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Bozak commanding over 5 million

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Old
04-16-2013, 08:14 PM
  #151
Bourne Endeavor
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Good luck with that Bozy.

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04-16-2013, 08:14 PM
  #152
Teeder9
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Originally Posted by seanlinden View Post
Any contract is easily movable this offseason. There's a buyout option. Grabovski may be more of an offensive catalyst than Bozak, but Grabovski isn't what Phil Kessel needs in a centre. Good teams spend on players that will maximize their effectiveness together.

Your approach is strangely reminiscent to that of John Ferguson Jr.




Depends on how many years. His sample size is too small to be taken as representation, so we'd still be paying a lot based on potential for him to extend that sample over a full season and multiple years.
I'm certainly not proposing paying either 5m per, but just for kicks and giggles, what would be paying Bozak for, exactly? The same, or potential?

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04-16-2013, 08:16 PM
  #153
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Originally Posted by New Liskeard View Post
Surprise, surprise. Not only does your user name not give you any credibility, but your assessment on Bozak defensively proves this in spades. I would respectfully recomend you watching Bozak a few time before commenting; you couldnt be any more wrong if you tried.

To the actual point at hand, before you tried to derail the thread. An argument can be mad Bozak isnt worth 5 mil, but until it is known what he actually will sign for, everything is all hypothetical. In the meantime, try watching players play, before commenting.
http://hockeyanalysis.com/2013/02/16...e-tyler-bozak/

How about some stats instead?

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Old
04-16-2013, 08:18 PM
  #154
seanlinden
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Originally Posted by Teeder9 View Post
I'm certainly not proposing paying either 5m per, but just for kicks and giggles, what would be paying Bozak for, exactly? The same, or potential?
Likely the same that he's delivered over the past 2 seasons. Somewhere in the 50-point range while being an all-purpose forward on our top line. Maybe a bit more production if Kessel could've become more consistent and buried a couple of the open nets he had at the beginning of the year & if JvR continues to develop.

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04-16-2013, 08:19 PM
  #155
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I wouldn't pay him a penny over 3 million.

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04-16-2013, 08:22 PM
  #156
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Originally Posted by Teeder9 View Post
Really all I can do. You start by calling someone not credible for their username. Forget about the substance of the post itself, just the username. Than, you tell someone else they don't watch games, because oddly enough, that's the cure all for anyone who doesn't hold your opinion in a debate with you. Moving on to the adults who can actually read a post, digest it, and not add unsaid things into it. Again,
I see you deflected again and chose not to address the questions posed to you. Why is it Bozak is such an "anchor defensively" and brings his linemates down, yet the coach gives him PK time and Bozak also plays against the other teams top checkers? As simple as this question is, you seem to be having a hard time responding. Now we know the coach thinks otherwise, this anchor defensively has one of his wingers in the top 10 in scoring last year, with Lupul doing well prior to injury, and yet again looks like Kessel will do well with this "anchor of a center" who brings his team mates down, once again. You seem to be in great disagreement with the coach on who and what kind of player Bozak is, I am eager to see your reasoing on this. Also looking forward to the credentials and experience you bring that overshadows Carlyle accomplishments and decision making process on NHL players.

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04-16-2013, 08:22 PM
  #157
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Originally Posted by VinnyC View Post
If Bozak is signed for $5M, then you end with only $3M to account for a bottom 6'er, a bottom pairing D-man and spares. The Leafs could get some wiggle room by buying out Liles and re-signing Gunnarsson, which would likely leave them with about $4M for the same spots. Still, they would be cutting very tight, with only about a million to spend on the #5-6 D-man and a 3rd-4th liner (who could also be guys like Ashton, Blacker and Rielly) then scraps for the spares.

Of course my contract estimates won't be accurate but while some guys who might command less (Reimer, Gardiner I'm thinking) others could command more (Kessel, Fraser). I'm also assuming "cheap" guys like Komarov or Colborne could take over the 3C spot by the end of 2014.
You're missing the fact that the cap will almost certainly go up for the 2014-15 season. Even if revenues are not there, the NHLPA still has their cap escalator and can artificially increase the cap by 5%. Not that this is an excuse for over paying Bozak. But in 3-4 years the cap will easily be over 75m (likely over 80m).

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04-16-2013, 08:25 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by seanlinden View Post
Likely the same that he's delivered over the past 2 seasons. Somewhere in the 50-point range while being an all-purpose forward on our top line. Maybe a bit more production if Kessel could've become more consistent and buried a couple of the open nets he had at the beginning of the year & if JvR continues to develop.
See, here's the thing. Just like history states, he likely isn't the guy who gets those points anyway. Like this season, when Kessel isn't scoring, he's still putting up points, but Bozak only does when Kessel is burying those shots, because, he pulls defenses to him opening up...Bozak. Offensively, he is a replacement player, and he should be treated as such in any contract negotiation. Pay him for what you like about him, not for something he adds nothing to, and it doesn't add up to anywhere close to 5m

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04-16-2013, 08:28 PM
  #159
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Originally Posted by Teeder9 View Post
See, here's the thing. Just like history states, he likely isn't the guy who gets those points anyway. Like this season, when Kessel isn't scoring, he's still putting up points, but Bozak only does when Kessel is burying those shots, because, he pulls defenses to him opening up...Bozak. Offensively, he is a replacement player, and he should be treated as such in any contract negotiation. Pay him for what you like about him, not for something he adds nothing to, and it doesn't add up to anywhere close to 5m
You don't seem to be making any point here about the Leafs having a better option to centre Phil Kessel for $5m...That's the only thing that matters.

