting
Fenton-Preds assistant GM
Gorton-Rangers assistant GM
Treliving-Coyotes assistant GM
Botterill-Pens assistant GM

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Old
04-14-2013, 11:00 PM
  #28
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Old
04-14-2013, 11:01 PM
  #29
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the man who likes to turn things around

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Old
04-14-2013, 11:05 PM
  #30
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What about Frank Provenzano, Assistant GM of the Stars?

No matter what you think of Burke's personality there are a number of reasons why it wouldn't work.

Bringing Burke in would require absolutely blowing up the Oilers front office. Lowe gone. MacT gone. Obviously Tambo gone. Howson probably gone. Clearly some people would like that.

As appealing as a total house cleaning would be to many people it would signal a re-boot of the re-build and put the team back two or three years.

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04-14-2013, 11:08 PM
  #31
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Jim Nill


Realistically, totally agree with Jason Botterill. Has university education in Economics, experience in player development and experience assisting a well run franchise. Was a player too, so he has some hockey connections and is from edmonton.


May be the minority, but I also wouldn't mind seeing Rick Dudley get another chance somewhere. He's coached at the professional level and while he never had real success as a GM he did a lot of good things. He's had bad luck imo, but has been a big part of the Leafs rebuild.


I'd also like Burke, who I don't really like, but see him as a consistent and experienced GM

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04-14-2013, 11:12 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Paralyzer008 View Post
MacGregor-Our Head Amateur Scout
MacG is an asset to the oilers, but I wouldn't want him as a GM. He was part of some pretty heavy mismanagment in his time with the Blazers. Good scout, but you have to be a cunning dealmaker to be a good GM imo

Not mentioned in this thread but I like Rick Olczyk, his only blemish to me is he's part of the current regime, but he's smart.

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Old
04-14-2013, 11:15 PM
  #33
dnicks17
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If they want an experienced guy, I hope it's Rick Dudley.

Look what he did with Atlanta. They were in a very similar situation to this team. He went out and added Byfuglien, Ladd, Wheeler and Stuart before he was let go when the team moved to Winnipeg. They're definitely reaping the benefits of his moves now.


If they want a young up and comer, I like Oilbleeder's pick in Jason Botterill.

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04-14-2013, 11:15 PM
  #34
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Old
04-14-2013, 11:16 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shoop View Post
What about Frank Provenzano, Assistant GM of the Stars?

No matter what you think of Burke's personality there are a number of reasons why it wouldn't work.

Bringing Burke in would require absolutely blowing up the Oilers front office. Lowe gone. MacT gone. Obviously Tambo gone. Howson probably gone. Clearly some people would like that.

As appealing as a total house cleaning would be to many people it would signal a re-boot of the re-build and put the team back two or three years.
Not at all, if anything, it shows that we are changing the culture of losing and need to start winning now. Look at what Montreal did. Got rid of everyone. Everyone in the front office, their assistant coach etc. Look where they are now.

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04-14-2013, 11:18 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
If they want an experienced guy, I hope it's Rick Dudley.

Look what he did with Atlanta. They were in a very similar situation to this team. He went out and added Byfuglien, Ladd, Wheeler and Stuart before he was let go when the team moved to Winnipeg. They're definitely reaping the benefits of his moves now.


If they want a young up and comer, I like Oilbleeder's pick in Jason Botterill.
This team doesn't need a young and up comer. They need an experienced GM that knows what it takes to win. Jim Nill I would be okay with because of how good of an organization Detroit has been. Brian Burke would be a great fit IMO. I wouldn't even mind Dudley.

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04-14-2013, 11:23 PM
  #37
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Not at all, if anything, it shows that we are changing the culture of losing and need to start winning now. Look at what Montreal did. Got rid of everyone. Everyone in the front office, their assistant coach etc. Look where they are now.
Montreal would be a good example, but there have been bad examples.

Look at Toronto for example. They bring in Burke and co. and things didn't look great for them for 5 years.

The new GM could be experienced or new, I don't care, as long as they can bring the supporting cast we need.

