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the Nash trade - We won

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Old
03-29-2013, 09:49 AM
  #1
Nordique
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the Nash trade - We won

No doubt in my mind at this point. We won the Nash trade. We win it without even considering the 1st round pick.

Where did the Rangers hide Anisimov? This guy is a beast and he reminds me more and more of a young Fedorov everytime I watch him play. He's incredible defensively, tenacious on the forecheck with that long reach, he can flat out snipe if you give him any space near the goal.

Dubinsky is as advertised. Gritty two way forward, high end competitor. I don't want to downplay #17, I'm just not as suprised by him as I am Anisimov.

Erixon by all indications is ready for the NHL. He's been solid all season on that 3rd pairing, and has more upside than most of our blueliners.

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Old
03-29-2013, 09:57 AM
  #2
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I totally agree. However, I'd like to add that we also got rid of Nash's crappy leadership and no accountability country club. That was worth the price of admission right there.

And the Nash lovers come to lynch me in 3.....2.....1

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Old
03-29-2013, 10:05 AM
  #3
Nordique
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fox2usp View Post
I totally agree. However, I'd like to add that we also got rid of Nash's crappy leadership and no accountability country club. That was worth the price of admission right there.

And the Nash lovers come to lynch me in 3.....2.....1
Well I'm a Nash lover I guess. He will always be one of my favorite players in the league, but I stand by my original post. We won the trade, and its not even that close imo.

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Old
03-29-2013, 10:08 AM
  #4
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eh, so far there's no true winner of the trade, both teams are enjoying their returns...its just the Rags are failing in other areas currently

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Old
03-29-2013, 10:11 AM
  #5
Derby
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You can love Nash and still believe we "won" the trade. The two are not mutually exclusive.

IMO, it's still too early to tell. Looks to me that both teams got what they wanted and at some cost. I like what we got from NYR. I LOVE Arty and the game he brings to CBJ. Watching the goal celebrations of his line last night was awesome. He looks like a giant between two munchkins. They fit neatly under his armpits like children with their big brother.

It will be interesting when we face big #61 several times next year. I for one am excited to watch him play in person again. He's a special player. I miss seeing him play, frankly.

Did we win the trade? Dunno, maybe. But I still don't hate Nash.


Last edited by Derby: 03-29-2013 at 10:20 AM.
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Old
03-29-2013, 10:17 AM
  #6
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It looks ok but it's too early to tell imo.. we have played just over 30 games since the trade.

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03-29-2013, 10:24 AM
  #7
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Compared to what Calgary got for Iginla we sure won...

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Old
03-29-2013, 10:27 AM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skraut View Post
Compared to what Calgary got for Iginla we sure won...
In order of pieces from the two trades combined:

1) NYR piece #1
2) NYR piece #2
3) NYR piece #3
4) NYR piece #4
5) Pittsburgh's 1st-rounder
6A and 6B) The two throwaway prospects Calgary got

Frankly, I don't care to order the pieces Columbus got from New York, as everyone brings something much different to the table.

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03-29-2013, 11:47 AM
  #9
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Love the pieces we got. Also a big Nash fan and he's showing he can play on the big stage in NY City. I think this trade really highlights the importance of secondary players and heart. NY didn't get enough heart to make up for what they lost. I think Dubi and Arty were more significant to the NYR than they thought. They also lost a few other key pieces that were heart and soul guys. What I find to be a potentially interesting dynamic is that the Rangers could be on a downward trend as they age putting Nash back in a position with little shot at the Stanley Cup. The reason he wanted out.... He may have moved to a more challenging situation.

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Old
03-29-2013, 11:49 AM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fox2usp View Post
I totally agree. However, I'd like to add that we also got rid of Nash's crappy leadership and no accountability country club. That was worth the price of admission right there.

And the Nash lovers come to lynch me in 3.....2.....1
This is huge for me too. As long as Rick Nash remained in that room, with the "C", no new leadership core and no accountability would have made its way inside.

Rick Nash was not the source of all our problems, but nobody wanted to ruffle the feathers of the "leadership heirarchy" either.

Real Change in that lockerroom was stalled until Nash departed.

I don't hate Nash, but I do hate how we had no team backbone or identity with him. He's just not a rah rah guy, and, right now, thats what this organization needs a lot of it, and we seem to have it.

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03-29-2013, 12:22 PM
  #11
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While the merits of "who won the trade" can be debated, the comparison to the Iginla trade isn't anywhere near valid.

