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Rumors & Proposals Thread Vol. 15 | Oilers Pick 7th OV

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Old
04-29-2013, 09:25 AM
  #976
Jimmi McJenkins
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scoobs View Post
All three of those are roster players for Washington. Injuries this year, but still... big parts of their team. We're not getting those players if we give them Gagner, a 6/7 defenseman and an overweight lug who was in the pressbox most of this season.

Washington says no and spreads rumours of MacT's excessive drinking.
Umm, not really sure if you're seeing the same thing I am. Yes they are "roster" players, Schultz is the same way Fistric is, and Laich is a rather expensive 3rd line center-ish.

The Caps have to cut dollars for next year

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04-29-2013, 09:57 AM
  #977
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Proposal:
Lucic + Boychuk\Peverly
For
Hemsky\Gagner + 2013 1st

We add negotiating rights to Whitney to sweeten the deal


BOLD

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Old
04-29-2013, 10:09 AM
  #978
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Petro Points View Post
Proposal:
Lucic + Boychuk\Peverly
For
Hemsky\Gagner + 2013 1st

We add negotiating rights to Whitney to sweeten the deal


BOLD
I bet if the Oilers ate some of Hemsky's contract the Bruins might think about this.

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Old
04-29-2013, 10:19 AM
  #979
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I wouldn't want to trade much more than our 1st for Lucic..

He has been bad.. and he is about to get paid like Taylor Hall.

I'd give say.. our 1st and Paajarvi
And thats an overpay, imo.


Last edited by dem: 04-29-2013 at 10:25 AM.
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Old
04-29-2013, 10:23 AM
  #980
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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
If our 1st is going to Philly I want Couturier coming back.
I'd like this, i know their fans wouldn't, but might their management? hmmmm


if they were in love with nurse i could see it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roof Daddy View Post
Could 7th overall + Petry + Marincin be enough to land Hedman? For the Bolts to go from Hedman to Petry is a sizeable downgrade, but the pick and Marincin would cover that IMO. Their team is actually up against the cap a bit (will be 59.8 needing to re-sign Aulie, 7th D, and 4 depth forwards), and that's if they want to march out the same team that led them to the 3rd worst record in the league. Their D prospect pool is poor and it's not out of the question to suggest Marincin would become their best D prospect. Maybe if Tampa wins the draft lottery and selects Jones this could become a reality?

Would love to have a top 4 of

Smid-Schultz
Klefbom-Hedman
well given the teams needs are identical, someone is losing bad, its just an illogical trade.

Quote:
Originally Posted by doubledown99 View Post
I rather try for Alzner. That guy is amazing. He's not flashy. Will likely never put up lots of points. But is a top pairing guy. He gets puck out of the zone. Is calm and collected. Good transition game. Good passer.

He is RFA....would WSH be interested in our 7th overall if Nich is available?
Would love Alzner... dont think just a pick will do it, unless they have major cap issues.

Possible deals:

7th for Alzner
Gagner for Alzner (do they need a 2C? is ribero out?)
Gagner+7th for Alzner+1st

That last one is a package i hope we could try to lure out some other solid and young Dmen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by notloilersfan View Post
I'm curious looking back at the deals for Carter and Richards.

8th Overall
Voracek
3rd rounder

Schenn
Simmonds
2nd rounder.

I wonder if there are any good top 6 centers that a package of the following could land us?

7th overall
Paajarvi
2nd rounder
I think that philly situation was relatively unique...anything can happen i suppose, what teams may be in a similar position this offseason?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jumptheshark View Post
Here is an idea of a future line

Maggs-Lander-Yakupov?

I like how Maggs and Yak started to click later in the season
Lander is a 4C at best right now, and would be shocking if at any point in his career made it into a top-6, he really shouldn't be with yakupov.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DousedInOil View Post
So we move the 7th overall pick packaged with two other assets instead of just drafting Sean Monahan (who has drawn Toews comparisons)? I'll wait the 1 year for him to make the NHL.
It's only a comparison, someone is the next lidstrom every other year.

and, i doubt he'll be there at 7.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmi Jenkins View Post
I bet if the Oilers ate some of Hemsky's contract the Bruins might think about this.
how would we do that? Lucic already costs more, and has more term. We still would need to sign some decent UFA's to fill out the team.

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Old
04-29-2013, 10:36 AM
  #981
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Do you think the Rangers have any interest in moving Del Zotto?

Would a Gagner for Del Zotto deal work? I am not sure who wins or loses that deal.

Looking at strictly value and not needs is the value there?

I realize that trading Gagner would create a big hole but I believe that hole is easier to fix than our defence is..

Hall stated he would play C if asked as long as he had a full training camp to try it.

xx-RNH-Eberle
xx-Hall-Yak

If Hall makes the transition smoothly than Gagner is expendable. We would have a hole for the first month or so until RNH returns but if they can get a quality 3rd line centre in the offseason than they can play him in the 2 role for that first month.

