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Old
04-21-2013, 02:37 PM
  #401
Kevin8se7en
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Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
HFOil also wouldn't trade Hall for Cowen + Zibanejad, both great young players in their own right. Does that make all of us homers too? Sometimes(often) it's best to keep the best player in the deal, and add some one else to fill that hole.

I would prefer to keep RNH and sign Streit, or make a deal around Paajarvi for Kulikov rather than move RNH+ for Berglund + Shattenkirk.
And you shouldn't accept this either. I'm a Sens fan and I believe we win this, even though I love Cowen.

A lot of people say Edmonton fans overvalue their specs... and the reason is because you claim to have all this talent, but the team was still a bottom feeder, and is currently still not a playoff team. Thing is.. it's not because of those specs.. it's because of things like Depth, and bad D. You don't see people bashing Tampa for having Stammer, Marty and Vinny, while still missing the playoffs, but Edmonton gets all the hate. Thats because Marty is old, Stammer is always a league leader in goals, and Vinny is a guy no one really wants for 7+ million. All of Edmonton's guys are amazing trade bait and any team would want them. The interest is there, so when a team makes an offer, and you reject it - they say "why? - your team sucks anyways". lol.

Before 07-08, Chicago missed the playoffs 5 years in a row, and 9 of 10 years.
LA Kings a few years ago was 6 years in a row.
Pittsburgh missed it 5 years straight including a year with Crosby.
It's now been 7 years for the Oilers. It's really not that out of the ordinary. You hold on to the valuable pieces and add smaller building blocks to support them. I personally think Edmonton has most of their big pieces in place, but needs the smaller ones - which is the opposite of what most teams need. lol.

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04-21-2013, 02:40 PM
  #402
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Because he is our best defense prospect smart guy. And our defense is still weak. Plus, Morrow was expendable because he was on a team stacked with defense prospects, and he hasn't been as good this year as his draft year.
And Klefbom has looked great this year. He may be good or he may have a hard time adjusting to the smaller rink and faster game. I don't rule out dealing him, but in saying that I don't deal him for a 3rd liner unless it's Clutterbuck.

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04-21-2013, 02:46 PM
  #403
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from an oiler perspective it is annoying when people suggest Eberle, Hall, Nuge and a few other have STOPPED developing and that they will be the players they are now for the rest of their careers

RNH has JUST turned 20 and is having a sophmore jinx type of year. Is he going to turn into a word killer? I do not know--but he has not stopped developing,

For Nuge and Yak--I suggest a few people look at how the Sedins developed ten years ago

it wasn't till the 05-06 season that they got the crap together and how old were both of them? 24

I think some fan bases want us to give away a kid or two so they can laugh their collective ***** off at us in 4 years

Sorry--i hope the oiler stick to their guns and stay away from a Alex Stojanov for Nasland or Cam Neely for barry Pederson type deal

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04-21-2013, 02:55 PM
  #404
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Originally Posted by Go Wings View Post
That's exactly what I'm talking about. You think that Hall, RNH and Yakupov are along the lines of Tavares and Stamkos??? What a vivid imagination you have. Are they talented and going to turn into something in the NHL abosulely but they arent in the same class as Stamkos and Tavares. Hall and Yakupov are probably going to be 30 to 40 goal scorers and RNH will be a top center on Edmonton but they arent as good as Tavares and Stamkos and they likely never will be.

Sorry be you don't get the moon for "potential future development"
In terms of DEVELOPMENT, not overall talent.

Crosby/Ovechkin were ready to dominate the league from their rookie seasons. Tavares/Stamkos started out slow and are now superstars.

Also Hall is arguably already better than Tavares. It's ludicrous to suggest he has no chance of ever being better.

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04-21-2013, 03:09 PM
  #405
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Originally Posted by 5RingsAndABeer View Post
In terms of DEVELOPMENT, not overall talent.

Crosby/Ovechkin were ready to dominate the league from their rookie seasons. Tavares/Stamkos started out slow and are now superstars.