Nash was traded in the prime of his career (age 28) and was signed for 5 or 6 more years. Iginla is on the downside (production already declining and age 36) and is a UFA after this season.

Pittsburgh bought a rental which they hope helps wins them hockey's ultimate prize for 2 prospects which they weren't going to sign (the equivalent of nothing) and a very late first round pick (not much). If they win the Cup, it's not overpayment and if they don't win it, it's not giving away much.


Last edited by Cyclones Rock: 03-29-2013 at 12:29 PM.
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Old
03-29-2013, 12:27 PM
  #12
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I don't see a trade like this one as "winning vs. losing" like some zero sum game.

From a CBJ perspective, did the trade improve the team short term? Long term?

I hope so, its hard to say because there are so many variables.

If the GAA was the same as it has been this year, and the Jackets still had Nash would they have won more games due to higher scoring?

If they still had Nash, would they have given up more goals due to the absence of Erixon, Dubinsky and Anisimov?

What impact will the player picked with the Rangers' pick have long term? How much will Dubinsky and Anisimov improve? Erixon?

I think it's possible the Jackets may have made a great improvement in time due to the trade. If the Rangers improve due to this trade as well, even better.

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Old
03-29-2013, 12:27 PM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KeithBWhittington View Post
This is huge for me too. As long as Rick Nash remained in that room, with the "C", no new leadership core and no accountability would have made its way inside.

Rick Nash was not the source of all our problems, but nobody wanted to ruffle the feathers of the "leadership heirarchy" either.

Real Change in that lockerroom was stalled until Nash departed.

I don't hate Nash, but I do hate how we had no team backbone or identity with him. He's just not a rah rah guy, and, right now, thats what this organization needs a lot of it, and we seem to have it.
I share this assessment.

I place the blame of Nash's forced role of leadership squarely at the feet of Howson. Nash was completely unsuited for the role and Howson didn't force the issue. He had 6 years to deal with it and failed utterly. Until the very end, which, ironically was too late to save his own bacon.

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Old
03-29-2013, 12:35 PM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclones Rock View Post
While the merits of "who won the trade" can be debated, the comparison to the Iginla trade isn't anywhere near valid.

Nash was traded in the prime of his career (age 28) and signed for 5 or 6 more years. Iginla is on the downside (production already declining and age 36) and is a UFA after this season.

Pittsburgh bought a rental which they hope helps wins them hockey's ultimate prize for 2 prospects which they weren't going to sign (the equivalent of nothing) and a very late first round pick (not much). If they win the Cup, it's not overpayment and if they don't win it, it's not giving away much.
You know who else was a UFA and on the downswing of their career? Brenden Morrow and Douglas Murray. Because of the UFA status of Iginla, no, a clean comp against Nash isn't possible. But to simply dismiss it with a wave of the hand isn't possible either.

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Old
03-29-2013, 01:04 PM
  #15
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Originally Posted by Skraut View Post
Compared to what Calgary got for Iginla we sure won...
Iginla is much older and in the final year of his existing contract. Not apples to oranges.

Back on the original topic. I'm not sure I am ready for a win/lose declaration. I'll be happy to look at again in two or three years.

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Old
03-29-2013, 03:03 PM
  #16
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Both teams do the deal 7 days a week. So it's even.

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Old
03-29-2013, 03:08 PM
  #17
Nordique
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Originally Posted by blahblah View Post
Iginla is much older and in the final year of his existing contract. Not apples to oranges.

Back on the original topic. I'm not sure I am ready for a win/lose declaration. I'll be happy to look at again in two or three years.
Stop being so comtemplative and thoughtful.

Give us your gut call, right now:

Nash

or

42,17,20, NYR-1st-rd

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03-29-2013, 03:24 PM
  #18
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1) take a coin
2) flip it in the air
3) check and see which side is up

Heads we win, Tails we lose

or

Tails we win, Heads we lose

Can't decide which???

1) take a coin........

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Old
03-29-2013, 03:29 PM
  #19
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I do the trade

I hated it when I first heard about it, thought the announcement that Nash had asked to moved left our hands tied. Really wanted Kreider or McDonough to be included in the deal.

Result: Love Artem, love Erixon, and I think Brandon will have better years in the future. Really looking forward to seeing what #1 becomes


Happy for Nasher. He wanted out, he needed out - He will be a great player for the Rangers. He is not their problem right now.

Good trades hurt a little bit both ways, this trade qualifies as good for both teams

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Old
03-29-2013, 03:43 PM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derby View Post
You can love Nash and still believe we "won" the trade. The two are not mutually exclusive.

