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Dinamo Rīga 2013/2014 season talk

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Old
11-21-2013, 12:04 PM
  #251
kp61c
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Originally Posted by ult View Post
Or they can just, you know, quit KHL and not deal with Russians? They had a lot of symbols to chose from as it is not a part of Latvian Heraldry, and yet...

The biggest loser in this story is KHL, who are already taking a massive hit on reputation. Dinamo knew that the could pull it off rather unscathed, as they have a "latvian culture" excuse. KHL on the other hand looks horrible in this story with their indecisive stance.
that pretty much sums it up. they can go nuts if they have nothing to do, i can grant them that, but the absensce of reaction from the khl is disappointing to say the least.


Last edited by stv11: 11-21-2013 at 01:32 PM.
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11-21-2013, 12:06 PM
  #252
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Cool. I'm waiting for your 96 anniversary then, because KHL said that even though it is a national symbol, Dinamo Riga should restrain from using it ever again. Maybe your wish will come through in 2014.



Why do you keep trying to convince me that it is a traditional Latvian symbol? I believe you. And it doesn't matter, because it doesn't matter to the majority of KHL audience. It looks as close to Swastika as you can get without breaking a law. No one believes that it was unintentional. Riga knew what reaction will be, and they defiantly shoved it to the KHL's face. It's when and where they did it that matters.
Okay then expalain this-why would Savickis,former KGB agent go against his friends in Moscow that makes ZERO ****ing sense.Who in Riga would benefit from this?

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11-21-2013, 12:21 PM
  #253
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Okay then expalain this-why would Savickis,former KGB agent go against his friends in Moscow that makes ZERO ****ing sense.
I'm not him, how would I know? Maybe as Latgale_fan said he was gaining some points in Latvia, maybe he is a tool and was used by someone else, maybe he has a habit of signing documents before reading them, or he's not as friendly with Moscow as you think, or he was proving a point.

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Who in Riga would benefit from this?
They were boosting their ego, obviously. Just look at this topic. It was a success.

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11-21-2013, 12:27 PM
  #254
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Just let it go and move on... Big deal...

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11-21-2013, 12:29 PM
  #255
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Originally Posted by ult View Post
Why do you keep trying to convince me that it is a traditional Latvian symbol? I believe you. And it doesn't matter, because it doesn't matter to the majority of KHL audience. It looks as close to Swastika as you can get without breaking a law. No one believes that it was unintentional. Riga knew what reaction will be, and they defiantly shoved it to the KHL's face. It's when and where they did it that matters.
Uhm, what? It's not really hard to see that as nothing but folk symbolism. I mean it's not the 90s, when people were still getting shocked to see swastikas on Russian costumes and even 1917 rubles, nowdays the traditional roots of swastika are rather well known, even though a kolovrat wearing person would still look pretty provocative. There sure are some brainwashed zombies and openly Latviaphobic people in Russia, but "no one believes"? Never speak for everyone.

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11-21-2013, 12:34 PM
  #256
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Was in Riga for Dinamo-Barys and Dinamo-Avangard!

2 good matches i think, atmosphere was even better in the match against Avangard! I thought there would be some brawl at the end of the match, Ozolinsh and Kulyash were going at it the whole match

Also KHL Bar is worth a visit i guess, that time there weren't many ppl, but from what the waitress said usually there are more ppl also when games are on...anyway it's worth a visit just because of the waitress lol! Really a lot of beautiful girls in Riga






























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Old
11-21-2013, 12:39 PM
  #257
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ult View Post
They were boosting their ego, obviously. Just look at this topic. It was a success.
You must be kidding.

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11-21-2013, 12:43 PM
  #258
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Originally Posted by obskyr View Post
Uhm, what? It's not really hard to see that as nothing but folk symbolism. I mean it's not the 90s, when people were still getting shocked to see swastikas on Russian costumes and even 1917 rubles, nowdays the traditional roots of swastika are rather well known, even though a kolovrat wearing person would still look pretty provocative. There sure are some brainwashed zombies and openly Latviaphobic people in Russia, but everyone? Never speak for everyone.
No, see, even you think that they intentionally were waiving this symbol, perfectly understanding its resemblance to the swastika. You just think it's unfair to take into consideration the recent meaning of it and its recent history, when it has a much longer history of being used by many nationalities as a harmless symbol of the sun. Am I right? The thing is, most people still have a very much living memory of those recent tragic events, that are associated with the swastika. And whatever happened hundred years ago fades in comparison. Blame Hitler for ruining it, not people offended by it.

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11-21-2013, 12:57 PM
  #259
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You must be kidding.
Well, if you want a serious answer - it's not uncommon for a small nations who just recently gained independence to overcompensate for the past, to see how far the can overstep their recent boundaries, to emphasize their independence every time they get a chance. I.e. a teenager who just reached a legal adulthood.

Otherwise I don't know how to answer his question about who in Riga would benefit from it. I don't know. I think it was stupid. Who would benefit from doing something stupid like that?