Also Hall is arguably already better than Tavares. It's ludicrous to suggest he has no chance of ever being better.
Yah Stamkos did start out slow it was all the way into his 2nd season in the league before he hit 51 goals

Hall is already better then Tavares LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOO Hall will never be better then Tavares

Ask the other 29 GM who you'd rather had Tavares or Hall I bet you'll get 29 Tavares.

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04-21-2013, 03:15 PM
  #406
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Originally Posted by Kevin8se7en View Post
And you shouldn't accept this either. I'm a Sens fan and I believe we win this, even though I love Cowen.

A lot of people say Edmonton fans overvalue their specs... and the reason is because you claim to have all this talent, but the team was still a bottom feeder, and is currently still not a playoff team. Thing is.. it's not because of those specs.. it's because of things like Depth, and bad D. You don't see people bashing Tampa for having Stammer, Marty and Vinny, while still missing the playoffs, but Edmonton gets all the hate. Thats because Marty is old, Stammer is always a league leader in goals, and Vinny is a guy no one really wants for 7+ million. All of Edmonton's guys are amazing trade bait and any team would want them. The interest is there, so when a team makes an offer, and you reject it - they say "why? - your team sucks anyways". lol.

Before 07-08, Chicago missed the playoffs 5 years in a row, and 9 of 10 years.
LA Kings a few years ago was 6 years in a row.
Pittsburgh missed it 5 years straight including a year with Crosby.
It's now been 7 years for the Oilers. It's really not that out of the ordinary. You hold on to the valuable pieces and add smaller building blocks to support them. I personally think Edmonton has most of their big pieces in place, but needs the smaller ones - which is the opposite of what most teams need. lol.
This is an excellent post.

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04-21-2013, 03:22 PM
  #407
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Originally Posted by Kevin8se7en View Post
And you shouldn't accept this either. I'm a Sens fan and I believe we win this, even though I love Cowen.

A lot of people say Edmonton fans overvalue their specs... and the reason is because you claim to have all this talent, but the team was still a bottom feeder, and is currently still not a playoff team. Thing is.. it's not because of those specs.. it's because of things like Depth, and bad D. You don't see people bashing Tampa for having Stammer, Marty and Vinny, while still missing the playoffs, but Edmonton gets all the hate. Thats because Marty is old, Stammer is always a league leader in goals, and Vinny is a guy no one really wants for 7+ million. All of Edmonton's guys are amazing trade bait and any team would want them. The interest is there, so when a team makes an offer, and you reject it - they say "why? - your team sucks anyways". lol.

Before 07-08, Chicago missed the playoffs 5 years in a row, and 9 of 10 years.
LA Kings a few years ago was 6 years in a row.
Pittsburgh missed it 5 years straight including a year with Crosby.

It's now been 7 years for the Oilers. It's really not that out of the ordinary. You hold on to the valuable pieces and add smaller building blocks to support them. I personally think Edmonton has most of their big pieces in place, but needs the smaller ones - which is the opposite of what most teams need. lol.
And here's the difference with those 3 teams and Edmonton. Those three teams spent resources to draft and develop defense and goaltending. They didn't just draft a bunch of top forwards and that's it. Edmonton doesnt have big pieces of defense or in net. I dont see a Keith/Seabrook, Letang or Doughty on Edmonton's blueline do you? And finally and most importantly those 3 teams had very good general mangers with a plan something Edmonton won't have while Lowe is still in charge.

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04-21-2013, 03:27 PM
  #408
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5RingsAndABeer View Post
In terms of DEVELOPMENT, not overall talent.

Crosby/Ovechkin were ready to dominate the league from their rookie seasons. Tavares/Stamkos started out slow and are now superstars.

Also Hall is arguably already better than Tavares. It's ludicrous to suggest he has no chance of ever being better.
Doubt anyone wins that argument, but I get what you're saying.