IMO, it's still too early to tell. Looks to me that both teams got what they wanted and at some cost. I like what we got from NYR. I LOVE Arty and the game he brings to CBJ. Watching the goal celebrations of his line last night was awesome. He looks like a giant between two munchkins. They fit neatly under his armpits like children with their big brother.

It will be interesting when we face big #61 several times next year. I for one am excited to watch him play in person again. He's a special player. I miss seeing him play, frankly.

Did we win the trade? Dunno, maybe. But I still don't hate Nash.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LetsGOJackets!! View Post
I hated it when I first heard about it, thought the announcement that Nash had asked to moved left our hands tied. Really wanted Kreider or McDonough to be included in the deal.

Result: Love Artem, love Erixon, and I think Brandon will have better years in the future. Really looking forward to seeing what #1 becomes

Happy for Nasher. He wanted out, he needed out - He will be a great player for the Rangers. He is not their problem right now.

Good trades hurt a little bit both ways, this trade qualifies as good for both teams
I agree with Derby and LetsGo..... "Win Win" sortof.

And I don't think he was a cancer. Remember that Howson and HITCH both decried the country club atmosphere, yet they signed Nash to a long-term deal. This was 7 months before Hitchcock was fired. If they thought he was the problem, do you think they would have resigned him? I don't think so.

While it's true Nash didn't make us a winner while he was here, it may also be true that getting rid of him didn't solve our problems. Time will tell.

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Old
03-29-2013, 04:39 PM
  #21
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I tend to oversimplify things. Always draft the BPA. If you traded away the best player in the deal, you lost.

So I guess we lost.

In reality we were obviously going to get a bunch of lesser pieces for Nash. The pieces we have gotten have played well besides Dubinsky who has been out too often. So we didn't really lose, but I don't think we can say we've won yet. That seems to be Howson's M.O. with regards to guys who demand to be traded.

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Old
03-29-2013, 04:40 PM
  #22
blahblah
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordique View Post
Stop being so comtemplative and thoughtful.

Give us your gut call, right now:

Nash

or

42,17,20, NYR-1st-rd
Assuming AA re-signs and improves over time, I think we have, at a minimum, a draw. I think those players (Dubi and AA) mean more to us, at this time, than Nash would. We have a lot of depth at D, I'm not sure what to make of Erixon in the long term. Worst case he's an asset we move.

That is the best I can do. This is a rare case in which the trade works well for all those involved. I'm not sure there is going to be a winner and loser out of this one.

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Old
03-29-2013, 05:11 PM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derby View Post
You can love Nash and still believe we "won" the trade. The two are not mutually exclusive.

IMO, it's still too early to tell. Looks to me that both teams got what they wanted and at some cost. I like what we got from NYR. I LOVE Arty and the game he brings to CBJ. Watching the goal celebrations of his line last night was awesome. He looks like a giant between two munchkins. They fit neatly under his armpits like children with their big brother.

It will be interesting when we face big #61 several times next year. I for one am excited to watch him play in person again. He's a special player. I miss seeing him play, frankly.

Did we win the trade? Dunno, maybe. But I still don't hate Nash.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xoggz22 View Post
Love the pieces we got. Also a big Nash fan and he's showing he can play on the big stage in NY City. I think this trade really highlights the importance of secondary players and heart. NY didn't get enough heart to make up for what they lost. I think Dubi and Arty were more significant to the NYR than they thought. They also lost a few other key pieces that were heart and soul guys. What I find to be a potentially interesting dynamic is that the Rangers could be on a downward trend as they age putting Nash back in a position with little shot at the Stanley Cup. The reason he wanted out.... He may have moved to a more challenging situation.
Two good posts. I'll always be a fan of Nash, but I'm very happy with what was gotten in the trade.

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Old
03-29-2013, 05:24 PM
  #24
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Duby has been injured and hasnt been able to produce as hoped.
There was a hint of hype surrounding Anisimov and I think he has delivered as Howson hoped.
Erixon has impressed. Probably exceeded expectations for this season.

I believe that the CBJ does have the potential to be the long term winners of this deal. But just in my opinion, its too soon to tell.

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Old
03-29-2013, 06:07 PM
  #25
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Nash has 28 points, the combined scoring from the 3 we got for him is 27 points. We have 33 points, which gets us 13th in the conference and 22nd overall. I'd hardly say its a clear win.

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