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11-21-2013, 01:03 PM
  #260
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Otherwise I don't know how to answer his question about who in Riga would benefit from it. I don't know. I think it was stupid. Who would benefit from doing something stupid like that?
I doubt anyone benefited from it in Riga or anywhere else. Alright, Savickis had a chance to earn his "Latvian" points, but that's about it. I mean, I really don't think it was intentional (luckily Latvians haven't yet reached a state during which Ugunskrusts would primarily resemble them a Nazi swastika).

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11-21-2013, 01:20 PM
  #261
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Anyway, some organizations are already writing public letters to the State Duma, which means to the other political leaders as well, who, without a doubt, would not miss a chance to score some very easy political points, and to blame KHL for their tolerance for that matter. Just great, thanks Dinamo Riga. It's not like KHL needs the government support or anything...

http://www.sovsport.ru/news/text-item/661362

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11-21-2013, 01:39 PM
  #262
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ult View Post
No, see, even you think that they intentionally were waiving this symbol, perfectly understanding its resemblance to the swastika. You just think it's unfair to take into consideration the recent meaning of it and its recent history, when it has a much longer history of being used by many nationalities as a harmless symbol of the sun. Am I right? The thing is, most people still have a very much living memory of those recent tragic events, that are associated with the swastika. And whatever happened hundred years ago fades in comparison. Blame Hitler for ruining it, not people offended by it.
Well, that was intentionally shaped like a swastika, but it's hard for me to see that as something intentionally provocative. It's obvious how amusing it may be to see a giant swastika on ice in Riga from the Russian pov, but I fail to see that as a refernce to the WWII in any way either. As you may notice in this thread, post-Soviet Latvia is used to a pretty different media environment, which in certain ways was inspired by the nostalgic sentiments for the times of the First Republic and the national revival, when swastika was one of the neutral national symbols.

If anything it reminds me the most of the last year Euro, when Polish soccer hooligans were attacking Russian tourists for whatever reason. I noticed that quite a lot of those tourists were wearing SSSR t-shirts and budyonovkas with red stars. From their perspective that was nothing but screamingly kitchy Russian accessories emphasizing where exactly they came from. For Poles, on the other hand, (keep on mind that the Soviet-Polish war, rarely remembered by Russians after school, was a pretty huge defining moment of their national history) budyonovkas were actually more than that, for them it was bordering a national insult, even though nobody was trying to imply anything like that in the first place.

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11-21-2013, 02:37 PM
  #263
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Wow. So much being made over absolutely nothing. I hardly think a league which still had a team with a hate symbol in its logo as of two years ago could ethically or morally make any sort of condemning statement regarding the use of an ancient traditional symbol that very obviously had no negative intentions. It's nice to see that they're taking this rationally, unlike some of the uneducated ignorant folks here and in the Russian media.

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11-21-2013, 03:02 PM
  #264
King EK65
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Well this is getting pretty interesting. Some of you guys have gone a bit too far with the comments though.

By the way, coyotechrisz, thanks for posting some pictures! Hope you enjoyed both games

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11-21-2013, 09:02 PM
  #265
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Quote:
Originally Posted by obskyr View Post
Well, that was intentionally shaped like a swastika, but it's hard for me to see that as something intentionally provocative. It's obvious how amusing it may be to see a giant swastika on ice in Riga from the Russian pov, but I fail to see that as a refernce to the WWII in any way either. As you may notice in this thread, post-Soviet Latvia is used to a pretty different media environment, which in certain ways was inspired by the nostalgic sentiments for the times of the First Republic and the national revival, when swastika was one of the neutral national symbols.

If anything it reminds me the most of the last year Euro, when Polish soccer hooligans were attacking Russian tourists for whatever reason. I noticed that quite a lot of those tourists were wearing SSSR t-shirts and budyonovkas with red stars. From their perspective that was nothing but screamingly kitchy Russian accessories emphasizing where exactly they came from. For Poles, on the other hand, (keep on mind that the Soviet-Polish war, rarely remembered by Russians after school, was a pretty huge defining moment of their national history) budyonovkas were actually more than that, for them it was bordering a national insult, even though nobody was trying to imply anything like that in the first place.
Another great post. Exactly my thoughts. All things considered it was stupid from whoever thought out that it is completely harmless as sensationalists will obviously blow this out of any proportion. They should of known better.

Yes, Savickis might have wanted to earn some bonus points for being a patriot or whatever (as he indeed is viewed very negatively in the media), so, of course, he was all for such a small play. But to think that he was actually directing this play or even ok'ing the inclusion of something that vaguely looks like some Nazi Germany symbol is lunacy.

Unfortunately, there are a lot of people, that always assume the worst and then this is the result - angry comments on webzones. Though, KHL have been all class, it's nice to see.

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11-22-2013, 12:25 AM
  #266
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karsums View Post

By the way, coyotechrisz, thanks for posting some pictures! Hope you enjoyed both games
Yes, really entertaining, liked it a lot! Tellqvist had 2 good games there. Penalty Shootout vs. Barys was kinda crazy, Nizivijs tried about 4 times...Dinamo had about 4-5 Shots to end it, but didn't make any and nearly lost it at the end!