Use HEMSKY, 2014 1st, 2013 2nd and JONES as trade bait.
Hemsky + 2nd is an attractive piece
Jones + 1st is as well

Talk to Ottawa about a Colin Greening - Pittsburgh about Orpik and Despres, Philly about Coburn... not necessarily for those packages, but I'm saying there are viable options. Overpay short term for Clarkson. Offersheet a guy like Chris Tanev (Vancouver has only 5 Dmen, 2 Goalies and 8 forwards signed with 1.4m in cap Space). Tampa has 2.6m in cap space so offer sheet Benoit Pouliot.. or leverage them in to a trade. Sign Zidlicky, Doug Murray or Regher...

Bottom line is Edmonton doesnt need to trade a young gun to accomplish what they want.

Find a way to sign some key UFA's and maybe make a few trades and this is a good team.

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04-21-2013, 03:56 PM
  #409
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Originally Posted by Go Wings View Post
And here's the difference with those 3 teams and Edmonton. Those three teams spent resources to draft and develop defense and goaltending. They didn't just draft a bunch of top forwards and that's it. Edmonton doesnt have big pieces of defense or in net. I dont see a Keith/Seabrook, Letang or Doughty on Edmonton's blueline do you? And finally and most importantly those 3 teams had very good general mangers with a plan something Edmonton won't have while Lowe is still in charge.
Keith was a 2nd round pick in 2002
Seabrook was a mid 1st in 2003
Letang was a late 1st in 2005
Doughty is the only one taken early and that was in 2008

Chicago missed the playoffs 5 years after picking those 2 Dmen. Then, their main picks were Toews and Kane. They never drafted a good goalie either. Crawford was a second round pick in 2003. Dubnyk was a mid 1st a year later in 2004

Pittsburgh drafted Crosby, Malkin and Jordan Staal. Two of them happened to be absolute phenoms. They drafted all forwards except Fleury, and Edmonton asn't really had the opportunity to take a goalie that high, and even if they had - he wouldn't be good yet anyways. Heck - Fleury isn't even that good. lol Pittsburgh wasnt great right away either. People seem to forget Fleury was 1st overall, Stall was 2nd I believe, Malkin was 2nd and Crosby was 1st. Three forwards and one goalie.

Dustin Brown was back in 2003. Kopitar was 11th overall in 2005. Quick was a 3rd round pick that year. They picked Bernier pretty high but he's their backup. Hickey was a bad pick but they made it up with Doughty the next year - but they would have picked Stamkos if they had 1st overall because he was the BPA. Lets not forget another high forward pick in Brayden Schenn.

Basically, both Chicago and LA's success is drafting over the span of 10 years... and most of their higher picks were on forwards. Pittsburgh did something similar to Edmonton, but got a little lucky because when they sucked, 2 of the players were phenoms. You can;t blame Edmonton for not winning the Crosby lottery.

Schultz was an early 2nd - he's just not as far along as the rest of the guys because he wasn't picked 10 years ago. And no one is disagreeing saying Edmonton needs better D - they do, but they would have had to draft that D 5+ years ago

2009: could have taken Ellis instead of MPS but would that help?
2008: Eberle
2007: D Alex Plante 15th overall in 2007 - bust (no good Dmen neerby)
2006: Picked Jeff Petry (decent Dman)
2005: Cogliano and no impact Dmen were taken neerby - now a 2nd from the Ducks in 2013

Their problems were drafting a long time ago - not now. Dmen take time to develop so they need to turn to trades and UFAs which is fine, because they have pieces they can give up like Hemsky, picks, and Jones.

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04-21-2013, 04:08 PM
  #410
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If I was Mac T, this would be my shopping list:

Top 4 dman
Streit is a possible free agent target. Might also pick one up from a cap troubled team for some 2nd/3rd round picks. An offer sheet might be another path.

Big, physical top 6 left winger
For the right player, the first round pick could be an asset to trade. Hemsky, Hartikainen, MPS, picks or defensive prospects could also be involved. There are a few free agents that might fill the role.

3rd line centre
Although a rookie isn't the best idea for this position, if we don't trade our first round there are quite a few centres in the draft this year. Honestly I think this might be one of the hardest positions to fill with quality if we have to do it through trade.