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04-14-2013, 11:28 PM
  #38
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Bob Green

Edit: I actually do hope they promote him to the pros at some point. Not as GM but in some capacity. Home grown talent is always better, especially when it's successful.

Any GM would be an improvement, if only because they would know to come in and focus on the weakest points. I think that would be understood as a required first step. Tambo seems stuck in a track that he thinks will work out if he just hangs on.


Last edited by nuck: 04-14-2013 at 11:35 PM.
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Old
04-14-2013, 11:29 PM
  #39
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People saying Brian Burke, they have noticed the contracts he's given out right?

Grabovski, Lupul, Komisarek, Connolly, and hell even Phanuef at some times.

Now look at Toronto's biggest holes when he got there. #1 C and #1 goalie. They are still needs.

The guy is decent at making teams tougher, and has an good eye for talent. But apart from that?

His ability to negotiate contracts means we'll probably lose quality young talent with the amount of money we'll probably have to give to our young stars. He's shown no real ability to fill holes in Toronto.

I don't exactly see why people want him so much. Especially over a talent up and comer like Botterill. Marc Bergevin has shown how inexperience doesn't have to be a factor if you have hockey smarts.

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Old
04-14-2013, 11:43 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paralyzer008 View Post
Montreal would be a good example, but there have been bad examples.

Look at Toronto for example. They bring in Burke and co. and things didn't look great for them for 5 years.

The new GM could be experienced or new, I don't care, as long as they can bring the supporting cast we need.
Brian Burke had literally nothing to work with in Toronto. Look at that team now. May not be the most skilled but they are tough to play against and they win. We already have the skill, all he would need to do is surround the team with the right players and he can do just that IMO. Look at what he did in Anaheim with Perry and Getzlaf.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilbleeder View Post
People saying Brian Burke, they have noticed the contracts he's given out right?

Grabovski, Lupul, Komisarek, Connolly, and hell even Phanuef at some times.

Now look at Toronto's biggest holes when he got there. #1 C and #1 goalie. They are still needs.

The guy is decent at making teams tougher, and has an good eye for talent. But apart from that?

His ability to negotiate contracts means we'll probably lose quality young talent with the amount of money we'll probably have to give to our young stars. He's shown no real ability to fill holes in Toronto.

I don't exactly see why people want him so much. Especially over a talent up and comer like Botterill. Marc Bergevin has shown how inexperience doesn't have to be a factor if you have hockey smarts.
He didn't give Phaneuf that contract. Phaneuf recieved that extention in Calgary I think and to be fair, Komisarek was coming off a great year. At the time, he looked great but that was due to Markov's play. I'll admit that the Grabovski and Connolly contracts were bad but Connolly's contract was short term and didn't really hurt the team. Grabovski on the other hand is about a mill overpaid.

However, Nuge and Yak wont make more than Hall and Eberle. They either sign to a deal similar to that or less and I dont think Burke would throw huge money at guys when he knows he has to lock up players like Schultz (who btw was drafted by Burke), Nuge and Yak.

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Old
04-14-2013, 11:43 PM
  #41
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Squeaky wheel gets the grease and Burke is the squeakiest wheel in existence. So people think of him even though I think he's a horrifically overrated GM.

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04-14-2013, 11:44 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilbleeder View Post
People saying Brian Burke, they have noticed the contracts he's given out right?

Grabovski, Lupul, Komisarek, Connolly, and hell even Phanuef at some times.

Now look at Toronto's biggest holes when he got there. #1 C and #1 goalie. They are still needs.

The guy is decent at making teams tougher, and has an good eye for talent. But apart from that?

His ability to negotiate contracts means we'll probably lose quality young talent with the amount of money we'll probably have to give to our young stars. He's shown no real ability to fill holes in Toronto.

I don't exactly see why people want him so much. Especially over a talent up and comer like Botterill. Marc Bergevin has shown how inexperience doesn't have to be a factor if you have hockey smarts.
So Burke gave out bad contracts...most GMs do. He also has locked players up to great deals like Getzlaf, Perry and the Sedins (prior to there current contracts).

