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Chico Resch's Top 26 Current Goalies from '97 and Goalies' World Top 26 Ranking

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Old
04-16-2013, 11:54 PM
  #1
Nalens Oga
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Chico Resch's Top 26 Current Goalies from '97 and Goalies' World Top 26 Ranking

Found a book called Hot Goalies with Stan Fischler and Chico Resch written in 1997ish. This is Resch's list of his top 26 goalies from the time. Now it doesn't actually number them or even put it on one list together but this is the order the profiles appear on on one section of the book so I'll assume that it's a ranking...if it is then I'm fairly sure Vanbiesbrouck is a bit low since this is from 1997:

Roy
Hasek
Fuhr
Richter
Joseph
Khabibulin
Belfour
Burke
Hebert
Daren Puppa
Ken Wregget
Bill Ranford
Brodeur
Moog
Jeff Hackett
Stephane Fiset
Potvin
Vanbiesbrouck
Salo
Tugnutt
Kidd
Vernon
Thibault
Kirk McLean
Jim Carey
Hextall

At the end of the book, there is another ranking:
Goalies' World Top 26 Ratings

and this one is clearly numbered so it is definetely in order.:
1. Hasek
2. Brodeur
3. Hebert
4. Roy
5. Potvin
6. Richter
7. Khabibulin
8. Joseph
9. Vanbiesbrouck
10. Fuhr
11. Jeff Hackett
12. Thibault
13. Burke
14. Salo
15. Rick Tabaracci
16. Moog
17. Osgood
18. Stephane Fiset
19. Lalime
20. Trevor Kidd
21. Wregget
22. Hextall
23. Belfour
24. Dafoe
25. Mark Fitzpatrick
26. Ranford


Last edited by Nalens Oga: 04-17-2013 at 04:17 PM.
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Old
04-17-2013, 12:06 AM
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eddytheeagle20
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fuhr ahead of all them guys in 97 really? 87 maybe but not 97

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04-17-2013, 12:10 AM
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That's a ridiculous list. For more than a few reasons, but one of the most glaring is the complete omission of Chris Osgood.

If the list is post 1997 playoffs: Then it's understandable why one might rate Vernon above Osgood (and many other goalies). But Osgood was the starter during the regular season and far outperformed Vernon (and most of this list).

If the list is 1997, conclusion of the regular season: Then there's zero justification for taking Vernon ahead of Osgood, and even less for leaving Osgood off as Osgood was the expected playoff starter for Detroit having played a significant majority of the regular season.

If the list is made in the summer of 1996, as a "going into 1996-97", Osgood has just been named to the second-team behind Carey, and was a Vezina finalist. In the eyes of many Osgood deserved it over Carey. The year before that he had a stellar season but split games with Vernon and didn't play enough to get serious consideration despite finishing second in save percentage.

I will say it one more time.

This list is ridiculous.

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04-17-2013, 12:35 AM
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TheDevilMadeMe
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Other than the strangely low ranking of Vanbiesbrouck, it seems reasonable as of 1997. Belfour definitely had a better regular season record than Fuhr, but as of 1997, he had a short peak followed by a sharp decline, and his rebound in Dallas hadn't happened yet. Also, Belfour was considered something of a playoff disappointment before Dallas.

Actually, even though it was published in 1997, I wonder if it was written before the 1996 playoffs - that might somewhat explain Beezer's low ranking - he had quite the weak playoff record before his awesome performance in 1996. He's still too low, though.

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04-17-2013, 12:37 AM
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TheDevilMadeMe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eva unit zero View Post
That's a ridiculous list. For more than a few reasons, but one of the most glaring is the complete omission of Chris Osgood.

If the list is post 1997 playoffs: Then it's understandable why one might rate Vernon above Osgood (and many other goalies). But Osgood was the starter during the regular season and far outperformed Vernon (and most of this list).

If the list is 1997, conclusion of the regular season: Then there's zero justification for taking Vernon ahead of Osgood, and even less for leaving Osgood off as Osgood was the expected playoff starter for Detroit having played a significant majority of the regular season.

If the list is made in the summer of 1996, as a "going into 1996-97", Osgood has just been named to the second-team behind Carey, and was a Vezina finalist. In the eyes of many Osgood deserved it over Carey. The year before that he had a stellar season but split games with Vernon and didn't play enough to get serious consideration despite finishing second in save percentage.

I will say it one more time.

This list is ridiculous.
As of 1997, you have a better case that Vernon is too low than that Osgood's omission is somehow onerous.