2 tough bottom 6 wingers
These types of players are usualy available at reasonable prices. We want quality, so trading prospects/picks might be an option rather than free agency.

Backup goalie
One can almost certainly be found in free agency, or possibly filled internally.

I don't see any need to trade Hall, RNH, Yakupov, J Shultz or Eberle. Gagner is probably safe as well because of RNH's shoulder injury. Hemsky will need to go and hopefully can get some kind of return, maybe a bottom 6 player or two. Edmonton will no doubt be looking to the free agent market for a few pickups after any compliance buyouts this summer. If Mac T can accomplish all of the above, I think that's a bold summer even without trading away any core pieces. Perhaps the hardest part will be doing it all in a cap friendly way.

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04-21-2013, 04:33 PM
  #411
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Originally Posted by NeutralZone View Post
If I was Mac T, this would be my shopping list:

Top 4 dman
Streit is a possible free agent target. Might also pick one up from a cap troubled team for some 2nd/3rd round picks. An offer sheet might be another path.

Big, physical top 6 left winger
For the right player, the first round pick could be an asset to trade. Hemsky, Hartikainen, MPS, picks or defensive prospects could also be involved. There are a few free agents that might fill the role.

3rd line centre
Although a rookie isn't the best idea for this position, if we don't trade our first round there are quite a few centres in the draft this year. Honestly I think this might be one of the hardest positions to fill with quality if we have to do it through trade.

2 tough bottom 6 wingers
These types of players are usualy available at reasonable prices. We want quality, so trading prospects/picks might be an option rather than free agency.

Backup goalie
One can almost certainly be found in free agency, or possibly filled internally.

I don't see any need to trade Hall, RNH, Yakupov, J Shultz or Eberle. Gagner is probably safe as well because of RNH's shoulder injury. Hemsky will need to go and hopefully can get some kind of return, maybe a bottom 6 player or two. Edmonton will no doubt be looking to the free agent market for a few pickups after any compliance buyouts this summer. If Mac T can accomplish all of the above, I think that's a bold summer even without trading away any core pieces. Perhaps the hardest part will be doing it all in a cap friendly way.
Don't know if it's been mentioned in here but if Edmonton ends up in a slot to pick Monahan, I wonder if they'd deal that for Jake Gardiner plus another pick (not this years first)? I think it's a deal that could benefit both teams a lot.

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04-21-2013, 07:33 PM
  #412
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NeutralZone View Post
If I was Mac T, this would be my shopping list:

Top 4 dman
Streit is a possible free agent target. Might also pick one up from a cap troubled team for some 2nd/3rd round picks. An offer sheet might be another path.

Big, physical top 6 left winger
For the right player, the first round pick could be an asset to trade. Hemsky, Hartikainen, MPS, picks or defensive prospects could also be involved. There are a few free agents that might fill the role.

3rd line centre
Although a rookie isn't the best idea for this position, if we don't trade our first round there are quite a few centres in the draft this year. Honestly I think this might be one of the hardest positions to fill with quality if we have to do it through trade.


2 tough bottom 6 wingers
These types of players are usualy available at reasonable prices. We want quality, so trading prospects/picks might be an option rather than free agency.

Backup goalie
One can almost certainly be found in free agency, or possibly filled internally.

I don't see any need to trade Hall, RNH, Yakupov, J Shultz or Eberle. Gagner is probably safe as well because of RNH's shoulder injury. Hemsky will need to go and hopefully can get some kind of return, maybe a bottom 6 player or two. Edmonton will no doubt be looking to the free agent market for a few pickups after any compliance buyouts this summer. If Mac T can accomplish all of the above, I think that's a bold summer even without trading away any core pieces. Perhaps the hardest part will be doing it all in a cap friendly way.
Nik Antropov.

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04-21-2013, 08:45 PM
  #413
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Originally Posted by Go Wings View Post
And here's the difference with those 3 teams and Edmonton. Those three teams spent resources to draft and develop defense and goaltending. They didn't just draft a bunch of top forwards and that's it. Edmonton doesnt have big pieces of defense or in net. I dont see a Keith/Seabrook, Letang or Doughty on Edmonton's blueline do you? And finally and most importantly those 3 teams had very good general mangers with a plan something Edmonton won't have while Lowe is still in charge.
Hey Lowe has 6 cup rings so I think he knows a little something about winning.