You've suggested Weiss, who is not a stronger puck posession player, would be more expensive, and coming off a major injury. That's not a better option.

As for history. Bozak has played the majority of his career alongside Phil Kessel. There's no history of any substance to suggest what he may or may not produce in a depth situation. He might find that he's entirely dependent on his linemates. He might find that going up against weaker defensive matchups, and not being tasked to be the guy who covers for Kessel's weaknesses actually gives him more offensive freedom and sees his production increase.

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04-16-2013, 08:28 PM
  #160
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Can't see this being true. It would be extremely idiotic to ask for that much when your name is Tyler Bozak and you play in Toronto.

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04-16-2013, 08:28 PM
  #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Riptide View Post
Sorry, I think they're allergic to stats.

Dumping Grabovski to keep Bozak would be one of the worst decisions made by an NHL team in the past 5 years. Grabovski is miles better than Bozak at everything except faceoffs.

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04-16-2013, 08:29 PM
  #162
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Since when do 50 point players get 5 million?

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04-16-2013, 08:31 PM
  #163
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Originally Posted by seanlinden View Post
You don't seem to be making any point here about the Leafs having a better option to centre Phil Kessel for $5m...That's the only thing that matters.

You've suggested Weiss, who is not a stronger puck posession player, would be more expensive, and coming off a major injury. That's not a better option.
On the contrary, you said they had no better option and I mentioned one, and also mentioned there's 2 others who would be better offensively. Weiss is as good or better than Bozak at everything other than Faceoffs, and not a big drop either way, and far better offensively. As far as major injuries are concerned, well, you take the chance like everyone else has.

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04-16-2013, 08:31 PM
  #164
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Bozak is really underrated. Do his offensive stats warrant that kind of money? No, certainly not. But combine that with him being a great penalty killer and faceoff guy and there's a good amount of precedent for him receiving that kind of money as a UFA.

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04-16-2013, 08:31 PM
  #165
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Originally Posted by Steeger View Post
https://twitter.com/TSN1050Radio/sta...86107372113921


Wow. Can't see anyone biting at that price
Who?

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04-16-2013, 08:31 PM
  #166
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Originally Posted by Dylbot View Post
Bozak is really underrated. Do his offensive stats warrant that kind of money? No, certainly not. But combine that with him being a great penalty killer and faceoff guy and there's a good amount of precedent for him receiving that kind of money as a UFA.
Name a comparable.

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04-16-2013, 08:33 PM
  #167
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Originally Posted by sabresfan129103 View Post
Since when do 50 point players get 5 million?
Grabovski, but at least he has 3 seasons better to look back on

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04-16-2013, 08:35 PM
  #168
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Originally Posted by Teeder9 View Post
On the contrary, you said they had no better option and I mentioned one, and also mentioned there's 2 others who would be better offensively. Weiss is as good or better than Bozak at everything other than Faceoffs, and not a big drop either way, and far better offensively. As far as major injuries are concerned, well, you take the chance like everyone else has.
So, you're suggesting we pay more for a player who was inferior or equal at the things that matter most for the role we're looking to fill?? All while he's coming off a major injury??

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04-16-2013, 08:38 PM
  #169
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Originally Posted by seanlinden View Post
So, you're suggesting we pay more for a player who was inferior or equal at the things that matter most for the role we're looking to fill?? All while he's coming off a major injury??
No, I'm suggesting we fill the spot with someone better than who currently holds it, and move other player to spot he currently is better at.

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04-16-2013, 08:39 PM
  #170
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Name a comparable.
Horcroft. And then Toronto will come to regret it just as Edmonton does.

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04-16-2013, 08:40 PM
  #171
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Originally Posted by New Liskeard View Post
bla bla bla
Where's the comparable? Pot, this is kettle...

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Old
04-16-2013, 08:43 PM
  #172
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Originally Posted by Riptide View Post
Horcroft. And then Toronto will come to regret it just as Edmonton does.
No doubt they will regret it, but in Horcoff's case, he was coming off 70, 51, and 50 in 53 games, so it at least had the earmarkings of a decent contract at the time

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04-16-2013, 08:46 PM
  #173
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Originally Posted by New Liskeard View Post
You were asked several questions to verify your position on Bozak, bias and agenda aside, and yet here you are again refusing to respond. You have strong opinions on this player that contradicts with not only the coach, but people who have actually watched him play, yet here you are unable to defend your position again. Nothing more credible than a poster making claims without any substance, and then running away when asked to logically defend their position. Seems derailing threads and trolling is part of the agenda.
Seriously, no one is this stupid. Here's the post you keep asking me to clarify.

http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=113

Remember him? The guy you said wasn't credible because of his username? Seems the only one trolling here is you

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04-16-2013, 08:54 PM
  #174
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Just because the Leafs have Grabovski at 5.5 doesn't mean Bozak should make a similar dollar. That's a classic case of your GM not being good with his CAP management. Bozak is a 3.5-4M player in my eyes. The Leafs should try to sign him for that and trade Grabovski.

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04-16-2013, 08:56 PM
  #175
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Originally Posted by Teeder9 View Post
No, I'm suggesting we fill the spot with someone better than who currently holds it, and move other player to spot he currently is better at.
Pay more for a guy who has skills that you won't even use, while being deficient in the skills you need....JFJ is that you??

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