I see some if you Burke detractors point out only his mistakes and exclude his great moves. You know what? TSN discussed Burke a few weeks back. Bobby Mac said that while some of his peers and hockey people may not agree with his "schtik" what thy do agree on is that he is one of the best GMs In the league and is a great builder and has a vision as to what his team should look like and executes his plan and more often then not is successful.

So while some of you may think Burke sucks, the people in the game, the experts, disagree.

Think about that for a second...

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Old
04-14-2013, 11:48 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by doulos View Post
Squeaky wheel gets the grease and Burke is the squeakiest wheel in existence. So people think of him even though I think he's a horrifically overrated GM.
I dont get how you can say he is overrated? He won a cup in Anaheim. I don't care what people say about that not being his team etc. He acquired the pieces required to take that team to the next level. Isn't that what this team needs? Pieces that can help us get to the next level? And think about where Toronto was before he was hired. They had no star players. Nothing to build around. Were considered the joke of the league. He turned that team around and that team that is in the playoffs is Brian Burke's team because Nonis hasn't made any moves besides acquiring Ryan O'Bryne and trading Mike Brown.

And most of all, Brian Burke actually gives a damn if this team is winning or not. He doesn't accept losing and will do what is necessary to help us win. I wish we could get a GM like Burke and even Toronto fans are saying Brian Burke would be good this team. There is a reason they're saying that. He has more to work with in Edmonton then he ever did in Toronto.

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04-14-2013, 11:53 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by copper_blue View Post
- Anyone who doesn't take 3 years to analyze his team.

- Anyone who likes gritty players

- Anyone who likes players that crash the net

- Anyone who likes players that are a pain in the ass to play against.

- Anyone who likes energy players

- Anyone who will provide a real supporting cast for our young upcoming stars
Yeah but Darryl Sutter has a job coaching in LA.

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04-14-2013, 11:53 PM
  #45
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The reason I wouldn't actually mind Burke is because the kind of hockey he likes is what we lack. Burke's bad moves in Toronto were when he was trying to add the talent to go with their best players. The Kessel trade and the Connolly signing were both brutal. The difference is he wouldn't have to do much of that here because our core is really already set. All he'd have to do is add the supporting cast and the supporting cast we need is something he knows how to get (grittier, bigger players) I also don't blame him for the Komisarek signings, I'd say that's more on the player failing. Komisarek was a beast before joining Toronto.

He's not afraid to make deals and most of his trades have been exceptional aside from the Kessel deal. People want to talk about how overrated Phaneuf is or whatever but you have to realize he gave up Matt Stajan as the center piece in the deal. When he first got to Toronto he wasn't exactly given much opportunity to thrive. That was a team that wasn't in a position to start giving up draft picks for help now. His worst trades (Kessel and Versteeg) were because of that reason. Here in Edmonton his situation would be a lot like Anaheim's. When he got to Anaheim Perry and Getzlaf were in the organization. He immediately had a 2nd overall pick to draft. (Bobby Ryan) Then he surrounded these young players with guys like Selanne, Niedermayer and Pronger! He did an unbelievable job there getting them a cup.

Over his career Burke has landed multiple elite players. Pronger at the draft (traded to get him), Sedin's at the draft (traded to get them), Jovanovski, Pronger, Phaneuf, Kessel, Van Riemsdyk all through trade. He has signed players like Selanne, Niedermayer, Burrows, Bozak, Penner (huge part of cup run), Beauchemin (which got Toronto Lupul and Gardiner) and probably more that I can't think of.

I know it's hard to like the guy because of how he is but I think he'd be a nice fit.

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04-14-2013, 11:56 PM
  #46
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The reason I wouldn't actually mind Burke is because the kind of hockey he likes is what we lack. Burke's bad moves in Toronto were when he was trying to add the talent to go with their best players. The Kessel trade and the Connolly signing were both brutal. The difference is he wouldn't have to do much of that here because our core is really already set. All he'd have to do is add the supporting cast and the supporting cast we need is something he knows how to get (grittier, bigger players) I also don't blame him for the Komisarek signings, I'd say that's more on the player failing. Komisarek was a beast before joining Toronto.