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04-21-2013, 10:01 PM
  #414
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Originally Posted by Kevin8se7en View Post
And you shouldn't accept this either. I'm a Sens fan and I believe we win this, even though I love Cowen.

A lot of people say Edmonton fans overvalue their specs... and the reason is because you claim to have all this talent, but the team was still a bottom feeder, and is currently still not a playoff team. Thing is.. it's not because of those specs.. it's because of things like Depth, and bad D. You don't see people bashing Tampa for having Stammer, Marty and Vinny, while still missing the playoffs, but Edmonton gets all the hate. Thats because Marty is old, Stammer is always a league leader in goals, and Vinny is a guy no one really wants for 7+ million. All of Edmonton's guys are amazing trade bait and any team would want them. The interest is there, so when a team makes an offer, and you reject it - they say "why? - your team sucks anyways". lol.

Before 07-08, Chicago missed the playoffs 5 years in a row, and 9 of 10 years.
LA Kings a few years ago was 6 years in a row.
Pittsburgh missed it 5 years straight including a year with Crosby.
It's now been 7 years for the Oilers. It's really not that out of the ordinary. You hold on to the valuable pieces and add smaller building blocks to support them. I personally think Edmonton has most of their big pieces in place, but needs the smaller ones - which is the opposite of what most teams need. lol.

Just when i was thinking no one on HF has a clue . Very well said and shows you know hockey . I was just looking at the standings and seeing Tampa was below Edmonton and thought the same thing . Only their players are older and should be leading their team to the playoffs , our kids are well for lack of a better word kids still learning the NHL game .

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04-21-2013, 10:07 PM
  #415
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Don't know if it's been mentioned in here but if Edmonton ends up in a slot to pick Monahan, I wonder if they'd deal that for Jake Gardiner plus another pick (not this years first)? I think it's a deal that could benefit both teams a lot.
No we would trade it for a concussed Gardiner who has not looked great this year . Now maybe Gagner if we draft a big 2C will be available .

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04-21-2013, 10:32 PM
  #416
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Originally Posted by Go Wings View Post
And here's the difference with those 3 teams and Edmonton. Those three teams spent resources to draft and develop defense and goaltending. They didn't just draft a bunch of top forwards and that's it. Edmonton doesnt have big pieces of defense or in net. I dont see a Keith/Seabrook, Letang or Doughty on Edmonton's blueline do you? And finally and most importantly those 3 teams had very good general mangers with a plan something Edmonton won't have while Lowe is still in charge.
As K87 mentioned, Doughty was the only Dman taken with high draft pedigree (2nd overall) of the ones you mentioned. If anything, I'd say the fact Keith and Letang were plucked in the 2nd and 3rd rounds only strengthens the argument to take a forward if he's the consensus BPA (which all the Oiler 1sts were). Weber was a 2nd rder, so was Subban. Not to mention we've spent quite a few picks on Dmen in recent drafts, netting some decent prospects (Marincin, Gernat, Klefbom, Musil).

As for whether those pieces are here, I don't think it's crazy to suggest Klefbom and Schultz could have a similar dynamic to Seabrook and Keith.

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04-21-2013, 10:51 PM
  #417
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Originally Posted by Go Wings View Post
And here's the difference with those 3 teams and Edmonton. Those three teams spent resources to draft and develop defense and goaltending. They didn't just draft a bunch of top forwards and that's it. Edmonton doesnt have big pieces of defense or in net. I dont see a Keith/Seabrook, Letang or Doughty on Edmonton's blueline do you? And finally and most importantly those 3 teams had very good general mangers with a plan something Edmonton won't have while Lowe is still in charge.
Doughty was drafted high, the others not. And they took time to develop. For all we know, Klefbom and Marincin could be future Kieth/Seabrooks and Schultz could be as good as Letang in the future.