Osgood had done nothing of historical note as of 1996-97 - he'd be better off naming Jim Carey at that point.

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04-17-2013, 01:10 AM
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I have my doubts as to that lineup being a ranking beyond the top 3 perhaps. The rest appear random; without a whole lot of thought in terms of standing, where their listed.

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04-17-2013, 01:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Actually, even though it was published in 1997, I wonder if it was written before the 1996 playoffs
Looks to be late in the 1997 season. One per team.

Roy (COL)
Hasek (BUF)
Fuhr (STL)
Richter (NYR)
Joseph (EDM)
Khabibulin (PHO)
Belfour (SJS)
Burke (HAR)
Hebert (MDA)
Daren Puppa (TBL)
Ken Wregget (PIT)
Bill Ranford (WAS)
Brodeur (NJD)
Moog (DAL)
Jeff Hackett (CHI)
Stephane Fiset (LA)
Potvin (TOR)
Vanbiesbrouck (FLA)
Salo (NYI)
Tugnutt (OTT)
Kidd (CGY)
Vernon (DET)
Thibault (MTL)
Kirk McLean (VAN)
Jim Carey (BOS)
Hextall (PHI)

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04-17-2013, 01:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eva unit zero View Post
If the list is made in the summer of 1996, as a "going into 1996-97", Osgood has just been named to the second-team behind Carey, and was a Vezina finalist. In the eyes of many Osgood deserved it over Carey. The year before that he had a stellar season but split games with Vernon and didn't play enough to get serious consideration despite finishing second in save percentage
In the eyes of who? If anything Puppa should have won it imo. 96-96 was a terrible year for goaltending anyways.

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Old
04-17-2013, 08:37 AM
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I was a big Stephane Fiset fan...odd to see him on a best goalie list though.

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04-17-2013, 09:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
As of 1997, you have a better case that Vernon is too low than that Osgood's omission is somehow onerous.

Osgood had done nothing of historical note as of 1996-97 - he'd be better off naming Jim Carey at that point.
Osgood was a second team all-star in 1996, his third season.

Only four goalies received Hart votes in 1996. Fuhr, Carey, Brodeur, and Osgood.

He had been to the conference finals as a starter and had played pretty well, winning key games with clutch play.

Based simply on the stats, some of the guys who I noticed missing are no-brainers and some of the guys included are huge question marks.

Cutting out the rookie season of Osgood (and Brodeur), we get some startling revelations. Let's look at them.

For goalies with at least 30 games player from 1994-95 to 1995-96, or 45 games for 1994-95 through 1996-97 (average 15 per season for the stretch), here are goalies with better than .900, and any goalies from the list who did not achieve that level.

1994-95 to 1995-96
GoalieTeam(s)GPsv%
Dominik HasekBUF100.924
Jeff HackettCHI42.915
Daren PuppaTB93.913
Chris OsgoodDET69.913
Guy HebertANA98.910
Sean BurkeHFD108.909
Felix PotvinTOR105.909
Jocelyn ThibaultQUE/COL, MTL68.909
Martin BrodeurNJ117.908
Jim CareyWSH99.908
John VanbiesbrouckFLA94.908
Kelly HrudeyLA71.908
Damian RhodesTOR, OTT60.908
Patrick RoyMTL, COL104.907
Andy MoogDAL72.906
Ed BelfourCHI, SJ92.904
Ron HextallPHI, QUE84.904
Nikolai KhabibulinWPG79.904
Ken WreggetPIT75.904
Stephane FisetQUE/COL69.904
Mike RichterNYR76.903
Corey HirschVAN41.903
Trevor KiddCGY90.902
Glenn HealyNYR61.901
Tom BarrassoPIT51.901
Dominic RousselPHI35.900
Grant FuhrBUF, LA, STL96.898
Ron TugnuttANA, MTL, OTT7.895
Curtis JosephSTL, EDM70.893
Mike VernonCGY, DET.895 
Kirk McLeanVAN85.891
Bill RanfordEDM, BOS117.884