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Old
04-29-2013, 10:39 AM
  #982
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BowDangles View Post
Do you think the Rangers have any interest in moving Del Zotto?

Would a Gagner for Del Zotto deal work? I am not sure who wins or loses that deal.

Looking at strictly value and not needs is the value there?

I realize that trading Gagner would create a big hole but I believe that hole is easier to fix than our defence is..

Hall stated he would play C if asked as long as he had a full training camp to try it.

xx-RNH-Eberle
xx-Hall-Yak

If Hall makes the transition smoothly than Gagner is expendable. We would have a hole for the first month or so until RNH returns but if they can get a quality 3rd line centre in the offseason than they can play him in the 2 role for that first month.
I don't get this pointlessness. Hall just had an All-World season on his natural wing and was the Oilers best player, so let's **** that up? Why?

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04-29-2013, 10:42 AM
  #983
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I asked this in the wrong thread.

Anyone know if Avs want to for sure keep O'Reilly? Just wondering if he'd be a potential 2C to go after...

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Old
04-29-2013, 10:51 AM
  #984
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmi Jenkins View Post
I don't get this pointlessness. Hall just had an All-World season on his natural wing and was the Oilers best player, so let's **** that up? Why?
Because if he can keep that pace at centre he can continue to have a huge impact but also fill a giant need for the Oilers.

The team would be set down the middle for years if Hall can translate to the position smoothly.

He already is all over the ice any way so I don't see it being that big of a difference... the only glaring issue I see is a lot of times Hall is the last guy out of the Offensive zone due to falling over.

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04-29-2013, 10:59 AM
  #985
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Originally Posted by BowDangles View Post
Because if he can keep that pace at centre he can continue to have a huge impact but also fill a giant need for the Oilers.

The team would be set down the middle for years if Hall can translate to the position smoothly.

He already is all over the ice any way so I don't see it being that big of a difference... the only glaring issue I see is a lot of times Hall is the last guy out of the Offensive zone due to falling over.
Yup, IF that happens, or you can **** with your best player by making him deal with being a center instead of playing his natural, successful position.

If Hall had yet to go ALL WORLD, I Might think it would be something to try, but not so much now, let him continue to be the best player on the team and play his natural position.

If they want a center, they should just find a center.

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Old
04-29-2013, 10:59 AM
  #986
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Originally Posted by armandh01 View Post
I asked this in the wrong thread.

Anyone know if Avs want to for sure keep O'Reilly? Just wondering if he'd be a potential 2C to go after...
Nope. He's WAY to expensive

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Old
04-29-2013, 11:09 AM
  #987
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmi Jenkins View Post
Yup, IF that happens, or you can **** with your best player by making him deal with being a center instead of playing his natural, successful position.

If Hall had yet to go ALL WORLD, I Might think it would be something to try, but not so much now, let him continue to be the best player on the team and play his natural position.

If they want a center, they should just find a center.
You make it sound so easy... Almost every team in the league would like a top 6 centre. They do not grow on trees..

I realize Gagner is a #2 C but he is pretty soft defensively and struggles in the face off dot. And is most likely Edmonton's best trading chip for getting a quality top 4 d man

It seems to me that moving Messier to C worked pretty well in the long run for Edmonton in the past... He was in his 4th year I believe? Strength down the middle is a lot more important than strength on the wing..

Also if Hall does not work at centre than you just switch him back to the wing... It didn't effect Patrick Kane long term in his play...

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04-29-2013, 11:26 AM
  #988
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Figured this post would be useful here as well...

Assuming Edmonton doesn't win the lottery or falls one spot from a team below them winning, here are the previous 7th overall draft picks since 2002. Out side of Skinner none of these players had an impact in their first year after being drafted.

2012 Mathew Dumba D
2011 Mark Scheifele C
2010 Jeff Skinner C
2009 Nazem Kadri C
2008 Colin Wilson C
2007 Jakub Voracek C
2006 Kyle Okposo RW
2005 Jack Skille RW
2004 Rostislav Olesz C
2003 Ryan Suter D
2002 Joffrey Lupul C

Unless Monahan is still available I think Edmonton is better off to package the pick for a top 4 defence man.

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Old
04-29-2013, 11:46 AM
  #989
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Quote:
Originally Posted by armandh01 View Post
I asked this in the wrong thread.

Anyone know if Avs want to for sure keep O'Reilly? Just wondering if he'd be a potential 2C to go after...
That guy gets qualified at $5M next year. Good god what happens if he has a decent year next season.

Sam Gagner will get $4.5 - $5M based on his play and he'll cost us nothing in assets to acquire. He's getting better and can move to the right side if necessary down the road.

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Old
04-29-2013, 11:51 AM
  #990
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Originally Posted by belair View Post
That guy gets qualified at $5M next year. Good god what happens if he has a decent year next season.

Sam Gagner will get $4.5 - $5M based on his play and he'll cost us nothing in assets to acquire. He's getting better and can move to the right side if necessary down the road.
isn't it 6.5?