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04-21-2013, 10:54 PM
  #418
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Yah Stamkos did start out slow it was all the way into his 2nd season in the league before he hit 51 goals

Hall is already better then Tavares LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOO Hall will never be better then Tavares

Ask the other 29 GM who you'd rather had Tavares or Hall I bet you'll get 29 Tavares.
Hall will never be better then JT ? please go straighten those idiots up at TSN as they have Hall power rating at #14 and JT,s at 25 . those fools should stick to soccer ....

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04-22-2013, 01:55 AM
  #419
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All I keep hearing is the Oilers need depth players...could this be a time when another quantity for quality trade actually makes sense?

If not, you'd have to think it would be quality forward for quality d man/goalie.

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04-22-2013, 02:32 AM
  #420
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I've been thinking about Mike Green and Ellis for awhile now. The Oilers need another pointman that can QB the PP from the blueline. I like how Green is setting up Ovechkin for his 1 timer and I want the same thing with Yakupov. No one on the Oilers can get Yakupov the puck on the PP on a consistant basis. It's just fustrating that I see Stamkos and Ovechkin get off their lethal 1-timer. Even Hall has a beauty of a shot and never do I see Hall letting 1 go.

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04-22-2013, 02:47 AM
  #421
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Keep in mind Keith and Seabrook were pretty terrible until about 2008 when Kane and Toews joined the team.

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04-22-2013, 03:12 AM
  #422
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin8se7en View Post
And you shouldn't accept this either. I'm a Sens fan and I believe we win this, even though I love Cowen.

A lot of people say Edmonton fans overvalue their specs... and the reason is because you claim to have all this talent, but the team was still a bottom feeder, and is currently still not a playoff team. Thing is.. it's not because of those specs.. it's because of things like Depth, and bad D. You don't see people bashing Tampa for having Stammer, Marty and Vinny, while still missing the playoffs, but Edmonton gets all the hate. Thats because Marty is old, Stammer is always a league leader in goals, and Vinny is a guy no one really wants for 7+ million. All of Edmonton's guys are amazing trade bait and any team would want them. The interest is there, so when a team makes an offer, and you reject it - they say "why? - your team sucks anyways". lol.

Before 07-08, Chicago missed the playoffs 5 years in a row, and 9 of 10 years.
LA Kings a few years ago was 6 years in a row.
Pittsburgh missed it 5 years straight including a year with Crosby.
It's now been 7 years for the Oilers. It's really not that out of the ordinary. You hold on to the valuable pieces and add smaller building blocks to support them. I personally think Edmonton has most of their big pieces in place, but needs the smaller ones - which is the opposite of what most teams need. lol.
Are Pittsburgh, Chicago, and LA the only teams to miss the playoffs for a number of years and get a lot of high draft picks?

LA won the Cup with a goalie/team that posted a 1.41 GAA and a .946 sv%. Chicago won with amazing depth backing up their top talent, Niemi, Byfuglien, Campbell, Ladd, Versteeg, Brouwer, Kopecky are all important/key players on other teams that had to be jettisoned due to the cap. And Pittsburgh won because Crosby and Malkin are the best in the game.

To counterpoint these examples you could take a team like the former Atlanta Thrashers, who drafted Heatley, Kovalchuk, and Lehtonen, and saw 1 playoff round in 10 years before losing the team. Or the current TBay if you will. I'm not saying Edmonton is going down that route, in my opinion they're more straddling the fence at the moment. But everyone and their dog around here is aware that Pittsburgh/Chicago/LA sucked for a long time, drafted, then won the Cup. To most outside Edmonton however the current Oilers group does not give that same sort of impression or confidence.

The elite talent is there, but lots of teams already have elite talent already in place. They're still missing depth, defense, and goaltending. This being the cap era they don't need all 3, but 1 more to be a playoff team and 2 to be a contender.

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04-22-2013, 05:09 AM
  #423
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandV View Post
Are Pittsburgh, Chicago, and LA the only teams to miss the playoffs for a number of years and get a lot of high draft picks?