1994-95 to 1996-97
GoalieTeam(s)GPsv%
Dominik HasekBUF167.926
Jeff HackettCHI83.921
Martin BrodeurNJ184.915
Guy HebertANA165.914
Patrick RoyMTL, COL166.913
Daren PuppaTB99.913
John VanbiesbrouckFLA151.912
Chris OsgoodDET116.912
Sean BurkeHFD159.911
Mike RichterNYR37.910
Felix PotvinTOR179.909
Jocelyn ThibaultQUE/COL, MTL129.909
Andy MoogDAL120.909
Nikolai KhabibulinWPG151.906
Stephane FisetQUE/COL113.905
Ken WreggetPIT121.903
Glenn HealyNYR84.903
Ron HextallPHI, QUE139.902
Ed BelfourCHI, SJ138.902
Kelly HrudeyLA119.902
Mark FitzpatrickFLA79.902
Trevor KiddCGY145.901
Damian RhodesTOR, OTT110.901
Curtis JosephSTL, EDM142.900
Rick Tabaracci118.900 
Corey HirschVAN41.900
Olaf KolzigWSH61.900
Grant FuhrBUF, LA, STL169.899
Jim CareyWSH, BOS158.899
Mike VernonDET95.898
Tom BarrassoPIT56.897
Ron TugnuttANA, MTL, OTT44.895
Kirk McLeanVAN129.890
Bill RanfordEDM, BOS172.885

Want me to do winning percentage? I'm pretty sure Osgood will come out very, very far ahead of the field in that one given that he had a 39-6-5 season in 95-96. Mike Vernon, his backup, had more losses. Over the period from 94-95 through 96-97, Osgood and Vernon both had the same number of losses and ties (24 and 14). But Osgood won 76 games to Vernon's 53. That's the equivalent of a 120-point season from a team. And 96-97 was actually Osgood's worst season in terms of his record; he was *only* on pace for a 100-point season (23-13-9) while in the previous two he had been on pace for 121 (14-9-0) and 136 (39-6-5). Maybe that drop is why he was left off the list.

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Old
04-17-2013, 01:14 PM
  #11
TheDevilMadeMe
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Well that long post was for naught, as QPQ already pointed out they did one goalie per team and if the list was done towards the end of 1996-97, Mike Vernon was Detroit's guy.

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04-17-2013, 01:28 PM
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Fuhr was excellent in blues in 96 and 97 so its not strange that hes ranked high, maybe too high but its not that big of a shocker.

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04-17-2013, 04:17 PM
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Nalens Oga
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Editor's Note from the book which I'm fairly sure was written at the end of the 97 season:
Unfortunately in the process we were complled to omit competitors we otherwise would have wanted to include.
For example, we have unbound admiration for performersh such as Glen Healy who had been Mike Richter's understudy on the Rangers from blah blah blah
We would have liked to profile Heals as well as the other worthies like Rick Tabaracci, Chris Osgood, Garth Snow, Olaf Kolzig, Damian Rhodes, and Mark Fitzpatrick to name a few blah blah.


The book has different sections, today's stars from page 9-108, "Chico's Skinny On The Top 26 Current Goalies" from 109-144, Developing an NHL goalie from 207-222, Style Analysis from 223-242 and goalie's world magazine at 243-248. The sorting of players on Today's Stars (pg 9-108) is different from Resch's top 26 current goalies so I have to think that Resch's top 26 current goalies are in order with a criteria of one/team even if they are not numbered. But there's another ranking

At the end of the book, there is another ranking:
Goalies' World Top 26 Ratings

and this one is clearly numbered so it is definetely in order.:
1. Hasek
2. Brodeur
3. Hebert
4. Roy
5. Potvin
6. Richter
7. Khabibulin
8. Joseph
9. Vanbiesbrouck
10. Fuhr
11. Jeff Hackett
12. Thibault
13. Burke
14. Salo
15. Rick Tabaracci
16. Moog
17. Osgood
18. Stephane Fiset
19. Lalime
20. Trevor Kidd
21. Wregget
22. Hextall
23. Belfour
24. Dafoe
25. Mark Fitzpatrick
26. Ranford

Minor League goalie deserving an NHL Chance: Frederick Chabot
Most fragile goalie: Barrasso:
Most disappointing goalie: Carey
Most overrated: Ranford
Saved his career: Tugnutt
Taken for granted: Potvin
Worst duo: McLean/Hirsch
Best Single Game Performance: Joseph (Mar 2 1997) Implying that this book was written at or around the end of the '97 season/playoffs

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Old
04-17-2013, 05:09 PM
  #14
quoipourquoi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kloparren View Post
Implying that this book was written at or around the end of the '97 season/playoffs
I'm doing a Ray Bourque fist-pump in celebration of having an eagle's eye for SJ Shark Ed Belfour.


I wonder if the Goalies' World list was composed with that mathematical formula that I still don't understand.

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