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04-29-2013, 12:00 PM
  #991
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isn't it 6.5?
Touché .

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04-29-2013, 02:01 PM
  #992
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Nope. He's WAY to expensive
They can`t trade him for one year after matching the OS which I believe is after next year`s trade deadline. The earliest we could trade for him would be next offseason.

He`s definitely a useful player, but not a cheap one.

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04-29-2013, 02:09 PM
  #993
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I am very intrigued into what a package like 7th overall, MPS and a 2nd could land us.

Or 7th overall and Sam Gagner...

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04-29-2013, 02:10 PM
  #994
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BowDangles View Post
Figured this post would be useful here as well...

Assuming Edmonton doesn't win the lottery or falls one spot from a team below them winning, here are the previous 7th overall draft picks since 2002. Out side of Skinner none of these players had an impact in their first year after being drafted.

2012 Mathew Dumba D
2011 Mark Scheifele C
2010 Jeff Skinner C
2009 Nazem Kadri C
2008 Colin Wilson C
2007 Jakub Voracek C
2006 Kyle Okposo RW
2005 Jack Skille RW
2004 Rostislav Olesz C
2003 Ryan Suter D
2002 Joffrey Lupul C

Unless Monahan is still available I think Edmonton is better off to package the pick for a top 4 defence man.
While this list may be useful, do people not think that other GMs can pull it up too, look at it and ask themselves "Why would I trade my top 4 defenseman for a 7th overall pick when that's the kind of history at that spot?"

It's not that easy.

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04-29-2013, 02:19 PM
  #995
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Originally Posted by BarDownBobo View Post
While this list may be useful, do people not think that other GMs can pull it up too, look at it and ask themselves "Why would I trade my top 4 defenseman for a 7th overall pick when that's the kind of history at that spot?"

It's not that easy.
I think some teams get blinded by this when it comes to the draft. Their scouts are telling them how high they are on certain players making them believe the player is a for sure thing when history tells us that he probably is not..

The 7th overall alone probably would not get you a top 4 Dman alone... unless it was a #4-5 guy.
They will need to package it to get one. But when you start doing that you would want a young dman with term on his contract.

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04-29-2013, 02:21 PM
  #996
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What do you think Minnesota would want for Cal Clutterbuck this summer? Rumour has it that they will have a hard time resigning him...what kind of $$$ do you think he is looking for?

Perfect bottom six guy in my opinion

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04-29-2013, 02:22 PM
  #997
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Originally Posted by BowDangles View Post
What do you think Minnesota would want for Cal Clutterbuck this summer? Rumour has it that they will have a hard time resigning him...what kind of $$$ do you think he is looking for?

Perfect bottom six guy in my opinion
He will want a million bucks and a written apology from Hall.

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04-29-2013, 02:24 PM
  #998
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What about Colton Orr for 4th line?

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04-29-2013, 02:26 PM
  #999
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Originally Posted by BowDangles View Post
What do you think Minnesota would want for Cal Clutterbuck this summer? Rumour has it that they will have a hard time resigning him...what kind of $$$ do you think he is looking for?

Perfect bottom six guy in my opinion
Imagine how much lunch money he would have to give to Taylor Hall if they shared the same dressing room. The last thing we need is Taylor Hall distracted by having to pick on Cal all day.

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04-29-2013, 02:30 PM
  #1000
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BowDangles View Post
Figured this post would be useful here as well...

Assuming Edmonton doesn't win the lottery or falls one spot from a team below them winning, here are the previous 7th overall draft picks since 2002. Out side of Skinner none of these players had an impact in their first year after being drafted.

2012 Mathew Dumba D
2011 Mark Scheifele C
2010 Jeff Skinner C
2009 Nazem Kadri C
2008 Colin Wilson C
2007 Jakub Voracek C
2006 Kyle Okposo RW
2005 Jack Skille RW
2004 Rostislav Olesz C
2003 Ryan Suter D
2002 Joffrey Lupul C

Unless Monahan is still available I think Edmonton is better off to package the pick for a top 4 defence man.
Not to sound rude but I don't get why people want to use this example as a predictor of future players.

1. It's too small of a sample size to make any kind of accurate correlation. It would have to be at least 25-30 picks to gather enough data.

2. It doesn't take into account how strong or weak a draft is. In other words in doesn't take variance into account.

3. Singling out a single pick like that would lead to situations where an 11th pick that had Kopitar appear more valuable than the 7th overall pick. Obviously an 11th pick isn't worth more than a 7th.

Is their any statistical indicator that we can use to accurately predict just how good Sean Monahan, Darnell Nurse and Elias Lindholm will be?

I guess you could compare their individual stats with players drafted with similar stats. If this the case with Lindholm, you would expect him to be slightly worse than the Sedins or Forsberg. I doubt he's that good. Monahans stats are also misleading because of the team he plays on.

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