He's not afraid to make deals and most of his trades have been exceptional aside from the Kessel deal. People want to talk about how overrated Phaneuf is or whatever but you have to realize he gave up Matt Stajan as the center piece in the deal. When he first got to Toronto he wasn't exactly given much opportunity to thrive. That was a team that wasn't in a position to start giving up draft picks for help now. His worst trades (Kessel and Versteeg) were because of that reason. Here in Edmonton his situation would be a lot like Anaheim's. When he got to Anaheim Perry and Getzlaf were in the organization. He immediately had a 2nd overall pick to draft. (Bobby Ryan) Then he surrounded these young players with guys like Selanne, Niedermayer and Pronger! He did an unbelievable job there getting them a cup.

Over his career Burke has landed multiple elite players. Pronger at the draft (traded to get him), Sedin's at the draft (traded to get them), Jovanovski, Pronger, Phaneuf, Kessel, Van Riemsdyk all through trade. He has signed players like Selanne, Niedermayer, Burrows, Bozak, Penner (huge part of cup run), Beauchemin (which got Toronto Lupul and Gardiner) and probably more that I can't think of.

I know it's hard to like the guy because of how he is but I think he'd be a nice fit.
Exactly this. Thank you. People can hate on him all they want, he is the right fit for this team and can take us to the next level.

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04-14-2013, 11:59 PM
  #47
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Again, like anyone who doesn't like Burke will tell you is, Burke is a great builder, but he isn't a finisher.

Bozak, Grabovski and Connolly were his attempts at a #1C. Could you imagine what he tries to put at the Oilers #2C if Gagner ends up being moved?

Jonas Gustavsson was his best attempts at a #1G.

Guys like Reimer, Kulemin, Komarov, Gunnarsson and Frattin were already in place before he got there.


Burke is a terrible option.

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04-15-2013, 12:03 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by paralyzer008 View Post
just adding the credentials of each guy here:
Nill-detroit longtime assistant gm
macgregor-our head amateur scout
risebrough-former oiler vp of hockey operations, rangers scout, former wild gm, former flames gm responsible for the gawd-awful gilmour trade.dudley-former thrashers gm, canadiens scouting
fenton-preds assistant gm
gorton-rangers assistant gm
treliving-coyotes assistant gm
botterill-pens assistant gm
fyp!

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04-15-2013, 12:04 AM
  #49
Joey Moss
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Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
Again, like anyone who doesn't like Burke will tell you is, Burke is a great builder, but he isn't a finisher.

Bozak, Grabovski and Connolly were his attempts at a #1C. Could you imagine what he tries to put at the Oilers #2C if Gagner ends up being moved?

Jonas Gustavsson was his best attempts at a #1G.

Guys like Reimer, Kulemin, Komarov, Gunnarsson and Frattin were already in place before he got there.


Burke is a terrible option.
Using Toronto as an example is kind of misleading. As I said, there wasn't exactly a lot to work with there. Just look at the people I listed that he brought in via trade and Free Agency with the other teams he's been apart of. Toronto was not a fit for him and what he likes to do as a Manager.

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04-15-2013, 12:07 AM
  #50
Ice Whole
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Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
Again, like anyone who doesn't like Burke will tell you is, Burke is a great builder, but he isn't a finisher.

Bozak, Grabovski and Connolly were his attempts at a #1C. Could you imagine what he tries to put at the Oilers #2C if Gagner ends up being moved?

Jonas Gustavsson was his best attempts at a #1G.

Guys like Reimer, Kulemin, Komarov, Gunnarsson and Frattin were already in place before he got there.


Burke is a terrible option.
He won a cup in Anaheim... how is he not a finisher? Those were his best attempts because those were the only options he had. He tried going after Richards, Luongo etc. to fill that need. Toronto is just a team that literally had 0 assets when he got there. He also drafted Kadri who looks like he will fill that role eventually if he keeps his play up. The thing is, Burke's situation here would be similar to his situation in Anaheim. The pieces are there, just need to build around it. He did an excellent job of that.

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