LA won the Cup with a goalie/team that posted a 1.41 GAA and a .946 sv%. Chicago won with amazing depth backing up their top talent, Niemi, Byfuglien, Campbell, Ladd, Versteeg, Brouwer, Kopecky are all important/key players on other teams that had to be jettisoned due to the cap. And Pittsburgh won because Crosby and Malkin are the best in the game.

To counterpoint these examples you could take a team like the former Atlanta Thrashers, who drafted Heatley, Kovalchuk, and Lehtonen, and saw 1 playoff round in 10 years before losing the team. Or the current TBay if you will. I'm not saying Edmonton is going down that route, in my opinion they're more straddling the fence at the moment. But everyone and their dog around here is aware that Pittsburgh/Chicago/LA sucked for a long time, drafted, then won the Cup. To most outside Edmonton however the current Oilers group does not give that same sort of impression or confidence.

The elite talent is there, but lots of teams already have elite talent already in place. They're still missing depth, defense, and goaltending. This being the cap era they don't need all 3, but 1 more to be a playoff team and 2 to be a contender.
To further extend on what you're saying, which I agree with you on the basics, I would say that Chicago and LA got to where they are because they had the right GMs to acquire the best players and develop them when they were doing poorly. Also, both teams were bad for a long time and basically rebuilt twice. I know in LAs case, we had all those forwards and a couple nice Dmen and traded them all to restart the build again. It wasn't the plan, it just wound up being that way.



Pitt on the other hand just got lucky in drafting Crosby and again got lucky getting such a good player in Malkin with a #2 pick. Now that team just has those two centers (who make their wings good) and Letang.

Chicago got lucky Toews fell to them and they developed him into a mini-Yzerman.

LA got pretty lucky that Kopitar fell to them.



But we in LA had the GM to put all of that together and developed Kopi into the two-way champ he is today.



Conclusion...you need a top Dman and a top center to come out of your system and you'll probably need to develop them. And you need a GM that's good at team and organization building. That's how you get the depth. In LA, Dean's Machine is still cranking out NHL players from non-first rounder picks. AND you need a special draft year to acquire a lot of talent from. Most of the top teams in the NHL have first rounders from 2003 and 2008 filling in top spots including the ones mentioned above.


Tampa is missing the GM. (I think Yzerman would be a good GM on a good team, like a Gillis, but he's too much of a new GM to know how to be Lou Lamerello (sp?) for TB. And Stamkos is like the goal-scoring version of Joe Thornton.

As for the Oilers, RNH I don't think is an elite #1 center. And they don't have the #1 dman yet. And the rest of their centers are flawed. And their GM...just got himself fired.




Bottom line, they changed the GM...hopefully that fixes that. If I were him, I would trade Yak, Hemsky, Eberle if he can get anything good for him even keep 2.5m salary to do it and Gagner, and build the team around J Schultz, Hall and RNH. Then in this draft, acquire the number one center they need. RNH for 2nd line center is a good situation. If they can trade big four guys and get another top five pick, then maybe get Jones and the aforementioned center. If you have J Schultz as your 2nd pairing anchor PMD and RNH as your 2nd line center, your team is going places. You'll be strong down the middle like Boston and LA.

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04-22-2013, 07:13 AM
  #424
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I think Mac T should try and get Morrow and maybe a guy Like Cleary, they need to get some veterans in there who knows what it takes to win.

Then they should buy out Horcoff, move Hemsky for a d-man or no 3 center.

If they can move Gagner + for an no2 center upgrade that would be nice for them as well.

The "big 5" need to play and focus on that and be forced to lead as well, getting some quality guys in there would make the Oilers a much better team.

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04-22-2013, 09:12 AM
  #425
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Without reading through the entire thread:

How about the Isles trade Reinhart, Kevin Poulin and Nino for Eberle and a swap of first round picks? (Maybe make it protected so that the Isles wouldn't pick later then eighth?) Don't bother asking for Strome. JT gets his RW and we use the top pick to replace Reinhart in the system.

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