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11-22-2013, 04:32 AM
  #267
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Originally Posted by coyotechrisz View Post

Also KHL Bar is worth a visit i guess, that time there weren't many ppl, but from what the waitress said usually there are more ppl also when games are on...
Well it indeed is sports bar in general, something must be going on to attract people (and it's not necessarily hockey). Was there or opening night of the season and all TV's there were tuning in on Eurobasket although there were KHL games going on already.

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11-22-2013, 04:46 AM
  #268
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Originally Posted by coyotechrisz View Post
Yes, really entertaining, liked it a lot! Tellqvist had 2 good games there. Penalty Shootout vs. Barys was kinda crazy, Nizivijs tried about 4 times...Dinamo had about 4-5 Shots to end it, but didn't make any and nearly lost it at the end!
When I saw the match against Barys on tv I kept thinking that an Austrian guy from this forum really got his money's worth.

Thanks for posting the pics.

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11-22-2013, 08:17 AM
  #269
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Originally Posted by ult View Post
Or they can just, you know, quit KHL and not deal with Russians? They had a lot of symbols to chose from as it is not a part of Latvian Heraldry, and yet...

The biggest loser in this story is KHL, who are already taking a massive hit on reputation. Dinamo knew that the could pull it off rather unscathed, as they have a "latvian culture" excuse. KHL on the other hand looks horrible in this story with their indecisive stance.
I think KHL (and Russia) will not lose reputation in the long run. Not sanctioning this (to be honest, there was nothing to sanction to begin with) proves Russia is moving towards democratic ways. That comes from the fact that i don't believe majority of the so called democratic western countries would be as rational as you handled it. So, in many ways, I'm shocked (but in a good way).

If it was a real svastika, i think 95% of people on this forum would be disgusted.


EDIT: D.Riga is doing great against Barys!! I'm jealous.

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11-22-2013, 09:45 AM
  #270
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Originally Posted by coyotechrisz View Post
Yes, really entertaining, liked it a lot! Tellqvist had 2 good games there. Penalty Shootout vs. Barys was kinda crazy, Nizivijs tried about 4 times...Dinamo had about 4-5 Shots to end it, but didn't make any and nearly lost it at the end!
Nice to hear that you liked it! Do you ever plan to go to any other games?

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11-22-2013, 03:38 PM
  #271
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ozo View Post
Well it indeed is sports bar in general, something must be going on to attract people (and it's not necessarily hockey). Was there or opening night of the season and all TV's there were tuning in on Eurobasket although there were KHL games going on already.
I see, well i was there on Thursday, just a group of 7 ppl, and later 4 ppl were there. I think not too many were interested in HK Riga match which was on the screens. Dont know if it's more packed when Dinamo plays or other big sport events are on.


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Originally Posted by Domenica View Post
When I saw the match against Barys on tv I kept thinking that an Austrian guy from this forum really got his money's worth.

Thanks for posting the pics.
yes def. was worth it!

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Originally Posted by karsums View Post
Nice to hear that you liked it! Do you ever plan to go to any other games?
Huh, might not make it again this year! But i hope for Dinamo-Medvescak so i would travel to Zagreb 2 times

But it's def. my first choice for KHL although Zagreb,Bratislava and Prag would not be that far! Unfortunately Riga played them away already this season!

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11-22-2013, 03:43 PM
  #272
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I think KHL (and Russia) will not lose reputation in the long run. Not sanctioning this (to be honest, there was nothing to sanction to begin with) proves Russia is moving towards democratic ways.
This has nothing to do with democracy, we all know Russia is the furthest thing from democratic. They're usually the first to throw the "fascist" card about if it's political or anti-state.

In this case though, as always, money talks. The team's a member of the KHL, let it slide. In western Europe and the USA, however, the Jewish lobby is so strong and influential that even if something slightly resembles a swastika you know there'd be a B.S. storm made and forced apology. Russia and the KHL on the other hand, couldn't care less since it's not against them.

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11-22-2013, 03:46 PM
  #273
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The firecross(latv: Ugunskrusts) displayed there has nothing to do wih nazi ideology. Altough ozo didn't think linking the article would do any good, let's do that anyway: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swastik...mbol_of_Nazism

If anything even remotly resembling swastika should be nono, should we also forbid public displays of sickles and hammers due to the atrocities commited by Soviet Union? It's the context that matters, not resemblences to some symbols.

edit: This is all a big misudnerstanding.
I agree 100%

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11-22-2013, 04:59 PM
  #274
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This has nothing to do with democracy, we all know Russia is the furthest thing from democratic. They're usually the first to throw the "fascist" card about if it's political or anti-state.
Who are those "we" you're talking about? Speak only for yourself, please. You've already proved that you know nothing about Russia at all, so don't try to represent your ignorant opinion as if it's well known fact.

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11-22-2013, 05:34 PM
  #275
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Who are those "we" you're talking about? Speak only for yourself, please. You've already proved that you know nothing about Russia at all, so don't try to represent your ignorant opinion as if it's well known fact.
Well he is somewhat telling the truth. I can't call any country democratic (as it is an ideal, not reality), but the reaction on the subject was suprising for me to say the least. I understand his perspective, but i think he misunderstood my point.

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